Are too many players eligible for Academies ??

[Pykie]

As I’ve said earlier. Have a national under 18s so it’s equal across the board and I’ll back the ending of the academies as they are.
That’s before we get to the other stuff stated earlier.

Yeah, um, awkward.

So is it AFL Vic helping to or the NSW and QLD clubs developing these kids now?

Where's Victorian clubs slice of the pie, my kids registration $$$ going into VFL Vic, with AFL mandated academy teams now developing against Nab League sides for periods of the year?


Seem fair?

I have no issue with the Tasmanian side entering the competition as their players are open to everyone...

 

[juss]

I guess i find it odd that a club ends up with three players on their list who were tied to other clubs in the one year, no odd is too
soft that is downright bizarre. The Brisbane Academy has provided Male and Female players to Brisbane and multiple other clubs
most of whom may never of even looked at football as a sporting option, good on them as Melbourne clubs have too traditional
a pull on young talent the numbers are staggering.

They don't though. The draft is 1-18 based on order of merit. The VIC clubs can't magically pick players wherever they like in the draft order, and they don't get to pick more players than other clubs. If Melbourne produces the bulk of AFL players, they still have to be picked in the same draft as every other club one by one, the actual drafting of players is decided by an order of merit, it's nothing to do with state bases.

 

[Yojimbo]

They don't though. The draft is 1-18 based on order of merit. The VIC clubs can't magically pick players wherever they like in the draft order, and they don't get to pick more players than other clubs. If Melbourne produces the bulk of AFL players, they still have to be picked in the same draft as every other club one by one, the actual drafting of players is decided by an order of merit, it's nothing to do with state bases.

There are plenty of Victorian kids who refuse to be drafted interstate, some even use medical certificates or attempt to.

 

[juss]

There are plenty of Victorian kids who refuse to be drafted interstate, some even use medical certificates or attempt to.

Would like some evidence to support this, as your "plenty" remark looks a bit like the Castle's "vibe" defence.

 

[Yojimbo]

Would like some evidence to support this, as your "plenty" remark looks a bit like the Castle's "vibe" defence.

Just do a bit of research on the basic list models of the clubs, Geelong with Geelong Falcons etc and you will have your answer.

Local is easier to procure and retain, until teams produce a good player then it is an outrage. Plenty fail, but they don't count.

 

[juss]

Just do a bit of research on the basic list models of the clubs, Geelong with Geelong Falcons etc and you will have your answer.

Local is easier to procure and retain, until teams produce a good player then it is an outrage. Plenty fail, but they don't count.

Yeh nah, you make a claim then come back without evidence that plenty of VIC players refuse to be drafted interstate. That's a bold call with no evidence.

There is no production/retain difference when we are talking about the access to and initial drafting of players. Every club gets equal allocated picks from an order of merit (trades/compo picks, etc. then change the order). It's the academies that then influence this access, they also influence the trades and whatnot as clubs can just offload and exploit points with a bunch of accumulative nothing picks.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I have no issue with clubs getting an incentive to develop more players with full African, Asian or Islander parentage (not birth), because it helps bring more communities into the game. Aboriginal people in traditional Australian rules states though? They're already growing up in a culture with a rich Australian rules heritage. Clubs shouldn't have any selective access to these players. I accept that some of them don't have the same equality of opportunity as white people, but that's better addressed through scholarships, not drafting privileges.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Would like some evidence to support this, as your "plenty" remark looks a bit like the Castle's "vibe" defence.

It was never confirmed by official sources, but there were rumours that Bailey Smith got a doctors certificate saying he had to stay in Victoria for his mental health. I wouldn't make sweeping declarations based on this though, since no facts were confirmed.

Rumour - Bailey Smith avoids being drafted interstate by way of medical reason

Reportedly told non Victorian clubs he only wanted to stay in Victoria. And got a doctors certificate saying it would be bad for his mental health. Where’s the investigation by the AFL for draft tampering? Will Bailey forgo insterstate matches?

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Luv_our_club]

This conversation is not possible when:

1. Northern club supporters claim they don't have a huge advantage through their accademies;

and/or

2. Northern club supporters claim the advantage is justified because it leads to northern clubs developing AFL talent in northern states and that broadens the draft pool. Even if that were true (nobody believes that), such development can happen through other mechanisms/investment.



If the above happens, then I will then try to fix my blinkered view = the view that there is no conversation really worth having. My opinion is that the accademies are such a harsh and egregious injustice (robbing clubs of hard earned draft position) that i really can't see any circumstance that can justify them.

 

[Colonial]

Yeah, um, awkward.

So is it AFL Vic helping to or the NSW and QLD clubs developing these kids now?

Where's Victorian clubs slice of the pie, my kids registration $$$ going into VFL Vic, with AFL mandated academy teams now developing against Nab League sides for periods of the year?


Seem fair?

I have no issue with the Tasmanian side entering the competition as their players are open to everyone...

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So no national under 18s? Ok well we can keep it the same.

 

[Colonial]

This conversation is not possible when:

1. Northern club supporters claim they don't have a huge advantage through their accademies;

and/or

2. Northern club supporters claim the advantage is justified because it leads to northern clubs developing AFL talent in northern states and that broadens the draft pool. Even if that were true (nobody believes that), such development can happen through other mechanisms/investment.



If the above happens, then I will then try to fix my blinkered view = the view that there is no conversation really worth having. My opinion is that the accademies are such a harsh and egregious injustice (robbing clubs of hard earned draft position) that i really can't see any circumstance that can justify them.

