Play Nice Indigenous AFL players call out Adam Goodes's treatment ahead of The Final Quarter documentary release

[4thebloods]

Here is a time line of Adam Goodes.

* May 24, 2013: Goodes stops playing and points out a young Collingwood supporter in the crowd who called him an ape during Sydney’s clash with the Magpies at the MCG – the opening game of Indigenous Round. The 13-year-old girl later apologises to Goodes, saying she didn’t understand it was a racial slur.
* May 29, 2013: Collingwood president Eddie McGuire fans the flames of the controversy when he suggests that Goodes be involved in the promotion of a visiting production of the musical ‘King Kong’. He quickly apologises for the gaffe.
* January, 2014: Goodes is made Australian of the Year and goes on to use that platform to highlight the state of race relations in Australia and push for improvements in indigenous health and other indigenous welfare issues.
* May 29, 2015: Goodes performs an indigenous ‘war cry’ dance directed at Carlton fans after he kicks a goal during the Swans’ round-nine clash at the SCG. Goodes stands by the controversial dance, which involved him pantomiming the throwing of a spear, saying it was a celebration of his indigenous heritage.
* July 26, 2015: Goodes is loudly booed by sections of the Perth crowd during Sydney’s loss to West Coast, leading indigenous teammate Lewis Jetta to perform a similar war cry directed at Eagles’ supporters.He describes the situation as “a continual battle”.
* July 28, 2015: Goodes is given two days off by the Swans to come to terms with the furore that erupts following events in Perth.
* July 29, 2015: Goodes reported to be so upset by the controversy that he is considering his future in the game and given indefinite leave by the club.
* August 7, 2015: AFL boss Gillon McLachlan says that anyone who boos Goodes in his return to the field against Geelong would be considered a racist.
* September 12, 2015: Goodes returns to Perth for the Swans’ qualifying final against Fremantle and is roundly booed at Domain Stadium, as one fan is ejected for racially vilifying a Swans player, presumed to be Goodes.
* September 18, 2015: After kicking two goals in Sydney’s semi-final loss to North Melbourne, Goodes informs his teammates he is retiring from AFL football.

So before he was booed by West Coast fans for the first time he had had the incident with the 13 year old girl, Eddies racist comment and he threw an invisible spear at supporters of the opposition team. He then gets a reaction by opposition supporters by getting booed. He sulks and threatens to quit if it continues, the virtue signaling media heads like Caro and the AFL under cheif SJW Gill calls anyone who booes Adam racists. This just makes the fans even more pissed off so they keep booing him.
One thing at the time that pissed people off was that the AFL took no action against Adam for the spear incident, with plenty of people pointing out that if some other player did something aggressive like that to supporters they would have called to answer for it. Adam claims it was a traditional war dance, which got shot down by Aboriginal elders as full of sh it, it wasnt a traditional dance at all.
Then he got the backlash from the supporters and he didnt have the strength of character to deal with it and sulked off. Like I said, becareful what you wish for.

A couple of things to add

1) he didn’t throw a spear/boomerang at anyone. It’s become a great line but check the footage there was no throwing of anything;

2) any commentary on the Carlton game mentions a significant and noticeable level of booing in the hawthorn game the previous week in particular but also weeks prior - I’m just saying any suggestion the dance and reaction to it kicked this off is wrong.


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[Kwality]

I don't know. Do you even follow the game?

Sure. Booing occurred to that extent for playing for frees. I don't use it often but definitely worth dusting off the for that one.

Players were regularly booed being my point, its not just Goodes. I've acknowledged on this thread that I became unsettled by the way the booing played out, just as I am well aware why I booed. You seem to need to broad brush the whole thing, & I reject that.
Plenty of non footy types tried to use the whole thing for what ever.
Most can walk & chew gum.

 

[Cleric]

Well, am surprised to hear that. Not very open minded of you cleric.
The war dance was created and taught to Goodes by a group of the best young indigenous teenage footballers in the country under a development and leadership program called the Flying Boomerangs.
So although you may have lived through it, sounds like you misunderstood and maybe watching it will help clear that up?

He initially sold it as a traditional Aboriginal war dance, which was disproven when it came out as something made up by a Jr football team.
The doco is from a biased point of view, of course. Would you watch a doco on the subject made by Sam Newman, or would you consider that one sided?
I have made my view on the subject from
living through it, and I think my view is quite even.

