Preview Round 2: Sydney vs Adelaide, Friday @ SCG

[MF]

Could be barking up the wrong tree but the Grundy Back Listing is smoke and mirrors imo. Was he listed as injured during the week ? Omission imo. Time waits for nobody but if his exit from Senior Football for this one particular Swan they can GAGF. Out and Out Warrior for this club and if anyone deserves to go out with pride and dignity in tact it is Reg. Like I said could have got this wrong but smell a rat.

It was always a risk for him going around again this year, same way it is for McVeigh and Jack. No disgrace in getting dropped at this stage IMO.

 

[MF]

I hope someone like COR can just cement that running HB role finally

Yep. We've been screaming out for a half back with some pace for years now.

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Could be barking up the wrong tree but the Grundy Back Listing is smoke and mirrors imo. Was he listed as injured during the week ? Omission imo. Time waits for nobody but if his exit from Senior Football for this one particular Swan they can GAGF. Out and Out Warrior for this club and if anyone deserves to go out with pride and dignity in tact it is Reg. Like I said could have got this wrong but smell a rat.

Maybe you are WW, there is such a thing as being injured AFTER injury listings.

 

[Donza]

666 at SCG will be interesting.

Dat intersecting 50

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Great to see the experts on here got their wish for an unchanged side. All you have to do is read and listen to the swans news...it’s all in there!

 

[Donza]

Yep. We've been screaming out for a half back with some pace for years now.

He needs some confidence to spread outside.
Crows play quite narrow defense forward.
Symptomatic of AO dimensions

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Thurlow stiff but his time will come.

 

[caesar88]

Because Melican and Grundy will give us close to similar output in the same position.

Your examples are a bit silly imo. The gap in performance between those is much larger as well as, with the exception of McVeigh, have longevity beyond 2019.

I also made the point I believe Grundy would have been told last year that he will be behind Melican when fit.

There is much more to list management and even selection than just “Horse”.

They were pretty apt examples. You could make arguments that the continued presence of JPK and McVeigh as the head honchos of their respective areas of the ground are halting progress and development on the future of those areas, just like Grundy sticking around is halting the development of Melican.

Grundy was significantly better than Melican last week. I also think Horse sees Grundy as equally as integral as Melican to the team, since he was willing to play them both in the JLT, and then again in rd 1 when all the pressure was on. I have no doubt that if Grundy is out on the back of a fairly decent game where he was nowhere near our worst, then it's injury-related.

 

[mikey_san]

Better question is why he wasn’t in last week!

Cause he was totally out of form - like a chook with its head cut off in the JLT - didn't even land 1 tackle. Went back and found form in the twos.
For once we've done that totally right.
Better balance in the team - hope Ronke and COR can land 10 tackles between them. We'll need them to in order to win. We are going to just have to absolutely crack in and want the win far more than they do to get the points. We have the forwards to kick a score - can we get it to them?
I'd of brought KJ in after his BOG performance in the NEAFL for mr low intensity millenial, but LIM will prove me wrong I hope.

 

[caesar88]

So half the players you mentioned have yet to break into the team and are young as you admitted. Yet you're absolutely rinsing the coaches for not playing the style they might eventually be capable of playing? You're saying it's a matter of time for those players but you're not prepared to give the same time to the coaches...

Whether you like it or not the current starting squad isn't capable of playing the progressive style you are begging for. Instead of being naive maybe notice that we are in the middle of a transition. Half the team is from that hard edged era. Clearly the coaching staff and list management have realised what we need to progress hence why we've drafted those types you mentioned. Suck it up, this is 2009 all over again, and you know what happened after that... Not only does horse need a few more years before we decide his future, but he also deserves it as well as our respect and support as fans for what he has treated us to for a frckn decade. Stop being a bunch of spoilt shits.

Yet we're playing them and developing them through a brand of footy that's not suited to many of them.

If you draft athletic, skilful, classy types, but play a brand of footy that is catered to players who are the opposite of that, then that would undeniably impact their development.

If not wanting hindered development of our talented young players is being a "spoilt s**t", then tattoo that across my forehead.

 

[Wolfgang West]

Maybe you are WW, there is such a thing as being injured AFTER injury listings.

Gee Mick I wouldn't of thought that possible.

 

[mikey_san]

Because Melican and Grundy will give us close to similar output in the same position.

Your examples are a bit silly imo. The gap in performance between those is much larger as well as, with the exception of McVeigh, have longevity beyond 2019.

I also made the point I believe Grundy would have been told last year that he will be behind Melican when fit.

There is much more to list management and even selection than just “Horse”.

Melican is improving off a REALLY low base in the JLT. Caught behind a bit last week and using his hips to tunnel forwards rather than his fist to punch it. I wonder if he's got his body back to pre injury yet - perhaps can't match for speed on the lead. Hope he has a good one. He was just starting to look like a future AA to me when he went down.

