Coach John Longmire

[RW]

No matter how good a coach is, if he's lost the players and won't change his plan then he's no good. Not saying any of that is happening at Sydney but you never really know. There's a reason guys like sheedy, hafey etc were all let go at various points in their careers. Doesn't mean they weren't great coaches.

That's a fair point, but I don't think we've reached that point with Horse yet. Looks this thread is going to hang around for a while though.

 

[GotTheGoodes]

Looks this thread is going to hang around for a while though.

Just like Horse!





I'll see myself out.

 

[6yearsold]

i'd love to see a new young coach with a fresh approach to reinvigorate the players. the roos-horse dynasty has had its day, we need someone who can connect more with our younger players (thats an eternal perception) and has a history (perhaps as an assistant coach) of developing them.

disregarding the brick around our neck that is buddy's contract or just buddy, how can our top 5 or 6 players all be out of form for the first 5 games? a couple of them were being talked about as brownlow contenders ffs.

 

[replicant]

There is no way we should sack Longmire. This thread is ridiculous.

We're consistently fielding a side with lots of kids. Remember when GWS first started? All that talent, all those top picks, yet they got smashed by 100 points every week. Did people blame the coach?

It takes time for a side to build, both physically and as a team. We can stick all the talented kids we want in like Heeney, Mills, Hayward etc, but they haven't played AFL for 3-4 seasons yet, and just aren't ready for the level. Watch the NEAFL teams (not the AFL ones, but teams like NT, Uni etc...), watch the u18 games. The skill level and positioning is way, way below AFL standard. It takes more then one pre-season and a few games to get up to speed. Given some time we'll settle on a pretty solid best 22. That team will get 20-30 games together, and we'll start to improve. There were already signs of it in the past couple of games, but it'll develop over the course of this season. We probably won't play finals this year, but we will next year, and the one after that too. We have a talented squad, they just need time.

The absolute last thing we need is to add more disruption to a young side by changing the coach and playing style. You want to do that, prepare for another season at the bottom of the table as the whole team tries to adapt to the new play style and structures.

Stick with Longmire. Give the kids time. Transition to a new coach in a few years, in a nice, smooth handover with minimal disruption.

 

[Grongey]

I'd have been up for trading Tippett last year, when he had some currency.

It's time. If Longmire is such a good coach, he'll have no trouble finding another gig will he.

Coaching cleanout, it's time. Kirky can stay on as midfield coach, and senior coach in waiting, if he proves himself.

It worked for Richmond.

 

[mtooler]

Who do you think should replace him or the whole coaching group?

I don't think we can unfortunately, hes on big $.

 

[Tuco]

Since we all melted during the first 6 rounds we've seen a few interesting things.

Buddy still leads 80m+ up the ground. But is no longer going as deep as the defensive 50 arc as he was in the first 6 rounds (that's left to Reid). Definitely staying forward.

We've increased our short kicking, and reduced our hand passing (it seems) and are now finding space. Lots of it. On the spread. It's leading to less holding the ball decisions and fewer bad turnovers. We broke Norf with our willingness to both play on and refuse to just give it up with speculative kicks.

Our mids aren't crushing every pack, they're keeping their feet...and we're seeing daylight in our setups for Parker, Hewett, JPK and Hannas to run into. Excellent improvement.

Jones has come up the ground more and is attacking through the midfield.

There is clearly a renewed aggression in the group. They're really backing each other.

Injured players aren't just parachuting in on reputations/or holding their spots for that matter (Kieran got the tap).

All of the above has resulted in renewed confidence - especially in the younger players who really need validation to avoid going into their shells.

I'm giving Horse some credit here. This is evidence of positive tweaks.

 

[Olian]

i'd love to see a new young coach with a fresh approach to reinvigorate the players. the roos-horse dynasty has had its day, we need someone who can connect more with our younger players (thats an eternal perception) and has a history (perhaps as an assistant coach) of developing them.

disregarding the brick around our neck that is buddy's contract or just buddy, how can our top 5 or 6 players all be out of form for the first 5 games? a couple of them were being talked about as brownlow contenders ffs.

So you want a young coach who bonds with the younger players. Leigh Matthews did ok for an old bloke coaching the younger Lions 15 years ago. Age has nothing to do with it.

Players fall out of form for many reasons such as missing a few players in the team replaced with rookies. Throw in interrupted preseasons and they are off their games. Confidence can drop quickly.

 

[Kirkswan]

I have no idea where the loss of confidence in Horse has come from, and yes, I am aware that we lost the first 6 games of this season.

Consider for a moment, some of things that can be attributed to Horse over the last 6 years…

• The Swans made the final series every single year
• The development and management of some very good young players: Parker, Hannebery, Rampe, Heeney, Mills just to name a few.
• The Swans have maintained an excellent relationship with the press during that time.
• The leadership during the Goodes crisis
• The support shown to Buddy during his health issues

Now some of you may want to say that the players made the finals not Horse, but that just indicates to me that you have not played sport at an elite level with any success. (Because this is a chicken and egg scenario, you can’t have one without the other.) And some of you may say that the development and management of young players, the press relationship and all the rest, cannot be attributed to him, but you would be wrong in my opinion! All of these things would be covered under his KPIs (Key Performance Indicators).

