List Mgmt. Trade & F.A. 2017 (if a scenario sounds wrong - read on before posting)

[Apex36]

One thing l will say that already shows a mismanagement of the salary cap, is that we can only sign Grundy to a 3 year deal, really this guy should have a 5 year deal. Grundy, currently in the top 3 or 4 ruckman in the comp, and could be the best ruckman in the comp next year.
Yet we have Mayne sitting with a 4 yr contract!!! Buckley must see this and punch the wall. Im sure Bucks is like WTF!

3 years for Grundy takes him to 8 years and FA eligible. If you reckon the club didn't try to lock him up for 5 years you're kidding yourself. He deliberately took a shorter contract for his FA payday, just like every high profile player is doing these days.

 

[Quicky]

Sounds very much like he's guessing

Language like "I can't work out..." and "they might have to..." suggests he's got no clue and is just guessing.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

One thing l will say that already shows a mismanagement of the salary cap, is that we can only sign Grundy to a 3 year deal, really this guy should have a 5 year deal. Grundy, currently in the top 3 or 4 ruckman in the comp, and could be the best ruckman in the comp next year.
Yet we have Mayne sitting with a 4 yr contract!!! Buckley must see this and punch the wall. Im sure Bucks is like WTF!

You do understand that there are two parties to a deal, right?

 

[Scodog10]

3 years for Grundy takes him to 8 years and FA eligible. If you reckon the club didn't try to lock him up for 5 years you're kidding yourself. He deliberately took a shorter contract for his FA payday, just like every high profile player is doing these days.

This all day long. I'll hang the club for some of the deals they've thrown around the past few years, but this isn't one of them.

FWIW I would agree that Ralph's POV on our TPP was a guess, but an educated one or at least more educated than all on here because he's in regular contact with player agents in his role.

It's a small incestuos industry (look at the potential for Lethlean to get back in immediately) where everyone talks to everyone. Ralph only needs to ask a few player managers what the go is at Collingwood and he'll have a reasonable idea. We aren't at GWS/ Hawthorn salary shredding levels, but I'd be shocked if we haven't reach a point of big contract in big contract out.

 

[MagpieBat]

3 years for Grundy takes him to 8 years and FA eligible. If you reckon the club didn't try to lock him up for 5 years you're kidding yourself. He deliberately took a shorter contract for his FA payday, just like every high profile player is doing these days.

Exactly. Comes out of contract right on the year he becomes eligible for Free Agency, right when he should be the fully developed article and smack bang in the middle of his peak prime years. Perfect strategy for the player. Us, not so much...

 

[Apex36]

Exactly. Comes out of contract right on the year he becomes eligible for Free Agency, right when he should be the fully developed article and smack bang in the middle of his peak prime years. Perfect strategy for the player. Us, not so much...

You just have to cross your fingers that by that time he's become dedicated enough to the club that he's willing to turn his back on FA offers without forcing the club in to matching bids.

 

[soreplums]

If Salem is on the trade table, we should look at it

 

[unplugged]

That feel when you get a BigFooty trophy for 5k likes. I'd like to thank my fans.

 

[CFC2010]

Exactly. Comes out of contract right on the year he becomes eligible for Free Agency, right when he should be the fully developed article and smack bang in the middle of his peak prime years. Perfect strategy for the player. Us, not so much...

I think 5 year contracts are very dangerous for any Club (E.G Reid, Cloke) and if Grundy chooses to leave for more $ in three years then as a Club we have failed.

What I would like to hear in three years time is Pies Premiership players taking pay cuts to keep the team together........a boys gotta dream.

 

[Scodog10]

If Salem is on the trade table, we should look at it

It's a yes from me. If Lever comes in there might be an opening.

 

[soreplums]

It's a yes from me. If Lever comes in there might be an opening.

They need a second first rounder for Lever.
Could we trade 6 for two mid-late first rounders, use one for Salem and a second rounder (throw in 36 if needed); use the second first rounder to trade in another player, or pair it with Melbourne's second rounder to get back in the top 5-8?

 

[Scodog10]

They need a second first rounder for Lever.
Could we trade 6 for two mid-late first rounders, use one for Salem and a second rounder (throw in 36 if needed); use the second first rounder to trade in another player, or pair it with Melbourne's second rounder to get back in the top 5-8?

It sounds complicated. Perhaps we could simplify it by targeting the two first rounders of Brisbane and Richmond to give them a live pick before Ballenden and Naish are bid on? Then use one of those as the core of a deal for Salem and take the other to the draft.

It's all highly speculative of course, but I'd rather us chase Salem than Smith because he would fit in nicely off a back flank, IMO.