 

[The King!]

Grundys back injury to save face?

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Gee Mick I wouldn't of thought that possible.

Then maybe you barked up the wrong tree?

 

[Mick Oxlong]

They were pretty apt examples. You could make arguments that the continued presence of JPK and McVeigh as the head honchos of their respective areas of the ground are halting progress and development on the future of those areas, just like Grundy sticking around is halting the development of Melican.

Grundy was significantly better than Melican last week. I also think Horse sees Grundy as equally as integral as Melican to the team, since he was willing to play them both in the JLT, and then again in rd 1 when all the pressure was on. I have no doubt that if Grundy is out on the back of a fairly decent game where he was nowhere near our worst, then it's injury-related.

Cannot argue with that...but someone will.

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Grundys back injury to save face?

Mountains and mole hills?

 

[zyzzbruh]

Yet we're playing them and developing them through a brand of footy that's not suited to many of them.

If you draft athletic, skilful, classy types, but play a brand of footy that is catered to players who are the opposite of that, then that would undeniably impact their development.

If not wanting hindered development of our talented young players is being a "spoilt s**t", then tattoo that across my forehead.

How can we play the brand when the players we've drafted aren't all in the squad yet?? You want attacking footy even though majority of the squad CANT play like that. Just cause you have a florent, Hayward and ronke in there doesn't mean you can just switch everything up. Plus you all think we have a 'defensive' gameplan when it's not even the case. It looks like we do because the opposition are able to actually get the ball to our defence and trap it in there. That is a regressing midfield, not a defensive plan. Where was horses defensive gameplan in 2016 when we were breezing past 100 points week in week out playing a brilliant gut running, immaculately skilled brand of footy. That's irrelevant though isn't it.

 

[MarkP]

Dawson the next Towers?

Not saying he should not have been dropped but the kid needs a bit of a run surely.

Team is fine, another no excuse side. If it doesn't perform then we can have a serious conversation.

 

[caesar88]

How can we play the brand when the players we've drafted aren't all in the squad yet?? You want attacking footy even though majority of the squad CANT play like that. Just cause you have a florent, Hayward and ronke in there doesn't mean you can just switch everything up. Plus you all think we have a 'defensive' gameplan when it's not even the case. It looks like we do because the opposition are able to actually get the ball to our defence and trap it in there. That is a regressing midfield, not a defensive plan. Where was horses defensive gameplan in 2016 when we were breezing past 100 points week in week out playing a brilliant gut running, immaculately skilled brand of footy. That's irrelevant though isn't it.

You are conveniently glossing over the aspects of our game that are clearly instructed. Like the way we present sideways out of defence, like how our half backs intentionally take those sideways options, like how we intentionally ignore taking the corridor switch in favour of a long bomb down the line, like how our forwards are always being sucked up the ground instead of remaining inside 50, like how our midfielders never lower their eyes and instead go for the kick and hope out of the centre square (yet conveniently harness their eye-lowering abilities when Buddy is injured!). Just like how we can conveniently harness our attacking qualities when the game is on the line and we're at risk of a game slipping out of our reach.

You just don't need to take it so personally was more my original point. We're not being spoilt shits for wanting our team to be better, nor are we Horse-hating just because we acknowledge his faults. To me, he's a very good coach but quick, clean and efficient footy have never been hallmarks of John Longmire teams. Nothing wrong with that, it's not his particular strength, he's only human. He has many other strengths, unfortunately our recruiting (which has been borderline impeccable) doesn't seem to align with many of his strengths.

 

[TheMase]

They were pretty apt examples. You could make arguments that the continued presence of JPK and McVeigh as the head honchos of their respective areas of the ground are halting progress and development on the future of those areas, just like Grundy sticking around is halting the development of Melican.

Grundy was significantly better than Melican last week. I also think Horse sees Grundy as equally as integral as Melican to the team, since he was willing to play them both in the JLT, and then again in rd 1 when all the pressure was on. I have no doubt that if Grundy is out on the back of a fairly decent game where he was nowhere near our worst, then it's injury-related.

I think we have made different arguments. Mine is Melican and Grundy will give similar output and thus the team will be much the same. Yours is those players hold back others from reaching their development earlier (which is also true) but the team would suffer in the meantime as their output won’t be as good.

I personally think that Melican was nowhere near as bad last week as has been made out. He got caught out on the lead at times due to the lack of pressure on their midfielders and subsequent sublime delivery that resulted. Not many defenders can stop that.

Grundy got moved into the ruck last week instead of being kept as a pillar of the defence. That to me says he is behind Aliir and Melican as KPD and therefore the one to miss out if we decide to go with only two. Significantly better he was not imo

 

[caesar88]

I think we have made different arguments. Mine is Melican and Grundy will give similar output and thus the team will be much the same. Yours is those players hold back others from reaching their development earlier (which is also true) but the team would suffer in the meantime as their output won’t be as good.

