Play Nice Eddie McGuire comments on holding Caro Wilson underwater

[Feerits Elf]

2) Caro is a sexist. Everyone knows it. She's actually far worse than any of the 'boys club members she ridicules are.' Too bad society isn't mature enough to call her out but we're close. Case in point is she has probably the most talented football journalist in Emma Quayle tight kept in a cage because she fears her development. If Caro truly wanted to fight the good fight for females would she do this or would you see her actively promote her and write about her? Of course but she doesn't.

I don't see how that's sexist unless Wilson actively promotes and writes about male journalists whose development she fears.

Who are the male journalists whose development Wilson fears but whom she nevertheless actively promotes and writes about in lieu of Quayle because she is sexist against women? You know, for science.

 

[H2F]

No I read those parts but the other parts were in there as well right? It threw me a little as it seemed out of place with the rest of your message.

How can I explain something complex without empathising with all perspectives ...

My messages were clear and your reply wasn't being helpful.

 

[Proper Gander]

When I first read the title of the thread I thought it was 'Eddie McGuire comments on wearing Caro Wilson's underwear'

I thought exactly that as well. Then I started worrying about why I thought that and what it said about me. Then I stopped worrying about that. Then I read your post. Now I'm worrying again.

 

[AM]

'We’d have to sell tickets for those who want to push you, Caro, I reckon,' Dwayne Russell can be heard saying in audio from the event last Monday.

'That’s very funny Dwayne. Hysterical,' Wilson responded.

'And hold her under Dwayne,' Collingwood legend Tony Shaw added.

'Oh, boys,' Wilson said as the men dissolved into fits of laughter.

Where is the difference? Why does Caro laugh alongside her colleagues, yet all hell breaks loose when two presidents say the same thing?

Russell says "for those who want to push you" and Shaw says "And hold her under Dwayne" (Insert laughter from all here.....)

You missed the primary point which was Wilson was able to defend herself at AW. Which she did and quickly brought the matter to an end when it looked like getting out of hand. She was not at MMM. If fact McEverywhere goaded people into piling into her. Note the Black Widow comment.

McGuire: In fact I reckon we should start the campaign for a one-person slide next year. Caroline Wilson. And I’ll put in ten grand straight away- make it twenty. [laugher] And if she stays under, fifty. [louder laugher] [laugher]

What do you reckon guys? Who else is up there? I know you’re in JB?

Brayshaw: No, yep, Straight in

Danny Frawley: I’ll be in amongst it Ed

McGuire: Is Duck there?

Wayne Carey: Yes, I’m here mate.

McGuire: Duck’s in. Danny’s in — already spoken up.

Frawley: Yeah I’m in Ed.

McGuire: I could do an auction here today.

Frawley: I’ll actually jump in and make sure she doesn’t — I’ll hold her under, Ed.

McGuire: I reckon we could charge ten thousand for everyone to stand around the outside and bomb her.

Damien Barrett: I’m on Caro’s side now, Ed. I’m on Caro’s side these days, Ed.

[indecipherable]
McGuire: She’ll burn you like everyone else, mate. She’s like the black widow. She just sucks you in and gets you and you start talking to her and then BANG! She gets you.

Brayshaw: If you ran that auction from down there, I reckon you’d start grabbing some bids out of the seats too. There’d be money piling in everywhere

McGuire: It’s be magnificent. I think we should do that next year. It’s all good for footy.

Brayshaw: Bloody oath!

Russell's point is irrelevant in the context of the conversation because all those about to hit the ice are pushed. Saying there are many who would do it isn't world shattering. It would apply to almost all in the media, including Russell.

 

[sherb]

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...a-we-should-have-waved-goodbye-to?CMP=soc_567

 

[Hawk_francais]

This thread sure is fun but most miss the point. I'll put it in bullets:

1) Eddie screwed up. People say stupid things (it's becoming a lazy habit of his recently) but his real screw-up was not delivering a powerful apology. In times of adversity comes opportunity. He could have made a statement that had most of the AFL community grow their respect of him. But he didn't.

2) Caro is a sexist. Everyone knows it. She's actually far worse than any of the 'boys club members she ridicules are.' Too bad society isn't mature enough to call her out but we're close. Case in point is she has probably the most talented football journalist in Emma Quayle tight kept in a cage because she fears her development. If Caro truly wanted to fight the good fight for females would she do this or would you see her actively promote her and write about her? Of course but she doesn't.

