List Mgmt. 2023 GWS Giants List Management - Academy, Free Agent, Trade, Draft

[Giant Strides]

Trade Period, October 6–18

• Restricted & Unrestricted Free Agency Period: Friday, October 6, 9am – Friday October 13, 5pm (bid matching ends Monday October 16, 5pm)
• Trade Period (1), picks & players: Monday, October 9, 9am – Wednesday October 18, 7.30pm

Quiet Period, October 19–November 20

• Trade Period (2), picks only: Monday, October 23, 9am – Friday November 10, 5pm
• List Lodgement 1*: Tuesday, October 31, 2pm
• Delisted Free Agency Period (1): Wednesday, November 1, 9am – Wednesday November 8, 5pm
• Delisted Free Agency Period (2): Friday, November 10, 9am–5pm
• List Lodgement 2*: Tuesday, November 14, 2pm

Here's the list of GWS players who are out of contract in 2023 (I'll progressively cross them out as they re-sign):

• Lachie ASH
• Callan WARD (Free Agent)
• Brayden PREUSS
• Tom GREEN
• Finn CALLAGHAN
• Lachlan KEEFFE (Free Agent)
• Jake RICCARDI
• Harry HIMMELBERG (Free Agent)
• Cam FLEETON - delisted (25/9/23)
• Matt FLYNN (Free Agent) - signed by West Coast as an Unrestricted Free Agent
• Xavier O'HALLORAN
• Jack BUCKLEY
• Callum BROWN

Rookie lists:

• Phil DAVIS (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
• Jacob WEHR (Free agent)
• Dan LLOYD (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
• Cooper HAMILTON
• Wade DERKSEN
• Nick MADDEN (Cat B) - assumed re-signed due to 2 sources of info
• Jason GILBEE (Cat B) - delisted (25/9/23)

Current list sizes (for when we get to list/draft/trade speculation):

• main list = 36 minus 3 (Fleeton, Flynn + Kennedy delisted with a view to be re-selected in the rookie draft)
• rookie A = 6 minus 2 (Davis, Lloyd)
• rookie B = 2 minus 1 (Gilbee)
• total = 44 minus 5

This is the future pick spreadsheet that comes into play only at trade time, as future picks are used in end of season (2023) trading:


Here's the 2023 AFL Academy Squad, so these (roughly) represent the best players for next year as they stand now:

2023 NAB AFL ACADEMY​

NAME	SURNAME	STATE	STATE LEAGUE CLUB	COMMUNITY CLUB
Lachlan	Cabor	NSW/ACT	Sydney Swans Academy	Shellharbour
Nate	Caddy	VIC M	Northern Knights	Yarrambat
Jack	Callinan	TAS	Tasmania Devils	Clarence
Caiden	Cleary	NSW/ACT	Sydney Swans Academy	Sydney University
Daniel	Curtin	WA	Claremont	West Coast
Jack	Delean	SA	South Adelaide	Reynella
Zane	Duursma	VIC C	Gippsland Power	Foster
Mitchell	Edwards	WA	Peel Thunder	South Mandurah
William	Green	VIC M	Northern Knights	Northcote
Riley	Hardeman	WA	Swan Districts	Caversham
William	Lorenz	VIC M	Oakleigh Chargers	Boroondara Hawks
Kane	McAuliffe	SA	North Adelaide	Central Augusta
Colby	McKercher	TAS	Tasmania Devils	Launceston
Ashton	Moir	SA	Glenelg	Plympton
Connor	O'Sullivan	NSW/ACT	Murray Bushrangers	Albury
William	Patton	SA	West Adelaide	Mitcham
Nathan	Philactides	VIC M	Oakleigh Chargers	Blackburn
Ethan	Read	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Palm Beach Currumbin
Archer	Reid	VIC C	Gippsland Power	Inverloch-Kongwak
Harley	Reid	VIC C	Bendigo Pioneers	Tongala
Archie	Roberts	VIC M	Sandringham Dragons	Hampton Rovers
Jake	Rogers	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Broadbeach
Ryley	Sanders	TAS	Sandringham Dragons	North Launceston
Cooper	Simpson	VIC C	Dandenong Stingrays	Mount Martha
George	Stevens	VIC C	GWV Rebels	South Warrnambool
Koltyn	Tholstrup	WA	Subiaco	Newtown-Condingup
Orlando	Turner	NT	West Adelaide	South Alice Springs
Jed	Walter	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Palm Beach Currumbin
Nick	Watson	VIC M	Eastern Ranges	East Ringwood
Darcy	Wilson	VIC C	Murray Bushrangers	Wangaratta Rovers

