Certified Legendary Thread The Medical Sub blunder - What the hell?

[ABAB]

Where's Tommy?

View attachment 1112456

So we should have done what the other teams have done for some of their subs? Continue to "assess" Hamill's injuries start of Q4 for another 5 minutes to allow Lynch to get ready so the camera aren't focus on Lynch?

 

[Apsaalooke]

Are you sure there's no mix with corticosteroids, in other regions? This is actually somewhat concerning if Lynch has had to have locals given in recent weeks prior to games starting...Why the heck wasn't he rested instead?

Steroids typically take days to work and can't be used that often whether straight or mixed with local, whereas local alone can be given repeatedly so is used on game day, but you're right, resting the player would have been a better option both for Lynch and the team.

 

[Apsaalooke]

Are you sure there's no mix with corticosteroids, in other regions? This is actually somewhat concerning if Lynch has had to have locals given in recent weeks prior to games starting...Why the heck wasn't he rested instead?

Steroids typically take days to work and can't be used that often whether straight or mixed with local, whereas local alone can be given repeatedly so is used on game day, but you're right, resting the player would have been a better option both for Lynch and the team.

Edit: Just in case you didn't believe me the first time

 

[King Elvis]

It was a dumb mistake, which could've been defended to an acceptable level (only just).

But the way the Club has tried to defend it is pathetic, and has only made it worse - another refusal to accept responsibility.

I've been pretty impressed by Nicks to date, but that press conference is a shocker - a whole bunch of spin and crap instead of just owning the blunder.

That said, I don't blame Nicks - I would assume there is supposed to be someone in charge of match day decisions and organisational requirements; so the Coach can actually coach.

And get rid of Shuttleworth, he's ******* useless.

 

[John Who]

Steroids typically take days to work and can't be used that often whether straight or mixed with local, whereas local alone can be given repeatedly so is used on game day, but you're right, resting the player would have been a better option both for Lynch and the team.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's had a combination of both over the weeks. Which is probably why he's deteriorated to the extent he has been yesterday. Which brings back to the original point, keep doing jabs is not the answer...rest is best!

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Did Nicks say why Lynch wasn't in the 22?

 

[FR0GGY]

Did Nicks say why Lynch wasn't in the 22?

Injured

 

[King Elvis]

Claiming Lynch was match fit is a straight up, bald faced lie

I'm way more disappointed in the response from the Club, than the issue itself.

 

[Redline]

It was a dumb mistake, which could've been defended to an acceptable level (only just).

But the way the Club has tried to defend it is pathetic, and has only made it worse - another refusal to accept responsibility.

I've been pretty impressed by Nicks to date, but that press conference is a shocker - a whole bunch of spin and crap instead of just owning the blunder.

That said, I don't blame Nicks - I would assume there is supposed to be in charge of match day decisions and organisational requirements; so the Coach can actually coach.

And get rid of Shuttleworth, he's ******* useless.

Great post, Kelly should be able to look after himself but whoever let him give that rediculous update on nothing yesterday needs a talking to. That just fuelled the story.

 

[Slippery Pete]

Did Nicks say why Lynch wasn't in the 22?

If you watch the media conference it’s obvious he wasn’t 100% and they were rolling the dice. He mentioned the sub hadn’t been activated the last three weeks - which was a very conspicuous giveaway that they didn’t want to “waste” a player as a sub who could or should be playing a full SANFL game.

 

[Hawk_francais]

Thread of 2021 so far. Needs a best of.

Let’s kick it off with the most unlikely of OPs, Abbott & Costello’s very own John ”Who”


We’re not in the least bit surprised, John.


Jackster claims the Adelaide forum’s GIF funnyman could make sense of this situation, and I think I agree:



Deaneus, polite as always



A Hawks supporter offers the most insincere apology of 2021 (in fairness, if this happened to them, we’d be over there offering insincere apologies too):


Gee, thanks man. That helps.


Stab enjoying his extended walk on the dark side:



Jackster provides a direct line into the childhood of every Gen Y poster on the forum:



MJ2611 sums up in one sentence what life as a Crows supporter is like:



The artist formerly known as Bicks throws up a brain teaser..


I think I need one now.


Vhaluus emphasizes the rare fact that every poster is on the same page with this, even Who!



Whoops, spoke too soon about everyone being on the same page...


I read that six times and all I can say is... I think we all want some of what ABAB is smoking.


