Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion - Part 3

[LanceRomance]

I don't think there are any calls to fail, but just some seeing things either as they are, or at least the way they see them.

Cuningham was a low-possession player in his TAC days and has mostly been a low-possession player, with us to date.

Will someone tell him to get more possessions?

 

[Mr_Plow]

People need to look at the goal against Pies 2s to see what he could become.

http://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2017-05-08/cuningham-jones-shine-in-vfl-win

He's certainly capable of being a serious impact player.

It's all between the ears. Needs to be more confident, demand the ball from his teammates and not hesitate in taking suckers on. He's a damaging player.

 

[1981]

Richie needs to find more of it. Stats say this is indisputable.

 

[btdg]

Cunningham's VFL possession tallies this year were: 21, 26, 15, 22, 25, 13. Not exactly Tom Mitchell, but he's certainly capable of getting his share of the ball.

I don't really know what he'll be. My perception has also been that he needs to do more, but then at other times looks like he belongs. I think we will see this year whether he can start to get a bit more into things at AFL level

 

[ShanDog]

When the ruck taps Cuningham the ball, he's gone. It's seriously Judd-like how he just steps through people and is away.

Problem is he doesn't get the tap very often. He has the ability though. Needs to turn it on this year and get more direct involvement out of stoppages as first recipient of a handball or something similar.

 

[HARKER]

I've seen him in the same games. 2 things

1. His first instinct is to do the team things like shepherd or tackle instead of hunt the ball
2. He isn't yet confident enough to take control of game like Polson does at VFL level. Also doesn't get the cheap possessions. If he gets 20 they are hard won.

We've clearly been watching different games then, in the past two years.

Bolton has thrown him into the centre in the VFL, to teach him to find more of the ball and he's found it tough, whereas Graham will quite easily rack up 30 possessions, Cuningham may only find it 20 times, trying to play a similar role.

I like Cuningham as the second possession player at stoppages as he has the tools to create havoc. First possession player? Going to be tough.

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Nup

Haha of course! Why didn't everybody think of that!

Excellent thinking ..

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Yeah you make me giggle

 

[thylacine60]

+1

See him also gaining 18-23 possessions per game and a goal. But I also like his hidden strengths. Can upend an opponent at times with a ferocious tackle. Carlton need that. Can run down an opponent. Will put fear into opponents unlike others on our list. Again, a requirement and not a possession count.

Got to read his development and progression so far as fine. Young, and injured a bit holding him back so far (lack of continuity)...but regardless of that, has played a lot minutes in our fwd 50 which is not conducive to gaining lots of possessions. Our fwd 50 is still dysfunctional with our mids like Kerridge, Curnow, Thomas and Murphy delivering pretty average kicks inside 50 making it even harder for a young developing mid playing out of position.

His midfield minutes were not that high in 2017 so we only see aspects of his true worth there.

Like some have mentioned and I agree with the criticism, probably does need team orientated help on where to position and where to receive the ball in the midfield. Needs to be brought into the game by Cripps and Kennedy. Footy is a repetitive structured game so I can see him getting that aspect solved easily within the next year. His assets are so high in what he offers it would take little effort of the other mids and Bolton to work him in nicely.

Barring injury, I see that happening this year. Really bullish on him as he will offer us a lot with hardness and dash away from the midfield.

On surface inspection, you can criticise, but looking deeper, there is so much on offer with Cunners.

who is BlueRenaissance and why doesn't s/he post more?

 

[Funk]

Too many people forget how young these kids are.

Cuningham has genuine leg speed, is hard and tough, a very good kick, good inside and outside and a fantatic workrate. IMO the only issue is a bit of confidence, which is coming. He didn't play a lot of junior footy, was a late starter and played HBF and is still catching up. Has then had injuries and still to get going. Everytime he has had a consistent run at it I have seen improvement and lots of upside.

I strongly believe that once he finds his feet and belief he could be very very good. The skills and effort are there it's now experience and time. 2018 is about getting game time and I expect big things in 2019 when he hits the 30 game mark.

Thanks - Hope you're right Soapy!!

 

[Funk]

Put it this way, if Cunningham ends up being one of our fringe best 22 players in 3 years time, we will have a very good list. Not everyone can be a superstar ie curnow/sps/Cripps

Understand your point but I expect us to get "fringe 22 players" as lower picks/rookies - not a high R2 pick.

 

[Tambourine]

Cunners runs well, neat disposal and tackles hard. Also kicked a couple of clutch goals when the pressure was on. We need more of this in the team ...not blokes that blow up after half time or cant hit a target . There's a spot for him in the team surely

 

[Soapy V]

Agree eager to see Lobbe and Kreuzer in the same team will give us an important new dimension.
Lobb acquisition may well turn out to be the most important one, reduce work load on the kruooz and properly develop and asses Phillips potential.