 

[Cleric]

A couple of things to add

1) he didn’t throw a spear/boomerang at anyone. It’s become a great line but check the footage there was no throwing of anything;

2) any commentary on the Carlton game mentions a significant and noticeable level of booing in the hawthorn game the previous week in particular but also weeks prior - I’m just saying any suggestion the dance and reaction to it kicked this off is wrong.


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There is booing at every game. It came to a head at the West Coast game after which Adam got the sulks up, and so after seeing his poor reaction to it other supporters jumped on the bandwagon.

 

[romeohwho]

He initially sold it as a traditional Aboriginal war dance, which was disproven when it came out as something made up by a Jr football team.
The doco is from a biased point of view, of course. Would you watch a doco on the subject made by Sam Newman, or would you consider that one sided?
I have made my view on the subject from
living through it, and I think my view is quite even.

Did he? In the post match interview he said it was from the boomerang kids who taught him a war cry-and he did it as a tribute to them.
Sam Newman isn’t a filmmaker so it’s not a valid comparison. I certainly watched him on his tv show for many years before him and the entire show became as boring as can be. I gave the footy show a good run though- kept an open mind for years after it became very ordinary viewing. No doubt Sam had become a ranting nutter by the end so I took no notice of anything he said at the point.
Can’t really agree that making your mind up from ‘living through it’ validates your view, more especially as you seem to keep getting the facts wrong.

 

[Kummerspeck]

He initially sold it as a traditional Aboriginal war dance, which was disproven when it came out as something made up by a Jr football team.

Quote from Goodes showing this please.

The doco is from a biased point of view, of course. Would you watch a doco on the subject made by Sam Newman, or would you consider that one sided?

You don't even know who made this documentary.

I have made my view on the subject from
living through it, and I think my view is quite even.

You've repeatedly made errors in your statements, including really massive ones about when this all started and boiled it down to "it's all Goodes' fault." Your view isn't even

 

[JackOutback]

That is not an answer. You cite a handful of individuals who (I'll take your word for it) criticized Winmar and Long! Is it now considered racist to criticize someone? Please link me to footage of crowds booing these two men after their bold stands against racism and I will see I am mistaken. I said there was absolutely zero mass booing of these two men. You know it is true and you are scrambling to explain it. Back in their day our footy crowds were less educated on the issue of racial abuse yet the response then was incredibly subdued compared to the reaction to Goodes. This leaves us with the only plausible explanation. The people didn't like the individual Adam Goodes (rightly or wrongly) and it had nothing to do with the colour of his skin.

So unless an exact replica of the circumstances can be found, it can’t be racist? That’s a terrible argument. The racism Goodes faced perpetuated itself differently to the racism Winmar and Long (and others) faced.

 

[4thebloods]

There is booing at every game. It came to a head at the West Coast game after which Adam got the sulks up, and so after seeing his poor reaction to it other supporters jumped on the bandwagon.

Hang on I thought it was the dance that triggered it? The West Coast game was well after the dance. The Carlton game came after a hawks game where hawthorn fans booed so much it was publicly commented on before that. Maybe check your timeline?

Let’s look at the west coast game tho...

"It is completely inappropriate and it has to stop.

"It was a minority of our fans booing yesterday, but it has happened across the competition for a number of weeks and as an AFL community we have to address this matter. I implore all clubs to stop this nonsense.”

Gee Goodes did get offended and get his “sulks up” right? No. That was West Coast CEO Nisbett commenting. Interesting hey?




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[Peter Sidorkiewicz]

The funniest part about Eddie's gaffe was that he'd tried so hard over that weekend to be apologetic on behalf of his club and quash any suggestion that Collingwood was racist, especially after the long-lasting infamy of the 1993 Nicky Winmar moment and the unfortunate foot-in-mouth stupidity of then Magpie President, Allan McAlister. (In addition to the racist abuse towards Michael Long on Anzac Day in 1995)

"Damned if there is going to be another Winmar/McAlister episode on my watch," you could imagine Eddie thinking as he went into damage control/PR overdrive seconds after the final siren

A whole weekend of media saturation and public apoplexy about Goodesey and the girl who cried "Ape!" with Eddie Everywhere appearing on radio and TV denouncing racism and showing his full support for Goodes...

