Recruiting Trade & Free Agency IV - hypotheticals etc. (Continued in Part V)

[Laverde2Smack]

If it means getting Josh Kelly id be happily doing it. Wouldnt you?

And why would GSW trade for Kobe Mutch a year after not wanting him as an academy player?

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[Laverde2Smack]

Brilliant speed and dash, can kick goals from half back and averages 23 touches a game, could do a lot worse than a player like JJ. I shall continue to be in the minority of people to rate JJ haha

He is a gun no doubt.

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[eth-dog]

An Ebert leaving Port would be like a Watson leaving Essendon

 

[WEEVZ]

An Ebert leaving Port would be like a Watson leaving Essendon

Yup, they're a Port Adelaide family through and through. When he left the Eagles he was always Port bound.

 

[citizen-erased]

It was stated in the Herald Sun that Doggies were only offering him ~$550k a year.

I think $700 would be appealing to him and I don't think that would be overs for us considering the recent CBA increase.

At 24 he is the perfect age and for mine he would be a great addition. Depth through midfield is no doubt a priority but I don't necessarily believe guys like Martin and Kelly are the answer. You can still get quality midfielders through other avenues that will do a job.

players to re-sign next year include McGrath, Laverde, Langford, Hartley, Ridley, Begley and Mutch
I'd expect some cash will be needed for them

Also, considering our backline will look like this;
Bags - Hartley - Ambrose
McGrath - Hurley - McKenna
+ Gleeson & Ridley
Who does JJ replace?
Unless he becomes a winger and replaces Colyer?

 

[Killer_Mike]

players to re-sign next year include McGrath, Laverde, Langford, Hartley, Ridley, Begley and Mutch
I'd expect some cash will be needed for them

Also, considering our backline will look like this;
Bags - Hartley - Ambrose
McGrath - Hurley - McKenna
+ Gleeson & Ridley
Who does JJ replace?
Unless he becomes a winger and replaces Colyer?

I would only get JJ if he didnt cost a first rounder which is unlikely.

But from what you are saying above.

Bags - Everyone except basically me has him delisted or retired at years end.

McGrath - Midfielder. Would be very surprised if he's not getting significant time up the ground next year.

Gleeson - I dont rate at all.

Ridley - Is a third tall. Is not a line breaker.

Depth in that role is not as deep as you think. And if this year has taught us anything, its how important it is to have dash from defence.


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[Teflon Dons]

Season Highlights for JJ
29 disps (16 kicks 13 hballs), 3 marks and a goal in Rd 10 40-pt win over St Kilda at Etihad Stadium (27 May 2017)
24 disps (15 kicks 9 hballs) and 7 tackles in Rd 9 23-pt loss to Geelong at Simonds Stadium (19 May 2017)
26 disps (22 kicks 4 hballs) and 5 marks in Rd 8 8-pt loss to West Coast at Domain Stadium (12 May 2017)
24 disps (17 kicks 7 hballs) and 3 marks in Rd 7 5-pt win over Richmond at Etihad Stadium (6 May 2017)
28 disps (18 kicks 10 hballs) and a goal in Rd 5 32-pt win over Brisbane at Etihad Stadium (22 Apr 2017)
29 disps (12 kicks 17 hballs) and a goal in Rd 3 16-pt loss to Fremantle at Domain Stadium (8 Apr 2017)
30 disps (18 kicks 12 hballs), 7 marks and 2 goals in Rd 1 14-pt win over Collingwood at the MCG (24 Mar 2017)

We could use that off our hbf. Agree on it needing to be less than a 1st rounder but I'd just pay him the 800k. Send McGrath to the middle next year.


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[Killer_Mike]

Season Highlights for JJ
29 disps (16 kicks 13 hballs), 3 marks and a goal in Rd 10 40-pt win over St Kilda at Etihad Stadium (27 May 2017)
24 disps (15 kicks 9 hballs) and 7 tackles in Rd 9 23-pt loss to Geelong at Simonds Stadium (19 May 2017)
26 disps (22 kicks 4 hballs) and 5 marks in Rd 8 8-pt loss to West Coast at Domain Stadium (12 May 2017)
24 disps (17 kicks 7 hballs) and 3 marks in Rd 7 5-pt win over Richmond at Etihad Stadium (6 May 2017)
28 disps (18 kicks 10 hballs) and a goal in Rd 5 32-pt win over Brisbane at Etihad Stadium (22 Apr 2017)
29 disps (12 kicks 17 hballs) and a goal in Rd 3 16-pt loss to Fremantle at Domain Stadium (8 Apr 2017)
30 disps (18 kicks 12 hballs), 7 marks and 2 goals in Rd 1 14-pt win over Collingwood at the MCG (24 Mar 2017)

We could use that off our hbf. Agree on it needing to be less than a 1st rounder but I'd just pay him the 800k. Send McGrath to the middle next year.


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And that has been in a team that has lacked cohesion and playing with different teammates in defence.

