Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy (CTE) and the AFL

[Demonic Ascent]

- AFL allowed the sport to continue without taking reasonable steps to at least mitigate and preferably eliminate the risk

This is where it falls down. The AFL has been changing the way the game is umpired for 15 years to protect the head. CTE is only a relatively recent phenomenon, unfortunately the players from the 70s, 80s and 90s will suffer because they played in an era prior to CTE awareness and the league doing much to protect the head.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

A lot of unscientific calls for banning the bump by people not qualified to determine the cause of the problems..NFL doesn’t have a bump for line of scrimmage players yet they suffer from CTE more than anyone.

Have you seen the impact those line players have when hitting each other? Often helmet to helmet hits as well. It's been compared to each game being equivalent to a violent motor vehicle accident.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Yeah just poorly thought out. The modern players may occasionally cop a bump to the head and end up in a bad way but it’s hardly a thing anymore.

It’s the knocks to the head in packs, tackles etc that are far more prevalent.

It's not the bumps to the head it's the whiplash effect of tackles/bumps causing the brain to bounce off the skull.

 

[Blue1980]

This is where it falls down. The AFL has been changing the way the game is umpired for 15 years to protect the head. CTE is only a relatively recent phenomenon, unfortunately the players from the 70s, 80s and 90s will suffer because they played in an era prior to CTE awareness and the league doing much to protect the head.

Watched on you tube the 95 grand final a few years ago and dipper interviewing brad Pearce after the game joking that injuries above the shoulders don’t count.

Fair insight into the mentality of the time and decades before, and probably up until the late 00s

 

[blackcat]

What is the control DemonicAscent. PEDs have been a staple of the elite sportsmen since about ~1960. Remember Fridgerator Perry as linebacker fo Chicago Bears who was late 70s thru 80s, he was first linesman at 300lbs. Now the <position of> offensivelinesman a lighter more nimble position, they are all tilting the scales at 300+

RussellEbertHandball
#Atypepsychology
#androgens
#firstdegreemurder

It ain't CTE, it's EricWeinstein's DISC and Overton Window

pro athletes don't have social education of working in trades or vocations

#androgens&droids brah

 

[Spearman]

It's not the bumps to the head it's the whiplash effect of tackles/bumps causing the brain to bounce off the skull.

I played through high school on both offensive and defensive line. Even at that age, the head is getting knocked, bumped and jostled around, usually multiple times on each play. Face mask to face mask, helmet to helmet, head slaps, hit by legs and feet while on the ground. It's been shown with Mike Webster, center from the Steelers glory years, that is was the cumulative effect of thousands of impact great and small.Hits and whiplash, the head is moving about violently.

 

[blackcat]

It's not the bumps to the head it's the whiplash effect of tackles/bumps causing the brain to bounce off the skull.

No, its virtue signalling
individuals need to take agency

corollary is virtue signallers need to appreciate they can damage vulnerable people's psychology too

 

[blackcat]

I played through high school on both offensive and defensive line. Even at that age, the head is getting knocked, bumped and jostled around, usually multiple times on each play. Face mask to face mask, helmet to helmet, head slaps, hit by legs and feet while on the ground. It's been shown with Mike Webster, center from the Steelers glory years, that is was the cumulative effect of thousands of impact great and small.Hits and whiplash, the head is moving about violently.

So everyone is dying in Queensberry rulz?!?!?!

Folks need to assume agency and autonomy.

This is result of the American civil law system and the aggregation in size of their profligacy of legal action and litigating matters * /grammar #pleonasm

paradox of lockean political economy, agency has been abrogated to state

 

[blackcat]

Watched on you tube the 95 grand final a few years ago and dipper interviewing brad Pearce after the game joking that injuries above the shoulders don’t count.

Fair insight into the mentality of the time and decades before, and probably up until the late 00s

Brought to us by American litigants

Don't be nuffies, I am noting Dermie and Yeats SHOULD NOT go around attempting to take opponents head off.

I agree w some ACTU workers rights like <safe workplace>

But this both workplace PLUS leisure aspirant sport... folks play the game for leisure.

They get VERY well compensated to play sport. Now they run to Slaters and Maurice Blackburn Cashman and hope to get double

When one takes into account political economy superimposed as lens for PubMed, issue is myriad more complex. I stake my bonafides that Gillian and chair Wesfarmers dude, are not all over it.

