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List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part I

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Delisted;
-

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle
Shaun McKernan

Current Players Out of Contract;
3. Zak Jones - Link
6. Sebastian Ross (RFA) - Link
7. Luke Dunstan (RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie - Link
15. Jack Billings (RFA) - Link
18. Patrick Ryder - Link
24. James Frawley - Link
25. Dean Kent - Link
38. Oscar Clavarino - Link
39. Darragh Joyce - Link
41. Paul Hunter - Link
42. Max Heath - Link
45. Sam Alabakis - Link


To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...
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Quinton Narkle is an interesting one. Not signed, Ralph car is his manager, I think he has enormous talent. Quick, creative, explosive and can win his own footy. Everything we need.
Being a bottom 5 chance, we should walk the lad through the pre season draft. He would be an upgrade to Dunstan.
disclaimer, I think Luke is a great player but he doesn’t play infront or crouch, Jones, Seb and Steele, include gresh and his type of player is a long way back.
Narkle would be perfect if we got him for nothing.
 
Sooo.. can we bite the bullet hear and get him off our books now? Surely we sallow our pride now and move on.




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Holy Hunter Clark said:
Sorry if I’m posting in the wrong group here for this, but if we do delist him, what do we do with that salary space?
Click to expand...
You can't just delist someone because they're injured. He has a contract. He would have to agree to retire.
 
PandaG said:
Quinton Narkle is an interesting one. Not signed, Ralph car is his manager, I think he has enormous talent. Quick, creative, explosive and can win his own footy. Everything we need.
Being a bottom 5 chance, we should walk the lad through the pre season draft. He would be an upgrade to Dunstan.
disclaimer, I think Luke is a great player but he doesn’t play infront or crouch, Jones, Seb and Steele, include gresh and his type of player is a long way back.
Narkle would be perfect if we got him for nothing.
Click to expand...

Narkle is a yes from me.
 
saint66au said:
So we are topping up and rebuilding all at the same time?
Click to expand...
when did we top up.

we restructured the list, we had a huge gulf in the mid-age bracket, which we've fixed. now we are deficient in youth, we brought in Frawley and McKernan and Hunter in the hope they wouldn't be needed but we had zero depth in that Dept. and maybe we thought our time had come earlier than planned but getting in 18y.o kids would of put us in exactly the same position as we are.

so in effect, we are neither topping up nor rebuilding, but patching up the Hatchette job done for the prior 10 years
 
stavro#4 said:
It’s not that they aren’t valuable. Let’s be really clear with that.

its that as it stands. They aren’t stars and Billings can be the pathway forward for us getting 2 players who are better via compensation and his salary to target free agents in 2022.

the group as it is - when fit,could maybe be the 4th best in the league with some luck. It’s not a. Flag winning list.
Click to expand...

Too many if buts and maybes for me.

Billings hasn't played in a good side. I don't think we're far off being that. I think he'll be an important part of the puzzle as we get closer to that.

We should be offloading quite a few players over the next couple of years. Lets keep our good players, particularly if they're good ball users. It's the area of our game we're lacking.

Of course it depends what money he wants. I'm not saying pay him 750k.

There's a lot this current group, coaches included, could improve on. I think your suggestion of membrey back is possibly a good one. If Battle can turn into something up forward and King gets going we'll be looking much better. Then it's a matter of the coaches doing a better job. I don't think ratts has had a good year, injuries aside.

I really hope both Billings and Battle are at the club next year.
 

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gringo2011 said:
At least my constant negativity wasn't a form of paranoid delusion. Jack Steven probably unlucky to not be AA at least once. Not sure but Lynch, Cripps and Mc Evoy probably all were on the AA long list potentially.
Click to expand...
Dempster, Ross, Butler, Roberton, the only Saints players since 2011/2 to have made the 40 man squad that I can think of
 
Sully111 said:
Too many if buts and maybes for me.

Billings hasn't played in a good side. I don't think we're far off being that. I think he'll be an important part of the puzzle as we get closer to that.

We should be offloading quite a few players over the next couple of years. Lets keep our good players, particularly if they're good ball users. It's the area of our game we're lacking.

Of course it depends what money he wants. I'm not saying pay him 750k.

There's a lot this current group, coaches included, could improve on. I think your suggestion of membrey back is possibly a good one. If Battle can turn into something up forward and King gets going we'll be looking much better. Then it's a matter of the coaches doing a better job. I don't think ratts has had a good year, injuries aside.

I really hope both Billings and Battle are at the club next year.
Click to expand...
I agree re Billings. I think of someone like Shane Edwards for Richmond. Everyone loves talking about how good he is and has been, but before they won their first flag he was regarded as just a handy inconsistent bit player. Now he’s regarded as one of their best players, a leader and an important player for their team. He was 28 years old when they first won a flag. I still think Billings can be an integral part of this team once we start to click.

In saying all that, if he wants a big contract then I hope we let him go, we need to start building a solid culture where players are willing to do what’s best for the team.
 
Mat Mann said:
when did we top up.

we restructured the list, we had a huge gulf in the mid-age bracket, which we've fixed. now we are deficient in youth, we brought in Frawley and McKernan and Hunter in the hope they wouldn't be needed but we had zero depth in that Dept. and maybe we thought our time had come earlier than planned but getting in 18y.o kids would of put us in exactly the same position as we are.

so in effect, we are neither topping up nor rebuilding, but patching up the Hatchette job done for the prior 10 years
Click to expand...
That kind of sensible posting can get you in a lot of trouble round these parts..
 
puppy_dog7 said:
I agree re Billings. I think of someone like Shane Edwards for Richmond. Everyone loves talking about how good he is and has been, but before they won their first flag he was regarded as just a handy inconsistent bit player. Now he’s regarded as one of their best players, a leader and an important player for their team. He was 28 years old when they first won a flag. I still think Billings can be an integral part of this team once we start to click.