Last year he and Biggs were running rings around opponents but JJ is having to provide much more this year because he's not getting support. Thats why teams are roughing him up. They know if they shut him down the doggies will struggle.

If and when doggies get going again JJ will start killing it again. He's a gun.


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[Teflon Dons]

And that has been in a team that has lacked cohesion and playing with different teammates in defence.

Last year he and Biggs were running rings around opponents but JJ is having to provide much more this year because he's not getting support. Thats why teams are roughing him up. They know if they shut him down the doggies will struggle.

If and when doggies get going again JJ will start killing it again. He's a gun.


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Been targeted heavily with no protection. Fletcher Roberts is just plain awful, they're struggling badly back there JJ is the only threat and its been identified the last few weeks. I'd back him to get back to his confident 2016 form with our back 6 and help McKenna learn the position.

 

[WEEVZ]

And that has been in a team that has lacked cohesion and playing with different teammates in defence.

Last year he and Biggs were running rings around opponents but JJ is having to provide much more this year because he's not getting support. Thats why teams are roughing him up. They know if they shut him down the doggies will struggle.

If and when doggies get going again JJ will start killing it again. He's a gun.


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You've hit the nail on the head there to a certain extent. Yes JJ isn't getting much support in terms of someone else picking up the slack and generating the run that he otherwise would be, but he's also showing he's incapable of changing how he plays when he has someone running with him (as proven by his meagre showing against the Swans 2 weeks ago).

I reckon we'll probably have Walla running with him in Round 19. And given how Walla attacks the ball and goes after his man, I think there's a fair chance JJ will have a poor game against us.

 

[Yoda_]

JJ is good. Dont think he is worth what hes asking for though

 

[blitzer]

I would only get JJ if he didnt cost a first rounder which is unlikely.

But from what you are saying above.

Bags - Everyone except basically me has him delisted or retired at years end.

McGrath - Midfielder. Would be very surprised if he's not getting significant time up the ground next year.

Gleeson - I dont rate at all.

Ridley - Is a third tall. Is not a line breaker.

Depth in that role is not as deep as you think. And if this year has taught us anything, its how important it is to have dash from defence.


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I dunno, if you compared it to any other position on the ground I reckon we have more depth than any other I could name.

McKenna - Breaking out this year - we'll know better by the end of the season but he projects to be a similar player to JJ albeit not as good.
McGrath - yes he COULD move to the midfield full time next year but its completely our choice and we don't have to. You only have to look at Mills at Sydney this year to see that.
FWIW I want to see the midfield move as well but the timing is still up for grabs. Heppell didn't really move to the midfield til year 3 either.
Gleeson - He's your average footballer type. Can play the role and do it cheaply.
McNiece - Right now the club have him behind Baguley but he's shown signs when he's played and I reckon is the front runner to take over the lockdown small d spot.
Ridley - Whilst not a true running line breaker, he can break the lines with his kicking similar to Goddard down back.
Bags - The club will probably retain him for another year. As depth if nothing else.

That's not even including other guys like Morgan or Long who could develop in that role.

At a certain point - even if you haven't hit the jackpot you can't invest in a role any further if its not midfield. List sizes are small and with 18 clubs you only get so much draft resources to use. I reckon going a bit cheap in defense is preferable.

Spending big on midfield and key forwards (if required) seems to be the way to go.

 

[eth-dog]

McKenna is better than JJ already IMO. Part of a half back's jib is to, you know, defend.

 

[Killer_Mike]

I dunno, if you compared it to any other position on the ground I reckon we have more depth than any other I could name.

McKenna - Breaking out this year - we'll know better by the end of the season but he projects to be a similar player to JJ albeit not as good.
McGrath - yes he COULD move to the midfield full time next year but its completely our choice and we don't have to. You only have to look at Mills at Sydney this year to see that.
FWIW I want to see the midfield move as well but the timing is still up for grabs. Heppell didn't really move to the midfield til year 3 either.
Gleeson - He's your average footballer type. Can play the role and do it cheaply.
McNiece - Right now the club have him behind Baguley but he's shown signs when he's played and I reckon is the front runner to take over the lockdown small d spot.
Ridley - Whilst not a true running line breaker, he can break the lines with his kicking similar to Goddard down back.
Bags - The club will probably retain him for another year. As depth if nothing else.

That's not even including other guys like Morgan or Long who could develop in that role.

At a certain point - even if you haven't hit the jackpot you can't invest in a role any further if its not midfield. List sizes are small and with 18 clubs you only get so much draft resources to use. I reckon going a bit cheap in defense is preferable.

Spending big on midfield and key forwards (if required) seems to be the way to go.

I'm not suggesting we even trade for JJ. All I'm saying is I think he's an excellent player and it's a position of need.

Your assessment above clearly shows that you also believe that it's a position of need. It's one of the most important roles in football and we have no depth in it.

