Game Day AFLW R8 - Carlton v Richmond Friday 14th October 6.30PM @ Ikon Park

[footballsthewinner]

I am very bullish on Gibbs but her last game where we smashed the saints she didn't touch the footy.

Because her confidence had been shattered from her first game back being put on the game's best key forward who was playing against her old club and against an old coach whom she hates.. Gibbs had no chance - she was used as cannon fodder. A coach who knows their players, knows when and how to challenge them. That was seen as brutal by all who know about footy.

 

[Coona Blues]

Because her confidence had been shattered from her first game back being put on the game's best key forward who was playing against her old club and against an old coach whom she hates.. Gibbs had no chance - she was used as cannon fodder. A coach who knows their players, knows when and how to challenge them. That was seen as brutal by all who know about footy.

Similarly, I found myself wondering why Kez is no longer considered an option as a key defender. Trudgeon is nowhere near as combative as last season and was getting towelled up, yet no respite was in sight. Another with lost confidence. I would love to see an element of system, player development just seems so haphazard.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Freedom of opinion and expression? Only if it suits your own opinion, maybe?
I’ve been completely honest about why I signed up and have posted. Enough is enough, we all deserve better.

Free speech isn't a thing on the privately owned forums. Our board rules say no negative agendas. I suggest you read them.

Mod. Notice - Carlton Board Rules & Posting Quality Policy

Time for an updated thread. Now that the footy season is on us again, the moderator workload has increased due to opposition supporters coming to the Blues board to elicit a negative response. I reiterate the BigFooty posting guidelines that state that you must be respectful when posting on...

www.bigfooty.com

* Repetitive negative agendas will be watched closely. This is a forum for Carlton supporters, not Carlton detractors, so if you dip predominantly into the latter, you leave yourself open to sanctions. Objectivity is the key.

 

[footballsthewinner]

Free speech isn't a thing on the privately owned forums. Our board rules say no negative agendas. I suggest you read them.

Mod. Notice - Carlton Board Rules & Posting Quality Policy

Time for an updated thread. Now that the footy season is on us again, the moderator workload has increased due to opposition supporters coming to the Blues board to elicit a negative response. I reiterate the BigFooty posting guidelines that state that you must be respectful when posting on...

www.bigfooty.com

I wasn’t talking about free speech I was talking about freedom of opinion within a group who all have the same agenda in that we all want the best for our club. There’s a difference.
Look, if you’re reaching for the rulebook then you’re missing the point completely.
Do you or do you not agree that all the red flags about the coach and another season missing finals spells the end for Daniel Harford?

 

[footballsthewinner]

Similarly, I found myself wondering why Kez is no longer considered an option as a key defender. Trudgeon is nowhere near as combative as last season and was getting towelled up, yet no respite was in sight. Another with lost confidence. I would love to see an element of system, player development just seems so haphazard.

100%! Why would you move and all Australian key defender, out of there??
Would Richmond ever move Alex Rance to the wing? Of course not! It’s just another in a long long line of strange decisions that point to this bloke not being able to coach.
As for your point about system, there is none and never has been.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I wasn’t talking about free speech I was talking about freedom of opinion within a group who all have the same agenda in that we all want the best for our club. There’s a difference.
Look, if you’re reaching for the rulebook then you’re missing the point completely.
Do you or do you not agree that all the red flags about the coach and another season missing finals spells the end for Daniel Harford?

You can hold your opinion. That's all you are talking about though. You are driving a negative agenda towards an employee of the club. I'm not missing any point. We are not hear to be overly negative in order to get our own agenda serviced. There has to be a balance. I think I've been pretty fair trying to get you to understand our position. If you are only here for that reason, then your access will be removed.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

On Kerryn Peterson, she's the one who has wanted to play midfield for a long time. She's 173cms, so she was an undersized KPD anyway. She wouldn't usually be playing on the Tayla Harris types.

But no, Harford inexplicably took her away from her best position the knockers say. This is what I mean about context and expanding on points with objectivity.

 

[Coona Blues]

You can hold your opinion. That's all you are talking about though. You are driving a negative agenda towards an employee of the club. I'm not missing any point. We are not hear to be overly negative in order to get our own agenda serviced. There has to be a balance. I think I've been pretty fair trying to get you to understand our position. If you are only here for that reason, then your access will be removed.

I am perplexed by the hard line stance on a few topical posts. This forum has recently been inundated by threads encompassing hundreds of pages on anti Teague, anti Liddle, anti SOS, even anti Russell agendas. The women’s program does not attract the same level of interest as the men’s, but fewer posts should not demand different standards. The poster professes some inside knowledge on the demeanour of the list, which I find topical. Yes, it does encompass views on Harf, but he should not be immune from scrutiny. Nor should the club, which clearly does not have a huge commitment to the program. We should not confuse the establishment of infrastructure at the “home of women’s football” with a genuine interest and focus on the health of our program. We seem to be too much “jobs for the boys/girls” than having a strategically developed structure.

