Review Do we need a new coach? Part 2

[Ancient Tiger]

It wasn't the most ridiculous post for long because you came and posted this. "People like you are the reason......"
******* please!!!

Oh so we should give Dimma a chance is reasonable? FFS, he's had more chances than any coach in the history of the game. Accepting mediocrity from supporters that get excited about any small change and think it's the second coming IS one of the reasons we are where we are. If you don't realise that then I'm not sure where you've been for the last 36 years.

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

Oh so we should give Dimma a chance is reasonable? FFS, he's had more chances than any coach in the history of the game. Accepting mediocrity from supporters that get excited about any small change and think it's the second coming IS one of the reasons we are where we are. If you don't realise that then I'm not sure where you've been for the last 36 years.

I'm simply saying that no supporters attitude has any bearing on anything.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

Explains why we've been bottom 2 these last few years.

EAD.

Does explain why we couldn't win a final with 5 AA players on the list. Also why we got completely dominated by at least 3 teams this year and barely gave a yelp against the might of the Demons and Saints to finish in the lofty position of bottom 6.

 

[Football Tragic]

Oh so we should give Dimma a chance is reasonable? FFS, he's had more chances than any coach in the history of the game. Accepting mediocrity from supporters that get excited about any small change and think it's the second coming IS one of the reasons we are where we are. If you don't realise that then I'm not sure where you've been for the last 36 years.

In the end, he's the coach for the year. I want to see our club succeed and if I have to see us fail just to see Dimma axed then I wish him all the success in the world and if I have to hear another poster blame Hardwick for all our woes then to quote another of our ex-coaches - "I'll throw up!" I don't love Dimma either but I love the club, so lets focus on that and talk about what an amazing 2017 we will be enjoying together!

 

[Livonski]

EAD.

Does explain why we couldn't win a final with 5 AA players on the list. Also why we got completely dominated by at least 3 teams this year and barely gave a yelp against the might of the Demons and Saints to finish in the lofty position of bottom 6.

EAD?

5 AA? We couldn't win a final because we only had 5 top liners and the 5 worst on our best 22 weren't up to it. That's why we had to go backwards this year, and why some pretty poor performances were seen.
We've drafted well over the last 2 years, have we not? Traded very well just now.

But hey, you are welcome to extrapolate this year and ignore everything else. A bit short sighted if you ask me.

 

[exceptional design]

In the end, he's the coach for the year. I want to see our club succeed and if I have to see us fail just to see Dimma axed then I wish him all the success in the world and if I have to hear another poster blame Hardwick for all our woes then to quote another of our ex-coaches - "I'll throw up!" I don't love Dimma either but I love the club, so lets focus on that and talk about what an amazing 2017 we will be enjoying together!

Some people are talking about who we might draft. Others previously spoke about who we might pickup in the trade period. Some talk about who we did pickup in the trade period. Others talk about past or future performance of the players. All of the above is based on their opinions. I don't see an issue with people voicing their opinions about the coaches or their performance regarding their responsibilities.

I support the club and individuals who are performing their role well. I should also be able to voice my opinion on who is performing, or who hasn't performed, regardless of what time of the year it is. I hope for a successful season too, but I see a major risk with going with DH again and have done since before I joined BF.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

EAD?

5 AA? We couldn't win a final because we only had 5 top liners and the 5 worst on our best 22 weren't up to it. That's why we had to go backwards this year, and why some pretty poor performances were seen.
We've drafted well over the last 2 years, have we not? Traded very well just now.

But hey, you are welcome to extrapolate this year and ignore everything else. A bit short sighted if you ask me.

Stupid comments get stupid responses.

 

[Livonski]

Stupid comments get stupid responses.

Apology accepted.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

Apology accepted.

 

[Sir_Loin]

I'll STFU when you STFU.

Do we need a new coach? Yes. But it aint gonna happen, at least for 6 months. So you have two options, either whinge about nothing that will keep going around in circles and hate the club. Or buckle up for a win-win ride, either the ball and chain gets axed or he succeeds. Capisce.

*felt weird trying to see the positive side. I feel dirty.

If I want to discuss it I'll do it here on this thread which was set up to discuss that exact topic. If you don't want to read about it why come on here and whinge about a thread/topic that's set up to discuss it?

So why don't you politely go forth and multiply and sook up to other threads that don't discuss Hardwick and coaching changes and have your whinge there. Freedom of speech sassafras, on a thread to discuss Hardwick and coaching changes. Not sure why your so emotionally anchored to it.