Happy speculating for 2023!

EDIT: 11/12/22 - Added Free Agent status to OOC player list
EDIT: 24/2/23 - Crossed out Tom Green

12

Tom Green

Age

23

Ht

192cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

3star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

5star

from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo!!) & Added 2023 Coates Talent League Fixture Link
EDIT: 27/2/23 - Crossed out Finn Callaghan from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo Hoo!!!)
EDIT: 27/4/23 - Crossed out Jacob Wehr from OOC player list
EDIT: 10/5/23 - Crossed out Jack Buckley from OOC player list
EDIT: 9/7/23 - Crossed out Callum Brown from OOC player list
EDIT: 18/7/23 - Crossed out Lachie Ash from OOC player list
EDIT: 20/7/23 - Crossed out Xavier O'Halloran from OOC player list
EDIT: 3/8/23 - Crossed out Harry Himmelberg from OOC player list
EDIT: 9/8/23 - Crossed out Wade Derksen from OOC player list
EDIT: 17/8/23 - Noted Dan Lloyd retiring at end of season
EDIT: 19/8/23 - Crossed out Jake Riccardi from OOC player list
EDIT: 28/8/23 - Noted Phil Davis

1

Phil Davis

Age

33

Ht

197cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.0

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.2

5star

T

1.7

4star

MG

55.5

1star

D

8.5

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

4.1

3star

M

3.4

3star

T

1.3

2star

MG

55.5

1star

D

14.0

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

6.0

4star

M

5.8

5star

T

1.4

4star

retiring at end of season
EDIT: 25/9/23 - Noted Cam Fleeton & Jason Gilbee delisted
EDIT: 4/10/23 - Noted Flynn, Preuss & Keeffe situations
EDIT: 9/10/23 - Updated Flynn to WCE, removed Preuss from OOC player list
EDIT: 12/10/23 - Updated Madden with 2 sources of information
EDIT: 19/10/23 - Updated Keeffe & Hamilton re-signed
EDIT: 31/10/23 - adjusted main list numbers with Adam Kennedy

40

Adam Kennedy

Age

31

Ht

183cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.9

4star

K

8.4

3star

HB

6.5

4star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.8

4star

MG

245.6

4star

D

1.0

1star

K

1.0

1star

HB

0.0

1star

M

0.0

1star

T

0.0

1star

MG

10.0

1star

D

18.6

5star

K

9.8

4star

HB

8.8

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.4

4star

delisting (with a view to be re-selected in rookie draft)

 

[GWS Goose]

Given how the top end of next year's draft looks like being 6-8 mids who atm seem pretty even. Its not surprising that clubs choose to keep top 12 selections in a draft that had more variety.

that can (and usually does) change a lot over 12 months.

I wonder what will be available at pick 18 (before compensation and bids)

 

[Giant YoYo]

AFL NSW/ACT posted on FB the incredible growth in NSW/ACT with the draft picks. Great stuff.

Looking forward to seeing the numbers increase with hopefully more draftees closer to or in Sydney appear in coming years.

 

[dlanod]

Academies have fixed the disparity. Let's get rid of them. /s

 

[sydney_gws]

Academies have fixed the disparity. Let's get rid of them. /s

Keep, Like Father Son. All they need to do is reduce discount to 5%, limit to 2 picks to match.

