We all have our biases - even more so on a Carlton fan forum. I do concede that Newman's defending will look better in a more team-oriented setup.
That being said - if we're in the business of hard headed realism, why no Plowman?
List Mgmt. 2022 Carlton Consensus Best 22
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We all have our biases - even more so on a Carlton fan forum. I do concede that Newman's defending will look better in a more team-oriented setup.
That being said - if we're in the business of hard headed realism, why no Plowman?
Jeremias
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I agree, though I did not vote for him here. Doc took his spot but I don't see any way Sam is there come round one.
He is a casualty of slightly unrealistic constraints of the poll, with more than 7 of these guys likely to feature in our best side.
Absolutely. I voted for Young (with Weitering moving to FB) but there's every chance Oscar is there instead come round 1 with Weitering at CHB.
- Dec 22, 2006
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We will have injuries, no surer thing and McDonald is great insurance but he isnt in the best 22 conversation.
Jeremias
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He was in the math day squad for the first three games of last year before succumbing to injury.
We have a big hole to fill down back and he's one of the more logical candidates to fill that hole.
He's very clearly in the conversation.
- Dec 22, 2006
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He was in the squad to play as a forward as we had lost De Konig, Curnow & McGovern to injury and had no viable 2nd fwd option to help H and no back up ruck to support Pitto which inevitably forced us to play Levi when he was well underdone and probably ruined his year.
Again, not everyone has bias when assessing a side or player
Because this is the setup I would have gone with:
List Mgmt. - 2022 Carlton Consensus Best 22
I can't believe LOB has the same number of votes as Ed. You people are absolutely crazy. Given our list and the way the voting is done, this exercise will not go well this year. No slight on Matty, just too many good options, going to outvote the peripherals. Wait until you see how the...
www.bigfooty.com
This is where I think things will now go pear shape after the likes of Dow being selected ahead of players with better output
So, gone with this backline
Doc - Weitering - Stocker
Williams - Young - Saad
7th Defender - Newwman
Kemp misses out here too
In reality, I believe Williams gets a start ahead of Dow in the midfield, Newman to 6th defender, Kemp 7th defender
Essentially, Doc and or Kemp could play the Plow option, giving us more run and carry, but I would have had Williams or Kemp ahead of Dow in the midfield, allowing Plow to be in that 7 defenders group
Again, not everyone has bias when assessing a side or player
Because this is the setup I would have gone with:
List Mgmt. - 2022 Carlton Consensus Best 22
I can't believe LOB has the same number of votes as Ed. You people are absolutely crazy. Given our list and the way the voting is done, this exercise will not go well this year. No slight on Matty, just too many good options, going to outvote the peripherals. Wait until you see how the...
This is where I think things will now go pear shape after the likes of Dow being selected ahead of players with better output
So, gone with this backline
Doc - Weitering - Stocker
Williams - Young - Saad
7th Defender - Newwman
Kemp misses out here too
In reality, I believe Williams gets a start ahead of Dow in the midfield, Newman to 6th defender, Kemp 7th defender
Essentially, Doc and or Kemp could play the Plow option, giving us more run and carry, but I would have had Williams or Kemp ahead of Dow in the midfield, allowing Plow to be in that 7 defenders group
We have the same line-up save for Plowman. Never enough love...
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McDonald is only 25 and has plenty to offer. The better of the two should play, suspect Young gets first crack.
I figure (given it's 2 weeks into pre-season) there are 5 locks, Weiters, Saad, Plow, Williams, Stocker.
Beyond that, you need to pick at least one tall, and then...
Doc on talent and performance (how do we take his health/injury issues over the last 3 years?).
Marchy on talent but how can you trust him with zero footy for over 2 years?
They poached Young for a reason. And gave MacDonald another year for a reason.
Then there's Kemp with his talent.
It's a raffle at this stage for the last 2 spots.
Beyond that, you need to pick at least one tall, and then...
Doc on talent and performance (how do we take his health/injury issues over the last 3 years?).
Marchy on talent but how can you trust him with zero footy for over 2 years?
They poached Young for a reason. And gave MacDonald another year for a reason.
Then there's Kemp with his talent.
It's a raffle at this stage for the last 2 spots.
Justnetime
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I’ve got Kemp in my personal best 22 but see he misses out here on this format.
I guess I can accept it’s a best 22 consensus vote and he was only a chance To start With this type of selection game.
