Club culture is like a cancer.

[Madison]

We are all tired. I'm 25, so have seen just the two finals series. 95 I was nine and I can barely remember anything to do with it. I am sick of my mates being able to post facebook groups on my page like "the last time Richmond was good, Bin Laden was chillin outside", there are 1000's of them.

But I have faith. The people are different, the message is different, the policy is different The club has learnt from the mistakes of the past.

And you have never played sport if you think they players don't care if they lose, cos they get paid anyway. Nevermind a professional sport. That's one of the most ridiculous things I have read on here.

 

[aislegi]

This is not just about this season...it is about the ONGOING season after season after season after season of...well...sweet FA.

As many others have said, in relation to themselves, I am one of these fans who could never follow anyone else; I will turn up every year at the SCG to see us play, regardless of how bad (or good!) we are. I just cannot see the signs of improvement that others keep going on about. Just as Terry Wallace got the Tigers playing some good football from time to time (or for a quarter or part of a quarter during a game), I can see a similar thing at times under Damien Hardwick, but just as Wallace was ultimately let down by having players that just weren't good enough (as a result of poor trading and drafting - both in and before his time), I can see us saying exactly the same thing about our time under Hardwick - there look to be a ridiculous number of duds, for instance, from the 2009 draft, and we need - desperately - to find outstanding players from other than first round draft picks.

The other - perhaps even more galling - thing about the club is that the culture of giving up, or not turning up ready to play - that was such a feature of the inconsistency that we saw in the Wallace era - is still rife. Whenever it is a big game, we go missing. We look shellshocked and play well below our best. Not until I see any sign of that changing will I believe the Tigers will rise up the ladder. This is a Richmond thing. Other clubs are not like that. Do you see this from Collingwood? When they have star players out, new fellows come in and are crawling over each other so as not to be the one that has to make way. Their players seem far more motivated than ours, and, as the commentators pointed out in today's game, nobody wants to be the one who isn't picked for a second premiership.

 

[TheProwler]

It's funny how threads like this pop up after a humiliating loss rather than when things are cruising along sweet. It's okay to feel some angst and look for reasons why we continue to stay in the bottom third of the ladder but at some stage we need to build a bridge over the past and get over it. I dont know if dimma is the guy to take us to the next flag or not but I can tell you I am confident we are starting to get some quality into our list. I can see 6-10 players who will likely all play 200 games and perhaps a few others will show their hands in the next year or so to bring the number up into the teens.

 

[Ice9ine]

As many others have said, in relation to themselves, I am one of these fans who could never follow anyone else; I will turn up every year at the SCG to see us play, regardless of how bad (or good!) we are. I just cannot see the signs of improvement that others keep going on about. Just as Terry Wallace got the Tigers playing some good football from time to time (or for a quarter or part of a quarter during a game), I can see a similar thing at times under Damien Hardwick, but just as Wallace was ultimately let down by having players that just weren't good enough (as a result of poor trading and drafting - both in and before his time), I can see us saying exactly the same thing about our time under Hardwick - there look to be a ridiculous number of duds, for instance, from the 2009 draft, and we need - desperately - to find outstanding players from other than first round draft picks.

The other - perhaps even more galling - thing about the club is that the culture of giving up, or not turning up ready to play - that was such a feature of the inconsistency that we saw in the Wallace era - is still rife. Whenever it is a big game, we go missing. We look shellshocked and play well below our best. Not until I see any sign of that changing will I believe the Tigers will rise up the ladder. This is a Richmond thing. Other clubs are not like that. Do you see this from Collingwood? When they have star players out, new fellows come in and are crawling over each other so as not to be the one that has to make way. Their players seem far more motivated than ours, and, as the commentators pointed out in today's game, nobody wants to be the one who isn't picked for a second premiership.

This is exactly my point. I am talking about the effin BELIEF and PRIDE in who and what the Richmond football club is. Collinwood are PROUD..they believe in themselves and each other..they give 100% every game. it is a MENTALITY Richmond do not have and have not had for 31 years. Stop denying it people. I am merley stating the facts and you know it. How are we improving?? Show me. Look at the ladder. Look at the percentage. Look at the half arsed, schoolboy tackles and commitment on field. I am not saying we do not have a handful of better players than last year..Iam not saying hardwick is a fail coach...however I am saying the culture of this club has not changed and WILL NOT change until the players, coaches,trainers, selectors, directors get back to good old fashioned sheer detemination and bloody heart.

