David Warner

[Dogs_R_Us]

It'sWarner who is at fault, why denigrate Hughes brother.Maybe he's looking for publicity for a book or his Instagram account

Was it Warner who denigrated Hughes' brother, or some click-bait journo who alleged he did?

 

[JackOutback]

As you said given his “form” then is he a scapegoat? How else are they meant to judge him? Form is form, his previous actions are his actions, his previous behaviour record is his behaviour record, what else should he be judged on?

If the majority of blame is being heaped on him to save the skin of others, then he’s a scapegoat, regardless of past history. There’s a lot about this whole saga that stinks. I mean, the bowlers claimed to know nothing about it despite the ball being thrown to them six times an over. They know what condition the ball should be in. There’s a distinct lack of honesty about the whole saga.

That said, don’t for a second mistake me for a fan of Warner. In many respects, it’s the chickens coming home to roost. But as I said at the time of the whole incident, I would have preferred complete honesty and smaller penalties than half truth and hammer ban for a select few.

 

[Spook]

If the majority of blame is being heaped on him to save the skin of others, then he’s a scapegoat, regardless of past history. There’s a lot about this whole saga that stinks. I mean, the bowlers claimed to know nothing about it despite the ball being thrown to them six times an over. They know what condition the ball should be in. There’s a distinct lack of honesty about the whole saga.

That said, don’t for a second mistake me for a fan of Warner. In many respects, it’s the chickens coming home to roost. But as I said at the time of the whole incident, I would have preferred complete honesty and smaller penalties than half truth and hammer ban for a select few.

I’m still no sure why Warner is a scapegoat when he instigated the cheating and then got a junior player to execute it. Let’s not forget that he had been playing around with a truck load of tape on his hands and fingers and once the camera was on that he suddenly handed the ball shining role to Bancroft.
Just do a google search and you’ll see it was a few series where he was questioned.

 

[JackOutback]

I’m still no sure why Warner is a scapegoat when he instigated the cheating and then got a junior player to execute it. Let’s not forget that he had been playing around with a truck load of tape on his hands and fingers and once the camera was on that he suddenly handed the ball shining role to Bancroft.

Also as Australia’s best fielder I always wondered why he fielded at mid off once the ball was past its seam and conventional swing and ready to prepare for reverse swing.

I consider him a scapegoat because excessive blame is being placed on him to divert it from others. Yes, he was involved and perhaps even instigated it all, but if others were also involved then he is currently taking their share of the blame.

You mention the tape. Was Smith and the bowlers blindly unaware of all this going on despite Smith fielding next to him for years and the bowlers regularly inspecting the ball? I’d have to be pretty naive to believe that.

 

[Socrates2]

Here's a good article about Warner from 3 years ago Crowe wrote in a column for Cricinfo. “Soon one day it will lead to an incident that will sully the game for good.” and this one https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...r-martin-crowe-thuggish-behaviour-rohit-shrma

 

[Gough]

I consider him a scapegoat because excessive blame is being placed on him to divert it from others. Yes, he was involved and perhaps even instigated it all, but if others were also involved then he is currently taking their share of the blame.

You mention the tape. Was Smith and the bowlers blindly unaware of all this going on despite Smith fielding next to him for years and the bowlers regularly inspecting the ball? I’d have to be pretty naive to believe that.

It's possible that these three coping it on the chin was seen as the more palatable alternative to the the possibility that better than half the team and some of the coaching staff were all in on it as well. I'm looking forward to hearing the player's versions of this saga from the safety of retirement.

 

[JimDocker]

Here's a good article about Warner from 3 years ago Crowe wrote in a column for Cricinfo. “Soon one day it will lead to an incident that will sully the game for good.” and this one https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...r-martin-crowe-thuggish-behaviour-rohit-shrma

I miss Martin Crowe. He was one of the most elegant batsmen of all time and he carried that elegance into his writing. He was a great thinker about the game and he was right.

 

[Spook]

I consider him a scapegoat because excessive blame is being placed on him to divert it from others. Yes, he was involved and perhaps even instigated it all, but if others were also involved then he is currently taking their share of the blame.

You mention the tape. Was Smith and the bowlers blindly unaware of all this going on despite Smith fielding next to him for years and the bowlers regularly inspecting the ball? I’d have to be pretty naive to believe that.

Warner admitted to instigating the plan.

 

[corbies]

I consider him a scapegoat because excessive blame is being placed on him to divert it from others. Yes, he was involved and perhaps even instigated it all, but if others were also involved then he is currently taking their share of the blame.

You mention the tape. Was Smith and the bowlers blindly unaware of all this going on despite Smith fielding next to him for years and the bowlers regularly inspecting the ball? I’d have to be pretty naive to believe that.

Warner had stopped fielding in the slips so Smith wasn't fielding next to Warner.

