List Mgmt. 2022 Trade Thread - Part III

[ScrappyDo]

The worst thing for Jack was Crouch coming in tbh. Took his spot

I've be an advocate for him since before his draft but there's no denying that both Windy and Chito look more promising.

I think the current scenario is the best thing for all. New coach, 1 year deal, last chance saloon. If he doesn't step up next year then we can probably let him go without regrets.

 

[CursingFijian]

If we get Harley Reid with it I'm in. He looks the business.

Mean fend. But more Cripps than Dusty. No left foot.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Mean fend. But more Cripps than Dusty. No left foot.

Want!

 

[gringo2011]

Mean fend. But more Cripps than Dusty. No left foot.

Harsh marker CF. He's ridiculous for his age. Absolute bull and his work inside is elite. Just looks a star.

 

[CursingFijian]

Harsh marker CF. He's ridiculous for his age. Absolute bull and his work inside is elite. Just looks a star.

Don't get me wrong he's definitely elite.

 

[crasha301]

Yeah its tricky.

Saints won around 216 centre clearances during 2022. ( can't find the exact figure ).
Steele attended 66% of bounces won 19% of the centre clearances. Ratio: 0.28
Crouch attended 59% , won 22% Ratio 0.37
Ross attended 59% , won 15% Ratio 0.25
Gresham attended 48% won 19% Ratio 0.39
Jones attended 25%, won 9%. Ratio 0.36
Windhager attended 18%, won 3.2% Ratio 0.18
Sinclair attended 7% , won 3.2% Ratio 0.45
Owens attended 8%. I think won zero.
Hannebery 4.4% won zero
Byrnes 1.4% won zero.
Clark 1.4% won zero.

In 2021 Bytel won 12 centre clearances.
I can't find the other data on centre clearances for that year. But he seems to have attended the bounce about as often as Clark, who won 4.

Only 5 Saints players won more than 12 centre clearances in 2022. Windhager won 7, Jones 20.

Its great that Gresham has that ability, but what if he won the clearance in the forward 50 instead?
Ross has never been great at that clearance ability, and is still pretty average.
Interesting to see Sinclair's ratio, highest clearance to attendance ration in the team.

There is a role there for Bytel if he can take it.

Wow, crazy that we didn't play sincs more often through the middle.

However with Ross back and being a big stats man I wouldn't be surprised to see sincs a starting mid next year.

On CPH2145 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

Harsh marker CF. He's ridiculous for his age. Absolute bull and his work inside is elite. Just looks a star.

I’d tank for him

 

[ScrappyDo]

Yeah its tricky.

Saints won around 216 centre clearances during 2022. ( can't find the exact figure ).
Steele attended 66% of bounces won 19% of the centre clearances. Ratio: 0.28
Crouch attended 59% , won 22% Ratio 0.37
Ross attended 59% , won 15% Ratio 0.25
Gresham attended 48% won 19% Ratio 0.39
Jones attended 25%, won 9%. Ratio 0.36
Windhager attended 18%, won 3.2% Ratio 0.18
Sinclair attended 7% , won 3.2% Ratio 0.45
Owens attended 8%. I think won zero.
Hannebery 4.4% won zero
Byrnes 1.4% won zero.
Clark 1.4% won zero.

In 2021 Bytel won 12 centre clearances.
I can't find the other data on centre clearances for that year. But he seems to have attended the bounce about as often as Clark, who won 4.

Only 5 Saints players won more than 12 centre clearances in 2022. Windhager won 7, Jones 20.

Its great that Gresham has that ability, but what if he won the clearance in the forward 50 instead?
Ross has never been great at that clearance ability, and is still pretty average.
Interesting to see Sinclair's ratio, highest clearance to attendance ration in the team.

There is a role there for Bytel if he can take it.

Great post SS.

 

[bird_man]

Bytel : 16 games. Most disposals. 21. Games with more than 15 =5 Games with less than 50% TOG sub ) = 5
games with 8 or more contested possessions : 4 Games with 6 or more tackles : 5 Games with 5 or more clearances : 4. Goals :2

Windhager : 17 games. Most disposals 23. Games with more than 15=3 Games with less than 50% TOG : 1
games with 8 or more contested possessions : 1 Games with 6 or more tackles : 2 Games with 5 or more clearances : 1 Goals :4

Owens : 7 games. Most disposals 18. Games with more than 15 = 1. Games with less than 50% TOG : 2
games with 8 or more contested possessions :1 Games with 6 or more tackles : 2 Games with 5 or more clearances : 0 Goals: 3

Jones 2022 13 games ) Most disposals 27 Games with more than 15 =10 Games with less than 50% TOG ( 2022) = 1
games with 8 or more contested possessions : 6 Games with 6 or more tackles :1 Games with 5 or more clearances : 4 Goals :2

Clark 2022: ( 8 games ) Most disposals 22 Games with more than 15= 5 Games with less than 50% TOG (2022)= 1 Goals 2
games with 8 or more contested possessions : 1 Games with 6 or more tackles : 0 Games with 5 or more clearances : 0 Goals 0.

