Customer Complaint

[Dan Moody]

As I stated... I can understand why I wasn't served initially but explain to me at what stage it becomes okay for me to return to the store to purchase alcohol by myself? Thats the part that I was pissed off about as the liquor sl*t behind the counter couldn't give me an answer. Surely if we both exit and I return by myself 10 minutes later to purchase something different or at least a different slab of the same beer then that is considered a separate transaction?

i'll refrain from calling you an idiot like the other clowns. i understand what you are saying, it seems very ambiguous and a lot of the decision making seems to be determined by the person working the register that night.
i realise it's the law, but people have different opinions and some can be overly judgemental. i think common sense can be used by the worker in some situations, but i wouldn't contemplate taking a mid-teen into a bottleo because of what it may imply.

 

[Dan Moody]

now if they looked underage and asked for some of this i'd understand ......

 

[HAWKS HEROES]

And that is why before posting a comment people should read the comment! for while written communication is extremely common its the easiest to misunderstand.

i did read it he was stirring me ! or being sarcastic , what ever anyway get bat to the subject !

 

[Macca19]

thats shocking i think she has gone too far , i know there are rules and all but if you went home and came back with out your brother what is the problem

Its a minimum $6000 fine if you supply alcohol to someone under 18, not only for the business, but I think the person supplying cops a fine as well. Can you afford a $6000 fine? Do you think your manager would be happy at you for not only costing them $6000 but also putting their liqour licence under serious risk? Do you realise that their are random checks involved and scenarios put in place to catch these things out? For secondary supply its an on the spot minimum $600 fine. A responsible service of alcohol certificate is sometimes a must to work in the liqour industry. If you are wanting a career out of it, im sure having your certificate revoked would go down a real treat.

Thats what the problem is. Its called doing your job properly. If someone has reasonable suspicion that youll be supplying alcohol to a minor then they are well within their rights not to supply you. Simply walking out and in again 5 minutes later doesnt change anything.

 

[Underdog]

ItThats what the problem is. Its called doing your job properly. If someone has reasonable suspicion that youll be supplying alcohol to a minor then they are well within their rights not to supply you. Simply walking out and in again 5 minutes later doesnt change anything.

What's reasonable suspicion?

Seems they more operate on unsubstantiated assumption.

 

[MF]

Did you read? 2 people have answered your question.

They cannot supply alcohol to minors or anyone they suspect might be supplying a minor.

It's not that hard a concept seriously.

Lol...Okay so I can return to the store to purchase alcohol once the persons suspicion subsides? Yeah, that's pretty straight forward.

Oh and I'm sorry for referring to your kind as "liquor s**ts". You guys perform a very valuable service to the community.

 

[Macca19]

What's reasonable suspicion?

I would say the lady was well within her right not to supply given there was a 16 year old in the car. Might be anal and might not apply in Malceskis situation, but its bad luck i guess. Saying 'its not for him its for me' doesnt change anything, they would have heard that a million times.

At what point would it be ok to come back in? Id say the next night. Again, what is simply dropping the 16 year old off and coming back gonna do? Nothing. For everyone thats innocent like in Malceskis situation, there'd be a dozen or more that arent and would be buying it for the 16 year old.

Seems they more operate on unsubstantiated assumption.

Of course they do. What else do they have to operate on?

 

[Niximus]

Lol...Okay so I can return to the store to purchase alcohol once the persons suspicion subsides? Yeah, that's pretty straight forward.

Oh and I'm sorry for referring to your kind as "liquor s**ts". You guys perform a very valuable service to the community.

If they have no reason to be suspicious then they are not laible for what you do with it. If you come back a month later and they still think you're buying it for a minor.

My kind? You assume that because I have an understanding of such a basic concept as responsible serving of alcohol and respect for someone doing their job that I must work in a liquor store...fail.

IMO the people you see giving a hard time to shop attendance are those who are so unhappy with the deficiencies in their own lives that they feel the need to take it out on those they see as below them. Only thing I can say is that I bet she didn't need to have this explained to her several times.