3) The rage against political correctness is lazy. It's easily to see why it annoys some people but it's lazy to hate it. Political correctness is a force where the anonymous it those lacking an identity in life (mostly) can get gratification. But the point is it only works because it's rooted in being 'good'. In the grander scheme it's a social weapon. Some people like Caro represent the annoying aspect of it as she uses it to attack men that she fears. She only really fears them because she's got no integrity or real self esteem but we should look past that because her overall contribution to football has been mostly quite outstanding.

I wish people would embrace political correctness in the right way. If Eddie did he could have used integrity to deliver a powerful message that allowed us to see he's a good person, which I assume he is, make a stand about sexism, bullying and whatever other PC forces appeared and believe it or not, if he wanted to expose Caro for being a cherry picking hypocritical insecure person.

Example: Caroline Wilson has probably made one of the biggest contributions to AFL reporting in my time. I thank her for calling me out on this terrible and idiot thing I said on radio.

5 min sincere apology.

I will also offer Caro some advise because I respect her immensely. Please promote Emma Quayle because a fair few people have been wondering why you haven't done that.

BANG the army she unleashed on him from Fairfax would call her out in a second.

Use your head Eddie and act with integrity ...

1) Why does Caro need to do this. It's catch 22 for her. If she promotes Emma Quayle then she is a biased, sexist hag who is just giving Emma a promotion because she's a woman, and if she doesn't do it then she's failing in her responsibility to the 'female cause'. How about this:

Caroline Wilson works as a journalist in a field dominated by men, but she acts like it doesn't matter. She regularly writes things that she knows people won't like, she even makes mistakes just like all of her (male) peers. Because of this, she is naturally the most despised sports journalist. Because of this people love to 'joke' about taking her down a peg. They 'joke' about raping her, drowning her and even wheel out an actual sex doll from time to time. But it's all just a joke though and the same could've been said about a man, anyway.

But she should get the message here. You need your own slide because no one likes you, stop writing articles that compromise the 'chi' of the locker room - you're not one of us.

2) Why would you assume Eddie is a good person?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

How can I explain something complex without empathising with all perspectives ...

My messages were clear and your reply wasn't being helpful.

My apologies. Your post read to me as though these were your perspectives as it wasn't very clear to me.

Okay. I will attempt to be clear as well. Expousing the good in political correctness while simultaneously suggesting it is a good tool for those with no identity in life to find gratification is not helpful. I realise you were only considering another perspective, not necessarily your own. It just stood out a bit considering your own apparent support of political correctness.

Using the opportunity to suggest that the recipient in this case is a bigger sexist than the person who made comments about her doesn't seem appropriate in this context as it muddies the current issue somewhat. Again, I realise you may only be talking from the perspectives of men in the football industry but it would probably be useful for them to highlight these sexist attitudes of Wilson at the time they are happening, not as a response to questions about potential sexist attitudes towards her.

I hope I was more helpful on this occasion. Happy to take on board any feedback to this end.

 

[Feerits Elf]

The person I feel for in all this is Wayne Carey.

McGuire: What do you reckon guys? Who else is up there? I know you’re in JB?
Brayshaw: No, yep, straight in.
Frawley: I’ll be in amongst it Ed.
McGuire: Is Duck there?
Carey: Yes, I’m here mate.
McGuire: Duck’s in.

WTF? Poor old Carey was doing his level best just to follow the conversation, nek minnit he's a domestic violence advocate by association (past indiscretions notwithstanding).

 

[Tas]

I guess Eddie is lucky Caro isn't an umpire.

 

[JackFlash]

You missed the primary point which was Wilson was able to defend herself at AW. Which she did and quickly brought the matter to an end when it looked like getting out of hand. She was not at MMM. If fact McEverywhere goaded people into piling into her. Note the Black Widow comment.

McGuire: In fact I reckon we should start the campaign for a one-person slide next year. Caroline Wilson. And I’ll put in ten grand straight away- make it twenty. [laugher] And if she stays under, fifty. [louder laugher] [laugher]

What do you reckon guys? Who else is up there? I know you’re in JB?

Brayshaw: No, yep, Straight in

Danny Frawley: I’ll be in amongst it Ed

McGuire: Is Duck there?

Wayne Carey: Yes, I’m here mate.

McGuire: Duck’s in. Danny’s in — already spoken up.

Frawley: Yeah I’m in Ed.

McGuire: I could do an auction here today.

Frawley: I’ll actually jump in and make sure she doesn’t — I’ll hold her under, Ed.

McGuire: I reckon we could charge ten thousand for everyone to stand around the outside and bomb her.

Damien Barrett: I’m on Caro’s side now, Ed. I’m on Caro’s side these days, Ed.

