List Mgmt. 2022 List Management and Trading Thread - Part 2

[Scorpus]

Updated list position



And 2024 as it stands

Spoiler

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Neither will be going at the end of their current contracts.

.. and there's no chance of Nicks being sacked next year either.

You state something with certainty when you have no possible way of knowing. It's entirely possible Nicks gets sacked. He's already lasted longer than any previous Crows coach who wasn't making the finals. We've also invested heavily in improving our small forward stocks in recent years so I'm pretty sure the club is aware that McHenry and Murph aren't getting it done.

 

[dogs105]

Spoke to a guy today that told me one of the coaches gave Reid a list of players that were unlikely to have an AFL career. Reid signed all them up. Most on 2-3 year deals.

Sounds legit. Reid surely has no accountability or supervision

 

[Crow till I die]

Unfortunately, it comes down to the only one out of the three who was out of contract.

Yep and that was a list f up imo

 

[Mutineer]

Sounds legit. Reid surely has no accountability or supervision

The sarcasm is just drippin'

 

[DJ75]

And you were dumb enough to believe them?

Given I know the connection and who the coach was - mostly yes.

Now, of course one single coach isn't going to have the whole say. I would guess all the coaches would have a say and put their thoughts forward.

What I do know is that we have a full list when we shouldn't.

 

[Crow_68]

Spoke to a guy today that told me one of the coaches gave Reid a list of players that were unlikely to have an AFL career. Reid signed all them up. Most on 2-3 year deals.

Reid also extended Soligo before he played an AFL game (only difference is this is fact)

 

[FR0GGY]

The sarcasm is just drippin'

Apparently not

 

[DJ75]

Reid also extended Soligo before he played an AFL game (only difference is this is fact)

One swallow does not a summer make

 

[Dudersaurus]

Overall I'd be happy to Delist and rerookie Strachan (almost certainly won't get picked by anyone else) and pick Keeler (hopefully there at 1st pick) and Michalanney.

ROB, Thilthorpe ruck. EH emergency. Keeler super emergency. If Keeler isn't available, then Murray super-duper emergency.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Which is strange as we keep targeting new small forwards to replace them.

Coaching and list management don't always appear to be on the same page. We saw this already with Kelly and Crouch.

 

[crows dude]

I hope Keeler is there at our first pick. We’ve had him in our nga program for a long time so would nice to get him even though afl changed matching rules

 

[feenix67]

Am I the only one who thinks that picking Max is a waste? How many more tweener half backs do we need?

 

[Scorpus]

Am I the only one who thinks that picking Max is a waste? How many more tweener half backs do we need?

Who? Doedee and Smith?

 

[feenix67]

Who? Doedee and Smith?

Worrell, Borlase

 

[Mutineer]

Worrell, Borlase

Worrell a "tweener"?

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

So can anyone explain the Turner drafting? Any defence at all?

Assume they are pleading the insanity clause...

Seriously wtf!

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

So can anyone explain the Turner drafting? Any defence at all?

An attempt to win a SANFL flag maybe? Which makes the pick even stranger given that Carmichael is the superior player and he was available.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

OK... so today's delistings don't leave us enough senior list spaces to use both picks 23 & 46 in the ND. I think it's a given that we'll want to use both draft picks, so what are our options going forwards? Note that all of our players are now contracted for 2023, so any move we make will involve a contracted player.

I'm not sure what the 2022 mechanism is for moving players from the senior list, to the rookie list. In 2021, it was only allowed to happen between the ND and RD. This would allow clubs to fill any senior list vacancies via the PSD, but not the ND - and is thus no use to us, if we wish to use pick 46. If that remains the case, then we will need to delist a contracted player (potentially re-drafting them in the RD).

AFL confirms 2022 list sizes, tweaks rule for rookies

So... who are the most likely candidates?

Kieran Strachan
We have the option of delisting and re-drafting Strachan in the RD, rather than promoting him to the senior list. By not promoting him, we create the required senior list vacancy. It also has the benefit of re-setting his RD clock back to zero, so we could potentially leave him there for another 3 years. Having our backup ruckman on the rookie list is not a bad thing. However, this would be incredibly unfair on Strachan, who has busted a gut to get himself onto the senior list, having already served 4 years on the rookie list.

This option also comes with significant risk. Ruckmen are always in demand, and Strachan has shown himself to be competent at AFL level. There is every possibility that another club could gazump us (as North did with Greenwood last year). Given that our only other rucks are TT and ROB, that would place our list in an extremely precarious position.

