List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part IV

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 4

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
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[Yawkey way]

Agreed I think the bigger problem for Steele is McRae. As much as I love both, the fact that the club is getting rid of Steele imo is a good strategic move as you cannot be a good afl midfield with too many one paced mids. Look at Carlton. It hurts though as I think Steele has earnt the right to stay and fight.

It’s just hot air, go tall, go small and on and on we go.

Carlton suffer from having a lousy supporting cast, no quality half backs just the old run and roost. Sup par defensive backs, sub par small forwards.

They have a very good midfield and spine. With Jagga Smith added to the mix their mids will be even better, he’s a great user and decision maker rather than super quick.

Our problem has been that we’re getting beaten on the inside and we’re not using it that well when we do win possession. We’ll have to rotate more mids through because playing as that in and under tackling machine wears players down as it has a less than 100% Steele.

He’ll have to fight for a spot but if Steele stays I’d be shocked if he doesn’t play most games baring injury. With 5 on the bench we’ll need more depth not less.

A reliable ex captain and number 1 mid is too valuable to push out the door, imo this is a reckless move we need to keep Steele.

 

[Captain Paddy]

Holy crap- you just reminded me- we made nas the sub in his debut match didn't we?

Poor bloke had all his family fly over from interstate to watch him fulfill his childhood dream.... sitting on a bench for 3 quarters or something.

Maybe he didn't forget that when demanding his 2mil a year?! Lol

He didn’t even get subbed on

 

[Yawkey way]

Maybe and fair enough if he does.

But simultaneously if they have told him that VFL is also on the cards he can’t be having a dummy spit if he runs around there.

That should be every players fate in a contending team, do your job or it’s next man up.

 

[Yawkey way]

From what I can see Butler should be playing for sheep stations for the local watering hole 3'rds if they are VFL stats.

Don't agree any of the above makes Ben Ainsworth terrible at all. Younger and everything indicates he is a straight upgrade on Butler even without considering GC's talent and ability to run through the middle.

Weird flex not wanting to upgrade our list.

Butler has had a horrible injury run, when fit he’s a quality front and centre smart small forward.

Ainsworth is a decent player but I’ve heard the old he’d play mid in another side about him for years now. Would he really, I very much doubt it. He gets a little more of the ball than butler because he plays higher, a very meh move if it happens and it will cost us what ?.

A couple of years younger is about the only advantage other than how the coaching staff want to set up.

 

[Yawkey way]

I want sos and the team to just go whack from the word go during the trade period.

If teams want to pitch lousy deals then tell them to come back when their sober or loose our number. Geelong and the other time wasters will start with stupid offers and hold up the week if you let them.

At the same time we need to nail the deals we’ve committed to and move on with whatever else we’re planning.

My hope is for Butters and Merrett to say I want out, that will make things very interesting. Curnow to be off the table works best for us, shut it down Vossy.

 

[dudeintheswamp]

I dare say it's been said before but why t f does the trade period need to go for ten days

 

[Anythings_sipposible]

I dare say it's been said before but why t f does the trade period need to go for ten days

We must pay homage to our true lord and saviour, Continental Tyres

 

[Yawkey way]

Are we still allowed to strap on the gloves at training or are we restricted to ballroom dancing these days.

 

[Yawkey way]

I dare say it's been said before but why t f does the trade period need to go for ten days

It’s not unreasonable when you have a lot of movement but very painful during quiet years.

Let’s hope it’s a wild ride driven in part by our aggression and the treat of Tassie. Teams who were lounging like the bulldogs will be playing catch up, desperate teams make mistakes.

I hope a few are feeling the pressure and we can sell the magic beans instead of buying them for a change.

 

[TheJackal]

Silvagni polling 9th playing half a season is a laugh

1. George Hewett - 160
2. Jacob Weitering – 147
3. Adam Cerra – 129
4. Nick Haynes – 126
5. Patrick Cripps – 125
6. Tom De Koning – 117
7. Ollie Hollands – 99
8. Sam Walsh – 93
=9. Zac Williams – 86
=9. Adam Saad – 86
=9. Jack Silvagni – 86

Just on that, its a joke that the umpires gave Cripps so many Brownlow votes this year in this dumpster fire of a season for Carlton. He barely got more votes than Olllie Hollands

To see both Saints boys in the top 10 after playing half a season is pleasing.

 

[Ads734]

I would personally rather keep Steele over Macrae, but I think if we try to move a player on who we traded in last season, we end up with egg on our face. With the emergence of our kids, I struggle to see a world where either of them gets consistent game time next season over the likes of Pou, Boxshall, or Garcia.

Completely agree which begs the question… why did we bring in McRae and what has changed.

 

[Joffaboy]

That should be every players fate in a contending team, do your job or it’s next man up.

It's a new era. Not long ago we complained about paying spuds, now we will complain about playing spuds

 

[dudeintheswamp]

What I'm digging is that just about all of these 'journos' are saying we're into another player or players but none of them have absolutely any idea who that might be

 

[stavro#4]

It’s not unreasonable when you have a lot of movement but very painful during quiet years.

Let’s hope it’s a wild ride driven in part by our aggression and the treat of Tassie. Teams who were lounging like the bulldogs will be playing catch up, desperate teams make mistakes.

I hope a few are feeling the pressure and we can sell the magic beans instead of buying them for a change.

It would be a lot easier to digest if journos explored the failed trade “raids”.