The idea that winning grand finals is one of his KPIs is ludicrous in my opinion. KPIs are measures of your performance of a role against the minimum requirements of that role. No-one would agree to that (winning a grand final) as a pass indicator. It would fall into bonus territory, as would just making the grand final. Making the final series might be a KPI, but even that wouldn’t be every year, maybe something like 3/4 out of every 5 years.

Horse has maintained our presence in the final series while ensuring our future by developing and playing youngsters, year after year… He is one more brilliant decision by the most strategic thinking board of directors in the competition, and you can absolutely bet that he is meeting his KPIs and earning bonuses year after year. He is in no danger of being stood down…

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I have no idea where the loss of confidence in Horse has come from, and yes, I am aware that we lost the first 6 games of this season.

It's coming from a generation of supporters with the attention span of a goldfish.

"I want us to be more dynamic......I want us to take the game on......I want someone to connect more with the players......the roos/horse dynasty has had its day".

These kinds of statements have one thing in common. They are entirely meaningless. Written from behind a screen by people who have quite probably never spilled a drop of blood for their team mates on the field.

They want shiny new toys all the time. They listen too much to radio commentators who have to fill 24 hours a day 7 days a week with footy talk so they wind up speaking complete bullshit......and these people lap it up.

If they don't see 10 pack marks from Sam Reid, they want him traded. If Lloyd doesn't kick 50m down the throat of Franklin they want him delisted.

They don't understand accountability.

 

[Jewelsbon]

It's coming from a generation of supporters with the attention span of a goldfish.

"I want us to be more dynamic......I want us to take the game on......I want someone to connect more with the players......the roos/horse dynasty has had its day".

These kinds of statements have one thing in common. They are entirely meaningless. Written from behind a screen by people who have quite probably never spilled a drop of blood for their team mates on the field.

They want shiny new toys all the time. They listen too much to radio commentators who have to fill 24 hours a day 7 days a week with footy talk so they wind up speaking complete bullshit......and these people lap it up.

If they don't see 10 pack marks from Sam Reid, they want him traded. If Lloyd doesn't kick 50m down the throat of Franklin they want him delisted.

They don't understand accountability.

Great post, couldn't agree more

 

[Keyter]

It's coming from a generation of supporters with the attention span of a goldfish.

"I want us to be more dynamic......I want us to take the game on......I want someone to connect more with the players......the roos/horse dynasty has had its day".

These kinds of statements have one thing in common. They are entirely meaningless. Written from behind a screen by people who have quite probably never spilled a drop of blood for their team mates on the field.

They want shiny new toys all the time. They listen too much to radio commentators who have to fill 24 hours a day 7 days a week with footy talk so they wind up speaking complete bullshit......and these people lap it up.

If they don't see 10 pack marks from Sam Reid, they want him traded. If Lloyd doesn't kick 50m down the throat of Franklin they want him delisted.

They don't understand accountability.

.....easier to dish than to give...

 

[Kapanis]

It's coming from a generation of supporters with the attention span of a goldfish.

"I want us to be more dynamic......I want us to take the game on......I want someone to connect more with the players......the roos/horse dynasty has had its day".

These kinds of statements have one thing in common. They are entirely meaningless. Written from behind a screen by people who have quite probably never spilled a drop of blood for their team mates on the field.

They want shiny new toys all the time. They listen too much to radio commentators who have to fill 24 hours a day 7 days a week with footy talk so they wind up speaking complete bullshit......and these people lap it up.

If they don't see 10 pack marks from Sam Reid, they want him traded. If Lloyd doesn't kick 50m down the throat of Franklin they want him delisted.

They don't understand accountability.

I agree with a lot of your posts, this one I don't. I'm not going to comment on Horse at all but to make assumptions on someone's opinions based on "the shiny new toy" me generation is quite simply wrong, let alone having not spilt blood bullshit. My opinion of Horse as a coach is not dictated by the opinion of others, here, in the media, anywhere. A post of over generalisations from start to finish, not your normal standards Bruce.

 

[The King!]

Since we all melted during the first 6 rounds we've seen a few interesting things.

Buddy still leads 80m+ up the ground. But is no longer going as deep as the defensive 50 arc as he was in the first 6 rounds (that's left to Reid). Definitely staying forward.

We've increased our short kicking, and reduced our hand passing (it seems) and are now finding space. Lots of it. On the spread. It's leading to less holding the ball decisions and fewer bad turnovers. We broke Norf with our willingness to both play on and refuse to just give it up with speculative kicks.

Our mids aren't crushing every pack, they're keeping their feet...and we're seeing daylight in our setups for Parker, Hewett, JPK and Hannas to run into. Excellent improvement.

Jones has come up the ground more and is attacking through the midfield.

There is clearly a renewed aggression in the group. They're really backing each other.

Injured players aren't just parachuting in on reputations/or holding their spots for that matter (Kieran got the tap).

