List Mgmt. 2024 List Management thread - Trade Targets Part 2

[Docker82]

And we'll have 44 if I have to explain my analysis on our KPDs again. I'll do it. You see if I don't!

We’ve already recruited spare KPDs and more than every AFL club has.

I don’t think we have McDonald out for basically a whole season and Cox and Pearce basically combining for a whole season out very often.

Draper, Davies and Murphy are only going to be better next year. The club has literally already planned for this - if anything they’ve slightly overdone it imo.

 

[andreww90]

Trade Cox to Adelaide in a deal that will assist in bringing Curtain to Freo.

Yes I am being reactive based on the weekends game. I’m just still in complete shock in how bad his performance was.

 

[Farrand]

We’ve already recruited spare KPDs and more than every AFL club has.

I don’t think we have McDonald out for basically a whole season and Cox and Pearce basically combining for a whole season out very often.

Draper, Davies and Murphy are only going to be better next year. The club has literally already planned for this - if anything they’ve slightly overdone it imo.

Problem is the injury cloud that hangs over all three. McDonald is notorious for being injured, Pearce has spent his career injury prone and of course we chuck him back in straight away only to get injured again, and Cox has had two fairly decent injuries. The other 3 are all development and as KPD's won't be ready for 2 to 3 years as the bodies mature. Okay, it's rare for them all to be injured but that's where we ended up.

Basically we need a resilient, mature bodied key defender. Tell you who was never injured. Zac Dawson!

 

[s_wd6]

Trade to Cox to Adelaide in a deal that will assist in bringing Curtain to Freo.

Yes I am being reactive based on the weekends game. I’m just still in complete shock in how bad his performance was.

lol as if Adelaide would want to take that on

 

[Midnite65]

Missing finals should be a real jolt to the club. It's really unacceptable and the club will be feeling the choker tag this week.

Anyone that doesn't have a contract will be nervous. However, If we cut Sturt, I expect Cockburn will be visited by one of those Ukrainian FPV bombs.

If Switta requests a trade which he is rumoured to be doing, then I think we will trade him. I think Richmond will ask for 3 first round draft picks for Bolton, and we will do it.

No way we give up 3 first round picks for Bolton only unless it includes Baker.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Problem is the injury cloud that hangs over all three. McDonald is notorious for being injured, Pearce has spent his career injury prone and of course we chuck him back in straight away only to get injured again, and Cox has had two fairly decent injuries. The other 3 are all development and as KPD's won't be ready for 2 to 3 years as the bodies mature. Okay, it's rare for them all to be injured but that's where we ended up.

Basically we need a resilient, mature bodied key defender. Tell you who was never injured. Zac Dawson!

I think your real argument is one of them should be delisted / traded because there is no scenario we bring in another KPD without that happening

 

[Farrand]

I think your real argument is one of them should be delisted / traded because there is no scenario we bring in another KPD without that happening

Too an extent yes. I think it's unfortunate but McDonald is too injury prone to have on the list.

 

[Footskill]

How about Curtin plus something else for Cox ... Any takers

 

[Stinky Lomax]

It’s a bit premature to be writing off Cox coming off a significant hamstring where he has definitely not been given the time to work back to full fitness before coming in due to others being injured.
He’s far better than the player we’ve been watching recently.

 

[Farrand]

It’s a bit premature to be writing off Cox coming off a significant hamstring where he has definitely not been given the time to work back to full fitness before coming in due to others being injured.
He’s far better than the player we’ve been watching recently.

Exactly, Cox needs a preseason and fitness. But the big thing is he's not a KPD. His breakout year was really as an intercept.

 

[freo1997]

Cox is a fine player. Not a defensive bond in his body, but effective in his way. Just has to get real with his body and get his body primed.

 

[nurries]

It’s a bit premature to be writing off Cox coming off a significant hamstring where he has definitely not been given the time to work back to full fitness before coming in due to others being injured.
He’s far better than the player we’ve been watching recently.

How much ****en time does he need? He did the Hammy 5 months ago. Should be humming by now. Yesterday was unacceptable

 

[s_wd6]

How much ****en time does he need? He did the Hammy 5 months ago. Should be humming by now. Yesterday was unacceptable

Humming is a reach. Should be trying a lot harder than he did on the weekend because that was just plain lazy.

But he was injured for 8 weeks on top of a 15 week hammy. There’s zero chance his body gets back to what it was before those injuries this season, especially missing so much pre season.