Just as the discussion can never be had as some Victorian fans can’t get passed the competition is an advantage to Vic clubs from the get go.
Are you against F/S?

 

[juss]

It was never confirmed by official sources, but there were rumours that Bailey Smith got a doctors certificate saying he had to stay in Victoria for his mental health. I wouldn't make sweeping declarations based on this though, since no facts were confirmed.

Rumour - Bailey Smith avoids being drafted interstate by way of medical reason

Reportedly told non Victorian clubs he only wanted to stay in Victoria. And got a doctors certificate saying it would be bad for his mental health. Where’s the investigation by the AFL for draft tampering? Will Bailey forgo insterstate matches?

www.bigfooty.com

Yep and to be fair, there may be the odd case, although there would also be legitimate factors. But I did have issues with the sweeping blanket statement that that "plenty" of kids do it, implying is a big problem. The overwhelming majority of draftees are happy to go interstate, even if their first preference is initially to stay home, but preferences don't mean they won't do it.

 

[Yojimbo]

"plenty"

I am sorry i used the word "plenty" you have my permission to insert another word of your choosing. Ample, Many, Multitudes a
few alternatives for you, some of them even ended up at my club.

 

[Pykie]

So no national under 18s? Ok well we can keep it the same.

You play a block against the Victorian TAC cup sides in a combination of Sydney and Melbourne. These best underage sides in the country.

You then play in a Div 2 carnival vs the QLD acadamies, Tasmania's state side, Northern Territories state side and Sydney's academy.


What more do you want? A national tour to SA and WA just to round it out?

You get that in the form of the Allies.


I don't see the AFL rolling the red carpet out for East Fremantle's u/18 side to get experience against Norwood or the Oakleigh chargers.

 

[Colonial]

You play a block against the Victorian TAC cup sides in a combination of Sydney and Melbourne. These best underage sides in the country.

You then play in a Div 2 carnival vs the QLD acadamies, Tasmania's state side, Northern Territories state side and Sydney's academy.


What more do you want? A national tour to SA and WA just to round it out?

I’ve said what I want, to be fair I said “would like.”
Do keep up.

 

[juss]

I am sorry i used the word "plenty" you have my permission to insert another word of your choosing. Ample, Many, Multitudes a
few alternatives for you, some of them even ended up at my club.

Well so far the evidence you have given has been "zero" examples.

 

[Luv_our_club]

Just as the discussion can never be had as some Victorian fans can’t get passed the competition is an advantage to Vic clubs from the get go.
Are you against F/S?

I view F/S as problematic. A problem especially for non-traditional clubs. Yes. But we have to find a way to make it work.

 

[Pykie]

I’ve said what I want, to be fair I said “would like.”
Do keep up.

You are writing a rubbish excuse with the throw away line "do that and we can talk about getting rid of the academies"

Well they pretty much are doing a national eastern seaboard u/18 comp.


In reality, none of you ever want to lose the academies. You'd much rather NSW remain the way it is to keep the status quo. As long as you hang onto those sweet sweet concessions.


Like mentioned a few posts above, nothing could justify the academies, nothing. Given how unequal they make the draft system.

 

[Colonial]

I view F/S as problematic. A problem especially for non-traditional clubs. Yes. But we have to find a way to make it work.

But don’t we all “want” a unaffected draft?

 

[Pykie]

But don’t we all “want” a unaffected draft?

Everyone other than GWS, Sydney, Brisbane and Gold Coast fans it seems.

 

[Colonial]

You are writing a rubbish excuse with the throw away line "do that and we can talk about getting rid of the academies"

Well they pretty much are doing a national eastern seaboard u/18 comp.


In reality, none of you ever want to lose the academies. You'd much rather NSW remain the way it is to keep the status quo. As long as you hang onto those sweet sweet concessions.


Like mentioned a few posts above, nothing could justify the academies, given how unequal they make the draft system.

I’ve written in here multiple times what I would like. Written it elsewhere also.

I know you don’t want it. Effects the power base too much away from Victoria.

 

[Colonial]

Everyone other than GWS, Sydney, Brisbane and Gold Coast fans it seems.

Lol keep on punching.

Did you read who that answer was for and the question? Or were you “trying” to be witty?

 

[Luv_our_club]

But don’t we all “want” a unaffected draft?

Perhaps the first round needs to be 100% clean - that is one view held by some.


*no point being sarcastic mate, doesn't really get anyone anywhere past high school

 

[Coops93]

Father Son should be scrapped as should the academies.

I can see a place for QLD and NSW teams to have academies, being in NRL heartlands there's perhaps an actual purpose for the academies to drag top athletes away from League into the AFL, but I can also see the argument that it's not fair to the other clubs so could live without them having it either.

Perhaps an overarching AFL academy as opposed to specific club academies is a fairer way about it.

Either way, as has been said the idea is to get non-traditional pathways for other sports athletes to "find" AFL. That's a tool I'd rather not lose in principle. But it's current incarnation is being taken for a ride by traditional AFL clubs grandfathering kids into teams who were always going to play AFL anyway.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

The overwhelming majority of draftees are happy to go interstate, even if their first preference is initially to stay home, but preferences don't mean they won't do it.

This is probably the case, although I haven't checked the statistics to confirm it. Still, the go home factor does screw over NSW and QLD clubs, particularly when they've had a bad few years. The Go Home 5 wasn't that long ago, and Gold Coast have had to rebuild since almost all their mature talent left from 2014 onwards.