[indecipherable]
McGuire: She’ll burn you like everyone else, mate. She’s like the black widow. She just sucks you in and gets you and you start talking to her and then BANG! She gets you.

Brayshaw: If you ran that auction from down there, I reckon you’d start grabbing some bids out of the seats too. There’d be money piling in everywhere

McGuire: It’s be magnificent. I think we should do that next year. It’s all good for footy.

Brayshaw: Bloody oath!

Russell's point is irrelevant in the context of the conversation because all those about to hit the ice are pushed. Saying there are many who would do it isn't world shattering. It would apply to almost all in the media, including Russell.

McEverywhere? It's Eddie bashing time. Talk about clutching at straws, Russell and Shaw did exactly the same thing and if Caro was annoyed then she should've admonished her colleagues there and then and not join in the laughter. I think this whole issue is more about Eddie bashing than anything else, Caro has form, (the Tracy/Martin story) and now the hypocrisy of her own radio team doing the same thing. It's points scoring, it's all ego.
Hypocrites and the entertainment industry have always gone hand in hand, but the relationship has become noticeably more intense in recent years. At least it seems like it has, because the Internet exists now, and we don't let people forget about anything. Eddie should know better, but he's more a victim of the demise of Aussie humour than anything else. We're all hypocrites, in a way. Even the most fierce animal rights activist may really love the leather shoes some poor cow made possible. The internet and social media won't let you get away with anything at all, If a commentator made an off-the-cuff comment on radio or TV six years ago, it damn well better fall in line with whatever shit they're talking about these days, because people will pounce if it doesn't. You're on a hiding to nowhere. Caro is no saint when it comes to bullying, she drove James Hird into the ground in recent years, she has her targets and she's always ready to shoot that arrow!

 

[H2F]

My apologies. Your post read to me as though these were your perspectives as it wasn't very clear to me.

Okay. I will attempt to be clear as well. Expousing the good in political correctness while simultaneously suggesting it is a good tool for those with no identity in life to find gratification is not helpful. I realise you were only considering another perspective, not necessarily your own. It just stood out a bit considering your own apparent support of political correctness.

Using the opportunity to suggest that the recipient in this case is a bigger sexist than the person who made comments about her doesn't seem appropriate in this context as it muddies the current issue somewhat. Again, I realise you may only be talking from the perspectives of men in the football industry but it would probably be useful for them to highlight these sexist attitudes of Wilson at the time they are happening, not as a response to questions about potential sexist attitudes towards her.

I hope I was more helpful on this occasion. Happy to take on board any feedback to this end.

Man I love you ODN...

Thank you mate. I'm sorry if I confused everyone ODN hopefully helped to make sense of what I was trying to do.

 

[AM]

McEverywhere? It's Eddie bashing time. Talk about clutching at straws, Russell and Shaw did exactly the same thing and if Caro was annoyed then she should've admonished her colleagues there and then and not join in the laughter. I think this whole issue is more about Eddie bashing than anything else, Caro has form, (the Tracy/Martin story) and now the hypocrisy of her own radio team doing the same thing. It's points scoring, it's all ego.
Hypocrites and the entertainment industry have always gone hand in hand, but the relationship has become noticeably more intense in recent years. At least it seems like it has, because the Internet exists now, and we don't let people forget about anything. Eddie should know better, but he's more a victim of the demise of Aussie humour than anything else. We're all hypocrites, in a way. Even the most fierce animal rights activist may really love the leather shoes some poor cow made possible. The internet and social media won't let you get away with anything at all, If a commentator made an off-the-cuff comment on radio or TV six years ago, it damn well better fall in line with whatever shit they're talking about these days, because people will pounce if it doesn't. You're on a hiding to nowhere. Caro is no saint when it comes to bullying, she drove James Hird into the ground in recent years, she has her targets and she's always ready to shoot that arrow!

What a load of convoluted largely irrelevant piece of nonsense.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

The person I feel for in all this is Wayne Carey.

McGuire: What do you reckon guys? Who else is up there? I know you’re in JB?
Brayshaw: No, yep, straight in.
Frawley: I’ll be in amongst it Ed.
McGuire: Is Duck there?
Carey: Yes, I’m here mate.
McGuire: Duck’s in.

WTF? Poor old Carey was doing his level best just to follow the conversation, nek minnit he's a domestic violence advocate by association (past indiscretions notwithstanding).

I think most picked up that he wasn't involved. I'd be a little annoyed with Eddie for doing that to me quite frankly.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Man I love you ODN...