Personally, A real stretch to see him play midfield or wing IMO. He has already mentioned somewhere he was gassed on the running. Needs development And tank build.
I guess I can accept it’s a best 22 consensus vote and he was only a chance To start With this type of selection game.
Personally, A real stretch to see him play midfield or wing IMO. He has already mentioned somewhere he was gassed on the running. Needs development And tank build.
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Agree with all your locks. Doch when available is number 6 for me and balance wise we need another tall - probably Young. However, a spot opens up if (as I would want) Doch takes a wing position. Newman or Marchy next up when fit.
- Dec 22, 2006
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I think the spot opens up with Williams being fit enough to play in the guts, or potentially on a wing..
Backline super hard to select. Going to be some deserving guys and talented guys who miss out.
Still shattering we don't have Jones.
Backline would be brilliant.
Still shattering we don't have Jones.
Backline would be brilliant.
Looking forward to the melts regarding "selection integrity" next year
- Sep 19, 2019
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I hope so. I keep hearing about Philp, hopeful…
- Sep 19, 2019
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I don’t care who, would be nice to be Philp. We need speed!
- Sep 19, 2019
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Surely he is no guarantee. Hope he is up and about but you you can’t fault people who question. He is battling cancer ffs.
N1ght Pizza
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I'm shocked Newman only has 33% of the votes, there is no way he's missing round 1 unless injured (touch wood)
Yeap
B: Saad Young Kemp
HB: Williams Weitering Stocker
Int: Docherty?
Foll: DeKoning Cripps Dow
C: Cerra Walsh Hewett
Int: Kennedy
HF: Fisher C.Curnow Martin
F: Silvagni McKay Honey
Int: Cunners
INT: Docherty Kennedy Cunners McGovern
EMG: Pittonett EdCurnow Plowman Newman Marchbank Newnes McDonald (mature)
EMG: Williamson O’Brien Setterfield Fogarty Cottrell Owies Boyd (22-24yrs)
EMG: Philp Carroll Motlop Durdin Parks Mirkov (youngsters)
HB: Williams Weitering Stocker
Int: Docherty?
Foll: DeKoning Cripps Dow
C: Cerra Walsh Hewett
Int: Kennedy
HF: Fisher C.Curnow Martin
F: Silvagni McKay Honey
Int: Cunners
INT: Docherty Kennedy Cunners McGovern
EMG: Pittonett EdCurnow Plowman Newman Marchbank Newnes McDonald (mature)
EMG: Williamson O’Brien Setterfield Fogarty Cottrell Owies Boyd (22-24yrs)
EMG: Philp Carroll Motlop Durdin Parks Mirkov (youngsters)
Jeremias
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1. Jacob Weitering. Obvious choice - one of the best key defenders in the game and the pillar of our defense.
2. Sam Docherty. Can't see him being out there come round one, but given the rules of the thread you just have to vote him in here. At full fitness he doesn't miss out.
3. Zac Williams. Eligible as a midfielder, but I said I wouldn't vote for him there because I'd vote for him down back. I'm a man of my word.
4. Lachie Plowman. Yeah, sorry people - he's clearly in our best side and it's fanciful to suggest he won't be there.
5. Adam Saad. Clearly one of the first picked in this backline. With his explosive pace he's a weapon coming out of the backline.
The above 5 pick themselves IMO given the premise of the exercise. Spots 6 and 7 are tougher but I've got 2 clearly in mind:
6. Liam Stocker. Similar to Williams, Stocker was eligible as a mid but made a home for himself down back in 2021 and I expect him to stay there, for now at least. Developing beautifully.
7. Lewis Young. Am a fan of Lewis' and the Jones situation has given him a golden opportunity to cement a spot in our best side.
The others:
LOB: Nope. Not considered even for one second. I don't have him as our best wing and I certainly don't have him as a viable option coming off half back.
McGovern: The enigma - will he feature down back? I can't pick him here but appreciate many think he needs to go down back to revive a stalling career. Part of me still wants to see how he goes as a 3rd tall up forward but I'm more patient than many. Not picking him here but there's a chance he'll be there in round one.
Kemp: Haven't picked him but seems he'll at least start his career down back and if fit he's every chance of being in the side come round one. So keen to see how he develops in 2022 but for mine it's all about getting games under his belt. I don't care at what level.
