Autopsy Rd 2 vs Hawks - Blues fight but lose due to lack of class and pace ... again

[Beyond Blue]

If the MC had any balls, they'd drop Gov. Bloke gives us nothing.

Would prefer to see us persist with Youngy - he looked great tonight and in the preseason as well.

Young is hopeless. So is McGovern. The fact both are on our list is an indictment on Austin. We need to get rid of both of them asap. I’d actually prefer us to have DGB and Phillips on our list than both of them.

 

[btdg]

Docherty and Haynes are not AFL standard any more

Docherty was in his first full/proper game back after an ACL injury. He was our 8th highest rated player on the ground, laid 9 tackles. Hardly the worst out there.

He's battling, no doubt. I think off-season we had him earmarked to play a veteran role as the sub, as Hawthorn do with Breust/Gunston, and last week was actually pretty good (unless we have another sub in the wings capable of 14 touches and 2 shots at goal in a quarter?).

Obvioulsy our lack of depth and complete shart in the bed last week has changed plans slightly, but lets not put him in the Haynes category yet.

 

[Bryce Bubbles]

I won’t hear Docherty slander on here. He has barely played in 18 months. Give him some time

He is cooked! Time to let a youngster take his spot.

 

[teddy-hopkins]

Last week Blight was a star and this week it's Battle.

I mean the common denominator is our disposal inside 50 being woeful I would have thought.

It's why whenever we play st kilda battle and wilke looked like stars. Ross always plays the extra marking player down the line and we are just so predictable.

Often you'd be better off handballing to a player under pressure on the wing causing a ball up than bombing it down the line. Yet we persist all game.

Our game plan is dumb and our coaches are so bad.

 

[reg_lower91]

Young?

Did you like that bit where he had an uncontested chestmark on the wing had just stood there and punched it over the line instead? Or when he got touched in the chest by Chol in the first quarter and fell over? Or when he got tapped on the back by Chol and fell over? both times gifting a simple mark and shot at goal.

Were you a fan of Cripps' performance tonight?
Which part? Where he had 5 players streaming forward on the third qtr and missed the handball? Or the plethora of free kicks he gave away unnecessarily? Or the several times he turned it over foot?

It's really easy to harshly judge a player when all you do is focus on their few mistakes and fail to acknowledge the good.

Did Youngy make some mistakes tonight? Yes. Most players on the field tonight made several tonight. But overall, he was very good I thought.

Again, another example of where his measuring stick is not the same as others - we judge him unfairly IMO.

 

[berisha]

Effort was better but still not good enough when the game was on the line.

Two goals in the second half for the second time in a row is indefensible. Our gameplan (if you can call it that) is deplorable. If we get another four weeks of this, Voss will be gone. There's no planet in which a club serious about making finals (let alone winning flags) doesn't act on our current form. We're a bottom 4 team at the moment.

Cripps, TDK, George and JSOS (learn to kick for the love of god) good. Young much improved after quarter time. The rest of the team just isn't good enough, not skilled enough, not quick enough or smart enough.

The MC has to make a statement. And not Fantasia. Play the kids. The season is almost done anyway.

Docherty. My lord. I don't think I've seen such a big regression. Shouldn't be anywhere near the 22. But we know there's no selection integrity, so Voss and co will continue to play the same duds.

Really thought this year could be our year. What a fool. Club feels like it's back to square one.

 

[juzza316]

Look at the positives , 2 games and no injuries yay

 

[Its an amigo!]

It might be wront but it

Doesn’t matter how wront it is it matters if it gets results it might make feel like you’ve released some energy but the results are usually counter to the outcome you won’t

I don't agree with this at all. It does more than "release some energy" it sets standards. Standards that are non-negotiable and that if you don't perform to those standards then you quite rightly cop it. It's a system that has worked for ever. Don't say that it doesn't work for this generation because I know it does - if you have the right players.

I am not much older than most players on this list, and when I was at the fire academy we got a spray daily! Literally every single one of us got yelled at both collectively and individually for the first couple of weeks. Then as needed after that. Yeah it was tough at times, but guess what, I never made the same mistake twice. Sure, I wasn't best friends with my instructors, but I did have a lot of respect for them, and they made us better because of it.

 

[Beyond Blue]

We broke their system for most of the game. Sometimes you just have to concede a team is better. I bet most people sinking the boot were surprised we were as close as we were. We had our chances.

Agreed. The coaches had a game plan that seemed to stop the most in form team in the comp in their tracks. The players did not deliver. The loss is on the players.

 

[dragonsblues]

He is cooked! Time to let a youngster take his spot.

Who would you like?

If Haynes, Young, Evans and others are getting games… the youngsters aren’t that good.

 

[The Rhino]

Haynes was an odd pick up. Slow....old......sounds great right. Just what we needed

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[Sharks On A Plane]

I have seen stronger efforts. none today

He is lazy without the ball and barely competes when out of position.

Incredible offensive player but in desperate need of strong coaching, would take so little to sort him out too.