People go to war and die under a flag. A piece of coloured cloth on a stick...but what is the flag really?..it is a symbol...a declaration of absolute love and adoration for your country..your homeland. Guys, I don't believe the Richmond gernsey of yellow and black is empowering the players and club like it once did. This gernsey symoblises 10 Premierships...VFL and AFL superstars...Football legends...once a powerhouse football club. It also represents US, the die hard suppoerters that have been following this club before some of these players were even born. Damn it, when this gernsey gets put on in the locker room, wear the bloody thing with pride and go out and fight for what it represents...not run around half arsed, laying schoolyard tackles and dropping your heads in defeat. Change players, coaches whatever you like. If the CULTURE at this club does not change our success will not either.

 

[aislegi]

It's funny how threads like this pop up after a humiliating loss rather than when things are cruising along sweet

Er, that would be because most people didn't have the internet in 1982!

 

[Livonski]

This footy club has completely changed it's culture in the space of 18 months. From the CEO down it has improved out of sight, coach, staff, facilities, professionalism. It's chalk and cheese to even 3 or 4 years ago. I think you're just extrapolating the last two weeks.

It's like the stockmarket my friend, the knuckleheads always sell at the bottom and buy at the top.

 

[aislegi]

It's like the stockmarket my friend, the knuckleheads always sell at the bottom and buy at the top.

Nobody is selling; there would be no buyers in any case!

 

[TheProwler]

Er, that would be because most people didn't have the internet in 1982!

A few weeks back there were threads galore about us making finals and how good our list was looking now after two bad perfomances its culture and we have recruited crap for 30 yrs etc...etc...

 

[aislegi]

A few weeks back there were threads galore about us making finals and how good our list was looking now after two bad perfomances its culture and we have recruited crap for 30 yrs etc...etc...

Not from me! I'm not excited by us beating a lousy outfit like Brisbane; it's how we go against good sides that are the true barometer of our progress, and, unfortunately, we haven't beaten a good side for years.

 

[tigerfansince86]

Not from me! I'm not excited by us beating a lousy outfit like Brisbane; it's how we go against good sides that are the true barometer of our progress, and, unfortunately, we haven't beaten a good side for years.

Development mate...aint it the truth brother. Club culture is great that's why I believe we still exist. I never waiver in my love for this club, EVER!

Your support is weak.

 

[Livonski]

Nobody is selling; there would be no buyers in any case!

It was a very bearish outlook from the OP, and at exactly the wrong time.

The club has not been rebuilding for 31 years.
Wallace didn't rebuild, Frawley thought he was at the top etc etc. To rebuild you need to recognise where you're at. We're doing it now. THere's been a significant clean out of the list and a clean out off field, now we're rebuilding on both fronts.

Just when there are reasons to be bullish there are fools who talk about today as a continuation of a trend lasting 31 years.

 

[aislegi]

Development mate...aint it the truth brother. Club culture is great that's why I believe we still exist. I never waiver in my love for this club, EVER!

Your support is weak.

Absolute bullcrap! You are not a better supporter than others because you are more optimistic than others; you may simply be a fool who is trying desperately to see something that never materialises.

 

[tigerfansince86]

Absolute bullcrap! You are not a better supporter than others because you are more optimistic than others; you may simply be a fool who is trying desperately to see something that never materialises.

It's not optimism it's actual fact. 2nd year into a rebuild the future looks very good and if you and any other supporter doesn't see that then you are blind.

Also your negativity is unrealistic.

 

[Ice9ine]

It was a very bearish outlook from the OP, and at exactly the wrong time.

The club has not been rebuilding for 31 years.
Wallace didn't rebuild, Frawley thought he was at the top etc etc. To rebuild you need to recognise where you're at. We're doing it now. THere's been a significant clean out of the list and a clean out off field, now we're rebuilding on both fronts.

Just when there are reasons to be bullish there are fools who talk about today as a continuation of a trend lasting 31 years.

Get off your high horse pedestal please. This club has had no success, let alone consistant success for three decades. Stop playing the 'loyal supporter card'. This is not about that, nor am I questioning anyone's committment as a supporter. How can countless coaches, players, board memebrs be wrong for thirty years?...come on. Successful clubs do not have Superman and Batman playing, they simply have an incredibly strong mindset to winning. yes they have a strong team, but don't tell me that Richmond could be top eight win with it's current list with the right mindset.