Marchbank: Probably deserves more consideration given we're assuming he's fully fit, but I just couldn't pick both him and Doc here. Just hope he gets his body right finally because if he does he's a good footballer.
Newman: The #1 victim in this lot from the thread rules. He misses out on being selected in my 7 defenders but I am very confident he'll be there come round 1 if fit. I've always liked him and still do, think he's undervalued by a lot of our supporter base.
Parks: Liked what I saw from Luke last year and am glad he was kept on for another season. Nothing special to his game but looks a decent reliable defensive option. Given our injuries last year was asked to punch above his weight and I'm interested to see how he goes with a better structure around him, but he's not someone I can pick for our best side.
Williamson: Great to see him stringing games together last year but seemed to lose or at least curb a lot of the traits I absolutely loved about him. Don't like him as a lock-down option but do love him streaming out of the back half. The frenetic game plan last year didn't help him but in the right environment I think he can flourish and whilst I'm not picking him here there's every chance he features prominently at senior level.
Newnes: A viable candidate for the midfield poll given I still see him as our most natural option on a wing, but not a candidate for a defensive spot. He'll miss out on this side but expect him to very much be in the conversation for round one.
Boyd: Mature aged small who misses out as a running defender given there are a fair few ahead of him, but could surprise if there's a spot available for a lockdown defender. I'm not picking him for our best side but I think there's an opportunity for him there to play seniors and probably surprise a few in doing so.
McDonald: Oscar came in late as a SSP option last year and couldn't have been much more impressive as a tall before being struck down by injury. With Jones retiring there's a spot available there for him and he's certainly in the conversation. I've gone with Young which is more a structural choice than anything.
Akuei: Thrilled we've brought him on as a Cat B rookie. Nobody could genuinely select him here but I'm so keen to see how he develops.
2. Sam Docherty. Can't see him being out there come round one, but given the rules of the thread you just have to vote him in here. At full fitness he doesn't miss out.
3. Zac Williams. Eligible as a midfielder, but I said I wouldn't vote for him there because I'd vote for him down back. I'm a man of my word.
4. Lachie Plowman. Yeah, sorry people - he's clearly in our best side and it's fanciful to suggest he won't be there.
5. Adam Saad. Clearly one of the first picked in this backline. With his explosive pace he's a weapon coming out of the backline.
The above 5 pick themselves IMO given the premise of the exercise. Spots 6 and 7 are tougher but I've got 2 clearly in mind:
6. Liam Stocker. Similar to Williams, Stocker was eligible as a mid but made a home for himself down back in 2021 and I expect him to stay there, for now at least. Developing beautifully.
7. Lewis Young. Am a fan of Lewis' and the Jones situation has given him a golden opportunity to cement a spot in our best side.
The others:
LOB: Nope. Not considered even for one second. I don't have him as our best wing and I certainly don't have him as a viable option coming off half back.
McGovern: The enigma - will he feature down back? I can't pick him here but appreciate many think he needs to go down back to revive a stalling career. Part of me still wants to see how he goes as a 3rd tall up forward but I'm more patient than many. Not picking him here but there's a chance he'll be there in round one.
Kemp: Haven't picked him but seems he'll at least start his career down back and if fit he's every chance of being in the side come round one. So keen to see how he develops in 2022 but for mine it's all about getting games under his belt. I don't care at what level.
Marchbank: Probably deserves more consideration given we're assuming he's fully fit, but I just couldn't pick both him and Doc here. Just hope he gets his body right finally because if he does he's a good footballer.
Newman: The #1 victim in this lot from the thread rules. He misses out on being selected in my 7 defenders but I am very confident he'll be there come round 1 if fit. I've always liked him and still do, think he's undervalued by a lot of our supporter base.
Parks: Liked what I saw from Luke last year and am glad he was kept on for another season. Nothing special to his game but looks a decent reliable defensive option. Given our injuries last year was asked to punch above his weight and I'm interested to see how he goes with a better structure around him, but he's not someone I can pick for our best side.
Williamson: Great to see him stringing games together last year but seemed to lose or at least curb a lot of the traits I absolutely loved about him. Don't like him as a lock-down option but do love him streaming out of the back half. The frenetic game plan last year didn't help him but in the right environment I think he can flourish and whilst I'm not picking him here there's every chance he features prominently at senior level.
Newnes: A viable candidate for the midfield poll given I still see him as our most natural option on a wing, but not a candidate for a defensive spot. He'll miss out on this side but expect him to very much be in the conversation for round one.