 

[Crazy Tails]

Devon Smith as well?

****Cats board I know but****

They are desperate to cash in whilst they are in the window of opportunity after their investment in Danger so they will try and strike whilst the iron is hot. Last Friday night shows they are desperate for additional avenues to goal; Gaz, Stringer, Smith instantly adds 50-70 goals and tonnes of x-factor.

I must be the only one who can see how the Cats could still get all this done.

- Firstly the TPP has gone up for next year
- They will lose veterans Lonergan and Mackie (frees up some cap)
- They also look like they are willing to trade out players who played a fair bit this year and have some currency (Motlop and Menzel) freeing up more cap and getting them some trade currency
- Other names who have shown a bit but struggling for opportunity also rumored to be on the table (Horlin-Smith, Darcy Lang). Some clubs will offer something ok for either of those two; and
- Lastly Geelong won't die wondering in trade week they just get things done.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

If Adam Saad is even considering to come to Victoria, he becomes our number 2 priority right behind Tom Lynch.

He's exactly what we need. A more controlled, skilful Lumumba. We need that bit of flair in the backline. I wouldn't think twice and give up next years second easy and a player. If he left, we could make do with 2 of these : Smith, Ramsay, Sinclair.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

I think 5 year contracts are very dangerous for any Club (E.G Reid, Cloke) and if Grundy chooses to leave for more $ in three years then as a Club we have failed.

I don't get why you are contradicting yourself.

The fact is - Grundy on $600k/yr is pretty good value, and well below what a lot of us thought offers would be.
That is only a 3-year contract is a trade-off, but you can understand why Brodie would want that re: Free Agency. It allows him to see where we're at as a club, allows Adelaide and Port to have room post Jacobs/Ryder, and allows his own value to rise.

Say his agent has said to him that in 3yrs time he could be worth $1m+ per year - and when Collingwood came asking for a 5yr contract, Brodie/Agent said: "Well only if you pay me that ($1m/yr)" - surely a 3yr/$1.8m deal is much better than a 5yr/$5m deal? Especially when we can negotiate that type of extension anytime during this contract, and right now, most players seem to be staying with their own clubs when approaching free agency.

 

[CFC2010]

I don't get why you are contradicting yourself.

The fact is - Grundy on $600k/yr is pretty good value, and well below what a lot of us thought offers would be.
That is only a 3-year contract is a trade-off, but you can understand why Brodie would want that re: Free Agency. It allows him to see where we're at as a club, allows Adelaide and Port to have room post Jacobs/Ryder, and allows his own value to rise.

Say his agent has said to him that in 3yrs time he could be worth $1m+ per year - and when Collingwood came asking for a 5yr contract, Brodie/Agent said: "Well only if you pay me that ($1m/yr)" - surely a 3yr/$1.8m deal is much better than a 5yr/$5m deal? Especially when we can negotiate that type of extension anytime during this contract, and right now, most players seem to be staying with their own clubs when approaching free agency.

I am not contradicting myself at all.......in five years time Grundy "could" be in the same position as Reid and Cloke at the end of their contracts.

My point is if Grundy continues at the Pies after three years it is because he wants to be at the Club and not primarily for the $.

 

[skelly12]

With looming certainty that Chris Mayne's contract is an absolute deadweight liability, I'm wondering whether we could look at an American-sport style salary dump trade. Hawthorn definitely moved towards the callous business-like approach to dealing with players last year and I think as we become more used to free agency, clubs will view salary cap space as more of an asset.

With that in mind, would you all be accepting of this approach? I.e. it would look something like Chris Mayne + 2nd rounder/player etc to Team A with cap space for a nominal asset in return, i.e. 5th/6th rounder.

 

[Linda_Lovelace]

With looming certainty that Chris Mayne's contract is an absolute deadweight liability, I'm wondering whether we could look at an American-sport style salary dump trade. Hawthorn definitely moved towards the callous business-like approach to dealing with players last year and I think as we become more used to free agency, clubs will view salary cap space as more of an asset.

With that in mind, would you all be accepting of this approach? I.e. it would look something like Chris Mayne + 2nd rounder/player etc to Team A with cap space for a nominal asset in return, i.e. 5th/6th rounder.

Problem is clubs can bank unused cap and use it in latter years so why would a club take Maybe and lose some of their bank ( i know you are saying they are paying his salary for our second rounder but, the lose of banking is a serious factor).