 

[Nantes]

If I want to discuss it I'll do it here on this thread which was set up to discuss that exact topic. If you don't want to read about it why come on here and whinge about a thread/topic that's set up to discuss it?

So why don't you politely go forth and multiply and sook up to other threads that don't discuss Hardwick and coaching changes and have your whinge there. Freedom of speech sassafras, on a thread to discuss Hardwick and coaching changes. Not sure why your so emotionally anchored to it.

Should I have put a sarcasm face at the end of the post? There are so many picture faces and none scream to me 'sarcasm!'.

 

[Sir_Loin]

Should I have put a sarcasm face at the end of the post? There are so many picture faces and none scream to me 'sarcasm!'.

I was being saracastic too! What a coincidence!

Still love you. You will always be sassafras to me though.

 

[Nantes]

I was being saracastic too! What a coincidence!

Still love you. You will always be sassafras to me though.

I U

 

[CoggaRules]

EAD?

5 AA? We couldn't win a final because we only had 5 top liners and the 5 worst on our best 22 weren't up to it. That's why we had to go backwards this year, and why some pretty poor performances were seen.
We've drafted well over the last 2 years, have we not? Traded very well just now.

But hey, you are welcome to extrapolate this year and ignore everything else. A bit short sighted if you ask me.

So for the unitiated can you enlighten us as why we had to go backwards this year ? Like it's all good to say that type of lame shit but at the end of the day why the **** did we have to go backwards ? I mean why didn't we go nowhere like stay put or improve by 0.00001% but naaaa we had to go backwards. Excuse 101 book dude by a lame arse coach who is bereft of any ideas bar the one idea he had. don't really care now anyway,he is the coach now but one things for sure he is número uno dead man walking. Will be gone by years end and if not by next year. That one is a given whatever you say.

 

[wegetpumped]

I'm simply saying that no supporters attitude has any bearing on anything.

So your saying clubs dgaf about supporters and all the people's attitudes on membership cancellations so on are a waste? Don't you think that had something to do with the changes we just had?

 

[wegetpumped]

In the end, he's the coach for the year. I want to see our club succeed and if I have to see us fail just to see Dimma axed then I wish him all the success in the world and if I have to hear another poster blame Hardwick for all our woes then to quote another of our ex-coaches - "I'll throw up!" I don't love Dimma either but I love the club, so lets focus on that and talk about what an amazing 2017 we will be enjoying together!

You are wrong he has 2 more years hence the troubles on here lol.

 

[_RT_]

Middle age top ups, like Petterd, Thomas etc, may help buy a win but cap long term development. Not investing properly in the draft as a result, also keeping players on too long.

You say it caps long term development, I say that these older blokes aid it. Having those mature bodies around at VFL level to help protect some of the younger kids and to also pass on some tips. As for not investing in the draft, we've taken 50 picks since Hardwick arrived, that's National, Pre Season and Rookie drafts. On average that's 7 new players per season, not including trades and free agent pick ups. Granted not every pick has come good, but no club ever nails every pick.

Cheap uninventive gameplan that tried to mitigate the poor skills on our list, knowing full well it would never stand up under finals pressure.

That 'cheap' game plan was good enough between 2013-2015 to win enough games to play finals each year. In that period there was a stretch of games where for 9 straight weeks we had to play finals type football each and every week, knowing full well a loss would have ended our chance of making finals that year. That game plan also played to our strengths, we kept control of the ball and were able to pick our way through zones and presses. Granted we didn't win any finals during that time and that sucked, but again I didn't see many complaints about the game plan when we were playing finals each year.

The fact that we have such a poorly skilled list after 7 years of a rebuild.

This is nothing more than opinion dressed up as fact.

That our midfield was the worst in the competition as we invested nothing in ball winners and spent our picks on flankers.

Prior to 2015, our midfield was ranked 3rd in the league for clearances, but something went wrong the last 2 seasons as we fell to 16th in the rankings. That has been dealt with over the current off season with the addition of Caddy and Prestia plus a change of coaches. Hopefully the addition of a couple of inside midfielders at the draft will further help.

Poor rucks, Poor defense and poor forwards with absolutely nothing coming through as we held onto guys who show nothing.

