Corona virus, Port and the AFL. Part 2.

[PA88]

I believe and trust the independent scientist, the big pharma making the product not as much.

You're likely to not know the independent scientist's findings until some time in the future.

 

[dirty2]

Covid isnt gonna go away is it...

 

[FishingRick04]

You're likely to not know the independent scientist's findings until some time in the future.

correct, when a company can make billions or many billions and it’s a race, I’m sure the pressure of money causes some rules to be bent, even just slightly.

 

[FishingRick04]

Covid isnt gonna go away is it...

almost gone in OZ if we’re competent

 

[PA88]

If they bothered to check my local shopping centre they would find plenty of non compliance from both customers and businesses.

Perhaps the worst perpetrators are the larger stores. Woolies have no one checking if customers are logging in and certainly no COVID Marshals with badges on display, Drakes and Cheap as Chips are the same. BigW have a greeter at the entrance with entry and exit points but from my experience that greeter does not enforce check in.

As I sit and take a coffee at the shopping centre I take note of the people checking into the stores around Gloria Jeans and I reckon that around 75% of people going into the stores do not check in and they are not asked to check in by staff. As I watch i feel sympathy for the store owners as I can see why they are not asking people to check in. Some of them are flat out and don't have time to act as unpaid policemen for Grant Stevens.

QR code audit finds more than 100 businesses breaching COVID-safe rules

An audit of QR code compliance by South Australian Police has found more than 100 businesses around the state are not following COVID-safe rules.

www.abc.net.au

Is it non-compliance when it is not enforced or compulsory?

 

[manureid]

So are we going to be able to over time take a cocktail of various vaccines? Will that increase the chance of protection if you have 2 or 3 variants?

 

[Del165198]

This ridicule of another person's apprehension to a new vaccine is liken to those happy clappers that accuse a supporter who questions the club's extension of the coach a Hinkley hater. Most are not conspiracy theorists believing youtube clips.

i don't think anyone has been ridiculed for showing apprehension. that's completely understandable. we're lucky enough to live somewhere you don't have to charge out and get a vaccine. i'm happy to sit back for now and see how things are panning out before joining the queue. if i lived in the UK or US i'd probably be in the line already because on the balance of risk i'm more likely to get more ****ed by covid than i am a vaccine.

the ridicule is for posting ridiculous unverified fake news sources which do nothing but spread misinformation.

 

[Del165198]

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

On the face of it the vaccines seem to be having an effect on the total numbers of new cases. No impact on deaths yet but that's to be expected given the usual lag between infections and deaths.

 

[backtozero]

if i lived in the UK or US i'd probably be in the line already because on the balance of risk i'm more likely to get more f’ed by covid than i am a vaccine.

Are you over 65?

 

[Del165198]

Are you over 65?

No, it was a figure of speech. I know they're prioritising people at high risk to begin with. I meant I'd be keen to get it asap there, here I'm happy to wait and see.

 

[raptalia]

Is it non-compliance when it is not enforced or compulsory?

It is compulsiry and it is being enforced but not too vigorously enfoced atm. You can be fined in South Australia for not complying with the QR code requirements. I am not sure if that fits your definition of 'compulsory'. To me, if I can be fined for not doing something that compels me to do it.

From the link below,

Since QR codes commenced on 14 December 2020, until 18 January 2021, there have been 6121 business compliance checks, resulting in 213 fines and cautions issued to persons and businesses for not complying with QR Code requirements. This included five fines to businesses and 131 cautions, while 42 individuals have been fined and 35 cautioned.

https://www.police.sa.gov.au/sa-police-news-assets/front-page-news/reminder-to-check-in-via-qr-codes

People will make up their own minds as to whether they want to use QR codes. I choose to do it not because I am compelled to but because I see merit in it. The President of the AMA in South Australia was on the radio this morning imploring people to use the QR codes as it will only take one case of the South African COVID variant to escape from quarantine and we may have a disaster.

 

[PA88]

It is compulsiry and it is being enforced but not too vigorously enfoced atm. You can be fined in South Australia for not complying with the QR code requirements. I am not sure if that fits your definition of 'compulsory'. To me, if I can be fined for not doing something that compels me to do it.