 

[Scodog10]

With looming certainty that Chris Mayne's contract is an absolute deadweight liability, I'm wondering whether we could look at an American-sport style salary dump trade. Hawthorn definitely moved towards the callous business-like approach to dealing with players last year and I think as we become more used to free agency, clubs will view salary cap space as more of an asset.

With that in mind, would you all be accepting of this approach? I.e. it would look something like Chris Mayne + 2nd rounder/player etc to Team A with cap space for a nominal asset in return, i.e. 5th/6th rounder.

I think it's the smart resolution, but I don't know if the AFL would tick off on it and I'm struggling to find a club that would go for it. Perhaps North because they were keen last year and may need to meet their salary floor, but three years is a long time to carry that sort of player. It's a hard sell, IMO.

 

[Linda_Lovelace]

****Cats board I know but****

They are desperate to cash in whilst they are in the window of opportunity after their investment in Danger so they will try and strike whilst the iron is hot. Last Friday night shows they are desperate for additional avenues to goal; Gaz, Stringer, Smith instantly adds 50-70 goals and tonnes of x-factor.

I must be the only one who can see how the Cats could still get all this done.

- Firstly the TPP has gone up for next year
- They will lose veterans Lonergan and Mackie (frees up some cap)
- They also look like they are willing to trade out players who played a fair bit this year and have some currency (Motlop and Menzel) freeing up more cap and getting them some trade currency
- Other names who have shown a bit but struggling for opportunity also rumored to be on the table (Horlin-Smith, Darcy Lang). Some clubs will offer something ok for either of those two; and
- Lastly Geelong won't die wondering in trade week they just get things done.

Menzel is last in the AFL for pressure acts inside the f50, LAST. This at a time when pressure is seen as one of the key drivers to success. He has virtually no currency. Motlop is soft, physically and mentally, might attract some interest but not much.

The rest you mention are junk. They are in a terrible spot, Lonegan is still there best defender and he is finished, Taylor not far behind and there is not much coming through to replace them. They also have little to no picks after paying up in previous years.

Danger will be all they have to watch in 2 years time because they will be cratering.

 

[barrackers]

With looming certainty that Chris Mayne's contract is an absolute deadweight liability, I'm wondering whether we could look at an American-sport style salary dump trade. Hawthorn definitely moved towards the callous business-like approach to dealing with players last year and I think as we become more used to free agency, clubs will view salary cap space as more of an asset.

With that in mind, would you all be accepting of this approach? I.e. it would look something like Chris Mayne + 2nd rounder/player etc to Team A with cap space for a nominal asset in return, i.e. 5th/6th rounder.

GWS smartly traded Palmer and his contract to Carlton last year for pick 135, so there's some AFL precedent.

 

[Thefly38]

With looming certainty that Chris Mayne's contract is an absolute deadweight liability, I'm wondering whether we could look at an American-sport style salary dump trade. Hawthorn definitely moved towards the callous business-like approach to dealing with players last year and I think as we become more used to free agency, clubs will view salary cap space as more of an asset.

With that in mind, would you all be accepting of this approach? I.e. it would look something like Chris Mayne + 2nd rounder/player etc to Team A with cap space for a nominal asset in return, i.e. 5th/6th rounder.

Good theory good post . Obe of those grub journos will prob run with this

 

[Crazy Tails]

Menzel is last in the AFL for pressure acts inside the f50, LAST. This at a time when pressure is seen as one of the key drivers to success. He has virtually no currency. Motlop is soft, physically and mentally, might attract some interest but not much.

The rest you mention are junk. They are in a terrible spot, Lonegan is still there best defender and he is finished, Taylor not far behind and there is not much coming through to replace them. They also have little to no picks after paying up in previous years.

Danger will be all they have to watch in 2 years time because they will be cratering.

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree. I still think clubs will pay semi decent currency at the trade table for those mentioned that help them get the deals done. Pressure acts aside Menzel kicked 38 goals from 17 games (out best kicked 34). Also dependent on Stringer/Smith etc wanting to go there.

I suppose we will find out after trade week. Enough talk about Geelong anyway. Back to the Pies!

On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Seedsfan]

Jon Ralph has reported tonight that Collingwood has no room to move within the salary cap due to poor TPP management, unless we trade out one or two of our better paid players.

They say this about us every year. Take no note of what Jon Ralph says

 

[Thefly38]

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree. I still think clubs will pay semi decent currency at the trade table for those mentioned that help them get the deals done. Pressure acts aside Menzel kicked 38 goals from 17 games (out best kicked 34). Also dependent on Stringer/Smith etc wanting to go there.

I suppose we will find out after trade week. Enough talk about Geelong anyway. Back to the Pies!

On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Menzel = free agent ?