 

[tigerfansince86]

It was a very bearish outlook from the OP, and at exactly the wrong time.

The club has not been rebuilding for 31 years.
Wallace didn't rebuild, Frawley thought he was at the top etc etc. To rebuild you need to recognise where you're at. We're doing it now. THere's been a significant clean out of the list and a clean out off field, now we're rebuilding on both fronts.

Just when there are reasons to be bullish there are fools who talk about today as a continuation of a trend lasting 31 years.[/quote]

Get off your high horse pedestal please. This club has had no success, let alone consistant success for three decades. Stop playing the 'loyal supporter card'. This is not about that, nor am I questioning anyone's committment as a supporter. How can countless coaches, players, board memebrs be wrong for thirty years?...come on. Successful clubs do not have Superman and Batman playing, they simply have an incredibly strong mindset to winning. yes they have a strong team, but don't tell me that Richmond could be top eight win with it's current list with the right mindset.

That's life mate, shit happens no need to dwell on it like all the other sheep. Get over it look ahead instead of behind. The club was never about finals this year, never.

 

[aislegi]

It's not optimism it's actual fact. 2nd year into a rebuild the future looks very good and if you and any other supporter doesn't see that then you are blind.

Also your negativity is unrealistic.

I'm not blind to the fact that we are 13th on the ladder. I'm not blind to the fact that we were embarrassed to the tune of 103 points by a side that's been soundly beaten in two of its last three games. I'm not blind to the fact that we have nobody who stands up when it gets a bit difficult. I'm not blind to the fact that our most talented player is still not winning us games. I'm not blind to the fact that we have the worst ruck division in the competition. I'm not blind to the fact that our midfielders have a woeful defensive game. I'm not blind to the fact that many of our footballers have poor disposal. I'm not blind to the fact that our "star" full-forward can't cope with a little bit of attention. I'm not blind to the fact that our last two performances are a combined total of 23 goals below what we did against the same sides earlier in the season.

 

[Livonski]

Get off your high horse pedestal please. This club has had no success, let alone consistant success for three decades. Stop playing the 'loyal supporter card'. This is not about that, nor am I questioning anyone's committment as a supporter. How can countless coaches, players, board memebrs be wrong for thirty years?...come on. Successful clubs do not have Superman and Batman playing, they simply have an incredibly strong mindset to winning. yes they have a strong team, but don't tell me that Richmond could be top eight win with it's current list with the right mindset.

Ok, I've dismounted.

If everything went right they could be verge of top eight with this list, but it doesn't. 12 months time they can for sure as players get another 20 senior games into them, plus additions. But that's not my point. i'm saying that off field and on field things have changed for the better to enable a sustained run of success.

 

[Ice9ine]

Ok, I've dismounted.

If everything went right they could be verge of top eight with this list, but it doesn't. 12 months time they can for sure as players get another 20 senior games into them, plus additions. But that's not my point. i'm saying that off field and on field things have changed for the better to enable a sustained run of success.

I laughed at that

 

[Highly Evolved]

... They are VFL standard and that is very, very sad ...

You're not that bad. Richmond are just inconsistent - a lot like Essendon. Coming from an Essendon supporter, I too know how frustrating it can be, but give the playing group some time to develop and in a few years we'll both probably be quite happy with where our teams are at.

Yes, Richmond put in an insipid performance against Carlton and lost to Essendon on Saturday, but lets not forget that Essendon were incredibly woeful against Hawthorn before their next two wins. Developing players takes time. I think the only difference between your club and ours at the moment is that we are prepared to wait a little longer because we have Hird at the helm. Contrast it to when Knights was coaching and club morale was pretty much non-existent. I hope yourself and other Richmond fans are prepared to wait for the playing group to develop because you have an excellent coach in Damien Hardwick and it wont be long before you're contesting consistently.

... Well, I can see what is going to happen. Martin will come out of contract and get poached by a Geelong or Collingwood or anyone willing to cough up more than than we can afford, as will Reiwoldt and Delidio ...

As for this, I both doubt it and I hope not. The Richmond players seem fairly dedicated to the club - especially Dustin Martin: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/how-loyalty-cost-dustin-martin-3m/story-fn6cisdj-1226049486283

 

[Varicho]

I would be shocked if we lost any of our young guns. Why would they want to lose?