From the link below,

Since QR codes commenced on 14 December 2020, until 18 January 2021, there have been 6121 business compliance checks, resulting in 213 fines and cautions issued to persons and businesses for not complying with QR Code requirements. This included five fines to businesses and 131 cautions, while 42 individuals have been fined and 35 cautioned.

https://www.police.sa.gov.au/sa-police-news-assets/front-page-news/reminder-to-check-in-via-qr-codes

People will make up their own minds as to whether they want to use QR codes. I choose to do it not because I am compelled to but because I see merit in it. The President of the AMA in South Australia was on the radio this morning imploring people to use the QR codes as it will only take one case of the South African COVID variant to escape from quarantine and we may have a disaster.

I wasn't aware it was compulsory in SA. It didn't seem so when places are not monitoring it. My workplace is exempt from QR and was exempt from wearing masks during the immediate lockdown we had, so I have struggled to be onside with the general public being forced to do so as well when we haven't had community transmission.

 

[raptalia]

I wasn't aware it was compulsory in SA. Did the above include SA?

The quote supplied was from the SAPOL website so it applies to SA. The figures are 10 days old so they may have been updated since then. I reckon one of the problems in SA is they do not have the resources to police the situation properly. What with Hotel Quarantine, border checks etc the resources are probably stretched thin.

One thing on QR codes I note that in NSW they have updated their software so that users are able to include dependents when checking in. This means if you take the family to McDonalds you only have to scan the QR once then select dependents and it will record the family members you select. It saves a queue of four or five people trying to check or sign in. They should think about a similar upgrade in SA as anything that makes the task easier may encourage people to do it.

 

[pastmyprimus]

correct, when a company can make billions or many billions and it’s a race, I’m sure the pressure of money causes some rules to be bent, even just slightly.

Drug companies can and do make billions from the sales of vaccines/drugs but the approvals for use are given by government regulatory authorities. In Australia it's the TGA. It has an Advisory Committee on Vaccines made up of independent medical and scientific experts. There's no representation from big pharma. It's this group that's providing advice to the TGA on the covid vaccines. The Advisory Committee on Vaccines is chaired by Professor Allen Cheng. He's an infectious diseases physician who's also the deputy Chief Health Officer for Victoria. The Committee would literally review hundreds of pages of evidence provided by drug companies before making a decision.

The approval process is designed to avoid any influences by big pharma. It's independent. That's not to say that things will go wrong with approved vaccines. You can't give guarantees based on clinical trials that involve tens of thousands of trial participants. Sometimes adverse affects only become evident when a vaccine is rolled out to entire populations. If that happens approvals will be removed.

At least in Australia I think we can have faith that vaccine/drug approvals are free from influence from big pharma.

 

[FishingRick04]

Drug companies can and do make billions from the sales of vaccines/drugs but the approvals for use are given by government regulatory authorities. In Australia it's the TGA. It has an Advisory Committee on Vaccines made up of independent medical and scientific experts. There's no representation from big pharma. It's this group that's providing advice to the TGA on the covid vaccines. The Advisory Committee on Vaccines is chaired by Professor Allen Cheng. He's an infectious diseases physician who's also the deputy Chief Health Officer for Victoria. The Committee would literally review hundreds of pages of evidence provided by drug companies before making a decision.

The approval process is designed to avoid any influences by big pharma. It's independent. That's not to say that things will go wrong with approved vaccines. You can't give guarantees based on clinical trials that involve tens of thousands of trial participants. Sometimes adverse affects only become evident when a vaccine is rolled out to entire populations. If that happens approvals will be removed.

At least in Australia I think we can have faith that vaccine/drug approvals are free from influence from big pharma.

I agree with you.My guess America and it’s thirst for the all mighty dollar could be a little more bent, so to speak.

 

[Lawnchair Larry]

Drug companies can and do make billions from the sales of vaccines/drugs but the approvals for use are given by government regulatory authorities. In Australia it's the TGA. It has an Advisory Committee on Vaccines made up of independent medical and scientific experts. There's no representation from big pharma. It's this group that's providing advice to the TGA on the covid vaccines. The Advisory Committee on Vaccines is chaired by Professor Allen Cheng. He's an infectious diseases physician who's also the deputy Chief Health Officer for Victoria. The Committee would literally review hundreds of pages of evidence provided by drug companies before making a decision.