 

[TheBlueCampaigner]

Oppo teams know that if they stay in the contest with us long enough we’ll wilt eventually and defeat ourselves. It’s like watching the same B grade movie every week.

 

[HyphensBack]

it was much better effort - nothing going our way

We need to sort out our forward line and lower our eyes obviously

Next week we play 4 quarters and will kick straight and win

 

[branedotorg]

Funny how Hawks play like a team with a plan and execute.

While we look like headless chooks just trying to somehow move the ball forward.

I've had this avatar since teague and I don't think it's going anywhere soon.

Our MO for many years has been talent over system and it makes stars but this millennium it doesn't win premierships. Brownlows, Colemans, MVPs and what Walsh won in the finals a few years ago.

 

[DangerousD]

Because McKay was never playing and shouldn’t have played last week and we had no other options

If this actually happened it needs to stop.
These are those times where it seems like you must pick one, as the idea of playing with none leaves us exposed.

But do you know what leaves us more exposed? Playing guys who can barely move.

 

[HarryFlashman]

I won’t hear Docherty slander on here. He has barely played in 18 months. Give him some time

Then why isn’t he reestablishing his touch in the 2s?

 

[teddy-hopkins]

Docherty was in his first full/proper game back after an ACL injury. He was our 8th highest rated player on the ground, laid 9 tackles. Hardly the worst out there.

He's battling, no doubt. I think off-season we had him earmarked to play a veteran role as the sub, as Hawthorn do with Breust/Gunston, and last week was actually pretty good (unless we have another sub in the wings capable of 14 touches and 2 shots at goal in a quarter?).

Obvioulsy our lack of depth and complete shart in the bed last week has changed plans slightly, but lets not put him in the Haynes category yet.

I agree. Doc was hopeless last week and made the odd mistake tonight. But overall wasn't our worst. He's playing HFF so his numbers are likely to be at Fog / Williams levels.

Cottrell was quite good tonight. 20 pos and a goal is a good return. He is one that can hit a target - at his best when getting a few goal assists.

 

[mikey83]

So now no-one in the team can kick and they should be coached to always kick long down the line?
I get the sense you’re not trying to make a coherent point and are just looking to argue here

No, my point was made in the first post of this thread: tonight's loss (and last week by extension) comes down to failure at list management.

They have failed to build a squad required to compete for flags, let alone winning them, and allocated the salary cap to the wrong places. Neither Voss nor any other prospective coach would be able to magically turn players like Young, Cowan, McGovern, Haynes into good kicks. Hawthorn were smart enough to recruit guys like Dambrosio, Amon, Battle and the like for very little. Meanwhile we allocated more than $2m in cap space for Curnow and McKay. Meanwhile Hawthorn allocated a tiny fraction of that money for Chol, who is currently producing more than double Curnow and McKay's current output.

One club has smart list managers, the other has dumb list managers.

Can guarantee you if we cut McKay and offered his entire salary to Tyson Stengle, we would be much better off.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

It's why whenever we play st kilda battle and wilke looked like stars. Ross always plays the extra marking player down the line and we are just so predictable.

Often you'd be better off handballing to a player under pressure on the wing causing a ball up than bombing it down the line. Yet we persist all game.

Our game plan is dumb and our coaches are so bad.

We line up run and play in straight lines. The forwards play from behind when we're in our own half for some reason. Around stoppages it's only straight backwards or straight forwards. The switch doesn't work because we don't have angles through the middle creating space for the switch.

It's amazing watching the way the team moves and thinking any player from any club would look like a million dollar distributor in navy blue. There's nobody to give the ball to not under pressure because it's extremely easy to defend straight lines. Extremely easy.

Players lining up wrong side and all of.this stuff just screams coaching framework to me.

What do I or any of us know though.

 

[Bryce Bubbles]

Who would you like?

If Haynes, Young, Evans and others are getting games… the youngsters aren’t that good.

Moir, Lem,

 

[LanceRomance]

I was at the game and it is now pretty clear to me that what we lack is the ability to create easy goals. All of our goals are a grind and we can grind it out with the best teams but when it comes to maximising a turnover or ‘free hit’ so to speak we are either not composed enough to make the right decision or classy enough to make sure we hit targets to create space for the easy goals. Jagga would have made a difference tonight as would straight kicking. We arent far off but I’m not sure we are coaching to better this area.

We could have won tonight but we ran out of legs due to our nature of the grind. We fix this issue and we win most games.


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I'm with you.

Our mojo is a little off, and the team balance a touch off.

I didn't think the performance was that bad.

 

[DirtyLeeds]

So most posters here had us being flogged by 50+, three goals in the end, criminal umpiring, missed shots (again)...
We convert after half time, we win. And this was without any impact from Charles. For all you Chicken Little's out there, both games could/should have been won.
It's a long season, 20+ games to go, in the words of Sticks "..stick fat people.."

 

[TheBlueCampaigner]

This is professional football, there’s no Encouragement Award for effort. Just do your jobs and get it done.

 

[Sewer de Lance]

There’s a valid explanation why your forward structure is so dysfunctional.