Also the umpires looked at the ball after the video was shown and they didn't see anything wrong with the ball to deem it to need replacing so its possible that the bowlers wouldn't know despite them having the ball in their hands often.

 

[JackOutback]

Warner had stopped fielding in the slips so Smith wasn't fielding next to Warner.

Also the umpires looked at the ball after the video was shown and they didn't see anything wrong with the ball to deem it to need replacing so its possible that the bowlers wouldn't know despite them having the ball in their hands often.

On that day, perhaps. But you’d have to be pretty naive to think this hadn’t been going on previously (the tape) and that no one knew about. Gough gets where I’m coming from; these three are the sacrificial lambs to protect cricket’s overall image. And Warner is the chief sacrificial lamb to protect Smith. That doesn’t mean he didn’t bring it on himself, but I won’t be tearing up at the musical montage that accompanies Smith’s rise from the ashes.

 

[PhatBoy]

On that day, perhaps. But you’d have to be pretty naive to think this hadn’t been going on previously (the tape) and that no one knew about. Gough gets where I’m coming from; these three are the sacrificial lambs to protect cricket’s overall image. And Warner is the chief sacrificial lamb to protect Smith. That doesn’t mean he didn’t bring it on himself, but I won’t be tearing up at the musical montage that accompanies Smith’s rise from the ashes.

Yeah somehow I doubt when they thought about who they could sacrifice, they sat around and thought ‘you know who we HAVE to have in the crosshairs? The best - statistically - batsman since Sir Donald Bradman.’

 

[The_Reaper]

This is basically my position. Given his form and reputation in cricket circles, I’m not surprised Warner is being used as a scapegoat to protect the career and reputation of Smith. But I’m still not comfortable with scapegoating of any kind and Smith getting a free pass to redemption with what I think is a bullshit narrative.


This is where we differ. I don’t for a second accept the story that poor naive Smiff was blindsided by big bad Davey’s cheating. Smith is the captain, the cricket field ain’t that big. Warner has decided to keep his mouth shut in the slim hope of salvaging his career. But the truth will out eventually. That’s what’s going to make the inevitable redemption story more pathetic.

Except the distaste for Warner goes well beyond the sandpapershit.

 

[Richard Pryor]

Yeah somehow I doubt when they thought about who they could sacrifice, they sat around and thought ‘you know who we HAVE to have in the crosshairs? The best - statistically - batsman since Sir Donald Bradman.’

If Smith hadn't lied about tape at the first press conference I imagine CA would have tried to get him out of it, possibly successfully. As it stands he publicly made it obvious he was trying for a coverup.

 

[big_e]

On that day, perhaps. But you’d have to be pretty naive to think this hadn’t been going on previously (the tape) and that no one knew about. Gough gets where I’m coming from; these three are the sacrificial lambs to protect cricket’s overall image. And Warner is the chief sacrificial lamb to protect Smith. That doesn’t mean he didn’t bring it on himself, but I won’t be tearing up at the musical montage that accompanies Smith’s rise from the ashes.

Stripped of captaincy and not considered again for a leadership position til 2020.

Suspended for 12 months.

And he's the one being protected?

 

[JackOutback]

Stripped of captaincy and not considered again for a leadership position til 2020.

Suspended for 12 months.

And he's the one being protected?

They had to protect CA first. But yes, when he makes his triumphant return, when they start waxing lyrical about how he has overcome adversity, when the musical montages play, when the prodigal son walks out to bat, then compare it to Bancroft and Warner, you’ll be seeing the final act of a carefully managed production.

 

[The Casey Cat]

Well, Warner just looks like bigger goose, as does his wife for trying to pump it up into something it wasn’t. As I said earlier, if it was something about Phil, removing himself from the situation would have made sense. As it is, he needs to grow a thicker skin, put his head down and play cricket.

Yep. Not a great sledge. Don't think it was necessary. But not something Warner should be making a big deal of. Given what he has done he must accept he needs to toughen up to it.

Sent from my Lenovo TB-8703F using Tapatalk

 

[Socrates2]

Smith and Warner will get booed in England and deservingly so.To blame Cricket Australia culture is partly correct, but an Australian captain should have the balls to stand up for certain principles.These two aren't men of character, Smith is a blubbering mothers boy and Warner's just a massive tool.Darren Leahman has helped ruin our reputation.I would like to see AB De Villiers and Rohit Sharma give a couple in the ribcage to Smith and Warner, then send them to play for Zimbabwe or Bangladesh.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Smith has ticked every box he can to get where he is. Ironically was gifted a spot as a bowler without doing squat to earn it but went away and turned himself into a run making machine. He’s had a good behavioural history, he’s early into his captaincy, and it’s been generally acknowledged that, while his non-actions at cape town were spineless, he wasn’t a driving factor in what happened. Warner has been on the edge of a major fall his whole career. He didn’t really pay his dues to get into the test side, most of his career has been based around stuffing his pockets with home town runs each summer and living off them for the next nine months aside from the odd sporadic appearance in the runs column in SA, he’s a noted f***head, by all accounts he actively encouraged a young teammate to cheat having not had the balls to do it himself, he nearly caused a corridor brawl with the opposition because he could give it but not take it - you didn’t see QDK trying to attack Warner in there. Smith has also never had to be disciplined for throwing a punch at an opponent in public.