I have a great desire to take women’s footy seriously and religiously watch our team. I watch a few other games as well, and there is a significant divide between the systems and skills of teams. Our girls have shown in numerous occasions, some great qualities individually, but the absence of any systematic development is blatantly obvious. If we are buying in to a professional/semi professional environment, we need to do more than keep up appearances.

I look at our list and wonder about pay structures. Is Darcy still on marquee money? Are Hill, Moody, Mua and a couple of others on appropriate contracts, given their value to the team. Kez is a stalwart and should be releasing pressure from the likes of Trudgeon and Gibbs. While remaining one of our very best, she is treacle slow and less suited to a wing than some of our developing youngsters. Kez does not need to be pigeon holed down back, but surely if playing up the ground, should be in an inside role, or perhaps a focal point forward as opposed to a wing when we have some promising young runners. It is somewhat depressing watching Mimi, Abby, Moods and Mua giving their all along with the kids and a couple of more peripheral types while others get “dibs” on roles and indeed “they” can choose when to compete. One of the saddest points of this season is Maddy Guerin’s injury after finally getting much deserved time in the middle, let alone game time. Harf persisted with Prespakis, Egan and other less committed types through last season when Guerin was showing excellent signs from her limited opportunities. Let’s build the program, not be half (Harf) arsed in what we do.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I am perplexed by the hard line stance on a few topical posts. This forum has recently been inundated by threads encompassing hundreds of pages on anti Teague, anti Liddle, anti SOS, even anti Russell agendas. The women’s program does not attract the same level of interest as the men’s, but fewer posts should not demand different standards. The poster professes some inside knowledge on the demeanour of the list, which I find topical. Yes, it does encompass views on Harf, but he should not be immune from scrutiny. Nor should the club, which clearly does not have a huge commitment to the program. We should not confuse the establishment of infrastructure at the “home of women’s football” with a genuine interest and focus on the health of our program. We seem to be too much “jobs for the boys/girls” than having a strategically developed structure.

I have a great desire to take women’s footy seriously and religiously watch our team. I watch a few other games as well, and there is a significant divide between the systems and skills of teams. Our girls have shown in numerous occasions, some great qualities individually, but the absence of any systematic development is blatantly obvious. If we are buying in to a professional/semi professional environment, we need to do more than keep up appearances.

I look at our list and wonder about pay structures. Is Darcy still on marquee money? Are Hill, Moody, Mua and a couple of others on appropriate contracts, given their value to the team. Kez is a stalwart and should be releasing pressure from the likes of Trudgeon and Gibbs. While remaining one of our very best, she is treacle slow and less suited to a wing than some of our developing youngsters. Kez does not need to be pigeon holed down back, but surely if playing up the ground, should be in an inside role, or perhaps a focal point forward as opposed to a wing when we have some promising young runners. It is somewhat depressing watching Mimi, Abby, Moods and Mua giving their all along with the kids and a couple of more peripheral types while others get “dibs” on roles and indeed “they” can choose when to compete. One of the saddest points of this season is Maddy Guerin’s injury after finally getting much deserved time in the middle, let alone game time. Harf persisted with Prespakis, Egan and other less committed types through last season when Guerin was showing excellent signs from her limited opportunities. Let’s build the program, not be half (Harf) arsed in what we do.

I literally posted the rule. One poster has come on to the site simply to slag off at Harford. He's not offering any balance or objectivity.

Given that breaches our rule, are we expected to believe every word that comes out off this newcomers keyboard, simply because (in your case), you want the same outcome?

Feel free to point out where anybody did the same thing for any of the other names you mentioned.

We are not going to let the board turn into a feral Facebook forum where the loudest voices guide the club's kneejerk reactions.

I have no issue with reasoned articulate discussion.

 

[footballsthewinner]

I literally posted the rule. One poster has come on to the site simply to slag off at Harford. He's not offering any balance or objectivity.

Given that breaches our rule, are we expected to believe every word that comes out off this newcomers keyboard, simply because (in your case), you want the same outcome?

Feel free to point out where anybody did the same thing for any of the other names you mentioned.

We are not going to let the board turn into a feral Facebook forum where the loudest voices guide the club's kneejerk reactions.

I have no issue with reasoned articulate discussion.

Come on, now whose not offering balance here? I’ve not “slagged” Harf, I’ve given clear reasoning and evidence of why the guy fails in so many areas. How else would you like me to word it?
As Coona Blues rightly says, we’re entitled to give equal feedback to our Women’s team as we do the Men’s, or do you believe we should all pretend everything is fine and just be happy the women have a team?