Boyd: Mature aged small who misses out as a running defender given there are a fair few ahead of him, but could surprise if there's a spot available for a lockdown defender. I'm not picking him for our best side but I think there's an opportunity for him there to play seniors and probably surprise a few in doing so.
McDonald: Oscar came in late as a SSP option last year and couldn't have been much more impressive as a tall before being struck down by injury. With Jones retiring there's a spot available there for him and he's certainly in the conversation. I've gone with Young which is more a structural choice than anything.
Akuei: Thrilled we've brought him on as a Cat B rookie. Nobody could genuinely select him here but I'm so keen to see how he develops.
Defenders vote complete
- Thread starter
- #150
It all starts with the D (efence)
Our backline is decided for 2022. Should-have-been-dual-AA Star CHB Jacob Weitering becomes out first '100-player' with every Bagger rightly selecting the Weiterbot as the first lock of our back six in 2022. He is our rock and undoubtedly 2nd-best player (not by much either) behind the GOAT Sam Walsh.
After missing out on midfield selection, most agreed that 2021 import Zac Williams (89.7%) is a must off the half-backline, with his speed and run essential to our transition from the back half of the ground. Likewise, speedster Adam Saad (97.1%) who is a pure back six player and after a solid debut in Navy Blue, recorded the second highest percentage of defender votes.
Fan-favourite Liam Stocker is fast becoming a star and will spend more time down back again in 2022 before a (hopeful) move up the ground. His 76.5% was the fourth-highest of defenders. Due to Jones' untimely departure, ex-Bulldog Lewis Young becomes an important piece of our makeup - so say 73.5% who have him partnering Weiters down the spine.
At number 6, popular whipping boy and oft badly-timed-giggler Lachie Plowman (66.9%) is - as most sensible fans agree - a crucial (if imperfect) element in our defense. He takes the tough jobs again and again and (mostly) breaking even in a team-first role.
Finally, the Sam Docherty (41.9%) conundrum befuddled and split voters this year, with his return date a complete unknown at this stage. With wistful optimism, our co-captain will line up Round 1 and provide heart and 100% effort in every game he plays. It would be wrong to exclude him from this side without a definite decision on his Round 1 availability at this stage.
In what was a very tight race, Doc beat out popular youngster Brodie Kemp (39%) and first-team regular Nic Newman (36.8%) for the final spot. It's likely both of these will see plenty of football in 2022. Indeed, if as many expect Docherty isn't ready for Round 1 - it will be one of these two that will slot in nicely to anchor the defence.
Our backline is decided for 2022. Should-have-been-dual-AA Star CHB Jacob Weitering becomes out first '100-player' with every Bagger rightly selecting the Weiterbot as the first lock of our back six in 2022. He is our rock and undoubtedly 2nd-best player (not by much either) behind the GOAT Sam Walsh.
After missing out on midfield selection, most agreed that 2021 import Zac Williams (89.7%) is a must off the half-backline, with his speed and run essential to our transition from the back half of the ground. Likewise, speedster Adam Saad (97.1%) who is a pure back six player and after a solid debut in Navy Blue, recorded the second highest percentage of defender votes.
Fan-favourite Liam Stocker is fast becoming a star and will spend more time down back again in 2022 before a (hopeful) move up the ground. His 76.5% was the fourth-highest of defenders. Due to Jones' untimely departure, ex-Bulldog Lewis Young becomes an important piece of our makeup - so say 73.5% who have him partnering Weiters down the spine.
At number 6, popular whipping boy and oft badly-timed-giggler Lachie Plowman (66.9%) is - as most sensible fans agree - a crucial (if imperfect) element in our defense. He takes the tough jobs again and again and (mostly) breaking even in a team-first role.
Finally, the Sam Docherty (41.9%) conundrum befuddled and split voters this year, with his return date a complete unknown at this stage. With wistful optimism, our co-captain will line up Round 1 and provide heart and 100% effort in every game he plays. It would be wrong to exclude him from this side without a definite decision on his Round 1 availability at this stage.
In what was a very tight race, Doc beat out popular youngster Brodie Kemp (39%) and first-team regular Nic Newman (36.8%) for the final spot. It's likely both of these will see plenty of football in 2022. Indeed, if as many expect Docherty isn't ready for Round 1 - it will be one of these two that will slot in nicely to anchor the defence.
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