 

[Orange crush]

Keep, Like Father Son. All they need to do is reduce discount to 5%, limit to 2 picks to match.

The part I dislke about it all is the trading out for a bunch of junk picks to match, even getting to trade into the following year and still get to match. It just seems like a double, triple dip

 

[sydney_gws]

The part I dislke about it all is the trading out for a bunch of junk picks to match, even getting to trade into the following year and still get to match. It just seems like a double, triple dip

2 picks fixes this .
Gold Coast would probably have needed to do the following ( assume they only had 4,22,40,58, and that they also use 2024r2).
4,2024r2 for 6,15.
6,58 for 10 17.
Gives them 10,15,17,22,40.
Would use 15,17 on Walter, they would need to trade 10 for 14,20, then 14 for a couple of 20's picks.
So 20,22,40 and 2 other picks in the 20's is probably enough for the other 3 academy kids.
They don't end up with 2 extra 2024r1 picks.

If they make changes to the system, including the NGA pick 40 or later, maybe we get Riverina or some of it back ( maybe limited to 1 pick every 3 years or something).

 

[Andre the Giant]

I have a firm belief that the 1st round of the AFL draft should be completely uncompromised and that includes Father Son and Academies.

The AFL can still give a leg up to Northern States and particularly if struggling allow them to pre-list players, they can do the same for struggling clubs in other regions and also offer priority picks in dire scenarios.

These people bleating about the rorting NGA can eat a bag. They are not rescuing humans from slums and concentration camps, they are merely exploiting an opportunity when a kid has a parent born overseas. Quaynor would have played AFL no matter what as would Jamarra.

The draft is completely compromised and is not doing what it is supposed to do. Sure developing talent in Academies is a good thing but let the AFL get off their arses and run each state academy.

They need to run them properly and where necessary divvy up some talent to even up the comp.

The idea of the draft is equalisation, it’s not “let’s exploit rules to the 9th degree to get an advantage.” The draft in its current state is a gigantic fail.

 

[Andre the Giant]

Further to this even if you have a situation with a Father Son like Daicos who is Collingwood royalty and say he could not be selected as a Father Son because he would be a 1st Round selection you could still have a scenario where he gets to Collingwood.

Say West Coast has Pick 1 and Daicos is the projected best player but states he does not want to leave VIC. West Coast then tell every VIC team to put their best foot forward and guess what, they extract maximum value and accelerate their ascend up the ladder. Alternatively they pick him and get a generational talent that makes them better.

Either way it’s a fairer outcome and gives bottom clubs greater access to difference makers or more chips to rebuild.

The current set up where a finals team can get the best player by manipulating points is a pathetic joke.

 

[Colonial]

Further to this even if you have a situation with a Father Son like Daicos who is Collingwood royalty and say he could not be selected as a Father Son because he would be a 1st Round selection you could still have a scenario where he gets to Collingwood.

Say West Coast has Pick 1 and Daicos is the projected best player but states he does not want to leave VIC. West Coast then tell every VIC team to put their best foot forward and guess what, they extract maximum value and accelerate their ascend up the ladder. Alternatively they pick him and get a generational talent that makes them better.

Either way it’s a fairer outcome and gives bottom clubs greater access to difference makers or more chips to rebuild.

The current set up where a finals team can get the best player by manipulating points is a pathetic joke.

To be fair no more a joke than much of the AFLs setup.

 

[GWS Goose]

Academies have fixed the disparity. Let's get rid of them. /s

sadly this is the message

 

[GWS Goose]

If they remove the incentive to run academies and develop players, they'll stop doing it, and no one gets those players.
comparisons to NGA are ridiculous. There are very few situations where the NGA had much (if any) influence on the rise of players.
the Gold Coast nabbing 4 is a complete outlier. They have, after having the eyes picked of their list, strategically focussed on growing their own players, they are successful, so people take it off them. There is a protections in place to protect them becoming an unbeatable juggernaut. Firstly the salary cap. But with the Academy player if they play finals they are limited to 2 picks in the first round, if they are top4, just 1.
If they keep producing 4 in the first round (which they wont) they will be growing the game fantastically and we should build a statue for whoever is running it.