All of the above has resulted in renewed confidence - especially in the younger players who really need validation to avoid going into their shells.

I'm giving Horse some credit here. This is evidence of positive tweaks.

If horse gets credit for that he still wears the blame for the issues in the side

Still has odd structures, even yesterday, that defence still looks shaky

Reid goes back so early

 

[sataris]

Going by the form of the last 2 weeks, some on here would be offering horse a lifetime contract.

He's still performing below par this year. , 2-7

Genius coaching,



Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I agree with a lot of your posts, this one I don't. I'm not going to comment on Horse at all but to make assumptions on someone's opinions based on "the shiny new toy" me generation is quite simply wrong, let alone having not spilt blood bullshit. My opinion of Horse as a coach is not dictated by the opinion of others, here, in the media, anywhere. A post of over generalisations from start to finish, not your normal standards Bruce.

Well I was addressing a general question in general terms. I've gone back 5 pages to find your specific opinion on Horse and can't see it. But I can tell you I well remember the dark years and it'll take me more than a batch of losses from a crippled side to scream for the sacking of our most successful coach ever.

 

[The King!]

Going by the form of the last 2 weeks, some on here would be offering horse a lifetime contract.

He's still performing below par this year. , 2-7

Genius coaching,



Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

Some think because south were s**t in the 60s horse is a god for making the finals

 

[sataris]

Some think because south were s**t in the 60s horse is a god for making the finals

Some will just say premiership player/coach.

And just accept that hes been outcoached by clarkson/beveridge and in 2017 Nathan buckley.



Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[The King!]

I have no idea where the loss of confidence in Horse has come from, and yes, I am aware that we lost the first 6 games of this season.

Consider for a moment, some of things that can be attributed to Horse over the last 6 years…

• The Swans made the final series every single year
• The development and management of some very good young players: Parker, Hannebery, Rampe, Heeney, Mills just to name a few.
• The Swans have maintained an excellent relationship with the press during that time.
• The leadership during the Goodes crisis
• The support shown to Buddy during his health issues

Now some of you may want to say that the players made the finals not Horse, but that just indicates to me that you have not played sport at an elite level with any success. (Because this is a chicken and egg scenario, you can’t have one without the other.) And some of you may say that the development and management of young players, the press relationship and all the rest, cannot be attributed to him, but you would be wrong in my opinion! All of these things would be covered under his KPIs (Key Performance Indicators).

The idea that winning grand finals is one of his KPIs is ludicrous in my opinion. KPIs are measures of your performance of a role against the minimum requirements of that role. No-one would agree to that (winning a grand final) as a pass indicator. It would fall into bonus territory, as would just making the grand final. Making the final series might be a KPI, but even that wouldn’t be every year, maybe something like 3/4 out of every 5 years.

Horse has maintained our presence in the final series while ensuring our future by developing and playing youngsters, year after year… He is one more brilliant decision by the most strategic thinking board of directors in the competition, and you can absolutely bet that he is meeting his KPIs and earning bonuses year after year. He is in no danger of being stood down…

I like a bit of the post
'But some of what you attribute as success to Horse is not much to do with how he coaches

Thats like saying we should pick Brandon Jack if he helps a few ladies cross the street.

 

[The King!]

Some will just say premiership player/coach.

And just accept that hes been outcoached by clarkson/beveridge and in 2017 Nathan buckley.



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People just dont rate the list if they are happy with 2-6 i guess

 

[sataris]

Jokes aside the issue here is that we currently sit at 2-7

Are we happy with this?

Im not, this list is better than that.

Im afraid that we will end up like carlton where a .500 season is "acceptable".

I expect to make finals, the standard you see is the standard you accept.

I do not want to accept 2-7.

Someone please explain to me why this is ok?

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[The King!]

Jokes aside the issue here is that we currently sit at 2-7

Are we happy with this?

Im not, this list is better than that.

Im afraid that we will end up like carlton where a .500 season is "acceptable".

I expect to make finals, the standard you see is the standard you accept.

I do not want to accept 2-7.

Someone please explain to me why this is ok?

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I think if we have a culture that demands success constantly it is a good thing

Besides you can be paying over a million for a forward and competing for spoons, thats just bloody stupid

If he misses the finals i dont really give a toss what he did before he should be moved on (only problem is finances)

 

[Olian]

Jokes aside the issue here is that we currently sit at 2-7

Are we happy with this?

Im not, this list is better than that.

Im afraid that we will end up like carlton where a .500 season is "acceptable".

I expect to make finals, the standard you see is the standard you accept.

I do not want to accept 2-7.

Someone please explain to me why this is ok?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

We are 2-6 with 10th best percentage.

 

[Olian]

I think if we have a culture that demands success constantly it is a good thing

Besides you can be paying over a million for a forward and competing for spoons, thats just bloody stupid

If he misses the finals i dont really give a toss what he did before he should be moved on (only problem is finances)

Didn't Clarkson miss the finals in 09? Should he have been moved on?

 

[sataris]

We are 2-6 with 10th best percentage.

Should i start writing a 9 year contract?

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