 

[eth-dog]

I'm not suggesting we even trade for JJ. All I'm saying is I think he's an excellent player and it's a position of need.

Your assessment above clearly shows that you also believe that it's a position of need. It's one of the most important roles in football and we have no depth in it.

Couldn't disagree more on both fronts. He's an average player in a position we actually don't need. Added on that he'll probably cost our first round pick, which could be used on a position we actually need (say a young FF or an inside midfielder) and 800k? Would be a stupid move

 

[Killer_Mike]

Couldn't disagree more on both fronts. He's an average player in a position we actually don't need. Added on that he'll probably cost our first round pick, which could be used on a position we actually need (say a young FF or an inside midfielder) and 800k? Would be a stupid move

Your opinion confirms I'm on to something!

 

[BrunoV]

I'd leave McGrath at half back.

He's not really the midfielder we need at this stage as run is not a problem. I'm far from being convinced that midfield is the best use of McGrath's talents in the next few years.

McGrath and McKenna at half back will be brutal for opponents. Over the course of the next few years we've got the time to recruit or otherwise sign a half back for a reasonable price when we reach the point that McGrath simply has to play midfield.

I think people forget that the running, unaccountable half back is probably the easiest position on the ground to play if you have some speed and can kick. The only guys who are elite players in the position are the ones who can also defend.

I don't see why we'd bother with any player who is half measure for any spot.

 

[eth-dog]

Your opinion confirms I'm on to something!

He's an average kick and there's one thing you seem to forget about being a good half back. It's something called defending. Which he doesn't do.

Honestly I would rather have a combination of McGrath, McKenna, Gleeson and Francis rotating through there as mids and half backs. If we bring him in on 800k it will be the dumbest list management decision we'd have made in a long time.

 

[Killer_Mike]

He's an average kick and there's one thing you seem to forget about being a good half back. It's something called defending. Which he doesn't do.

Honestly I would rather have a combination of McGrath, McKenna, Gleeson and Francis rotating through there as mids and half backs. If we bring him in on 800k it will be the dumbest list management decision we'd have made in a long time.

I agree on the 800k remark which lets face it, we don't know if that's accurate.

I actually am not campaigning for JJ so you know. If you read my posts you will see that I'm suggesting that we need more depth through our small defenders, and in particular line breaking ones.

I couldn't care less where they come from but they are integral to a good side and I personally believe we need another.

 

[MAAAATTDAAAAMON]

Is Parish OOC? Would love him up here in Brisbane. Pick 1 for him?

Brisbane would be silly to do this I think. Parish will be a very good player but I don't think he'll ever be a real superstar. Pick one should be looking for a true superstar. Bombers wouldn't trade him anyway.

 

[quotemokc]

JJ is like a poor mans Lewis Jetta when he played for Sydney and was good.

Jetta could actually kick as well.

 

[TheGrizz]

I might get shouted down for this...

But does anyone else reckon jono o'rourke is worth a punt on.

Starved of opportunity at GWS and a premiership team at hawthorn and now had some injury worries and his price is down. Looked a gun mid at u18s

Easy to forget he was a top two picks not too long ago
If he is let go at end of season he may be worth a rookie spot I reckon.

 

[Zach Package]

We could use that off our hbf. Agree on it needing to be less than a 1st rounder but I'd just pay him the 800k. Send McGrath to the middle next year.

I'd be more inclined to go the opposite way if anything, stump up the pick (because clearly that's the kind of player you're looking for with that pick anyway) but ask him to buy in to what we've got going on and leave money on the table.

I'll come at this from a different direction. Campbell has openly stated that we consult the board when it comes to big money recruits, so instead of just giving a thumbs up or thumbs down, let's say they've got a set of criteria they've all got to meet before they get the board's seal of approval.

positional need
body
character
age
repeatability

Now these are my criteria and not theirs but I would argue that the of the 5 JJ is only truly ticking off age and body. As far as positional fit goes McKenna and McGrath both going great guns has basically solved that issue, as far as character goes where there's smoke there's rarely not fire, even if it's just a small one with journalists standing around it pouring petrol on it and as far as repeatability goes 2016 was a break out for him but 2017 has been massively disappointing, who knows what 2018 and beyond is going to get you.

 

[eth-dog]

I might get shouted down for this...

But does anyone else reckon jono o'rourke is worth a punt on.

Starved of opportunity at GWS and a premiership team at hawthorn and now had some injury worries and his price is down. Looked a gun mid at u18s

Easy to forget he was a top two picks not too long ago
If he is let go at end of season he may be worth a rookie spot I reckon.

Bloke is average at VFL level let alone AFL

 

[TheGrizz]

Bloke is average at VFL level let alone AFL

Pick 2 talent doesn't just go away.

Has been average true, but injuries haven't helped.
I'm not saying sell the farm for him, in not even saying trade for him

But if he is let go, I sparsely think you can go wrong giving a 23 year old former pick 2 a one year shot on the rookie list