Josh Kennedy ( Hawks ) 2008/ 2009 13 Games Most disposals 26. Games with more than 15: 9 Games with less than 50% TOG = 0
Games with 8 or more contested possessions : 5. Games with 6 or more tackles : 2 Games with 5 or more clearances : 3. Goals 4.

Jack Bytel had a bit of a dud year , he peaked too late to get a call up.

VFL Stats - Jack Bytel

vfl.aflmstats.com

I don't think the others have gone past him just yet, i think he still has good credentials if we need someone in the guts.
Particularly if we want someone to win clearances.
His use as a medical sub needs to stop, it has clearly cut into his development.


Note : Never use these ":" next to brackets unless you want to look miserable.

Note : I didn't call it a colon in case George got excited.

The reason those guys are ahead of Bytel is versatility.

There stats might not be overly impressive but you can stick them in other positions other than the midfield.

If Bytel is playing the majority of his footy through the guts he needs to find more footy than he does.

 

[gringo2011]

The reason those guys are ahead of Bytel is versatility.

There stats might not be overly impressive but you can stick them in other positions other than the midfield.

If Bytel is playing the majority of his footy through the guts he needs to find more footy than he does.

He was really unlucky this year. He had injury and concussion issues and the times that we were an inside midfielder short were always when he was unavailable. When Steele went down he should have been able to walk in and take that spot. Unfortunately the stars didn't align for him. Hopefully it makes him hungrier.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The reason those guys are ahead of Bytel is versatility.

There stats might not be overly impressive but you can stick them in other positions other than the midfield.

If Bytel is playing the majority of his footy through the guts he needs to find more footy than he does.

I'm hoping he grows into our version of Viney. No-one ever raves about Viney, but he's there winning the ball out each week, only noticed if he misses, and Dunstan comes in and starts spraying it about.

 

[Sainttony]

The reason those guys are ahead of Bytel is versatility.

There stats might not be overly impressive but you can stick them in other positions other than the midfield.

If Bytel is playing the majority of his footy through the guts he needs to find more footy than he does.

My take on Jack is he is not fit enough, injuries have probably impacted his fitness level but he needs a huge pre season

 

[bird_man]

My take on Jack is he is not fit enough, injuries have probably impacted his fitness level but he needs a huge pre season

Reading between the lines I think you are spot on.

It was mentioned in the post about his signing about him having to work harder on the track and also a few times in the Sandy write ups about how they are trying to get him to spread more and find more footy on the outside.

He needs a massive pre season.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

My take on Jack is he is not fit enough, injuries have probably impacted his fitness level but he needs a huge pre season

He's had decent time trial results in the past.

You can see here that his VFL stats for disposals and tackles were pretty damn good late 2021.
He had a persistent Calf Injury during the 2022 pre-season, and the club held him back from the start of the season to get his fitness up.
His stats were down throughout the year but his last 2 games were not so shabby. I think you'd need to be reasonably fit to rack up disposals and tackles like that, even at VFL level.


Hopefully he gets a good pre-season in for 2013 and shows us what he can do.

VFL Stats - Jack Bytel

vfl.aflmstats.com

 

[Sainttony]

He's had decent time trial results in the past.

You can see here that his VFL stats for disposals and tackles were pretty damn good late 2021.
He had a persistent Calf Injury during the 2022 pre-season, and the club held him back from the start of the season to get his fitness up.
His stats were down throughout the year but his last 2 games were not so shabby. I think you'd need to be reasonably fit to rack up disposals and tackles like that, even at VFL level.


Hopefully he gets a good pre-season in for 2013 and shows us what he can do.

VFL Stats - Jack Bytel

vfl.aflmstats.com

I think the level of fitness required for vfl is a step down and at top level he struggles to get to as many contests but again a massive or season and let’s see what he can do.

RTB just the type of coach who will get him producing good form

With only a one year deal he will be desperate to get into it so let’s hope he is training now . Like Coff with a trainer over the holidays.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

I think the level of fitness required for vfl is a step down and at top level he struggles to get to as many contests but again a massive or season and let’s see what he can do.

RTB just the type of coach who will get him producing good form

With only a one year deal he will be desperate to get into it so let’s hope he is training now . Like Coff with a trainer over the holidays.

Someone mentioned a few weeks back that they saw Jack doing laps at RSEA when all the the other boys had booted off overseas.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I think the level of fitness required for vfl is a step down and at top level he struggles to get to as many contests but again a massive or season and let’s see what he can do.