The approval process is designed to avoid any influences by big pharma. It's independent. That's not to say that things will go wrong with approved vaccines. You can't give guarantees based on clinical trials that involve tens of thousands of trial participants. Sometimes adverse affects only become evident when a vaccine is rolled out to entire populations. If that happens approvals will be removed.

At least in Australia I think we can have faith that vaccine/drug approvals are free from influence from big pharma.

Certainly the APVMA is partially funded by industry - Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority.

After the vaginal mesh caper of a few years ago, questions were raised about the independence of the TGA.

Therapeutic Goods Administration rejects claims it is 'too close' to medical industry

Health experts say accepting fees from industry is unacceptable following the transvaginal mesh scandal

www.theguardian.com

From my experience the TGA is led by the nose by the US FDA. The Australian TGA is quite good at compliance auditing of Pharma facilities, but it would be really interesting to see what happened if a US FDA drug approval were rejected by the Australian TGA. In terms of any Free Trade Agreement, I wonder if the government could be sued for so doing. Not sure.

 

[Visenfest]

Covid isnt gonna go away is it...

I don't think it'll ever be wiped from existence. But hopefully a vaccine can push it back to a low enough number of annual cases that allows the world to get back to normal. Keen for stuff like social distancing, better hygiene and staying home when sick to stay though.

 

[raptalia]

Drug companies can and do make billions from the sales of vaccines/drugs but the approvals for use are given by government regulatory authorities. In Australia it's the TGA. It has an Advisory Committee on Vaccines made up of independent medical and scientific experts. There's no representation from big pharma. It's this group that's providing advice to the TGA on the covid vaccines. The Advisory Committee on Vaccines is chaired by Professor Allen Cheng. He's an infectious diseases physician who's also the deputy Chief Health Officer for Victoria. The Committee would literally review hundreds of pages of evidence provided by drug companies before making a decision.

The approval process is designed to avoid any influences by big pharma. It's independent. That's not to say that things will go wrong with approved vaccines. You can't give guarantees based on clinical trials that involve tens of thousands of trial participants. Sometimes adverse affects only become evident when a vaccine is rolled out to entire populations. If that happens approvals will be removed.

At least in Australia I think we can have faith that vaccine/drug approvals are free from influence from big pharma.

I read that the Advisory Committee on Vaccines will make some recommendations on the AstraZenica vaccine this coming Wednesday. I wonder if the committee will be influenced by the German findings? Allen Cheng was non committal about the situation when asked last Wednesday.

I suspect that the TGA will not rush the decision given the latest data from Germany and may want more time before approving the AstraZeneca vaccine. After all the decision to delay the roll out in Australia was based on the fact that the TGA wanted as much information as possible before decisions were made. In any case given the supply hiccups and squabbling over the Pfitzer and AstraZenica vaccines a late February roll out may be in jeopardy. None of this would please the Federal Government who are under pressure to get the vaccine roll out under way.

'Too early' to say whether AstraZeneca Covid vaccine will go to older people in Australia

Vaccine advisory chief says Australian regulator still evaluating data after EU says AstraZeneca may only be authorised for young people in Europe

www.theguardian.com

 

[pastmyprimus]

Certainly the APVMA is partially funded by industry - Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority.

After the vaginal mesh caper of a few years ago, questions were raised about the independence of the TGA.

Therapeutic Goods Administration rejects claims it is 'too close' to medical industry

Health experts say accepting fees from industry is unacceptable following the transvaginal mesh scandal

www.theguardian.com

From my experience the TGA is led by the nose by the US FDA. The Australian TGA is quite good at compliance auditing of Pharma facilities, but it would be really interesting to see what happened if a US FDA drug approval were rejected by the Australian TGA. In terms of any Free Trade Agreement, I wonder if the government could be sued for so doing. Not sure.

The FDA I don't trust so much. A big black mark for its role in the opioid crisis in the USA.