Thank you mate. I'm sorry if I confused everyone ODN hopefully helped to make sense of what I was trying to do.

You know, I am quite fond of you too H2F. Please don't tell my wife.

 

[JackFlash]

What a load of convoluted largely irrelevant piece of nonsense.

Explain? You have to have an alternative argument to what is clearly the truth. Don't just say it's nonsense, prove it isn't!
3AW did the same thing
Caro has form
Eddie is getting bashed from pillar to post, but her colleagues are not.

Give me a break. The whole story is a beat up, now that's where the real nonsense lies.

 

[H2F]

You know, I am quite fond of you too H2F. Please don't tell my wife.

:hearts mate...

Secret is safe with me.

 

[Farm Boy]

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...a-we-should-have-waved-goodbye-to?CMP=soc_567

If he wasn't the president of Collingwood, and was purely a journalist/media man, these incidents would result in him increasing his pay packet. He would be in demand. Controversy creates interest, it creates clicks, it increases viewers. So for any media folk baying for Eddies blood, they are naive if they think he would just disappear. If he loses his Collingwood presidency - he will be bigger than ever. He really will be Eddie McEverywhere again. Eddie might be part of the last era, but he is even more suited to the current one.

 

[AM]

Explain? You have to have an alternative argument to what is clearly the truth. Don't just say it's nonsense, prove it isn't!
3AW did the same thing
Caro has form
Eddie is getting bashed from pillar to post, but her colleagues are not.

Give me a break. The whole story is a beat up, now that's where the real nonsense lies.

I've been through it buddy. You just don't get it as your last largely irrelevant post shows.

 

[JackFlash]

I've been through it buddy. You just don't get it as your last largely irrelevant post shows.

What a cop out....and i'm not your buddy!

Where was the AFL when Dustin Martin affair was twisted to make the victim look like a liar? Caro was right there in the thick of it.

She sits besides Russell and Shaw who says and that's a FACT and joins in a similar banter and nothing comes of it. Shaw says "I'll hold her under" and all she says is "Oh Boys please"

She it took it as it was intended tongue in cheek.

 

[Feerits Elf]

I'm not your friend, buddy!

He's not your buddy, guy!

 

[ItsGameTime]

Their board is weak. Accepted Eddie's apology.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

What a cop out....and i'm not your buddy!

Where was the AFL when Dustin Martin affair was twisted to make the victim look like a liar? Caro was right there in the thick of it.

She sits besides Russell and Shaw who says and that's a FACT and joins in a similar banter and nothing comes of it. Shaw says "I'll hold her under" and all she says is "Oh Boys please"

She it took it as it was intended tongue in cheek.

This again. If a friend says something like that to your face, you are going to take it a lot better than an enemy saying the same thing behind your back. Furthermore their intent is probably slightly different.

The fact that Ed went on about the black widow bit, suggesting to Barrett that Caro would be nice to you, get you to talk and then do him in too, suggests a lot of venom and vindictiveness not friendly banter towards a media colleague he respects.

 

[MacMum]

You know, I am quite fond of you too H2F. Please don't tell my wife.

:hearts mate...

Secret is safe with me.

Good grief you two, get a room!!

 

[Seadog]

One needs the other. Without cultural norms, there couldn't be PC to be judged against, and without PC, there wouldn't be an awarness of what can and can't be said publically. There is a line. Sometimes its hard to draw but its there. Trump wanting to profile muslims and ban all from entering the country, now that is "bigotry," as for Eddies joke, perhaps its poor taste, but a joke many normal good hearted Aussies might possibly make with friends and family over dinner, that I would consider PC.

I agree, if Eddie and co had made the same joke over a few beers after work, no problem. But they didn't, they broadcast it over the airwaves. The former is just a joke in bad taste, broadcasting it is insulting, hurtful and humiliating which is what was intended.

 

[AM]

What a cop out....and i'm not your buddy!

Where was the AFL when Dustin Martin affair was twisted to make the victim look like a liar? Caro was right there in the thick of it.

She sits besides Russell and Shaw who says and that's a FACT and joins in a similar banter and nothing comes of it. Shaw says "I'll hold her under" and all she says is "Oh Boys please"

She it took it as it was intended tongue in cheek.

You are making a fool of yourself. A primary school student could see the difference in the two matters. To once again attempt to make it clear she was able to defend herself in one and not the other. McGuire made several references that were borderline defamatory including referring to Wilson as a black widow. You clearly have not the slightest idea of the difference between banter and personal abuse. And you keep raising matters that are irrelevant to this issue.