I personally think that Melican was nowhere near as bad last week as has been made out. He got caught out on the lead at times due to the lack of pressure on their midfielders and subsequent sublime delivery that resulted. Not many defenders can stop that.

Grundy got moved into the ruck last week instead of being kept as a pillar of the defence. That to me says he is behind Aliir and Melican as KPD and therefore the one to miss out if we decide to go with only two. Significantly better he was not imo

You specifically made the argument that Horse had tapped Grundy on the shoulder and made him a casualty of the youth movement. I was talking specifically about the last game where I think everyone could unanimously agree that Grundy was far from our worst defender. You obviously believe Horse doesn't just have both eyes on the present, but has one eye on the long game.

So riddle me this...

If Horse is such a youth-inspired guillotine-expert with our fossils, why did he make the young, promising rising star of our back-line Aliir Aliir the scape-goat for Grundy when he was absolutely putrid and lazy and also unfit during our 0-6 run? I love Grundy and always been a warrior but that was not two months of his career that he would be proud of as his effort and intensity simply wasn't there. So why wasn't he dropped and Aliir was?

Because of the experience Grundy offered over Aliir? (Don't we need that experience now after a pretty disappointing loss?)

Or did it have nothing to do with Grundy, but Aliir simply needed to find form in the NEAFL? (Doesn't Melican need that now after a very ordinary month or so?)

 

[zyzzbruh]

You are conveniently glossing over the aspects of our game that are clearly instructed. Like the way we present sideways out of defence, like how our half backs intentionally take those sideways options, like how we intentionally ignore taking the corridor switch in favour of a long bomb down the line, like how our forwards are always being sucked up the ground instead of remaining inside 50, like how our midfielders never lower their eyes and instead go for the kick and hope out of the centre square (yet conveniently harness their eye-lowering abilities when Buddy is injured!). Just like how we can conveniently harness our attacking qualities when the game is on the line and we're at risk of a game slipping out of our reach.

You just don't need to take it so personally was more my original point. We're not being spoilt shits for wanting our team to be better, nor are we Horse-hating just because we acknowledge his faults. To me, he's a very good coach but quick, clean and efficient footy have never been hallmarks of John Longmire teams. Nothing wrong with that, it's not his particular strength, he's only human. He has many other strengths, unfortunately our recruiting (which has been borderline impeccable) doesn't seem to align with many of his strengths.

I feel like the sideways only happens when there isn't an option down the line. Instead of kicking it long down the line to the dismay of everyone here, atleast we're keeping the ball. It's obvious in our skills and constant fumbling, lowering the eyes isn't even an option with deplorable skills. If I didn't see an elite team for 6 solid years under horse trust me id be on your bandwagon. We used to score 120+ points for a laugh, our hands in close, ball handling and skills were immaculate. We used to run the ball from our defensive 50 to our goals square with 3 handballs and a kick. We used to swarm the opposition no matter where the ball was on the ground. It's funny how hindsight only works at certain times.

Yes we don't have the same team anymore and we need to adapt in certain areas. But you can only adapt to a certain point. The fundamentals of footy have always stayed the same. If your squad is unbalanced and you have a weak midfield, you're shouting for no reason. No coach can just make a team tick by moving a few magnets around. With that logic you'd have Clarko going to Carlton and winning the premiership

 

[caesar88]

Dawson the next Towers?

Not saying he should not have been dropped but the kid needs a bit of a run surely.

Team is fine, another no excuse side. If it doesn't perform then we can have a serious conversation.

Dawson has had a tough run at it so far in his career. Debuts during the dreaded 0-6 run, then can't crack into the team while we're on a dominant streak on the run home in 2017. His matches last year were also far from smooth sailing: he played in two losses (to the Bombers and Hawks) and two very narrow wins over Collingwood and Melbourne. Then his first game this year and it's a loss. Unlike other youngsters, like Papley, Hewett, Mills, who benefitted from coming into a strong team with it's leaders firing on all cylinders, Dawson has come into a team that's, for lack of better words, limp.

But unlike, say, Hayward or Heeney, who seem to do well even when the rest of the team is stinking it up around them, Dawson strikes me as the type who needs the team around him to be solid. It's why his form so far in his career is almost unrecognisable from his NEAFL form. Clearly he's finding that transition difficult, and who can blame him. This year is going to be more of the same with the team probably struggling for form and consistency. It's why I said people would be disappointed with Dawson's season (and was then accused of Dawson-hating.)

 

[The King!]

Mountains and mole hills?

Seems a coincidence he was s**t and now injured

 

[The King!]

Dawson the next Towers?

Not saying he should not have been dropped but the kid needs a bit of a run surely.

Team is fine, another no excuse side. If it doesn't perform then we can have a serious conversation.

He’s the easy safe move ,