 

[Gigantic]

Gee whiz, I know the footage is selected and edited to make it look the way it does but going by that Caruso really really rates him.

 

[Hendo_21]

Few interesting things that jump out to me

• They REALLY like Gothard, seems like they were fine with taking him at 7 even over someone like Caddy but recognized they could slide back a little bit and still scoop him up
• Beveridge reporting that North would pick him up on draft night seems to match with what Caruso was saying being worried he wouldn't be there with their second pick, leak to Beveridge probably came from us then
• Lual and Jiath was interest was real but weren't able to work their way back in to the top 40 to land him before he could be bid on.

 

[GWS Goose]

Gee whiz, I know the footage is selected and edited to make it look the way it does but going by that Caruso really really rates him.

I dont think there was too much selective editing with the Gothard and Leake comments, they were pretty clear cut.

I would like to know who the other 2 on the board still were and if someone went night one they were hoping to be there at 40, he did say now there are only 3 on the board.

they seemed more bullish on Harvey Thomas than I expected as well.

Caruso is not afraid to be a little different, that is for sure.

 

[Hendo_21]

I dont think there was too much selective editing with the Gothard and Leake comments, they were pretty clear cut.

I would like to know who the other 2 on the board still were and if someone went night one they were hoping to be there at 40, he did say now there are only 3 on the board.

they seemed more bullish on Harvey Thomas than I expected as well.

Caruso is not afraid to be a little different, that is for sure.

Other 2 would have to be Lual and Jiath right? They were linked to both those guys a fair bit leading into the draft and they're both tied to academies.

 

[Orange crush]

Other 2 would have to be Lual and Jiath right? They were linked to both those guys a fair bit leading into the draft and they're both tied to academies.

PMBangers seems to think they were the two ... fits what Caruso said

 

[Crow till I die]

Few interesting things that jump out to me

• They REALLY like Gothard, seems like they were fine with taking him at 7 even over someone like Caddy but recognized they could slide back a little bit and still scoop him up
• Beveridge reporting that North would pick him up on draft night seems to match with what Caruso was saying being worried he wouldn't be there with their second pick, leak to Beveridge probably came from us then
• Lual and Jiath was interest was real but weren't able to work their way back in to the top 40 to land him before he could be bid on.

Sorry to intrude but I saw this and posted it on our board. The crows have done one of these behind the scenes clips too - they are fascinating. Its no wonder that you guys were happy to drop down a few spots with the proviso of moving up with your 2nd pick as they knew Gothard was not on anyones radar inside the top 10 picks (ex academy picks). The other thing that really stands out is how much they rated him on their talent order and you know what, these guys live and die by their decisions so they would have done a mountain of work there and its reassuring to know they have faith in their guy they pick.

We are to a man absolutely stoked to get Curtin and it seems that your team were very reasonable in trading and what they were seeking to facilitate it..might be a wink and a nod next year to allow Himmelberg to wander over to you guys and thank him for his service for a very nominal compo pick by way of thanks .

So this fella, Greene, Bedford etc are going to be real pests for the rest of us going forward according to your list manager..hopefully we can raise you a Rankine, Rachele and Pedlar in the classy small forward stakes when we meet next year

 

[Orange crush]

Sorry to intrude but I saw this and posted it on our board. The crows have done one of these behind the scenes clips too - they are fascinating. Its no wonder that you guys were happy to drop down a few spots with the proviso of moving up with your 2nd pick as they knew Gothard was not on anyones radar inside the top 10 picks (ex academy picks). The other thing that really stands out is how much they rated him on their talent order and you know what, these guys live and die by their decisions so they would have done a mountain of work there and its reassuring to know they have faith in their guy they pick.

We are to a man absolutely stoked to get Curtin and it seems that your team were very reasonable in trading and what they were seeking to facilitate it..might be a wink and a nod next year to allow Himmelberg to wander over to you guys and thank him for his service for a very nominal compo pick by way of thanks .