 

[freo1997]

Cox should never of played rd 1.. that’s Jlo rushing back one of his faves.

One of the many bonehead selection decisions.

 

[nurries]

Humming is a reach. Should be trying a lot harder than he did on the weekend because that was just plain lazy.

But he was injured for 8 weeks on top of a 15 week hammy. There’s zero chance his body gets back to what it was before those injuries this season, especially missing so much pre season.

Humming isn’t a reach if you are a professional athlete. If he was that underdone, put in Davies

He’s played a couple of games at Peel and 7 games now in the ones. If he can’t be up to speed by then, I don’t think he will ever be

 

[ilikepotatoes]

(I couldn't find great sources on VFL games so may be wrong on McDonald)

McDonald has played 139 AFL/WAFL/VFL games since 2015 for an average of 13.9 games per season.

Cox has played 128 AFL/WAFL games since 2017 for an average of 16 games per season.

Pearce has played 144 AFL/WAFL games since 2014 for an average of 13.1 games per season.

Obviously covid has affected those numbers a bit but that's not great. That means assuming they aren't injured at the same time we wouldn't get a full season of 2 experienced KPDs fit out of the 3 of them on average.

This season was probably on the higher end of games missed but to expect all 3 to be fit for more than 2/3 of a season each is highly optimistic.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

(I couldn't find great sources on VFL games so may be wrong on McDonald)

McDonald has played 139 AFL/WAFL/VFL games since 2015 for an average of 13.9 games per season.

Cox has played 128 AFL/WAFL games since 2017 for an average of 16 games per season.

Pearce has played 144 AFL/WAFL games since 2014 for an average of 13.1 games per season.

Obviously covid has affected those numbers a bit but that's not great. That means assuming they aren't injured at the same time we wouldn't get a full season of 2 experienced KPDs fit out of the 3 of them on average.

This season was probably on the higher end of games missed but to expect all 3 to be fit for more than 2/3 of a season each is highly optimistic.

Of anything, your research shows how we should be perfectly covered. We should normally have 2 of 3 available with Draper to cover when needed. It's just been an extra bad season between the three of them

 

[ilikepotatoes]

Of anything, your research shows how we should be perfectly covered. We should normally have 2 of 3 available with Draper to cover when needed. It's just been an extra bad season between the three if them

That's assuming that they aren't injured simultaneously.

I also don't rate McDonald at all.

 

[ilikepotatoes]

He’s hurt his knee by a bad landing not a soft tissue injury.

This is an over reaction

McDonald was an unlucky injury. It wasn't a recurrent hyper extension of the knee.

Non contact mechanism is not a great sign in terms of chances of recurrence.

That coupled with a history of back stress fractures suggests to me it's optimistic to think he won't miss significant time next season either.

 

[Docker82]

Personally I think the club has deliberately over-recruited talls of all descriptions so that in 2-3 years we have no issues.

Our best 22 has two KPDs, two rucks and two KPFs. Fully fit and firing it’s a very good group too. We’d only be able to improve that group if we got a genuine star of the competition like Sam Taylor

15

Sam Taylor

Age

26

Ht

198cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.1

4star

MG

130.5

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

2.5

1star

HB

5.5

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.5

3star

MG

60.8

1star

D

8.6

3star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.6

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.8

5star

MG

110.8

2star

. Cox had the worst game I’ve seen him play yesterday but I’d back him to get back to 2022/2023 form tbh.

Our list has six KPDs, four rucks, six KPFs and Corbett who’d almost need to be considered a KPF too (he’s undersized but you can’t play him anywhere else).

I’m completely fine not really touching these parts of our list except for gradually cutting down to a more suitable level. My view is that five KPDs, four rucks and four KPFs with one of the rucks being a forward option is about what we should have.

The obvious needs are small forwards and a bit of extra outside class but I also think it’s quite likely our depth in HBFs and inside mids will disappear by the end of 2026 through retirements and delistings. Think we need to invest 5-6 list spots (trade or draft) into these areas to both improve our list to the point where it’s a top four best 22 but the 20-30 on our list is pretty strong also.

 

[Purple Suit]

Humming isn’t a reach if you are a professional athlete. If he was that underdone, put in Davies

He’s played a couple of games at Peel and 7 games now in the ones. If he can’t be up to speed by then, I don’t think he will ever be

You’re living in dream world if you don’t think big injuries affect AFL players. Miss a preseason and even the best won’t reach their top level.