Even prof of Epidemiology and Neurology @ Johns Hopkins won't have adequate inputs as far as one is concerned

 

[HardcoreGeelongFan]

 

[mianfei]

Interesting. But soccer is probably as far over on the aerobic side of the anaerobic/aerobic spectrum as you can get, and that is commercially viable worldwide. Indeed, they don't have the same ad break opportunities, so how do they ensure advertising revenue? Is it simply weight of numbers in its favour?

Actually, regarding all sports soccer is not that aerobic at all. First-class (though not limited-overs) cricket is much more aerobic than soccer, but it has been largely supplanted by limited-overs forms for the same reasons noted above, plus the fact that high taxes and more alternatives mean people are not willing to watch long games, and over-rates only 55 percent of those in 1947 multiply this problem. Moreover, if we expand beyond team sports, there are meany sports far more aerobic and less anaerobic than soccer, especially distance running but also many other endurance sports that in this high-tax age are affordable only for the ruling classes, as you can read here.

As to why soccer remains so popular when it is as attendance-based as it is, for one thing road lobbies are not nearly so powerful in Europe or Latin America as they are in Australia, and for another soccer is a very cheap sport in all three criteria of equipment, land and training requirements.

 

[FRUMPY]

good luck getting money from the AFL now

 

[BIRDBRAIN]

This is where it falls down. The AFL has been changing the way the game is umpired for 15 years to protect the head. CTE is only a relatively recent phenomenon, unfortunately the players from the 70s, 80s and 90s will suffer because they played in an era prior to CTE awareness and the league doing much to protect the head.

Vast majority of players from 70s, 80s and 90s are absolutely fine. This is because they played before the area of the league trying to protect the head, so they didn't purposely try and lead their head into other players in order to get cheap free kicks. The modern players are stuffed, because they ram their head into opponents to get free kicks because the league now try to protect the head.

 

[blackcat]

Actually, regarding all sports soccer is not that aerobic at all. First-class (though not limited-overs) cricket is much more aerobic than soccer, but it has been largely supplanted by limited-overs forms for the same reasons noted above, plus the fact that high taxes and more alternatives mean people are not willing to watch long games, and over-rates only 55 percent of those in 1947 multiply this problem. Moreover, if we expand beyond team sports, there are meany sports far more aerobic and less anaerobic than soccer, especially distance running but also many other endurance sports that in this high-tax age are affordable only for the ruling classes, as you can read here.

As to why soccer remains so popular when it is as attendance-based as it is, for one thing road lobbies are not nearly so powerful in Europe or Latin America as they are in Australia, and for another soccer is a very cheap sport in all three criteria of equipment, land and training requirements.

critical mass begets critical mass (market share) and legacy infrastructure begets popular broadcast media

changing demographics provides a glitch in the legacy paternal lineage - I think this is the biggest one. We are not the same nation with demographics of 30 years ago

look to Hutchie buying a half share in pro basketball team Melbourne UNITED (49/50/51%) for SEN. Basketball requires (relatively) low/no infrastructure, much more amenable to a HongKong urban capitalist economy life, and on back end of Magic/Bird and the emergent Nike Jordan we had four nbl teams, Melbourne Tigers, South Eastern Melbourne Spectres(Nunawading) St Kilda Saints, North Melbourne Giants, plus there was a Geelong Supercats. (Hutchie aka Mike Rublewski at Kings)

No one immediately jumps out as an 800, 1500, 3km Olympic runner. The 8's rowing crew, many AFL players poke their heads above parapet

Daly Thompson said during the era of St Kilda coach Grant Thomas era the captain Nik Riewoldt could have been a 400 metre runner at Olympics. Georgie Clarke runner brother at Hawks and now Richmond runner/BoxHill or Coburg coach may be best runner, just like best sprinter Freo winger/stockbroker James Walker, but no chance for second reserve in 4x100

 

[Ron The Bear]

Patrick Pritzwald-Stegmann, google him.

His wife is suing the hospital for failing to protect him.

I'd be happier if she sued the state government over lax sentencing. The useless campaigner of a perp was out on bail after 40+ convictions in the previous year. Even now he's only doing ten years for taking a valuable life.

