List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part IV

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 4

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
​

 

[Joffaboy]

Oh, sucks for the dogs.

Why would they care, they have Wilkie going to them for pick 10 and 28 with our no.7 going back to them according to their supporters

 

[mad-saint-guy]

We picked up a 3 time AA midfieldet who had been played out of position for a second rounder, but Flanders is worth pick 7?

30 year old vs 24 year old. Past his prime vs entering prime.

 

[Joffaboy]

30 year old vs 24 year old. Past his prime vs entering prime.

So we just pick up any mid who hasn't been near the midfield for a season for pick 7?
Dangerfield is thirty five and just got Geelong into a GF. Macrae was second to NAZ in the Brownlow.
The age excuse is just bullshit.
Yeah he is contracted, but so is Marshall who some want to ship off for a shit mid twenties pick.
GC see Flanders as a list clogger and want him off their books, we are happy to keep Marshall.
You people are cooked if you want to pay pick 7 for a player seen by their club as a list clogger.
Would be so St.Kilda to trade 7 for him and trade Marshall for 25
If we do that we are not a serious club.

 

[phantom13]

Where did I say that. I love Roma, I hope we keep him if you read my other comments. I think he’s worth a late first round pick/early second. All I said was Flanders is worth more. This isn’t even up for debate. If Flanders requests the saints and Marshall requests to leave, I will happily delete my account if we straight swap Marshall for Flanders. This is just delusional.

Oh my apologies i didnt realise it wasnt up for debate. Weird that seems to be what the sites for and many others are doing here.

If we cant turn Roma into Flanders then personally id rather just retain Roma and use 7 at the draft.

Were not really discussing what the club will do, we dont know what that will be.

IMO youre over valuing one and under valuing another.

 

[Captain Paddy]

Marshall loses the hit outs pretty consistency, especially coming up against the bigger rucks.

He doesn't really jump much in ruck contests either.

His ability to win possessions around the ground and link up in play is where he can pull ahead of other rucks.

But if we just have a ruck who can win more hitouts and contests, we don't have to set up defensively at stoppage, can get more attacking and win more ball first up.

It's the same argument Collingwood had with Grundy - paid him a fortune because he 'was like another midfielder' compared to other ruckman, but compared to midfielders he was ass.

Just get a ruck that can win the hitouts and that's what TDK can provide

 

[snails13]

View attachment 2437157

 

[bird_man]

Both Draper and Xerri were 21/22 at the time with barely a game between them. You dont recruit players like that with the notion that they are going to replace your first choice ruck which was the post I was replying to. If anything interest in both those players, and the fact we actually did get Ryder, shows the club is more inclined to play two rucks if it can be managed.

I also cant see where we were actively pursuing Meek. I cant really see any articles or remember discussion around him. I dont doubt we would have had interest to some degree though, he's a good player.

I think the aim was to play them in tandem, which probably means Marshall plays more forward.

We were offering Draper in particular quite a large contract, I doubt the plan was to bring him over on big money to play for the Zebras.

 

[Geezington]

Sean Darcy

4

Sean Darcy

Age

27

Ht

203cm

Wt

111kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.1

3star

K

3.4

1star

HB

6.6

4star

CL

2.4

4star

HO

28.8

5star

D

6.8

1star

K

2.0

1star

HB

4.8

3star

CL

1.8

4star

HO

20.3

5star

D

11.4

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

6.8

5star

CL

2.6

5star

HO

32.0

5star

to Essendon lmao campaigners got mattress guts

 

[NAS THE GOAT]

"Putting our head down and getting to work": Windhager on re-signing
https://www.saints.com.au/news/1902048

 

[bird_man]

So we just pick up any mid who hasn't been near the midfield for a season for pick 7?
Dangerfield is thirty five and just got Geelong into a GF. Macrae was second to NAZ in the Brownlow.
The age excuse is just bullshit.
Yeah he is contracted, but so is Marshall who some want to ship off for a shit mid twenties pick.
GC see Flanders as a list clogger and want him off their books, we are happy to keep Marshall.
You people are cooked if you want to pay pick 7 for a player seen by their club as a list clogger.
Would be so St.Kilda to trade 7 for him and trade Marshall for 25
If we do that we are not a serious club.