I really think you’re missing the point if my posts just because you’re trying to ban opinions which aren’t just positive.

And if Kez is going in to the midfield, 100% she would be inside and not on a wing.. but few, if any coaches would move an AA defender away from her strongest position.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Come on, now whose not offering balance here? I’ve not “slagged” Harf, I’ve given clear reasoning and evidence of why the guy fails in so many areas. How else would you like me to word it?
As Coona Blues rightly says, we’re entitled to give equal feedback to our Women’s team as we do the Men’s, or do you believe we should all pretend everything is fine and just be happy the women have a team?

I really think you’re missing the point if my posts just because you’re trying to ban opinions which aren’t just positive.

And if Kez is going in to the midfield, 100% she would be inside and not on a wing.. but few, if any coaches would move an AA defender away from her strongest position.

Okay, you're just ignoring the crux of what I'm telling you re a negative agenda. And this entitlement you speak of doesn't exist.

You're not contributing to this forum in any constructive way.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Does anybody recall former captain and AA defender Sam Docherty

15

Sam Docherty

Age

30

Ht

187cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.3

5star

K

15.1

5star

HB

7.2

4star

M

6.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

CL

1.1

3star

D

22.6

5star

K

16.0

5star

HB

6.6

4star

M

7.0

5star

T

0.6

1star

CL

0.4

3star

D

11.2

3star

K

6.0

3star

HB

5.2

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.4

4star

CL

0.6

3star

getting moved to the midfield when we have been short on numbers?

 

[BlueGum]

Yep. We'd love several clones of Kez to provide experience across the ground. Any year but especially this year with the youngsters and injuries.

Not convinced by Harf, mind you. Too many slow starts. Not enough connection and commitment like the Demons game last season. He can do it but doesn't seem to have the drive until it's too late each season.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Yep. We'd love several clones of Kez to provide experience across the ground. Any year but especially this year with the youngsters and injuries.

Not convinced by Harf, mind you. Too many slow starts. Not enough connection and commitment like the Demons game last season. He can do it but doesn't seem to have the drive until it's too late each season.

While I do have some doubts on several aspects of our coaching and development, it doesn't help that our fringe players often don't have a VFL competition running concurrently to develop and keep match fit. The increased contracts should make that part a necessity.

There is no loyalty in the AFLW at present. If you aren't playing finals, players will jump. If there are added extras available, players will jump. If you have friends in another team, players will jump. If the team you supported as a kid wants you to join, players will jump.

So unless your culture is top notch and the women are all supportive of each other, there will be issues. This is not always possible in a competition where the income is not equitable with each other and sometimes not enought to sustain someone.

People keep pointing to the amount of players who have jumped ship, especially those who jumped while we weren't performing. What if those players were a big part of the reason the team wasn't performing? Why do some players seem very happy and hungry? Are they happy despite everyone hating the coach or are only some players happy with the coach?

Hill, McKay, Peterson, Laloifi, Pound, Moody .... they contribute every single week. Skepper is growing every week. Good gives her all every week. These girls are getting around each other when they score.

I keep seeing Gibbs brought up, but she did take a year off for mental health reasons. Unless we are related to her, how to we really know how she feels. She hasn't cemented a spot yet, but all of the blame is on Harford, when a player has to work hard and earn their spot. Wouldn't you have to be a neutral eye behind the scenes to know who is putting in the work and who isn't?

We recruited Mia Austin as a tall forward and she was injured in her 1st game, Phoebe McWilliams injured in her 4th game. A young midfield lost possibly its 3rd best midfielder for the season in Maddie Guerin.

For a team that had lost a lot of players in the offseason, these injuries were crucial.

Some of our players have improved so much. I wonder how this happens in a team that hates the coach. Laloifi has gone to another level. Hill is a deadset star of the comp and a natural footballer. McKay has never looked this good and has benefitted from the loss of Prespakis and Egan. Keeley Sherar and Brooke Vickers are coming on strong in their 2nd seasons. I'm seeing good attitudes and building blocks everywhere.

Some people see issues in the team on match day and use that as a reason for why the coaching is poor. I see some actions and wonder if the fitness is where it needs to be right now, and what will happen when players get more experience.

 

[BlueGum]

While I do have some doubts on several aspects of our coaching and development, it doesn't help that our fringe players often don't have a VFL competition running concurrently to develop and keep match fit. The increased contracts should make that part a necessity.

There is no loyalty in the AFLW at present. If you aren't playing finals, players will jump. If there are added extras available, players will jump. If you have friends in another team, players will jump. If the team you supported as a kid wants you to join, players will jump.

So unless your culture is top notch and the women are all supportive of each other, there will be issues. This is not always possible in a competition where the income is not equitable with each other and sometimes not enought to sustain someone.