Study Reveals FDA History of Approving Opioids with Limited Scientific Data (verywellhealth.com)

 

[Duckimus Prime]

I suspect that the TGA will not rush the decision given the latest data from Germany and may want more time before approving the AstraZeneca vaccine. After all the decision to delay the roll out in Australia was based on the fact that the TGA wanted as much information as possible before decisions were made. In any case given the supply hiccups and squabbling over the Pfitzer and AstraZenica vaccines a late February roll out may be in jeopardy. None of this would please the Federal Government who are under pressure to get the vaccine roll out under way.

'Too early' to say whether AstraZeneca Covid vaccine will go to older people in Australia

Vaccine advisory chief says Australian regulator still evaluating data after EU says AstraZeneca may only be authorised for young people in Europe

www.theguardian.com

There's no data coming out of Germany on the AstraZeneca vaccine. They're just saying that based on the data that Oxford/AstraZeneca has supplied to everyone that they can only recomment it for 18-64 years olds. This is because the trial didn't contain enough people in the 65+ age bracket to allow the German's to make a decision for that age group. There is no data or findings that its dangerous for that group, there is just not enough data for any decision.

Similar for pregnant women. The vaccines will probably all be not recommended for usage on pregnant women, simply because no one is willing to do tests on pregnant women.

 

[backtozero]

Why aren't they trialing it on 65+ year olds when thats the only demographic affected by this virus?

 

[raptalia]

There's no data coming out of Germany on the AstraZeneca vaccine. They're just saying that based on the data that Oxford/AstraZeneca has supplied to everyone that they can only recomment it for 18-64 years olds. This is because the trial didn't contain enough people in the 65+ age bracket to allow the German's to make a decision for that age group. There is no data or findings that its dangerous for that group, there is just not enough data for any decision.

Similar for pregnant women. The vaccines will probably all be not recommended for usage on pregnant women, simply because no one is willing to do tests on pregnant women.

That is right, on the basis of limited data the Germans are making assumptions at this stage. As Norman Swan says the AstraZeneca trial has been a 'dog's breakfast'. Astra Zeneca cannot complain as therie haphard trials have given people a chance to question their vaccine. Dr Swan explains the situation in the link below. The AstraZeneca vaccine is producing a high anti body count in the elderly so it should work it is just not supported with data at this stage.

Production of the Astra Zeneca vaccine has been under way in Melbourne since November so we hope it all works out.

Dr Norman Swan says Germany 'under-recruited' elderly people for the AstraZeneca trials

Follow the latest news headlines from Australia's most trusted source. Read in-depth expert analysis and watch live coverage on ABC News.

www.abc.net.au

 

[HinkleysHeroes]

Why aren't they trialing it on 65+ year olds when thats the only demographic affected by this virus?

Because they are not the only ones affected??

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

Obesity and mortality of COVID-19. Meta-analysis. BMI>25 increases risk of death by 2.5x


Background: Obesity is a global disease with at least 2.8 million people dying each year as a result of being overweight or obese according to the world health organization figures. This paper aims to explore the links between obesity and mortality in COVID-19.

Methods: Electronic search was made for the papers studying obesity as a risk factor for mortality following COVID-19 infection. Three authors independently selected the papers and agreed for final inclusion. The outcomes were the age, gender, body mass index, severe comorbidities, respiratory support and the critical illness related mortality in COVID-19. 572 publications were identified and 42 studies were selected including one unpublished study data. Only 14 studies were selected for quantitative analysis.

Results: All the primary points but the gender are significantly associated with COVID-19 mortality. The age >70, [odd ratio (OR): 0.17, CI; 95%, P-value: <0.00001], gender [OR: 0.89; CI: 95%, P-value: 0.32], BMI > 25 kg/m2 [OR: 3.68, CI: 95%, P-value: <0.003], severe comorbidities [OR: 1.84, CI:95%, P-value: <0.00001], advanced respiratory support [OR: 6.98, CI: 95%, P-value: <0.00001], and critical illness [OR: 2.03, CI: 95%, P-value: <0.00001].

Conclusions: Patients with obesity are at high risk of mortality from COVID-19 infection.

 

[backtozero]

Because they are not the only ones affected??

Near enough. Take out the 65 year olds that account for 80% of deaths and its not a pandemic.
So why can't they be trialed for the vaccine?