You always hear about them in the years to come. But if you plugged the gaps with:

SAINTS asked the question of Humphrey and explored the logistics of what would actually be required. It would be a lot better

 

[stavro#4]

Butler has had a horrible injury run, when fit he’s a quality front and centre smart small forward.

Ainsworth is a decent player but I’ve heard the old he’d play mid in another side about him for years now. Would he really, I very much doubt it. He gets a little more of the ball than butler because he plays higher, a very meh move if it happens and it will cost us what ?.

A couple of years younger is about the only advantage other than how the coaching staff want to set up.

If the Brisbane model of multiple forwards who can roll through the midfield and have maximum impact from multiple touches is the way forward.

Ainsworth would be a significant upgrade on Dan Butler.

People can tell me about Ryan Henry Hall Higgins etc.

But smalls who can have 15 touches a goal and a direct goal assist every week are worth their weight in gold these days.

He has also been close to ever present under Hardwick. So is hardly some shit footballer.

24/25 games this year.
17/23 last
21/23 2023
22/23 2022

 

[stavro#4]

Steele to GWS was what I had heard months ago and shared here a few times. This opens that back up I reckon

 

[Joffaboy]

If the Brisbane model of multiple forwards who can roll through the midfield and have maximum impact from multiple touches is the way forward.

Ainsworth would be a significant upgrade on Dan Butler.

People can tell me about Ryan Henry Hall Higgins etc.

But smalls who can have 15 touches a goal and a direct goal assist every week are worth their weight in gold these days.

He has also been close to ever present under Hardwick. So is hardly some shit footballer.

24/25 games this year.
17/23 last
21/23 2023
22/23 2022

Nothing to do with Ainsworth being a shit player, I don't believe that at all, it is just that we have that position well covered already with who we have and are spending capital to bring in a 29 year old Ryan.

I am not against the Saints going after more than the five already targetted, I just query if he's the right fit. In my view we should focus on other area's of weakness. Maybe Butler is on the table

Addressing your tweet earlier, I am not against us using as much capital as we can including future drafts.
Our record with getting diamonds in the rough of late had been outstanding with rookies and mid season drafts. Get what we need now, and trust Dalrmple to find the late pick gems.

 

[Sainter93]

Why is James Hird’s mic always at 5% volume

 

[St Muir]

Apologies, I did get that (on a second read). Unfortunately for me, I was born a pedant with OCD, which is a really unfortunate combination for someone reading BF where good grammar seems like an optional thing. I doubt many of our fellow BFers could appreciate how the improper use of "there", "they're" and "their" could be as grating as someone scratching fingernails on a blackboard. This is my curse

Mine is compliment instead of complement. The world is full of footballers running around complimenting one another, apparently.

 

[The_Steadier]

Completely agree which begs the question… why did we bring in McRae and what has changed.

Windhager went next level and is now one of our highest paid players- that's what has changed since we got macrae.

When we were deciding whether to bring in macrae or not 12-18 months ago, we would have hoped windy would go next level... but it was far from certain then.

Hope is not a strategy for success.
So we made the call to bring in macrae.

Plus now we have TDK who unlike roma can jump and win a hitout- presumably we will have more fast clearances now (less need for 3 defensive slower mids)- another new factor we would have hoped for 12-18 months ago, but could say with any certainty would happen.

It wasn't a terrible call bringing macrae in with what we knew at the time.
In fact- the way steele seems happy to stick around regardless makes it an even better decision.
We will go into 2026 with some genuine top quality midfield depth- instead of wheeling out zac jones

 

[Gavinmitchell11]

With so much uncertainty and probably tension, with numerous players’ contracts throughout this season I can see why we were pretty underwhelming on- field. Hopefully everyone can settle down next year, not too many with uncertain immediate future now.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Hey, they’re finally admitting we have good kids - I guess that’s a positive.

( side note - not sure you’re supposed to include the name of the poster)

 

[Rogue Warrior]

Looking at the list, if we assume Marshall gone, it seems the biggest holes:

1. Centre half forward:

• I’m not convinced Caminiti is the answer forward.
• Sharman/Owens are undersized
• We can’t rely on King. And if he goes down we have 0 high caliber Key forwards.
• If King is fit and we play a fast ball movement game plan this could work but some big Ifs.
• Do we commit to Tauru in this role?
• if we’re serious about playing finals/contending in the next couple of years it makes zero sense getting rid of Marshall while we have no alternative.

2. Lock down back pocket:
I’m fans of Hastie and O’Connell BUT as this stage we’re projecting they will be good AFL footballers and can play the role.
Perhaps we back in one of those 2?
Or do we roll the dice and play the 4 talls and 2 half back?

 

[gringo2011]

100000%

Why bring in another teams average asset if it means we’re potentially taking games away from some of our younger guys who might be better if given the chance.

Ainsworth is 10 years in to his career and with all due respect, he hasn’t achieved anything even remotely close to impressive

I guess you’re projecting what you think they add. He’s going to be a pretty much free hit. These kind of role players are Lyon’s bread and butter. Perhaps we want Hall playing 70% midfield so need a high HF? I’m coming around to the idea. We have plenty of mids but looked very thin in the small forward and tall backs all year.

 

[True Believer]

Why is James Hird’s mic always at 5% volume

I don't think it's his mic, I think it's his voice!

I think after a regimen of drugs for a good tan and roaring boners, his voice was impacted?