I think I can see why the redemption narrative applies to one and not the other

Tim Paine is captain now and I can't see CA giving it back to Smith. He's ****ed himself like Shane Warne.

 

[FRUMPY]

So if Warner gets back into the Australian side, is he going to walk off when someone sledges him? The hypocrisy from one of the biggest sledgers going around (and that's a good effort from someone who can barely string 2 words together)

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

So if Warner gets back into the Australian side, is he going to walk off when someone sledges him? The hypocrisy from one of the biggest sledgers going around (and that's a good effort from someone who can barely string 2 words together)

Hard to say. Given his prior when playing at club level, its quite possible he was not taking the game all that seriously.
And we still don't know for sure what was said, Fairfax reports of it being fairly benign notwithstanding.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

David Warner is a little bitch and a national disgrace. I hope he gets sledged for the rest of his natural life.

 

[Run n Spread]

I consider him a scapegoat because excessive blame is being placed on him to divert it from others. Yes, he was involved and perhaps even instigated it all, but if others were also involved then he is currently taking their share of the blame.

You mention the tape. Was Smith and the bowlers blindly unaware of all this going on despite Smith fielding next to him for years and the bowlers regularly inspecting the ball? I’d have to be pretty naive to believe that.

This is what doesn't fit.

How did Warner instigate it? Bancroft has been playing representative cricket all his life, followed by Club, State and national Cricket. Pretty sure he knows what ball tampering is and doesn't need a lesson on sand paper. (What exactly was that sugar in his pocket for in the 5th test in Sydney btw?).

All teams in world cricket have been fidgeting with the ball for years. Not surprising given the penalties are lax and the rules inconsistent. Only the sand paper wasn't a great look so scapegoats came. (And maybe the bowlers didn't know specifically about sandpaper but would've known the ball was being "worked on" all summer). "IF" the punishment is for the 1 instance hard to see what Warner has being pinged for.

I'd have them back and lobby the ICC to clarify exactly what the rules are on tampering and crack down on all the ridiculous personal abuse that goes on.

 

[Spook]

This is what doesn't fit.

How did Warner instigate it? Bancroft has been playing representative cricket all his life, followed by Club, State and national Cricket. Pretty sure he knows what ball tampering is and doesn't need a lesson on sand paper. (What exactly was that sugar in his pocket for in the 5th test in Sydney btw?).

All teams in world cricket have been fidgeting with the ball for years. Not surprising given the penalties are lax and the rules inconsistent. Only the sand paper wasn't a great look so scapegoats came. (And maybe the bowlers didn't know specifically about sandpaper but would've known the ball was being "worked on" all summer). "IF" the punishment is for the 1 instance hard to see what Warner has being pinged for.

I'd have them back and lobby the ICC to clarify exactly what the rules are on tampering and crack down on all the ridiculous personal abuse that goes on.

They got exactly the same punishment from the ICC as others had for ball tampering. From memory 1 match each and Bancroft 3 points.

Cricket Australia charged them for bringing the game into disrepute which was more around the planning, lying, concealing and what they said in the first post match interview..... they said tape and not sand paper.

 

[Run n Spread]

They got exactly the same punishment as other had from the ICC for ball tampering. From memory. 1 match each.

Cricket Australia charged them for bringing the game into disrepute which was more around the planning, lying, concealing and what they said in the first post match interview.

If that was the official charge and I don't remember there ever being a hearing or a chance to defend themselves then no way. There have been far far worse instances of Bringing the Game into Disrepute(just a silly catch all rule to get rid of those disliked) than this to suddenly be the precedent.

 

[Spook]

If that was the official charge and I don't remember there ever being a hearing or a chance to defend themselves then no way. There have been far far worse instances of Bringing the Game into Disrepute(just a silly catch all rule to get rid of those disliked) than this to suddenly be the precedent.

Why did they not appeal? They had a chance https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-04-02/ball-tampering-hearings-could-be-heard-on-april-11/9609776

And you think they’d make the ‘disliked’ captain and vice captain?

Also btw I agree the bans were a tad harsh, I think it should have been 6 months all cricket then 6 months international cricket/ipl etc so they could have played shield and domestic cricket over this summer so they are ready to go if picked come the end of their 12 months.

And the ICC have now just changed their ball tampering punishments to 6 Test matches or 12 ODIs which what would be close to a 9 month ban depending on fixtures.