You know it’s a bad day when Spackler’s cynical humour becomes a reality literally minutes after he posts:


You jinxed it, Drugs.


Sanders then gives his review of said press conference.



Vhaluus with the “too soon” award



Crowboto sums it up using the least number of characters humanly possible:



ABAB asks the exact question the rest of the forum are asking him:



Spackler with more Mackay-related humour:



Mutineer somehow thinks this is a good start to any sentence:


Can I finish that sentence with “the moon is made out of cheese” ?


Karen award goes to Deaneus...



Grotto is way too optimistic about the club’s future with this assessment:


You and I both know they haven’t.


Hey Shorty sums up how I feel about most posts on BigFooty



Captain Obvious award goes to another sneaky Hawks Fan


C’mon man! Please!


Spackler sets an impossible assignment for ABAB



And ABAB obliges, with a paragraph of waffle that would make even Jen’s eyes water



The Texan explains very clearly and concisely why he supports the Crows:



Froggy just edges Spackler in the humour stakes with this gem


Crisp!


Sanders triggers 80% of the folks who post in the politics thread:



And finally, what would any thread be without Godwin’s Law

An Adelaide fan showing the kind of wherewithal the club can only dream of.

 

[King Elvis]

Do you realise reading one article that states "anesthetic" does not mean an entire subject? Here's an article for you to see where I'm coming from:

Soft Tissue Injections in the Athlete

Injections into or adjacent to soft tissue structures, including muscle, tendon, bursa, and fascia, for pain relief and an earlier return to play have become common in the field of sports medicine.Clinical review.Corticosteroids, local anesthetics, and ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Here's the main part which flows on from the main point I stated earlier on:
Corticosteroids, local anesthetics, and ketorolac tromethamine (Toradol) are the most commonly used injectable agents in athletes. The use of these injectable agents have proven efficacy in some disorders, whereas the clinical benefit for others remain questionable. All soft tissue injections performed for pain control and/or an anti-inflammatory effect have potentially serious side effects, which must be considered, especially in the pregame setting.

Note the last sentence, and that being my main point before, they ALL can have potentially serious side effects if overusing. All you've done is to quote an article stating "anesthetic" and you're high-fiving skam85, as if me mentioning steroids is completely absurd. Who's laughing now eh?

So can ibuprofen, but lets assume we have competent medical staff who aren't going to overdo the use of injections to the detriment of our players.

Just stop digging.

 

[jackster83]

What would have happened if someone had rolled an ankle or jagged a calf during the pre-game warm up?

Considering the sub also doubles as the travelling emergency, surely that's as good a reason as any as to why you don't have an injured player in that role.

 

[ABAB]

If you watch the media conference it’s obvious he wasn’t 100% and they were rolling the dice. He mentioned the sub hadn’t been activated the last three weeks - which was a very conspicuous giveaway that they didn’t want to “waste” a player as a sub who could or should be playing a full SANFL game.

And? Lynch hasn't been playing 100% fit in the last 3-4 weeks. Nicks mentioned that the sub hasn't been activated in the last 3 weeks so they couldn't use this new sub strategy. It's like the media is surprise Lynch was playing with "treatment" and Kane Cornes said the Crows will at least have the jumper on as the sub now.

 

[Slippery Pete]

What would have happened if someone had rolled an ankle or jagged a calf during the pre-game warm up?

Considering the sub also doubles as the travelling emergency, surely that's as good a reason as any as to why you don't have an injured player in that role.

So if you have to use your sub as an emergency, you play without a sub, is that how it works?

 

[King Elvis]

Where's Tommy?

View attachment 1112456

Just a little thing - why is our changeroom so messy and disorganised?

 

[GreyCrow]

Just a little thing - why is our changeroom so messy and disorganised?

It's the little things that cultures are built on

Phil Walsh knew it - Trent Cotchin showed it

 

[Murray2503]

I'm way more disappointed in the response from the Club, than the issue itself.

The club has a history of doubling down. The stench of Fagan still exists. There's no shame in admitting you made a mistake. The longer Nick's talked the worse he looked. Was clearly reading off a prepared response. I'm not totally blaming Nick's as 'subgate' was likely a Kelly/Riccuito directive but he shouldn't put his name defending that crap.

Internally I hope he is saying to the squad that if you deserve to play you will be picked in the 23 regardless of your experience. I don't like this constant over emphasis of "young squad". We know there are some young kids, you don't need to keep mentioning it continually. He needs to show more confidence in the group publicly and set higher expectations.