 

[HAWKS HEROES]

Its a minimum $6000 fine if you supply alcohol to someone under 18, not only for the business, but I think the person supplying cops a fine as well. Can you afford a $6000 fine? Do you think your manager would be happy at you for not only costing them $6000 but also putting their liqour licence under serious risk? Do you realise that their are random checks involved and scenarios put in place to catch these things out? For secondary supply its an on the spot minimum $600 fine. A responsible service of alcohol certificate is sometimes a must to work in the liqour industry. If you are wanting a career out of it, im sure having your certificate revoked would go down a real treat.

Thats what the problem is. Its called doing your job properly. If someone has reasonable suspicion that youll be supplying alcohol to a minor then they are well within their rights not to supply you. Simply walking out and in again 5 minutes later doesnt change anything.

i know about the license and the fines read my other posts i am just shocked that he could not go and drop his brother off then go back that is why i thought she went over the top a bit but hey i can be wrong too and i will be inquiring out of curiosity to my local about it as i do work in the place where i sell cigs i know about that too as i can be fined if i sell to an under ager !

 

[Bombermania]

Its a differcult question for when I was 18 and being short I remember being in a shop with a 16 & 17 year and since they were really tall the shopkeeper asked me for id but didn't ask them, therefore they were able to buy what ever they chose

 

[HAWKS HEROES]

Its a differcult question for when I was 18 and being short I remember being in a shop with a 16 & 17 year and since they were really tall the shopkeeper asked me for id but didn't ask them, therefore they were able to buy what ever they chose

yeah i asked id of a very tall just turned 18 2 days before fellow when he wanted cigs no probs there showed me i said bet you been smoking longer then 2 days he said yes to that he quite often got away with it cause of his height and build sometimes he was asked , if asked he went out and probably got a mate to get them for him if he could not get them

 

[MF]

If they have no reason to be suspicious then they are not laible for what you do with it. If you come back a month later and they still think you're buying it for a minor.

I have no trouble understanding this concept, I just don't agree with it.

My kind? You assume that because I have an understanding of such a basic concept as responsible serving of alcohol and respect for someone doing their job that I must work in a liquor store...fail.

Generally when someone gets their back up so much that they resort to petty name calling then you assume you've hit a nerve.

IMO the people you see giving a hard time to shop attendance are those who are so unhappy with the deficiencies in their own lives that they feel the need to take it out on those they see as below them. Only thing I can say is that I bet she didn't need to have this explained to her several times.

I'm normally very sympathetic towards shop attendants almost to the point where I'm too polite. We've all been in positions where we've had to deal with difficult customers or clients and I always try to put myself in their shoes, however the reason I referred to her in this manor is due to her attitude. If you re-read my post you'll find that she was rude from the outset and at no stage did she give any sort of adequate explanation of why I could not return to the store at a later time. Had she properly explained at any point that she could not sell me alcohol while she suspected I may be supplying it to a minor or even just spoken in a civil and friendly manor then I wouldn't have had a problem.

If people that give shop attendants a hard time do so because of deficiencies in their own lives then what explanation do you have for resorting to petty name calling?

 

[Niximus]

I have no trouble understanding this concept, I just don't agree with it.

Generally when someone gets their back up so much that they resort to petty name calling then you assume you've hit a nerve.

Really? I guess I was fooled by your repeated calls for clarification after multiple people had already explained it to you

I'm normally very sympathetic towards shop attendants almost to the point where I'm too polite. We've all been in positions where we've had to deal with difficult customers or clients and I always try to put myself in their shoes, however the reason I referred to her in this manor is due to her attitude. If you re-read my post you'll find that she was rude from the outset and at no stage did she give any sort of adequate explanation of why I could not return to the store at a later time. Had she properly explained at any point that she could not sell me alcohol while she suspected I may be supplying it to a minor or even just spoken in a civil and friendly manor then I wouldn't have had a problem.

Judging by the way you failed to get the explanations you've received on here she probably did explain it.

If people that give shop attendants a hard time do so because of deficiencies in their own lives then what explanation do you have for resorting to petty name calling?

Think of it more as an observation.