So this fella, Greene, Bedford etc are going to be real pests for the rest of us going forward according to your list manager..hopefully we can raise you a Rankine, Rachele and Pedlar in the classy small forward stakes when we meet next year

Yes to the EH deal, but we'll have to put Perryman on Rachele again for the lols

 

[GWS Goose]

Other 2 would have to be Lual and Jiath right? They were linked to both those guys a fair bit leading into the draft and they're both tied to academies.

Don't know.
It could be players they expected to go early or those two who can be matched at 40.
I thought he was meaning expected to be selected.

 

[Andre the Giant]

One thing I will say which I think is a bit concerning is that more than any team our projected selections seem to be known by the wider public.

Clearly the interviews, managers and families talk which often puts messaging out there but we seem to be particularly poor poker players. Perhaps someone in the team has loose lips.

Even though nobody saw us taking Gothard with the 1st selection everybody knew our guys were him and Leake.

Caruso seems very bullish about Gothard, hopefully it’s similar to his affection for Butters? Maybe not taking him influenced him to pounce this time and get the one he really wanted.

 

[dlanod]

I'm not sure I follow the logic. We pulled the single most surprising pick in the draft and yet also our selections are the most known? Usually you can set your watch to the first round picks (excluding exactly where nominations come).

 

[Colonial]

Gee whiz, I know the footage is selected and edited to make it look the way it does but going by that Caruso really really rates him.

We are going to have an unstoppable small forward group?

We already had the best Mosquito Fleet in the game in 2023.

Geez pumped for the next few years.

 

[GWS Goose]

One thing I will say which I think is a bit concerning is that more than any team our projected selections seem to be known by the wider public.

Clearly the interviews, managers and families talk which often puts messaging out there but we seem to be particularly poor poker players. Perhaps someone in the team has loose lips.

Even though nobody saw us taking Gothard with the 1st selection everybody knew our guys were him and Leake.

Caruso seems very bullish about Gothard, hopefully it’s similar to his affection for Butters? Maybe not taking him influenced him to pounce this time and get the one he really wanted.

I think the reverse.
We always seem to be picking players that no one sees.

Just about every pick in the first round was known (or knownish)

The first 8 went in the exact order it was predicted.

Everyone knew we interested in the 2 we got, but we were also linked to others, pretty much like everyone else.

The pick in the 40's was a complete shock to me, nothing in media reported us linked to Fonti. I have never even heard his name until the draft night.

 

[Hendo_21]

One thing I will say which I think is a bit concerning is that more than any team our projected selections seem to be known by the wider public.

Clearly the interviews, managers and families talk which often puts messaging out there but we seem to be particularly poor poker players. Perhaps someone in the team has loose lips.

Even though nobody saw us taking Gothard with the 1st selection everybody knew our guys were him and Leake.

Caruso seems very bullish about Gothard, hopefully it’s similar to his affection for Butters? Maybe not taking him influenced him to pounce this time and get the one he really wanted.

It's pretty widely known who every club is interested in, Twomey goes at like 80% is his mock draft every year so if we have loose lips then so does every club. I think we do a better job then most of keeping things close to our chest, also just because there's info out there in the media about who clubs are interested that doesn't necessarily mean it comes from our end, every chance it's agent and other clubs putting that info out there to drive up interest in certain players.

 

[Andre the Giant]

We clearly didn’t know what other clubs were doing based on our deals

Hendo you couldn’t be more wrong about teams knowing all the picks. Yes there is a talent order and between managers, last minute interviews, families media things get spread but we are a team known in the industry to be easily read. Compare that to Geelong, nobody knows what they are doing…not even Essendon

I personally think Caruso got a bit spooked by what happened last year where Sydney basically sabotaged our draft.

Also the Butters pick still haunts him. I am glad he really loves Gothard, you can see he was passionate about the pick, when that happens it’s usually on the money.