 

[ftmch]

For the first time I'm beginning to question the role of our board in terms of our general PR and comms strategy (as opposed to key individuals, such as Chappy or Fages). I'm not talking about the decision to play Lynch and his lack of readiness - that's a whole other discussion now, and, amusingly, now almost the side issue to how spectacularly we've once again managed to * up our messaging and PR of this issue.

Board aside, we've pretty much cleaned house in terms of all other key roles / functions, and yet here we are again dragging out another debacle that should have been put to bed 24 hrs ago, simply because of our inability to put our hand up and say we got it wrong.

Shutt's is clearly an incompetent fool, but I can't believe he is the one pulling the strings in our media strategy, so you can't help but think that it's a reflection of a broader mandate set down from the board. They are now the lowest common denominator.

 

[FR0GGY]

So if you have to use your sub as an emergency, you play without a sub, is that how it works?

Jones would have probably been the sub.
I think we normally travel with one or two emergencies?

 

[Deaneus!]

For the first time I'm beginning to question the role of our board in terms of our general PR and comms strategy (as opposed to key individuals, such as Chappy or Fages). I'm not talking about the decision to play Lynch and his lack of readiness - that's a whole other discussion now, and, amusingly, now almost the side issue to how spectacularly we've once again managed to fu** up our messaging and PR of this issue.

Board aside, we've pretty much cleaned house in terms of all other key roles / functions, and yet here we are again dragging out another debacle that should have been put to bed 24 hrs ago, simply because of our inability to put our hand up and say we got it wrong.

Shutt's is clearly an incompetent fool, but I can't believe he is the one pulling the strings in our media strategy, so you can't help but think that it's a reflection of a broader mandate set down from the board. They are now the lowest common denominator.

I asked the board this during the AGM... how did we get so much stuff wrong and fire everyone in the joint but the board were unscathed?

An uncomfortable silence followed.

 

[FR0GGY]

Just a little thing - why is our changeroom so messy and disorganised?

Sometimes you’ve just got to get ready quickly.

 

[xazos79]

Just a little thing - why is our changeroom so messy and disorganised?

I wouldn't expect away change rooms to be neat and tidy.

 

[Murray2503]

What would have happened if someone had rolled an ankle or jagged a calf during the pre-game warm up?

Considering the sub also doubles as the travelling emergency, surely that's as good a reason as any as to why you don't have an injured player in that role.

Nostradamus is in our match committee apparently. The club has never come across as gamblers and epecially dumb gamblers. It's almost as though their need for experience was so strong they were willing to play one short if a player did an injury in the pregame. Playing an injured Lynch all game is playing one short.

Tbh I am glad this has come to a head as the club will now have pressure on it to not play injured seniors again. At least in the sub role. Or will it? It will also create greater discussion about why we would pick an injured player over a fit one, why we undervalue our list and why we haven't done anything about it through changes in the recruiting and list management areas if they don't value the list.

They have also made Lynch look like a complete idiot. Is he as much to blame as the club for putting himself ahead of the result? Is it "team-first" putting your hand up when you know you can't perform? I feel both he and the club got what they deserved. My advice to Nick's is that humility is better than spin. Everyone makes mistakes but a fool never admits they make any.

I have nothing personal against Lynch and I'm sure he's a great fella but this incident is ridiculous. It needs to be called out otherwise the club will never do better. The fact that they aren't taking ownership has now pissed me off more than the idiotic act itself. First lesson of PR is don't treat the public like fools. They can try and justify it all they like but they themself said Lynch was injured last week. Who on the board is directing our communication strategy as this has been a problem for some time and they find it impossible to admit mistakes.

I think that their poor attitude towards the value of the sub and how it can be maximised competitively on GameDay has been a fail from the club. In saying that I think the AFL should have increased the interchange to 5 instead of a medical sub. I expect that change will occur at the end of the year.

I also feel that we need to look at what the NFL does and force all clubs to disclose injuries to the media. If people are putting their hard earned on a match they deserve all the information available. Lastly games are way too long and are increasing injuries. They need to cut them from 125-135min on average to around 110-115min imo. Also I think the rotation reduction is fatiguing players too much and leading to more injuries. They may also need to look at less games in a season to increase players career lengths. The public wants to see the best players playing and not a second string competition.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Our press conferences have a touch of the Three Stooges about them

The rowboat springs a leak and starts taking on water... so we solve the problem by punching another hole in the boat to let the water out