2017 Non Crows AFL Discussion Thread part 2

[mistylake]

Appears to be one of those people living in his own realty where he is so awesome...

See post #5200.
Maybe he got one too many students of the week.

 

[GROTTO]

I posted it on the Ken Hinkley thread on the mainboard, but Power (like Adelaide), can't point to a huge bank of supporting evidence that they are a good team in 2017 ...

Round 1 - beat Sydney in Sydney when they were bad
Round 2 - thrashed Freo at home when they were awful
Round 3 - admirable loss to the Crows
Round 4 - admirable loss to GWS away
Round 5 - thrashed Carlton at home when they played the kids
Round 6 - thrashed Brisbane away (nuff said)
Round 7 - worst loss of the season to Eagles at home
Round 8 - thrashed an absent Suns in China

At least we have had our attitude correction in rounds 7 and 8 !! I don't see the same cautionary approach by a lot of Tealsters.

With that list, I simply do not rank not a single win of theirs as good. Thats with my biased Crows cap off too. Sydney also had plenty of injury issues in R1.

With our list of wins, I rate our wins over the Tigers (in cherry ripe, red hot form), Port (prancing along as if they are flag favs) and GWS at at home (given our "midfield" issues). If I took a step further, our best win of the season was against GWS. They have been solid this season, only losing to us and the Saints.

If Port posters reading this, please rate your big win over a bona fide Top 8 side in the 8, when you played them.

 

[Geoffa32]

No team is outright favourite this year. Pretty much every team is in the eight on the back of cheap wins so far.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[subaru]

This is what happens when kids get student of the week in primary schools on a roster basis and not for actually doing anything worthy of recognition.
Sets up a sense of importance which is not based on anything except the ability to breath air, eat and shit, even if shitting in your own pants.

An eloquent post - paints an absolute picture !

And is absolutely true

He's done nothing so far.

 

[feenix67]

The Schache issue highlights how unworkable the current system is. Players hold the power, largely because of that old restraint of trade fear perpetually hanging over the draft system.

There's an easy solution. Remove contracts from clubs. Make every player sign a contract with the AFL. Then put a system in place, underpinned by the AFL contract, that facilitates the movement of players.

Basically, you are contracted to play in the AFL, which allows participating clubs to select players, trade players and delist players. Your contract with the AFL terminates when you are no longer on an AFL list.

The details could form an essay, but suffice to say I'm surprised the AFL haven't centralised contracts in order to mitigate the legal risks associated with the current system and thus remove much of the leverage currently enjoyed by the AFLPA.

 

[Geoffa32]

The Schache issue highlights how unworkable the current system is. Players hold the power, largely because of that old restraint of trade fear perpetually hanging over the draft system.

There's an easy solution. Remove contracts from clubs. Make every player sign a contract with the AFL. Then put a system in place, underpinned by the AFL contract, that facilitates the movement of players.

Basically, you are contracted to play in the AFL, which allows participating clubs to select players, trade players and delist players. Your contract with the AFL terminates when you are no longer on an AFL list.

The details could form an essay, but suffice to say I'm surprised the AFL haven't centralised contracts in order to mitigate the legal risks associated with the current system and thus remove much of the leverage currently enjoyed by the AFLPA.

I believe in terms of empolyment contracts the players are effectively employed by the AFL, not the actual clubs.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Niximus]

It would do more for true equalisation than anything else.

Players would have an absolute value for cap space, no having to pay extra to pull them out of big cities. They would be traded on a true open market, no more having to accept crappy trades because your player wants to go to a top 4 side.

Armed forces, cops and others sign up for a career knowing they can be sent to locations where they are required, why not footy players? They already do in the beginning when first drafted.

 

[Deaneus!]

I believe in terms of empolyment contracts the players are effectively employed by the AFL, not the actual clubs.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

This is true. So i've heard.

 

[baldandbroke]

No team is outright favourite this year. Pretty much every team is in the eight on the back of cheap wins so far.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

The form team of the comp is probably North !!!

 

[Thetrader15]

This is exactly where clubs need the right to trade players wherever they clubs want. I know the kid will be out of contract but there has to be some sort of threat over their heads. First up 4 years for a first time draftee, if he wants out in that time, the club trades him to the best offer.

...to the club which gives the best offer, not the club of his choice until FA

 

[Geoffa32]

The form team of the comp is probably North !!!

WCE, if they didn't have to play games in Victoria.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[feenix67]

I believe in terms of empolyment contracts the players are effectively employed by the AFL, not the actual clubs.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Yes, but contracts are at club level. Stupid system. Should just be employed by the AFL with a mobility clause, and subject to player selection by clubs on a sub contract or some other similar system.

 

[feenix67]

It would do more for true equalisation than anything else.

Players would have an absolute value for cap space, no having to pay extra to pull them out of big cities. They would be traded on a true open market, no more having to accept crappy trades because your player wants to go to a top 4 side.