 

[jimmyn13]

She was wrong to refuse you in the first place in my opinion. If you and your brother were say 16 and 18 she'd be right to refuse without anything to get suspicion (you can assume they'll be hanging out drinking it together and that theyll most likely share some). But if one person is a fair bit older than the underager and you haven't seen the underager hand over cash or pick stuff out or carry it up then i think it's overkill to refuse. There's no real good reason to suspect that the slab is for the youngster.

BUT once she had made the decision to refuse she was right to continue to refuse- just cos you leave doesn't mean she should serve you once you come back. You'd be unable to buy from the store for the rest of that night/day, but the next day is generally when it's fine for you to puchase

 

[-VC-]

I think there's a lesson to be learned here.

Don't take your underaged sibling into a liquor store if you are buying liquor for yourself. In fact, that can easily be extended to the scenario where you actually are buying for them. Never take them inside.

 

[Ljp86]

I still haven't had an answer to my question. If this is based on law then surely there must be some sort of concrete guidelines for them to follow.

There is. If any attendent suspects that a person is or may be supplying alcohol to a person under the age of 18 then they have the right to refuse service to that customer regardless of whether they are supplying minors alcohol or not.

It is purely up to the discretion of the person. If they think you are supplying to persons under 18 or doing something dodgy then they can refuse service. Simple as that.

Its a minimum $6000 fine if you supply alcohol to someone under 18, not only for the business, but I think the person supplying cops a fine as well. Can you afford a $6000 fine? Do you think your manager would be happy at you for not only costing them $6000 but also putting their liqour licence under serious risk? Do you realise that their are random checks involved and scenarios put in place to catch these things out? For secondary supply its an on the spot minimum $600 fine. A responsible service of alcohol certificate is sometimes a must to work in the liqour industry. If you are wanting a career out of it, im sure having your certificate revoked would go down a real treat.

Thats what the problem is. Its called doing your job properly. If someone has reasonable suspicion that youll be supplying alcohol to a minor then they are well within their rights not to supply you. Simply walking out and in again 5 minutes later doesnt change anything.

In WA it's a $10,000 fine for the manager, $5000 for the attendent and $2000 for the customer purchasing the products.

RSA is compulsory in WA when working with or selling alcohol products.

She was wrong to refuse you in the first place in my opinion. If you and your brother were say 16 and 18 she'd be right to refuse without anything to get suspicion (you can assume they'll be hanging out drinking it together and that theyll most likely share some). But if one person is a fair bit older than the underager and you haven't seen the underager hand over cash or pick stuff out or carry it up then i think it's overkill to refuse. There's no real good reason to suspect that the slab is for the youngster.

BUT once she had made the decision to refuse she was right to continue to refuse- just cos you leave doesn't mean she should serve you once you come back. You'd be unable to buy from the store for the rest of that night/day, but the next day is generally when it's fine for you to puchase

Going into a liquor store with a person aged under 18 is just asking for trouble. Even if you're buying the alcohol for yourself it's still going to look bad with a 16 or 17 year old there with them. Even worse so when it's your sibling.

The girl had every right to refuse Malceski service even if he was buying the alcohol for himself. No-one wants to risk a hefty fine and the loss of their job for the sake of potentially bending the rules. Not only do they get fined but so does the person buying the stuff. I don't think many people have a few thousand dollars lying around.

I think there's a lesson to be learned here.

Don't take your underaged sibling into a liquor store if you are buying liquor for yourself. In fact, that can easily be extended to the scenario where you actually are buying for them. Never take them inside.

Exactly. Don't take anyone underage into a liquor store. It's just stupid.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Well malceski fan, the girl was in the right as everyone said, while you might of not been supplying to your brother, but in the liquor store i work at, we sometimes have police waiting outside sitting in a car for 15-20 minutes, and if a youngish looking person walks out they will ask for id, if they dont produce they pay us a visit.

I wouldnt of served you, but this is because as i am a manager i dont really want a 10,000 fine, or even risk it.