Martin, Cotchin, Reiwoldt etc will earn more at Richmond that they could possibly earn anywhere else (barring Gold Coast & GWS) as we have salary cap room. The big clubs couldn't afforrd to take them away on a big deal.

And despite that we are an attractive place to be...

Young list about to go places, great coaching set up, brilliant CEO, big club with awesome support, great facilities and you get to play on the MCG most weeks...

It will be young talent wanting to come to Richmond rather than them wanting to leave...

 

[tiggywigs]

Hello,

I was at last nights game against Essendon. I love my footy and I am passionate about my Tigers. I don't get to the footy often and was let down...again.

I am 41 years old and I remember 1980 as a kid. I don't need to tell you all the demise since then. In all seriousness, the belief and heart of this club is shot and has been for decades. Hundreds of players later and endless coaches have made no change. I do not buy the 'rebuilding' BS. We have been 'rebuilding' season after season.

So now we get a few star players and everyone gets excited. Well, I can see what is going to happen. Martin will come out of contract and get poached by a Geelong or Collingwood or anyone willing to cough up more than than we can afford, as will Reiwoldt and Delidio. Newman will probably retire at the end of this season too. Why would these star players want to stay at a club going nowhere? So then we will be left with rookies who will come and go..producing the occasional star who will ultimatley leave for greener pastures.

There is a culture at our club of failure. No, there really is. Look at them...what are they playing for?...a finals berth?..give me a break. They get their big salaries win,lose or draw...who cares about winning. This cancer goes beyond the players, coach and panel. It is becoming the culture at this club and I have had it.

What is the answer? I don't know. The players are not hungry, the coaching staff does need seem tough enough to me either. Put everyone on performance based contracts...you lose you get nothing..you win you get paid. Not realistic but I am grabbing at straws.

Richmond is the laughing stock of the AFL and has been for years.
'Like the Tigers of Old' we are not...they had spirit, belief and were hungry.

I will always love my footy and my beloved Richmond but we are at a crisis point I believe. Do not fool yourselves or be fooled that we are a better team and on the improve. This club needs an absolute clean out.

Should have got Sheedy when he put hand up but then again, even his magic woud fall on deaf ears. Where is the heart of this club?? Where has the passion gone on field. They are VFL standard and that is very, very sad.

Oh well, there's always next yeah eh.

Cheers.

The problem has already been identified. The head surgeons are Hardwick, Gale and March. You can either stick around for the result of the surgery or bugger off. Personally, I think the prognosis is good and the patient will survive.

 

[harimal12]

Where did it all go wrong?? We had a great culture, strong tough tigers we were the most feared and hated team in the VFL.

Then perhaps lots of money came into the game people like Sheedy and Malthouse who took the dollars and turned their backs on anything Ricmond.

Now we have Benny Gale,Campbell,and Richo around the place I can sense a change it will happen.

We need the ex players around the club helping out.We are still sweeping out the dusty corners from Wallets and god help us Robert Walls.

Hang in there Tiger

 

[aislegi]

We need the ex players around the club helping out.We are still sweeping out the dusty corners from Wallets and god help us Robert Walls.

Good grief! It was predominantly the ex-players that led us into the wilderness in the first place.

 

[santa claws]

i will stop watching football if it takes that long

you may as well stop then because that is how long it may take.sheesh we have another clean out coming this yr and there is probably another coming the yr after.
we lack things like depth how long does it take to build up adequate depth we arent talking 22 players here more like 32 35.
how many yrs will it take for us to get a significant number of afl standard players up to 100 games 4 5 6 yrs. these are just a couple of the many things we need to do and do right. sheesh first up we need to find/recruit enough afl standard players and develop them.

where is the common sense and patience to see something thru for once. im supposed to be a pretty negative one about these parts but i have to say i think as a club we have in place some good processes that will help us build a decent side and grow the club itself. but it all takes time.

if being riddled with glass half full footballers is culture then we are riddled with cancer.if you dont have the cattle you dont have the cattle and in the short term you are stuck where you are with very little you can do about it in the short term.

 

[Kapital city TIGER]

as an outside fan that mostly doesnt buy membership or get to games, Id like to offer that I have NO IDEA about the actual culture of the club, but from the outside, it seems that it has gone from aggressive cancer (trade wars of the 80s) through some prolonged suffering with a few relapses (coach sacking, eating our own) and is currently in remission, with a bright future.