Hard to argue with that based on 2016 results, but the addition of Nankervis will help the ruck division, while the return of Houli and addition of Yarran should help the defense improve. The forwards need Griffiths and/or Nankervis to stand up and give support to Jack. Lloyd and Rioli are dangerous at ground level and there is now an opening for someone to take the medium forward role.

Terrible head recruiter who seemed to have a job with no accountability.

I don't think he is as bad as people make out. What I do believe is that early on he suffered from being under funded as far as resources were concerned. Since there has been extra money put into scouting he has been able to unearth some later round picks that have the chance to make it. Now he has been moved on. Hopefully Clarke can deliver improved results with the improved resources.

Fact we were only really aiming for finals and never a flag.

Again opinion dressed up as fact.

 

[Tigersfan35]

I think that we should be giving DH one more year and if we don't win a final in 2017 then it is definitely time for someone new moving forward who could make the right decisions for us in the long term. Drafting well in our next rebuild (which will probably start in around next year) is crucial as well and something that Dimma didn't do well.

 

[wegetpumped]

[
Cheap uninventive gameplan that tried to mitigate the poor skills on our list, knowing full well it would never stand up under finals pressure.
That 'cheap' game plan was good enough between 2013-2015 to win enough games to play finals each year. In that period there was a stretch of games where for 9 straight weeks we had to play finals type football each and every week, knowing full well a loss would have ended our chance of making finals that year. That game plan also played to our strengths, we kept control of the ball and were able to pick our way through zones and presses. Granted we didn't win any finals during that time and that sucked, but again I didn't see many complaints about the game plan when we were playing finals each year.

He just said that the game plan didn't stack up in finals so your contradicting yourself by saying it didn't get us a finals win but.
Let me tell you in 14 we were crap and he got told to let the players play free game and we went on a stroll than first final he went back to his game plan.
He started 15 the same way only once again it wasn't working so it was changed and we went on a stroll till first final and we know what happened even though we were unlucky. This year he went back to his principals and we all know what happened. This are facts.
The fact all that he is in charge next year if he sticks to his sick gameplan he will be gone early and it be people with your opinions that will be screaming for his head as from some of us will be saying we told you so. Either way if things don't change it will be a loss for the rfc so hopefully the new ideas we have brought in we might be able to change things around for the better.

 

[Boston tiger]

EAD?

5 AA? We couldn't win a final because we only had 5 top liners and the 5 worst on our best 22 weren't up to it. That's why we had to go backwards this year, and why some pretty poor performances were seen.
We've drafted well over the last 2 years, have we not? Traded very well just now.

But hey, you are welcome to extrapolate this year and ignore everything else. A bit short sighted if you ask me.

But we still had to move on the assistant coaches even though coaching had nothing to do with.

 

[Livonski]

But we still had to move on the assistant coaches even though coaching had nothing to do with.

Renewal of playing list, coaches and staff in FD.

My reply was to a statement about 5 AAs and we couldn't win a final. So list was my only focus. But other factors needed to be addressed also

 

[_RT_]

He just said that the game plan didn't stack up in finals so your contradicting yourself by saying it didn't get us a finals win but.
Let me tell you in 14 we were crap and he got told to let the players play free game and we went on a stroll than first final he went back to his game plan.
He started 15 the same way only once again it wasn't working so it was changed and we went on a stroll till first final and we know what happened even though we were unlucky. This year he went back to his principals and we all know what happened. This are facts.
The fact all that he is in charge next year if he sticks to his sick gameplan he will be gone early and it be people with your opinions that will be screaming for his head as from some of us will be saying we told you so. Either way if things don't change it will be a loss for the rfc so hopefully the new ideas we have brought in we might be able to change things around for the better.

In 2014 we tried to change to a game plan that we believed would be capable of handling finals pressure and it didn't work because we didn't have the players required to play that style of highly contested footy. Our list was built to be one that controlled the footy and forced turnovers by forcing the opposition into mistakes. That was how we beat Hawthorn Fremantle Sydney regularly during those years despite them being more contested sides than us. Where we struggled was playing against sides who were not only good at contested footy, but played quick free flowing footy once they got control of the ball.