ANYWAYS

Ah saturday 3 blokes walk in and i ask them for id, 2 cant produce, i tell both to leave and one goes "but im not buying anything " "Well you dont have to be in here then?" he then shouts at the 18 bloke what he wants, then i tell him to leave and i wont serve him, oh he didnt like that,

 

[Bosun]

Intersting stuff, I had no idea about how strict they are when walking in with minor's. In the last couple of weeks I have walked in with minor's (15 and 16 yr old cousins) and bought a slab (which was for me, none for them) with no suspicion or objections from the staff.

Whilst I do agree with the strict measures the stores put in place, no one wants a $5000 fine, I can also see how it "muddies up the waters" when being applied.

 

[-VC-]

Ah saturday 3 blokes walk in and i ask them for id, 2 cant produce, i tell both to leave and one goes "but im not buying anything " "Well you dont have to be in here then?" he then shouts at the 18 bloke what he wants, then i tell him to leave and i wont serve him, oh he didnt like that,

Haha, some people are so stupid.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

I can remember many years ago my parents had a newsagency/corner store. There was a lady lived two streets down who used to send her dog up to the shop.

It would come and sit inside the front door with a little coin bag around it's neck. Inside was a note and money.

She often used to get cigarettes (to be honest not much else would have fitted in the bag anyway) - I wonder how that would be viewed today?

Afterall, the dog would only have been 4-8 years old. Is there a limitation on selling alcohol/cigarettes to non-humans?

(Would make Roger's life easier anyway).

 

[-VC-]

That story is so awesome!

 

[Upgrayedd]

Intersting stuff, I had no idea about how strict they are when walking in with minor's. In the last couple of weeks I have walked in with minor's (15 and 16 yr old cousins) and bought a slab (which was for me, none for them) with no suspicion or objections from the staff.

Whilst I do agree with the strict measures the stores put in place, no one wants a $5000 fine, I can also see how it "muddies up the waters" when being applied.

Do you look older? they might of thought you were their dad

While there are blokes at my store who will probably serve you, i wouldnt, but then again if they were supplying and they didnt kick you out, they would get a 1000 fine (usually 100 dollars)

I however as a approved manager get my ass kicked, and would get something ranging from 1000-10,000 its just a safeguard, i know its annoying, but most people would realise and wont take it personally.

 

[Bosun]

Do you look older? they might of thought you were their dad

While there are blokes at my store who will probably serve you, i wouldnt, but then again if they were supplying and they didnt kick you out, they would get a 1000 fine (usually 100 dollars)

I however as a approved manager get my ass kicked, and would get something ranging from 1000-10,000 its just a safeguard, i know its annoying, but most people would realise and wont take it personally.

Lol **** I hope not, Im 29 I hope I havent aged that badly.

I wouldnt take it personally, I understand the caution and its not hard to get to another bottle O though it would suck if you were in a rural area and that was the only one around for 100 odd k's.

 

[Benno_900]

I can remember many years ago my parents had a newsagency/corner store. There was a lady lived two streets down who used to send her dog up to the shop.

It would come and sit inside the front door with a little coin bag around it's neck. Inside was a note and money.

She often used to get cigarettes (to be honest not much else would have fitted in the bag anyway) - I wonder how that would be viewed today?

Afterall, the dog would only have been 4-8 years old. Is there a limitation on selling alcohol/cigarettes to non-humans?

(Would make Roger's life easier anyway).

Lazy bitch

 

[Traces of Nuts]

I can remember many years ago my parents had a newsagency/corner store. There was a lady lived two streets down who used to send her dog up to the shop.

It would come and sit inside the front door with a little coin bag around it's neck. Inside was a note and money.

She often used to get cigarettes (to be honest not much else would have fitted in the bag anyway) - I wonder how that would be viewed today?

Afterall, the dog would only have been 4-8 years old. Is there a limitation on selling alcohol/cigarettes to non-humans?

(Would make Roger's life easier anyway).

I'm sure the law states that so long as the dog is over 2 years, 6 months and 2 days of age (18 in dog years) then he can but as much smokes and piss as he likes. Except in some remote communities where they have issues with alcoholism in dingoes (indigenous dogs).