MaCrae was not even cemented into the 22, playing at times in the VFL and as sub.

 

[phantom13]

MaCrae was not even cemented into the 22, playing at times in the VFL and as sub.

Yeh but the dogs also have a grade mids coming out of their ass and Macrae lacked the spread game they needed to compliment Libba.

To be clear, im not knocking Flanders, if we pay 7 for him thats fine (personally i dont think hes worth that and the Macrae comparison is pretty apt cause Flanders is a mid that isnt playing mid because hes behind some absolute freaks).

Id argue pretty strongly Geelong NEEDS Roma more than we need Flanders given Nas, Pou, Garcia, Steele, Macrae, Boxshall and Hall which is also why we should be pushing pretty hard to max value for one and pay unders for the other.

Im not against anything but anyone suggesting that Roma is worth way way less than Flanders is wrong IMO.

 

[gringo2011]

Yeah, but if we trade Marshall this offseason, who is going to grab the ball from the ruck, ignore several quality handball options and then hack a ball capable of dislocating every finger on your hand?

Carlton family say the same about TDK. Reckon he just hack kicks to nobody and watches it sail back over his head.

 

[bird_man]

Yeh but the dogs also have a grade mids coming out of their ass and Macrae lacked the spread game they needed to compliment Libba.

To be clear, im not knocking Flanders, if we pay 7 for him thats fine (personally i dont think hes worth that and the Macrae comparison is pretty apt cause Flanders is a mid that isnt playing mid because hes behind some absolute freaks).

Id argue pretty strongly Geelong NEEDS Roma more than we need Flanders given Nas, Pou, Garcia, Steele, Macrae, Boxshall and Hall which is also why we should be pushing pretty hard to max value for one and pay unders for the other.

Im not against anything but anyone suggesting that Roma is worth way way less than Flanders is wrong IMO.

It still de valued him heavily and it's very obvious why Flanders would be worth a lot more than MaCrae.

I think Marshall and Flanders aren't far off. Unfortunately Geelong don't have a high pick though and the fact that we do means Gold Coast can ask for it.

 

[BrutThough]

It still de valued him heavily and it's very obvious why Flanders would be worth a lot more than MaCrae.

I think Marshall and Flanders aren't far off. Unfortunately Geelong don't have a high pick though and the fact that we do means Gold Coast can ask for it.

Turning onto into the other would be a huge win for us.

 

[phantom13]

It still de valued him heavily and it's very obvious why Flanders would be worth a lot more than MaCrae.

I think Marshall and Flanders aren't far off. Unfortunately Geelong don't have a high pick though and the fact that we do means Gold Coast can ask for it.

So the same thing that de valued Macrae doesnt de value Flanders?

Cant say i follow that logic...

 

[NAS THE GOAT]

Stinks like a poor man’s Malcolm Blight to me

 

[gringo2011]

It still de valued him heavily and it's very obvious why Flanders would be worth a lot more than MaCrae.

I think Marshall and Flanders aren't far off. Unfortunately Geelong don't have a high pick though and the fact that we do means Gold Coast can ask for it.

Flanders would probably cost a lot more if he was Melbourne based. The franchises are often easier to deal with because they are set up to amass bulk talent. You can say he was soft and outside and all that but to get the second most touches in the comp last year, 4th in super coach scores, ahead of guys like Mannagh and Ed Richards for score involvements, same stoppage clearances per game as Petracca, second in effective disposals per match etc means he's a high level player. He had an absolutely brilliant 2024. He would have been hyped if he was at Collingwood or Carlton.

 

[saintbill]

Flanders would probably cost a lot more if he was Melbourne based. The franchises are often easier to deal with because they are set up to amass bulk talent. You can say he was soft and outside and all that but to get the second most touches in the comp last year, 4th in super coach scores, ahead of guys like Mannagh and Ed Richards for score involvements, same stoppage clearances per game as Petracca, second in effective disposals per match etc means he's a high level player. He had an absolutely brilliant 2024. He would have been hyped if he was at Collingwood or Carlton.