As I've said it would appear that we have addressed that this off season by adding some inside types in Caddy and Prestia to the midfield and by all reports our drafting will also aim to add the same type of players. This will enable guys like Cotchin and Martin to play more outside which will aid our ball movement and then there is the return/addition of Houli Yarran McIntosh C.Ellis Menadue Markov Short that will also help make necessary changes to the way we play.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

You say it caps long term development, I say that these older blokes aid it. Having those mature bodies around at VFL level to help protect some of the younger kids and to also pass on some tips. As for not investing in the draft, we've taken 50 picks since Hardwick arrived, that's National, Pre Season and Rookie drafts. On average that's 7 new players per season, not including trades and free agent pick ups. Granted not every pick has come good, but no club ever nails every pick.


That 'cheap' game plan was good enough between 2013-2015 to win enough games to play finals each year. In that period there was a stretch of games where for 9 straight weeks we had to play finals type football each and every week, knowing full well a loss would have ended our chance of making finals that year. That game plan also played to our strengths, we kept control of the ball and were able to pick our way through zones and presses. Granted we didn't win any finals during that time and that sucked, but again I didn't see many complaints about the game plan when we were playing finals each year.


This is nothing more than opinion dressed up as fact.


Prior to 2015, our midfield was ranked 3rd in the league for clearances, but something went wrong the last 2 seasons as we fell to 16th in the rankings. That has been dealt with over the current off season with the addition of Caddy and Prestia plus a change of coaches. Hopefully the addition of a couple of inside midfielders at the draft will further help.


Hard to argue with that based on 2016 results, but the addition of Nankervis will help the ruck division, while the return of Houli and addition of Yarran should help the defense improve. The forwards need Griffiths and/or Nankervis to stand up and give support to Jack. Lloyd and Rioli are dangerous at ground level and there is now an opening for someone to take the medium forward role.


I don't think he is as bad as people make out. What I do believe is that early on he suffered from being under funded as far as resources were concerned. Since there has been extra money put into scouting he has been able to unearth some later round picks that have the chance to make it. Now he has been moved on. Hopefully Clarke can deliver improved results with the improved resources.


Again opinion dressed up as fact.

Utter pile of apologist crap. Clubs have bottomed out and rebuilt and even won flags in the time it's taken us to peak at 7th with no finals wins! Our list has so many holes after 7 years it's pathetic, that comes down to list management, recruiting and the feedback on players from the coaches. Results speak louder than words, and we have nothing to indicate that our club is a competently run organization. You might be happy with the mediocrity this club dishes up but the rest of us can look around the rest of the competition and wonder what the **** is going on down at the RFC?

 

[wegetpumped]

In 2014 we tried to change to a game plan that we believed would be capable of handling finals pressure and it didn't work because we didn't have the players required to play that style of highly contested footy. Our list was built to be one that controlled the footy and forced turnovers by forcing the opposition into mistakes. That was how we beat Hawthorn Fremantle Sydney regularly during those years despite them being more contested sides than us. Where we struggled was playing against sides who were not only good at contested footy, but played quick free flowing footy once they got control of the ball.

As I've said it would appear that we have addressed that this off season by adding some inside types in Caddy and Prestia to the midfield and by all reports our drafting will also aim to add the same type of players. This will enable guys like Cotchin and Martin to play more outside which will aid our ball movement and then there is the return/addition of Houli Yarran McIntosh C.Ellis Menadue Markov Short that will also help make necessary changes to the way we play.

Yeah and i hope it happens. But you said our superb game plan got us to those 2 finals when in fact it did not. Only when he was told to change it we went on a roll and even when we kept winning he changed it back in the finals to his play style which like you said we were not good enough to execute in finals so why revert to that when our free flowing play style got us there in the first place.
The thing is RT we were never skilled enough to play his playing style yet he kept persisting in it even to this year when we were so crap club came out and said this playing style isn't on as the game has moved on and we were caught under prepared.
As you say we recruited the 2 mids is that so we can execute his awesome game plan when the club has admitted it don't stack up?

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

So your saying clubs dgaf about supporters and all the people's attitudes on membership cancellations so on are a waste? Don't you think that had something to do with the changes we just had?

I'm talking about on field.
The most ridiculous thing I ever read is when somebody tells another supporter they are accepting mediocrity.
If you don't like the coach how the **** are you going to get rid of him?
We have been the most irate supporter group for over 30 years due to being rubbish. How much effect has that had?
We could get fair dinkum instead of being some try hard Internet tough guys and all cancel our memberships and not go to games but would that help us? Of course not.
So basically it's being said that a supporter who types angry words is a better supporter than one who doesn't see the point in doing so.
If you actually step back and look at it you'll see how ridiculous it is.