I can't deny that the option exists - but in my opinion, the risk outweighs the reward (not to mention fairness).

Paul Seedsman
Blind Freddy can see that Seedsman's AFL career is over, as a result of his concussion issues. Seedsman himself, remains desperately optimistic and still harbours hopes of playing again, and is thus extremely reluctant to retire. I suspect that the club allowed him to continue to hope, while they were attempting to trade Crouch/Sholl/McAsey - but now those options are gone, and the walls are now closing in on Seedsman.

Seedsman was one of our few remaining senior players, and is thus likely to be on a fairly high salary. Given that any retirement is the result of injury, his retirement payout would be 100% of his expected salary for 2023. With Brown's negotiated retirmeent settlement already included in our 2022 salary cap, we may not have enough room to pay Seedsman's 2023 salary this year.

I still think Seedman is the most likely delisting - and that we'll be forced to re-draft him in the RD, to include his salary in our 2023 salary cap. However, this was clearly not the club's Plan A, so I can definitely understand any delays in making the announcement. He doesn't deserve to be delisted in the same announcement as Rowe/Davis/Turner, he deserves his own announcement, at a later time.

Andrew McPherson
Moose is a decent player, but his body is constantly breaking down. Unlike Seedsman, his injury problems may not be career terminal - at least not yet. Maybe there's hope that Burgess can fix his problems, just as he worked miracles with Fogarty's fitness.

Counting against Moose is the fact that his contract would be relatively minimal (compared to Seedsman), and thus paying him out in the 2022 salary cap could be a possibility.

The Decision
I think the decisions about Rowe/Turner/Davis were made long ago. I think the club was hoping to create the extra senior list position by trading one of Crouch/McAsey/Sholl, but nothing eventuated. They now need to stop and decide on Plan B. I think Seedsman will be Plan B, but they need time to break the news to him, and for him to come to terms with it, before it is announced.

Strachan - no, as we need a backup ruckman.

We need to use someone we won't miss too much if another club pounces.

McPherson a candidate, but we may be happy to risk someone like Crouch.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

James Rowe - 17 games this year - delisted.

Tariek Newchurch - 0 games this year - retained

Classic Crows

Cat B rookie list is the difference.

Wouldn't worry at Rowie I not up to AFL standard.

Not sure they other 2 are either, but neither has been give a go.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Over the two years we invested alot of ganes in Rowe. He was basically a regular. Happy that we don't think he will make it but just seems a waste

Sunk cost.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Murphy and McHenry suck just as much as Rowe (for different reasons) but we were dumb enough to sign them up again so Rowe cops it instead.

Which one is coming out of contract...

None are looking like long term prospects..

 

[Vader]

You state something with certainty when you have no possible way of knowing. It's entirely possible Nicks gets sacked. He's already lasted longer than any previous Crows coach who wasn't making the finals. We've also invested heavily in improving our small forward stocks in recent years so I'm pretty sure the club is aware that McHenry and Murph aren't getting it done.

That would be because he was hired at the start of a rebuild - the first time the club has ever accepted the need to do so. The Board, unlike many members of BF, realise that Rome wasn't built in a day - and that when you have the youngest & least experienced team in the competition, it takes multiple years to get back to the position where you're ready to contend for finals.

At this point, our failure to contend for finals is entirely due to our list, and the fact that it's chock-a-block full of kids. It has nothing to do with coaching failures. If anything, Nicks has the team over-peforming relative to expectations.

 

[Scorpus]

Worrell, Borlase

Borlase is no chance of making it and Smith is finished.

Worrell is 195cm

 

[Vader]

Overall I'd be happy to Delist and rerookie Strachan (almost certainly won't get picked by anyone else) and pick Keeler (hopefully there at 1st pick) and Michalanney.

ROB, Thilthorpe ruck. EH emergency. Keeler super emergency. If Keeler isn't available, then Murray super-duper emergency.

The bolded bit is one of the worst assumptions I've ever seen posted on BF.

If we delist him, there's a 99.9% chance that Strachan does get picked up by another club.

 

[Vader]

Coaching and list management don't always appear to be on the same page. We saw this already with Kelly and Crouch.

... and neither should they be. The coach's job is to win games this year. The list manager's job is to build the team for 5 years down the road. Completely different priorities.