Those are good numbers, didn't realise he had that good a year. Probably worth pick 7 in an average draft where our pick is downgraded anyway.

 

[gringo2011]

So the same thing that de valued Macrae doesnt de value Flanders?

Cant say i follow that logic...

The thing with Flanders is that he's still only 25 so you imagine out from under Rowell and Anderson he has the potential to go up another level still. He was playing as the third defensive mid with those guys in the side.

Macrae was over 30 and heading for the paddock. Plenty didn't think he was going to be able to hold up a starting midfield spot and if he can't play there he is a liability.

Flanders can play a multiple roles so you can shove him into other spots if he can't hold up in the centre.

 

[Mr Platinum]

Rowan Marshall is consistently ranked among the AFL's top rucks, often featuring in the top 10 or top 5, though specific rankings can vary by season and analyst. He is considered an all-round ruck, known for his strong aerial skills and, unusually for a big man, his exceptional ground-level play and mobility, which allow him to operate effectively as an additional midfielder.

Key characteristics that place him among the best:

• All-Round Game:
  Unlike more specialized aerial rucks, Marshall excels both in the air and at ground level, often described as an extra midfielder due to his endurance and ball-winning ability.
  
  
• Elite Mobility:
  His mobility and running ability for a big man are considered elite, contributing significantly to his impact at stoppages and in open play.
  
  
• Strong Performances:
  He has had multiple seasons where he dominated the league, earning him recognition in coaches' votes and club awards.
  
  
• Leadership:
  Marshall was inducted into St Kilda's leadership group in 2024, further highlighting his influence on the field.

Examples of his status:

• In 2023, he was considered one of the best all-round rucks in the league, alongside Tim English, with analysts highlighting his combination of aerial and ground-level skills.
  
  
• A 2024 ranking on SEN placed him at number 6 among the top 10 rucks in the AFL.

I rank him poorly as a ruck, but one of the better 'followers' in the game. He isn't a tap ruckman's arseh*le, it's no surprise we have fallen down the ladder since Patty Ryder retired.

 

[Minga]

If we turned the Marshall pick into a straight swap for Flanders, it is far more palatable. However, we will need to likely part with 7 for Flanders which I am fine with considering this years draft (and how it will be pushed down due to academy picks/FS).

In the short term I’d prefer Marshall in our best 22 than Flanders.

 

[TheJackal]

Pretty sure I saw a strange stat on Brownlow night, last year Roma was the top 'non midfield' vote getter last year. He's got his deficiencies in the centre circle, but he's still a very good footballer.

 

[jimmytigs]

I know he’s not a sprinter but Wilson is our best runner. I think they usually just give it to someone for the free GF ticket.

Higgo is the only one not involved in the exodus

its also like that trade get together of 13 clubs and the saints not showing up a couple weeks ago,we are playing hard to get

 

[TheJackal]

Its obviously a pretty pointless exercise (no pun intended) but if we turned pick 7 and what we got from Geelong into pick 13 and Flanders I'd consider it.

Personal preference would be just to keep Roma and use 7 for Flanders and a lesser pick I think.

I'd go to Geelong and ask for SDK or Roma stays. Its got to be a player for Roma.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

It still de valued him heavily and it's very obvious why Flanders would be worth a lot more than MaCrae.

I think Marshall and Flanders aren't far off. Unfortunately Geelong don't have a high pick though and the fact that we do means Gold Coast can ask for it.

It really bugs me that every year Geelong’s trade target value is met with “ah well, they only have pick 17, so that’ll have to do it”. If that’s us, we have to go out and improve the pick or find other assets to add!

I suspect we won’t be getting a higher pick than that, but some steak knives would be warranted.

And I do expect that pick 7 would go for Flanders unless we can manoeuvre picks around to get GC something equiv in later picks for bid matching. Again, something back would be nice, but even Cal has suggested pick 7 (and that Geelong’s first rounder is roughly Roma’s price).