Not advocating a police state but we are moving in the wrong direction on law and order. If you **** up, you need to be made to pay.

 

[rdhopkins2]

Shane Tuck

Shane Tuck

Age

42

Ht

189cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.4

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

12.0

5star

M

4.5

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.0

5star

No current season stats available

D

14.8

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.6

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.4

4star

confirmed to have had CTE. So young. Such a tragic passing.

‘He knew something was wrong with his brain’: Shane Tuck had severe CTE

The former Richmond footballer, who died last July, is the latest victim of the disease that also was found in the brains of Polly Farmer and Danny Frawley.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Pessimistic]

Despite all this, we see a new tv program dodgeball where contestants regularly are hit on the head with heavy balls

 

[Rusty Brookes]

Shane Tuck

Shane Tuck

Age

42

Ht

189cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.4

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

12.0

5star

M

4.5

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.0

5star

No current season stats available

D

14.8

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.6

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.4

4star

also boxed so there are mitigating circumstances but you've got to think his football career at least contributed something to his CTE.

I remember seeing him knocked out cold at a game at Box Hill and the game was help up for more than 10 minutes while he was motionless on the ground. It was frightening.

 

[HairyO]

Shane Tuck also boxed so there are mitigating circumstances but you've got to think his football career at least contributed something to his CTE.

I remember seeing him knocked out cold at a game at Box Hill and the game was help up for more than 10 minutes while he was motionless on the ground. It was frightening.

That is the big question isnt it: what damage was caused during Aussie Rules and what through boxing?

 

[Barrybran]

It's sad but not surprising. I hope someone finds a way to diagnose this in living people soon.

 

[telsor]

That is the big question isnt it: what damage was caused during Aussie Rules and what through boxing?

173 AFL matches
5 professional boxing matches.

You could never say for sure, but I think it's a fair net that most of it was due to AFL.

 

[Pessimistic]

173 AFL matches
5 professional boxing matches.

You could never say for sure, but I think it's a fair net that most of it was due to AFL.

One sport is designed to hit the body and get knocked over often, the other designed to hit the head but hit the ground not so much.

Is whiplash a factor?

 

[Rob]

173 AFL matches
5 professional boxing matches.

You could never say for sure, but I think it's a fair net that most of it was due to AFL.

Not sure you can draw that conclusion, especially given boxers can take a lot of hits to the head during training. You might still be right, but I have to say of the 3 articles i've read about it, none even make mention of his boxing career.

 

[TheExtractorFactor]

Not judging him but if you are able to get out of an AFL career with at least some of your marbles (if he did) maybe becoming a boxer afterward isn't the best idea. Some of these rugby players who do it may as well put their brain in a blender.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

The problem we have in the AFL now is that the head is not sacrosanct and no matter how many times the AFL say it is you only have to watch games to clearly see it is not.
Head high contact is rife in the sport and what was once penalised above shoulder contact is no longer penalised.
The AFL in its stupid wisdom introduced a ruling where the player with the ball is at fault for head high contact and since that moment head high contact has increased remarkably.
Other than actually ducking your head the player with the ball should be rewarded for above shoulder contact on every occasion.
The AFL now believe and have convinced the footy public that you should be able to pick the ball up off the ground without bending over, they now call this leading with the head, of course the reality is that the player is charged at head on while trying to pick up said ball and of course is contacted above the shoulder. No free kick however.
Player has ball tries to manoeuvre, wriggle his way around incoming traffic and is consistently tackled above the shoulder. AFL deem player with ball is at fault and created the contact. No free kick.
THE HEAD IS NOT SACROSANCT.
If it was the AFL would pay these free kicks and every coach and player would simply have to change how they tackle, go in lower and tackle lower, not touch players who have their head over the ball.
Once they decided the player with the ball is at fault then they have put themselves in a bad position. It is a certainty that one day a player with the ball, making the ball his play is going to be seriously hurt and that the rules offer said player no longer protection the AFL could be in serious trouble.
Just simply return to all contact above shoulder is penalised and watch how the coaches and players change how they tackle.
The AFL have this wrong and I am sick to death of them or anyone telling me the Head is Sacrosanct because it is as far from Sacrosanct as it could possibly be.