In saying all that, if he wants a big contract then I hope we let him go, we need to start building a solid culture where players are willing to do what’s best for the team.
Click to expand...
Billings has had 2 good to very good seasons including this one, both of them in contract years. He's also had 5 meh to very meh seasons at the same time.
I don't want us to get sucked in again only to have him spud it up next year. Right now his value is as high as it will get, and there are hopefully clubs sniffing around that can afford a band 1 compo contract.

I have little doubt we can adequately replace him with guys already on the list, so if it gets another high pick then it's an absolute no brainer..
 

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Stewart66 said:
Prefer Greg Clark.
Click to expand...


He must have had an offer for a more permanent gig if he didn't nominate for the mid season draft. He looks pretty good. Was it us that got him to stay out of the draft?
 
gringo2011 said:
He must have had an offer for a more permanent gig if he didn't nominate for the mid season draft. He looks pretty good. Was it us that got him to stay out of the draft?
Click to expand...


Guy would walk into 6 clubs list ….…not to my knowledge.

Yeah Riley Knight wanted 2 years ..for example
 
So as a result of that article about Port’s reset in 2018 (not having a top 20 pick in any of the prior five years), and the stavro#4 argument re getting another early draft pick, I actually had a look at what Port did in 2018.

Essentially (as things get complicated):
They traded Polec and Pittard for the pick (eventually #6), they used for Rozee.
They already had the pick (eventually #12), they used for Butters.
They traded Wingard for the pick (eventually #18), they used for Duursma.

That’s some impressive trading.
We might argue about the merits of each trade, but they did move out three of their best 22, and got a couple of really good kids in return.
Either Duursma or Butters would walk into our best 22.
As would Rozee, but he was drafted.
Plus they addressed their list issues.

Then consider what they did in 2019 (with us) ultimately turning #10 and Howard/Ryder into #12 and #18, becoming Bergman and Georgiades.
Georgiades would walk into our team too.
Not sure about Bergman.

I think it‘s entirely plausible that we could match that.
It might not be a North trading to bolster their list, or a Hawthorn trading to extend their window, but there’ll be someone interested in a deal.
It just depends on the offer and for whom.

Or, as Stavro has suggested, we wait and see what free agency offers.

If Band #1 compo does become available it might be as low as #6.
Would we use that, or leverage it like Port into a #10 and #16 for example?

I guess what I am saying is that based on what Port achieved in 2018, there is no reason why we cannot adopt a similar strategy and get a similar outcome.

Ultimately the success of doing so will depend on three factors:

1. The quality and depth of quality in this year’s draft.
2. The List Manager’s ability to negotiate a strong trade result.
3. And the Recruiting Team’s ability to identify and select quality players with the hand they are dealt.

I reckon this year will be a great test to see how well our trade and recruiting team actually perform.

No excuses.
 
sunny3193 said:
So as a result of that article about Port’s reset in 2018 (not having a top 20 pick in any of the prior five years), and the stavro#4 argument re getting another early draft pick, I actually had a look at what Port did in 2018.

Essentially (as things get complicated):
They traded Polec and Pittard for the pick (eventually #6), they used for Rozee.
They already had the pick (eventually #12), they used for Butters.
They traded Wingard for the pick (eventually #18), they used for Duursma.

That’s some impressive trading.
We might argue about the merits of each trade, but they did move out three of their best 22, and got a couple of really good kids in return.
Either Duursma or Butters would walk into our best 22.
As would Rozee, but he was drafted.
Plus they addressed their list issues.

Then consider what they did in 2019 (with us) ultimately turning #10 and Howard/Ryder into #12 and #18, becoming Bergman and Georgiades.
Georgiades would walk into our team too.
Not sure about Bergman.

I think it‘s entirely plausible that we could match that.
It might not be a North trading to bolster their list, or a Hawthorn trading to extend their window, but there’ll be someone interested in a deal.
It just depends on the offer and for whom.

Or, as Stavro has suggested, we wait and see what free agency offers.

If Band #1 compo does become available it might be as low as #6.
Would we use that, or leverage it like Port into a #10 and #16 for example?

I guess what I am saying is that based on what Port achieved in 2018, there is no reason why we cannot adopt a similar strategy and get a similar outcome.

Ultimately the success of doing so will depend on three factors:

1. The quality and depth of quality in this year’s draft.
2. The List Manager’s ability to negotiate a strong trade result.
3. And the Recruiting Team’s ability to identify and select quality players with the hand they are dealt.

I reckon this year will be a great test to see how well our trade and recruiting team actually perform.

No excuses.
Click to expand...
If we get band one.

just take the pick and ours to the draft. There is apparently real quality at the pointy end of this one. Don’t do anything creative. Don’t out smart ourselves. Don’t get over confident thinking some half back will be a gun mid etc.


just best available and one will be a pure mid.

i think we cut the list hard post season. The creativity will be how will build out the rest of the list. But I really dont want to screw around with potential top 5 picks
 
Joffaboy said:
King is not an option to st least the end of 2022.
Taranto was promising early this year. Haven't heard anything since.
Click to expand...


You mean like Heeney 🤣
Can go any club…never came ours 😉
 
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