People keep pointing to the amount of players who have jumped ship, especially those who jumped while we weren't performing. What if those players were a big part of the reason the team wasn't performing? Why do some players seem very happy and hungry? Are they happy despite everyone hating the coach or are only some players happy with the coach?

Hill, McKay, Peterson, Laloifi, Pound, Moody .... they contribute every single week. Skepper is growing every week. Good gives her all every week. These girls are getting around each other when they score.

I keep seeing Gibbs brought up, but she did take a year off for mental health reasons. Unless we are related to her, how to we really know how she feels. She hasn't cemented a spot yet, but all of the blame is on Harford, when a player has to work hard and earn their spot. Wouldn't you have to be a neutral eye behind the scenes to know who is putting in the work and who isn't?

We recruited Mia Austin as a tall forward and she was injured in her 1st game, Phoebe McWilliams injured in her 4th game. A young midfield lost possibly its 3rd best midfielder for the season in Maddie Guerin.

For a team that had lost a lot of players in the offseason, these injuries were crucial.

Some of our players have improved so much. I wonder how this happens in a team that hates the coach. Laloifi has gone to another level. Hill is a deadset star of the comp and a natural footballer. McKay has never looked this good and has benefitted from the loss of Prespakis and Egan. Keeley Sherar and Brooke Vickers are coming on strong in their 2nd seasons. I'm seeing good attitudes and building blocks everywhere.

Some people see issues in the team on match day and use that as a reason for why the coaching is poor. I see some actions and wonder if the fitness is where it needs to be right now, and what will happen when players get more experience.

Good summary ODN. Some individuals flourish. Need more experience. ******* injuries. I don't think Harf is hated, just not sure he's getting the best from the team/s across multiple seasons. But it's probably more on the whole footy dept/club not being aligned. Fitness is an issue. So is recruiting.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Good summary ODN. Some individuals flourish. Need more experience. ******* injuries. I don't think Harf is hated, just not sure he's getting the best from the team/s across multiple seasons. But it's probably more on the whole footy dept/club not being aligned. Fitness is an issue. So is recruiting.

Fitness is always an issue when the team gets younger. Recruiting is improving. Hill was taken around Pick 10 and is worth pick 1 right now. I can now see the merits of Sherar and Vickers and Skepper and Austin are great selections. We now have pace in the side. I'm content.

 

[Coona Blues]

Fitness is always an issue when the team gets younger. Recruiting is improving. Hill was taken around Pick 10 and is worth pick 1 right now. I can now see the merits of Sherar and Vickers and Skepper and Austin are great selections. We now have pace in the side. I'm content.

There is plenty of promise, we must work to retain them first and foremost. I am most concerned about the buy in of the coaching staff.

I look to my own history at lower levels. Wasn’t any spectacular levels, but involved in coaching and admin as well as playing. The game was all encompassing, no remuneration, but absolute buy in and was absorbed by related issues close to every waking hour. I am sure many of the officials throughout the AFLW are similarly “obsessed” despite average remuneration. Are ours? Harf has a solid media presence, a significant life away from “The Game Changers”. Our other coaches are part timers, most former players perhaps gifted a gig. How invested are they? I am sure coaches like our initial captain Lauren Arnell are driven to make their mark, as well as furthering the status of the women in the game. I have no doubt she will go above and beyond to obtain success. Does Harf have a similar focus, or is he simply fulfilling a role?

I do not want to unfairly demean Harf. He might be very invested, and my questions may be off base, but his circumstances beg the question. Then there is the simple question of his tactical and developmental nous, does he have the credentials for the role? I continue to get mixed feelings from games. Positional allocations are often perplexing and some players have monumental gaps between their best and worst, suggesting limited buy in. Most notably DV who’s best irrepressible, but at worst bounces around the periphery rather than committing to the contest, let alone leading. The women’s game is falling in to the sphere of giving “diverse” players a public forum as opposed to engaging in their prime pursuits.
I get the overuse of handball as possibly an effort to bring more in to the action, but it often smacks of players lacking confidence in their kicking skills. This clearly links back to preparation, or perhaps a conscious lack of confidence in the players by the coaches.

 

[footballsthewinner]

Does anybody recall former captain and AA defender Sam Docherty getting moved to the midfield when we have been short on numbers?

Omg.. I’m sorry I even brought it up in this forum now. You have just shown that you clearly have zero idea about football. Doherty move to the midfield due to short on numbers
I give up.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Omg.. I’m sorry I even brought it up in this forum now. You have just shown that you clearly have zero idea about football. Doherty move to the midfield due to short on numbers
I give up.

You're a dick and you're gone.

Doc has been tried in the midfield several times .. yes. However he was specifically moved into our centre square rotations when Kennedy and Hewitt were out.

It is not relevant to the fact that other coaches do move AA defenders out of that position.

Goose.