And then it FINALLY gets around to his weekday morning radio show... Eddie sighs with relief, lets down his guard, and resumes his role as host of blokey banter on Triple M and does the King Kong bit.

You couldn't script it. His Allan McAlister moment!

Priceless.

That makes it so disappointing and extremely let down as a Collingwood supporter. He showed great leadership with his apology and then he has the nerve to make that comment. Really disgusting.

Zero tolerence towards racism was one of the things Eddie said. If he truely believed it, he should of resigned.

 

[Hawk_francais]

That makes it so disappointing and extremely let down as a Collingwood supporter. He showed great leadership with his apology and then he has the nerve to make that comment. Really disgusting.

Zero tolerence towards racism was one of the things Eddie said. If he truely believed it, he should of resigned.

Agreed, he and Jeff Kennett leading the way in 'talking the talk'.

I think my view is quite even.

Why didn't you just post that a few pages ago and save everyone having to wade through all the stuff you posted.

Nobody has an even view on this. There are just those who think they know what Adam Goodes experienced, and everything he should or shouldn't have done, better than he does.

 

[4thebloods]

It's hilarious the way people keep urging others to watch the doco. Both of them are nothing more than carefully edited hit pieces on the footy crowds and individual critics like Sam Newman. Why would anyone waste their time watching such a one sided presentation?

So you haven’t seen it and won’t see it but know it is one sided?


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[Firestarter]

It wouldn't surprise me if the Sydney people were supporting their own player instead of supporting the larger cause...

"It's only a bad thing when it's happening to me."

 

[Kwality]

He initially sold it as a traditional Aboriginal war dance, which was disproven when it came out as something made up by a Jr football team.
The doco is from a biased point of view, of course. Would you watch a doco on the subject made by Sam Newman, or would you consider that one sided?
I have made my view on the subject from
living through it, and I think my view is quite even.

Hang on I thought it was the dance that triggered it? The West Coast game was well after the dance. The Carlton game came after a hawks game where hawthorn fans booed so much it was publicly commented on before that. Maybe check your timeline?

Let’s look at the west coast game tho...

"It is completely inappropriate and it has to stop.

"It was a minority of our fans booing yesterday, but it has happened across the competition for a number of weeks and as an AFL community we have to address this matter. I implore all clubs to stop this nonsense.”

Gee Goodes did get offended and get his “sulks up” right? No. That was West Coast CEO Nisbett commenting. Interesting hey?

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Nisbett was following the AFL line when that comment was made? That party line was about as welcome as tax increases at the last election.
Did West Coast have any indogenous players in that game, were they booed. The broad brush approach is never going to convince anyone.

 

[happy_eagle]

The doco is from a biased point of view, of course.

Isn't the documentary just archival media footage from 2013-2015 ???
No talking heads as far as I am aware. Of course none of us have actually seen the thing, so comments like this are pretty stupid

 

[Cleric]

Isn't the documentary just archival media footage from 2013-2015 ???
No talking heads as far as I am aware. Of course none of us have actually seen the thing, so comments like this are pretty stupid

"It follows the Sydney Swans captain, two-time Brownlow Medalist and 2014 Australian of the Year through the final seasons of his career, during which time he was subjected to racially-driven abuse by AFL fans which was not publicly condemned by the code."

Yeah doesnt seem biased at all.

 

[happy_eagle]

"It follows the Sydney Swans captain, two-time Brownlow Medalist and 2014 Australian of the Year through the final seasons of his career, during which time he was subjected to racially-driven abuse by AFL fans which was not publicly condemned by the code."

Yeah doesnt seem biased at all.

Whats wrong with that statement ?

You don't think any of the booing (not all, as the statement doesn't say that) was racially motivated ?
Do you think its a coincidence that the unprecedented campaign to boo Goodes just happened to coincide with a lot of his political statements ?

For what its worth, I expect the documentary will address the "we boo Goodes because he's a dirty player" argument. There was a lot of misinformation throughout this whole thing (people misinterpreting his Australia Day speech, and his words towards the Collingwood supporter).

 

[Catters 070911]

I have a question about the booing of Adam Goodes.

During that time, did Sydney Swans members and fans boo Goodes?

If they did, then it is racism, because why would they boo a champion of their own club, who would have given them much delight over the years, and been a great of their club.

