List Mgmt. 2022 Carlton Consensus Best 22

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gandaal

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I hope the 16 of you who don't have Doc in their 7 are simply neglecting the OP and assumption he's fit for R1.

Otherwise, touch disrespectful to the great man. May have his limitations and flaws but he's an AA and captain of the club.

Tough vote, this. Won't feel right it he's not selected.
Looking like he'll be selected. I can understand why people wouldn't vote for him. Its easy to say assume he's fully fit, but will he ever be fully fit again?

Getting healthy surely is the life goal for Sam right now. I don't think playing footy would be too high a priority.
 

Matty411

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That's why I was suggesting we do the 4 interchange players last, as inevitably some good players will miss out with this format unfortunately :straining:
That'd make the votes even bloody harder! In all honesty, there's merits with both systems of voting and more. The variation may not be as big as you think either way and good players will miss out.

If Doc does miss out though, for reasons like GapInIkonPark has suggested - saying Willo as a direct comparison is better - than I'm genuinely surprised.

But he'll likely be eased into the season anyway so won't overly matter.

Just don't agree with the logic - he would never be dropped or not named when fit. Interesting position though! That's what makes this exercise great.
 
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Matty411

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Looking like he'll be selected. I can understand why people wouldn't vote for him. Its easy to say assume he's fully fit, but will he ever be fully fit again?

Getting healthy surely is the life goal for Sam right now. I don't think playing footy would be too high a priority.
I agree, but he strikes me as a competitor and he's already running by the looks of an earlier video last week.

He will want to beat this and get back out there.
 

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I have a hunch that our wings are going to surprise a lot of people. Tempted to move Saad and williams up to the wings. They are both too good to be used just in defence. We have plenty of other options for Half back- docherty, Tom W, Newman, Marchbank, stocker, kemp

Going to need one of them back there, if only for speed to cover for quick turnovers.
 

Ash24

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too many similar types ahead of him - they can't all be attacking HBFs
Doc won't be playing any time soon, and I've always suggested that Saad (or even Williams) plays on a wing - that leaves Newman and Williams as our two attacking HBFs.
 

Arr0w

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Williams, Saad, Doc (when fit) in direct competition. I have Plowman and Stocker ahead because they play a different role. Then there's the talls + whatever Kemp is.

You are assuming all those named play in the backline

Also, for 2 years, there have been many players that have been suggested, that would be better options, yet when fit, Newman is always selected

At this stage, I think he is a lock for the back 7
 

El Topo

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You are assuming all those named play in the backline

Also, for 2 years, there have been many players that have been suggested, that would be better options, yet when fit, Newman is always selected

At this stage, I think he is a lock for the back 7

Well yeah, that's the exercise in this thread.

Agree that he'll get plenty of opportunity in the real thing given his character and consistency, Docherty's issues and the usual injuries/team rotation. The club might even look at bringing Docherty back through the VFL - we have that flexibility.
 

Arr0w

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Well yeah, that's the exercise in this thread.

Agree that he'll get plenty of opportunity in the real thing given his character and consistency, Docherty's issues and the usual injuries/team rotation. The club might even look at bringing Docherty back through the VFL - we have that flexibility.

This thread is a mix of realism and bias.

Like last year where Willo was selected as a lock for the back 6 and Newman was an emergency
 

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ItsAllAboutMe

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Which players would be ahead of him, considering there are normally 7 defenders on game day

Saad, Williams (if not playing mid) Docherty & Stocker. The only one not clearly in front of Newman is Stocker however they need to continue playing him because of the upside.

Like all coaches DT & MV would have there favorites and a player like Willow might even come into the mix.. If you assume that Vossy will be mirroring parts of Ports defense that you can take it to the bank that we wont be playing a 1 on 1 defensive structure again, and players that can play a role within the system will become far more valuable, which is why I think losing Jones wont hurt us that much.
 
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Arr0w

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Saad, Williams (if not playing mid) Docherty & Stocker. The only one not clearly in front of Newman is Stocker however they need to continue playing him because of the upside.

Like all coaches DT & MV would have there favorites and a player like Willow might even come into the mix.. If you assume that Vossy will be mirroring parts of Ports defense that you can take it to the bank that we wont be playing a 1 on 1 defensive structure again, and players that can play a role within the system will become far more valuable, which is why I think losing Jones wont hurt us that much.

So naming those 4, still allows Newman to be the 7th defender. Guys like Willo, Parks aren't ahead of him, until Marchbank can stay on the park, he should be considered a bonus. Kemp could come into contention, but he might play further up the ground.

I doubt we will go round again with an antiquated 1 on 1 back unit, so an extra intercept player will lessen the concern of Jones leaving, but I have no doubt Young and Weitering will play the main posts, rather than playing an undersized backline
 

El Topo

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This thread is a mix of realism and bias.

Like last year where Willo was selected as a lock for the back 6 and Newman was an emergency

We're all biased here, but I don't think anyone is too invested in the competition for a bench spot in the 22.