RTB just the type of coach who will get him producing good form

With only a one year deal he will be desperate to get into it so let’s hope he is training now . Like Coff with a trainer over the holidays.

He's had contested ball counts of 10 and 12. He's getting to contests.
If anything he's not running to good positions to receive uncontested ball.

Getting more uncontested ball was one of Batchelor's goals for him.

 

[Blended]

I wasn’t sure where to put this George, so picked this mega thread. Anyway give us a father son in 20 years please Kosi

 

[gringo2011]

I wasn’t sure where to put this George, so picked this mega thread. Anyway give us a father son in 20 years please Kosi

They would have some seriously tall offspring.

 

[Premium]

He's had contested ball counts of 10 and 12. He's getting to contests.
If anything he's not running to good positions to receive uncontested ball.

Getting more uncontested ball was one of Batchelor's goals for him.

More game time and he will develop that , we hope.

 

[jwikked]

I wasn’t sure where to put this George, so picked this mega thread. Anyway give us a father son in 20 years please Kosi

That's wild, I don't think he knew her growing up despite living kinda close.

 

[Joffaboy]

I wasn’t sure where to put this George, so picked this mega thread. Anyway give us a father son in 20 years please Kosi

Get to work Kosi, Lauren is 41.

 

[Drop Kick]

Hopefully he gets a good pre-season in for 2013 and shows us what he can do.

VFL Stats - Jack Bytel

vfl.aflmstats.com

2013, is Watters going to be his coach.

 

[MrFoster]

Yeah its tricky.

Saints won around 216 centre clearances during 2022. ( can't find the exact figure ).
Steele attended 66% of bounces won 19% of the centre clearances. Ratio: 0.28
Crouch attended 59% , won 22% Ratio 0.37
Ross attended 59% , won 15% Ratio 0.25
Gresham attended 48% won 19% Ratio 0.39
Jones attended 25%, won 9%. Ratio 0.36
Windhager attended 18%, won 3.2% Ratio 0.18
Sinclair attended 7% , won 3.2% Ratio 0.45
Owens attended 8%. I think won zero.
Hannebery 4.4% won zero
Byrnes 1.4% won zero.
Clark 1.4% won zero.

In 2021 Bytel won 12 centre clearances.
I can't find the other data on centre clearances for that year. But he seems to have attended the bounce about as often as Clark, who won 4.

Only 5 Saints players won more than 12 centre clearances in 2022. Windhager won 7, Jones 20.

Its great that Gresham has that ability, but what if he won the clearance in the forward 50 instead?
Ross has never been great at that clearance ability, and is still pretty average.
Interesting to see Sinclair's ratio, highest clearance to attendance ration in the team.

There is a role there for Bytel if he can take it.

Bytel definitely has talent, it’s a pity he hasn’t been able to put it together yet due to injury etc. He is an inside mid in the mould of Steele, can find the ball, clean hands and a neat kick. Can also hit the score board, remember him kicking 2 goals in a game last year (against Freo?)… Byrnes also showed promise before regressing this year.. I would say it’s difficult to be a mid in Saints colours for the last 10 years, with very little structure and support, everything is congested, even when you do win the ball, it’ll be a rushed kick/handball..

Let’s wipe the slate clean, get the midfield set up properly and let them play.. clear roles for inside mid, outside mid, tagger..not just 3-4 players going after the same ball like a Sunday little league team..

 

[Username Unknown]

With our recent coaching appointments, and if by the end of the 23 season we had implement a good game plan, had buy in and some good development in our players. Surely that would spark a bit of curiosity for Ben King

34

Ben King

Age

25

Ht

202cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

3.5

4star

T

0.5

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

1.9

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.5

5star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

2.4

3star

M

3.2

4star

T

0.2

3star

G

1.0

4star

. Whether that would be next year or when his contract runs out.

Hey Ben we really want you too come play for the St Kilda club, we think that you could be a part of bringing home the clubs second flag. Whist playing along side your twin. I love my brother, but the bond twins have is some thing completely different. Imagine those playing as targets in our forward line. How could you actually stop them both? Two 202cm twins, as forward targets who already are in sync. You couldn’t double or triple team them. Either one the other would get off the leash or two they would come over and get stuck into you. Sure other team mates could help out. But once again, it is 202cm twin brother who very may well be a super star talent.

I also don’t understand the whole thing of making his own name in football and playing in your brothers shadow? Other supporters think Ben if better, but yet put that forward as a reason he won’t come. I don’t understand why it would be different from say purely based on positioning. As Hawkins and Cameron, two superstars playing in the same team. Every fan would get around them both, also the love they would get from growing up in Bayside. The kings of Bayside.

This is all just a dream. In saying that, with Lyon, Harvey and Hayes sitting on the other side of the table selling the dream to Ben. Maybe Ben might have a dream to come to the club to help win our elusive second flag. Like some of his idols have done.