If they didn't, then it isn't racism, but opposition fans booing a Sydney Swans player.

If you attended a game that Goodes played in during that time, did you notice if the Swans fans cheered or booed when Goodes had the ball? There will be your answer right there.

 

[Catters 070911]

"It follows the Sydney Swans captain, two-time Brownlow Medalist and 2014 Australian of the Year through the final seasons of his career, during which time he was subjected to racially-driven abuse by AFL fans which was not publicly condemned by the code."

Yeah doesnt seem biased at all.

Most documentaries are biased, and skewed the way the documentary maker wants to present it.

The best docos present both sides, and have people present their side equally.

This is why I like docos from a BBC journo called Louis Theroux. He just seems to ask questions of his subjects, and lets them say what they want to say, rather than make a judgment one way or another about any of them.

 

[Cleric]

Whats wrong with that statement ?

You don't think any of the booing (not all, as the statement doesn't say that) was racially motivated ?
Do you think its a coincidence that the unprecedented campaign to boo Goodes just happened to coincide with a lot of his political statements ?

For what its worth, I expect the documentary will address the "we boo Goodes because he's a dirty player" argument. There was a lot of misinformation throughout this whole thing (people misinterpreting his Australia Day speech, and his words towards the Collingwood supporter).

There may have been pedophiles who were booing him, gays, muslims and even other Aboriginals.
Thats not the point. The statement by Gill, Caro etc was that if you boo him you are a racist. Dont try to change the issue.
My issue isnt that Adam antagonized opposition supporters. Hey, go for it. Chad Cornes did it to Adelaide supporters. And surprise, surprise he was booed all the time by Crows supporters. He stuck his head up and had a go at them, and they had a go back. My issue with Adam is that he also challanged opposition supporters, but then when they gave it to him back he claimed victim status, threatened to quit the game and sulked. He showed poor character. If he had of embraced it and taken up the challange and used it as motivation he would have got the admiration of all supporters.

 

[Cleric]

Most documentaries are biased, and skewed the way the documentary maker wants to present it.

The best docos present both sides, and have people present their side equally.

This is why I like docos from a BBC journo called Louis Theroux. He just seems to ask questions of his subjects, and lets them say what they want to say, rather than make a judgment one way or another about any of them.

Louis is a legend. Love his documentaries.

 

[Kummerspeck]

. My issue with Adam is that he also challanged opposition supporters, but then when they gave it to him back he claimed victim status, threatened to quit the game and sulked. He showed poor character. If he had of embraced it and taken up the challange and used it as motivation he would have got the admiration of all supporters.

Why do you keep insisting this all started with him stirring up opposition fans when even a timeline you posted earlier doesn't support that idea? Are you that incapable of reflecting on your own view?

 

[Cleric]

Why do you keep insisting this all started with him stirring up opposition fans when even a timeline you posted earlier doesn't support that idea? Are you that incapable of reflecting on your own view?

You cannot compare the booing he recieved before the Carlton incident to what he got after. Lots of players get booed by opposition supporters the same level that Goodes got before his confrontation with supporters. Selwood gets booed for being a ducker, Danger gets booed by Crows supporters, Bickley got booed every time he played Port after elbowing one of their players, Cornes got booed every time he played the Crows, and I am.sure other supporters can point out opposition players who get booed by their teams supporters.
It ramped up after the Carlton game, and especially after the West Coast game where he sulked it up and threatened to quit. To think he played no role in the way supporters addressed him is just plain out crazy.

 

[Kummerspeck]

You cannot compare the booing he recieved before the Carlton incident to what he got after.

Well, yeah I can because it was at the same level. You can't even keep events straight, don't try and claim you now have an understanding of the shifts in what happened.

 

[Cleric]

Well, yeah I can because it was at the same level. You can't even keep events straight, don't try and claim you now have an understanding of the shifts in what happened.

Rubbish.

 

[Bombermania]

The Michael Long/Nicky Winmar is starting the drift you see that basically says," if only he was one of those quietly spoken more reserved black fellas then everything would be ok."

I guess it's ok to be outspoken and white if you're someone like say... Dane Swan?

The "he played for free kicks" idea is hilarious.

I never said anything against Goodes having an opinion, but he didn't need to charge the Carlton supporters and i watched a number of Goodes games and there were times when he would look at the umpire for a free kick instead of focusing on winning the ball.