Williamson in last year's poll would have been a mix of different player roles plus a young player with a strong final game vs a mature fringe HBF who had just missed a year to an ACL. The knock on Newman is his pace and defending so it makes sense from a player type perspective. The comparison this year might be a with a proper lockdown defender like Plowman.
 

ItsAllAboutMe

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So naming those 4, still allows Newman to be the 7th defender. Guys like Willo, Parks aren't ahead of him, until Marchbank can stay on the park, he should be considered a bonus. Kemp could come into contention, but he might play further up the ground.

I doubt we will go round again with an antiquated 1 on 1 back unit, so an extra intercept player will lessen the concern of Jones leaving, but I have no doubt Young and Weitering will play the main posts, rather than playing an undersized backline

Newman 186, Willow 190 & Parks 187.. Not a huge difference in height but Willow seems to play a bit taller and will probably depend on the opposition.. I can see Voss trying to deploy Weiters in the Aliir Aliir role (and he will do it twice as well).. So Weiters will get the 3rd tall and play off them to intercep, which means if we play a team like Melbourne Young takes Brown, Marchbank takes McDonald, Plow takes Fritsch and Weiters plays on Jackson zoning off. Something along those lines.. I think we are reliant on Marchbank getting fit, so may need to play 4 talls only leaving 2 runners.. Which will be Saad and Willims/Stocker.
 

ItsAllAboutMe

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McDonald also a forgotten man. He played some decent footy at the Dees. Not in my round 1 side but I could see him locking down FB if Young doesn’t take his opportunity early. He’s a better pure defender/stopper than Young as it stands.

Yes Oscar was a reasonable full back at Dees, and the reason they pushed Tom McDonald forward was because Oscar held down FB however his disposal was just so poor he became a liability, and with May & Lever was no longer required. The type of player we hope we dont need but he is decent back up for injury.
 

JuddgementDay

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It looks like 6 defenders have been decided, with Kemp and Docherty fighting it out for the 7th spot.

The 6 are: Weitering, Saad, Williams, Stocker, Young, Plowman

The good news is we have good depth here, when you look at who is likely to miss out: Docherty, Marchbank, Newman & McGov
 

Kreuuuzeurns

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Yes Oscar was a reasonable full back at Dees, and the reason they pushed Tom McDonald forward was because Oscar held down FB however his disposal was just so poor he became a liability, and with May & Lever was no longer required. The type of player we hope we dont need but he is decent back up for injury.

We’d have plenty of good users around him. He doesn’t need to break records, just do enough on the number 1 forward to allow Weiters to play his natural game.
 

Arr0w

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We're all biased here, but I don't think anyone is too invested in the competition for a bench spot in the 22.

Williamson in last year's poll would have been a mix of different player roles plus a young player with a strong final game vs a mature fringe HBF who had just missed a year to an ACL. The knock on Newman is his pace and defending so it makes sense from a player type perspective. The comparison this year might be a with a proper lockdown defender like Plowman.

Not everyone is bias.

I still have high hopes for Willo, moreso as a wingman, but he was never ahead of Newman in my eyes, nor did it play out that way. We have a number of one-paced players in the side, so Newman playing alongside the likes of Saad, Williams, etc, isn't an issue. Newman is one of our better defenders, which will be more apparent with a better defensive setup and he is our best user, despite at times trying to bite off too much/force forward momentum.

At this stage, I think he is a lock in the back 7


Newman 186, Willow 190 & Parks 187.. Not a huge difference in height but Willow seems to play a bit taller and will probably depend on the opposition.. I can see Voss trying to deploy Weiters in the Aliir Aliir role (and he will do it twice as well).. So Weiters will get the 3rd tall and play off them to intercep, which means if we play a team like Melbourne Young takes Brown, Marchbank takes McDonald, Plow takes Fritsch and Weiters plays on Jackson zoning off. Something along those lines.. I think we are reliant on Marchbank getting fit, so may need to play 4 talls only leaving 2 runners.. Which will be Saad and Willims/Stocker.

Still think Newman is well ahead of Parks and Willo, based on composure, ball use and how he reads the game.

I would be very surprised if Weitering plays as a 3rd tall, considering we have no one that could play on the better body on body forwards. But, if that was to happen, think it would be better suited to play Young and OMac as KPD's, not Marchbank
 

ItsAllAboutMe

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We’d have plenty of good users around him. He doesn’t need to break records, just do enough on the number 1 forward to allow Weiters to play his natural game.

I agree and footy has changed a little over the last few years where the full forward is back in vogue, so having someone capable of locking them down makes a fair bit of sense.
 

HaydossJ

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McDonald also a forgotten man. He played some decent footy at the Dees. Not in my round 1 side but I could see him locking down FB if Young doesn’t take his opportunity early. He’s a better pure defender/stopper than Young as it stands.
I could be wrong, but I just don't see a world where McDonald is playing when Young is fit. We need to be courageous and play Young even in the midst of a form slump (if this happens). We need to know if Young is the future.
 

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