Not for me. Disaster written all over it. One ruck is the go and all 3 of our ruck options need to ruck on their own. Kruezer has his best year this season for that reason

 

[CJMB]

Agree eager to see Lobbe and Kreuzer in the same team will give us an important new dimension.
Lobb acquisition may well turn out to be the most important one, reduce work load on the kruooz and properly develop and asses Phillips potential.

Not for me. Disaster written all over it. One ruck is the go and all 3 of our ruck options need to ruck on their own. Kruezer has his best year this season for that reason

My thoughts exactly, Soapy. I'm not convinced by the 'death of the tall forward' as some would have you believe, I think it's more the you can't just have a heap of big guys on the ground whose main talent is being big. If they're mobile, have endurance and can apply pressure it's fine to have a couple. What you don't want is a second tap ruckman who's just going to sit in the square and try and take the occasional mark. I think the Lobbe signing was a great move but solely with the intention of him being an AFL standard ruckman as Kreuzer's understudy if he goes down (touch wood) or needs a rest. Not to be named in the forward pocket.

 

[johnsy14]

My thoughts exactly, Soapy. I'm not convinced by the 'death of the tall forward' as some would have you believe, I think it's more the you can't just have a heap of big guys on the ground whose main talent is being big. If they're mobile, have endurance and can apply pressure it's fine to have a couple. What you don't want is a second tap ruckman who's just going to sit in the square and try and take the occasional mark. I think the Lobbe signing was a great move but solely with the intention of him being an AFL standard ruckman as Kreuzer's understudy if he goes down (touch wood) or needs a rest. Not to be named in the forward pocket.

Can he be named as back pocket, to pick up opponents resting ruckman?

 

[CJMB]

Can he be named as back pocket, to pick up opponents resting ruckman?

Surely ahead of Lobbe you'd rather any of Marchbank, Plowman, Weitering, Jones, Macreadie, ASOS, Rowe, etc. You're going to get much better value out of one of them in that spot, better value with Kreuz doin' his thang as much of the game as possible and Levi giving him a bit of chop out when needed. I'd rather Kreuz rest on the bench when he needs it then to play both ruckman in which case one is nearly always resting on field somewhere, providing less output then the guys who actually play that position.

Not many teams run multiple rucks anyway. All you need is someone tall-ish who can give the big dog a chop out for 5 minutes at a time while he rests. *insert comments about Nank & Grigg, Mumford & Lobb, etc*

The only time Lobbe should be in the 22 is when Kreuzer isn't. Taking that further the only reason Phillips should be in the 22 is when Kreuzer AND Lobbe are both out.

 

[HBF]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/th...s/news-story/cee26703cdbf8a2c49974da375f15477

Interesting reading

Thanks for posting that. Was a very good read. Will be interesting to see if we decide to go for a mature aged player at 30.

 

[thebluelagoon]

Cunners will be fine i suspect, not all your mids can be high possession non-tackling show ponies. Cunners brings a lot of defensive and team aspects and has the tools to hurt when he does have the ball. if his confidence builds with time he can definitely be part of our premiership rotation. HELL shaun grigg was good enough

 

[Moody Blue]

That's rather my point; why have two inaccurate full forwards???

Crameri is a proven goal kicker. I would not say that about Casboult.

 

[bigm386]

Thanks for posting that. Was a very good read. Will be interesting to see if we decide to go for a mature aged player at 30.

Could argue we could do with a mature small forward and midfielder to be honest. See how we go

 

[Aphrodite]

Crameri is a proven drug cheat. I would not say that about Casboult.

 

[Moody Blue]

Oh well let's not sign him. I am sure we will win a lot of games kicking 70 points this year. I didn't hear you complain when Chris Judd came over from the Weagles...you know that place where everyone pretended they were Sergeant Schultz. Ofcourse their premiership was legitimate.

 

[Jatz]

Oh well let's not sign him. I am sure we will win a lot of games kicking 70 points this year. I didn't hear you complain when Chris Judd came over from the Weagles...you know that place where everyone pretended they were Sergeant Schultz. Ofcourse their premiership was legitimate.

Guess I missed where Judd was found guilty of taking drugs.

Not even close to the same thing.

 

[Mr_Plow]

Crameri is shit bro.

 

[Aphrodite]

Oh well let's not sign him. I am sure we will win a lot of games kicking 70 points this year. I didn't hear you complain when Chris Judd came over from the Weagles...you know that place where everyone pretended they were Sergeant Schultz. Ofcourse their premiership was legitimate.

Won't be winning any games this year.

Can you please show me where CJ is a drug cheat.