Armed forces, cops and others sign up for a career knowing they can be sent to locations where they are required, why not footy players? They already do in the beginning when first drafted.

Exactly.

 

[relapse]

The Schache issue highlights how unworkable the current system is. Players hold the power, largely because of that old restraint of trade fear perpetually hanging over the draft system.

There's an easy solution. Remove contracts from clubs. Make every player sign a contract with the AFL. Then put a system in place, underpinned by the AFL contract, that facilitates the movement of players.

Basically, you are contracted to play in the AFL, which allows participating clubs to select players, trade players and delist players. Your contract with the AFL terminates when you are no longer on an AFL list.

The details could form an essay, but suffice to say I'm surprised the AFL haven't centralised contracts in order to mitigate the legal risks associated with the current system and thus remove much of the leverage currently enjoyed by the AFLPA.

Here is my idea for a fairer system for the clubs.

Once you get drafted, other than nominating yourself to be traded and putting a price on your head (if you're uncontracted), you are unable to nominate a club until you're a free agent. Also if you're traded the free agency clock resets.

Lets use Schache as an example, if he doesn't want to re-sign at Brisbane then he can elect to nominate his asking price and contract, but from there it is up to Brisbane to get the best deal they can from any club in the AFL that is prepared to meet his asking price.

This system will dissuade players from wanting to walk out the door early in their careers because the power is out of their hands. It also gives the clubs the ability to be able to negotiate better trade deals for players because it removes the ridiculous you can only trade a player to their nominated club nonsense. This should see fewer players doing a Gunston/Schache and will also see clubs getting a fairer return at the trade table because it will force clubs to pay tote odds for a player rather than shitty take it or leave it deals like we had for Gunston, Stenglein etc

 

[Scorpus]

Player salaries should be public knowledge

 

[Geoffa32]

Yes, but contracts are at club level. Stupid system. Should just be employed by the AFL with a mobility clause, and subject to player selection by clubs on a sub contract or some other similar system.

They effectively work within the system you have suggested.

The issue is the AFL gives them too many rights to move from one location (club) to another within their employment. Without the same fairness going the other way to the clubs.

I think the AFLPA is the issue. AFL is terrified of strike action.



Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Is Brisbane a well-run club?

 

[DD#23]

Is Brisbane a well-run club?

I think so, but Noble can only do so much overnight.

 

[feenix67]

They effectively work within the system you have suggested.

The issue is the AFL gives them too many rights to move from one location (club) to another within their employment. Without the same fairness going the other way to the clubs.

I think the AFLPA is the issue. AFL is terrified of strike action.



Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Not really. The contract is AFL endorsed and stipulates the players will adhere to AFL rules and policies, but the club is the signatory and carries the financial risk.

My system proposes that the clubs work within a player movement framework that is not contract based, and underpinned by the AFL as the employer.

A simple analogy is the AFL is the employer/head office and the club is the branch. The player is employed by head office and assigned to a branch. Branches can the facilitate the movement of players under predetermined guidelines and TPP, but the player remains employed by the head office until no branch wants him. Players don't sign contracts with clubs, but rather stay with the branch until

a ) the branch trades him
b ) the branch delists him
c ) free agency

Therefore the club doesn't carry financial risk, the player values are still determined by free market, but the AFL doesn't have to worry about restraint of trade issues anymore.

 

[Tyls83]

Memories

 

[DD#23]

Memories

 

[Geoffa32]

Not really. The contract is AFL endorsed and stipulates the players will adhere to AFL rules and policies, but the club is the signatory and carries the financial risk.

My system proposes that the clubs work within a player movement framework that is not contract based, and underpinned by the AFL as the employer.

A simple analogy is the AFL is the employer/head office and the club is the branch. The player is employed by head office and assigned to a branch. Branches can the facilitate the movement of players under predetermined guidelines and TPP, but the player remains employed by the head office until no branch wants him. Players don't sign contracts with clubs, but rather stay with the branch until

a ) the branch trades him
b ) the branch delists him
c ) free agency

Therefore the club doesn't carry financial risk, the player values are still determined by free market, but the AFL doesn't have to worry about restraint of trade issues anymore.

The AFL and the club are signatories to the contract. Section 5 of the CBA outlines the parties to a playing contract. I would link it but it is a pain in a phone. But can be found at aflplayers.com.au

AFL being head office and the club is a branch. Remember every AFL club is a franchise of the AFL franchise system. Every club is guaranteed financially by the AFL.

Your example is how it works.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[jackster83]

They're super confident about tonight's game on the Port board. All that smog in Shanghai must have fried their brains.

Hoping for a fiery, spiteful encounter. No Wingard will hurt Port, while the Cats will struggle with Ryder and Dixon. Danger and Selwood to get 17 free kicks between them.

 

[Simmo28]

Player salaries should be public knowledge

Really? You happy to post a copy of your payslip here?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[rezagun]

What do we want from tonight?