Just because you get paid for it, doesn’t change science.

 

[Docker82]

(I couldn't find great sources on VFL games so may be wrong on McDonald)

McDonald has played 139 AFL/WAFL/VFL games since 2015 for an average of 13.9 games per season.

Cox has played 128 AFL/WAFL games since 2017 for an average of 16 games per season.

Pearce has played 144 AFL/WAFL games since 2014 for an average of 13.1 games per season.

Obviously covid has affected those numbers a bit but that's not great. That means assuming they aren't injured at the same time we wouldn't get a full season of 2 experienced KPDs fit out of the 3 of them on average.

This season was probably on the higher end of games missed but to expect all 3 to be fit for more than 2/3 of a season each is highly optimistic.

Cox has had two major injuries in season in eight years throughout his career.

Pearce had barely missed a game for three years until recently. He’s missed 2-3 whole seasons due to impact injuries which massively brings down his numbers.

If we recruited another KPD they wouldn’t be better than Draper will be next year. I reckon we could possibly add Davies to that next year too but obviously he’s got some work to do.

We’re talking about this because we haven’t been lucky this year yet we’ve seen a grand total of three games played by KPDs that aren’t Draper, Pearce and Cox.

Saying Cox might not be 100% is irrelevant btw. We’re playing him if he’s available even if McDonald or a similar level defender was available.

 

[Superkoops]

Number 1 defense in the comp and people talking about KPD because Pearce was out. Cox was clearly hampered and McDonald only just coming back.

It’s the least of our worries.

We can’t build a squad based on possibilities of player availability being absent.

We need front half class. We still need a winger.

We don’t need any more KPD. We suffered serious LT injuries to two (note two) KPD in round 1. Blooded Draper (who will be better for the run with another PS), gave Davies a taste and also have Ollie Murphy developing.

It very rare that a team suffers two LT injuries in 1 game and round 1 for that matter. With Josh having played 19 games or whatever he will likely slot back to Peel with no injuries and be next in line along with McDonald. McDonald is back and was listed as our fourth best player on Sat in terrible big ugly ground conditions.

My point is like you say we have suffered 3 injuries to KPD (which is decently rare) and still managed to perform.

At the other end of the ground we lose Josh Treacy and our forward line and teams chances go to poop. Walters is pretty much cooked and we have inconsistent mid forwards.

Draft/trade needs:
Quality small forward, quality medium forward and speedy outside mid that can play wing and/or half back. A developing KPF is more needed than KPD especially if we cut all of Tabs, Corbett and Kuek.

Some possibility that Banfield or Sturt aren’t with us in 2024. Really hope Sturt stays on. But we need a quality mid forward either way. In the mould of Oliver Henry.

There are question marks over the following players:
Stanley (W), Worner (W/HBF), Kuek (KPF), Voss (KPF)

 

[Superkoops]

You’re living in dream world if you don’t think big injuries affect AFL players. Miss a preseason and even the best won’t reach their top level.

Just because you get paid for it, doesn’t change science.

Cox missed whole pre-season - scraped into round 1 off no games and then suffered LT injury. This has affected his confidence and mobility. He and McDonald will be ready for start of Pre-season.

 

[Midnite65]

Personally I think the club has deliberately over-recruited talls of all descriptions so that in 2-3 years we have no issues.

Our best 22 has two KPDs, two rucks and two KPFs. Fully fit and firing it’s a very good group too. We’d only be able to improve that group if we got a genuine star of the competition like Sam Taylor. Cox had the worst game I’ve seen him play yesterday but I’d back him to get back to 2022/2023 form tbh.

Our list has six KPDs, four rucks, six KPFs and Corbett who’d almost need to be considered a KPF too (he’s undersized but you can’t play him anywhere else).

I’m completely fine not really touching these parts of our list except for gradually cutting down to a more suitable level. My view is that five KPDs, four rucks and four KPFs with one of the rucks being a forward option is about what we should have.

The obvious needs are small forwards and a bit of extra outside class but I also think it’s quite likely our depth in HBFs and inside mids will disappear by the end of 2026 through retirements and delistings. Think we need to invest 5-6 list spots (trade or draft) into these areas to both improve our list to the point where it’s a top four best 22 but the 20-30 on our list is pretty strong also.

Also surely the trial of players like Lobb into the backline would mean that we could transform others like Voss into KPD's if required.