DT Rucks 2012

[ize_]

It's so incredibly handy to have Giles as your 2nd ruck, especially after 20 days of most likely having him as your 3rd. However, I wonder whether the really top coaches will not get sucked in? Let's remember Brogan wasn't playing on the weekend, and he will be during the season proper...

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I'm looking for a cheap 4th ruckman. Does anyone have any information on the following ruckmen?

Josh Jenkins (Adel) - $104,200
Ben Dowdell (Adel) - $98,700
Craig James (Adel) - $98,700
Billy Longer (Bris) - $148,200
Tom Derickx (Rich) - $104,200
Jordan Staley (StK) - $85,800
Jay Lever (StK) - $98,700

Lever is injured and probably would be lucky to get a game ( long term prospect ).
Staley is a 194cm rookie. At that height I dont think he'll ever be a serious ruck option, and as a forward he is behind Archer for elevation.

 

[Keystone agony]

Brogan and NN both not played ala the inflation of scores both from Giles and Cox

Expected and pretty basic. Im not going to even care about ruck scores in 2 20 min quarters. Coaches see it as a way to play one ruck which just wont happen in the season if they have the backup ability of Brogan and NN.

 

[Hank93]

Brogan and NN both not played ala the inflation of scores both from Giles and Cox

Expected and pretty basic. Im not going to even care about ruck scores in 2 20 min quarters. Coaches see it as a way to play one ruck which just wont happen in the season if they have the backup ability of Brogan and NN.

Cox played with Nic Nat all year in 2011 and averaged 107. I don't think that partnership will affect his score too much, especially as Cox gets so many of his points around the ground.

I thought Cox might drop his average slightly due to his age, but he certainly didn't look like he's lost anything based on sunday night.

Brogan and Giles might be a separate story though.

 

[PykeDream]

I'm looking for a cheap 4th ruckman. Does anyone have any information on the following ruckmen?

Josh Jenkins (Adel) - $104,200
Ben Dowdell (Adel) - $98,700
Craig James (Adel) - $98,700
Billy Longer (Bris) - $148,200
Tom Derickx (Rich) - $104,200
Jordan Staley (StK) - $85,800
Jay Lever (StK) - $98,700

Cross off James Craig for the time being, he won't be there for the first ten rounds or so, as he is a rookie behind Jenkins/McKernan/L Thompson etc. Ben Dowdell is an 'International' rookie, who was drafted from the NCAA College Basketball league in America. Is very raw, and if you see him running around this season, something has gone seriously wrong with our list.

Jarrad Redden (PTA) is a nice smokie that I've picked as fourth ruck in my team. May finally get his chance with Lobbe and Renouf injured/sore.

 

[Wheedus]

Jarrad Redden (PTA) is a nice smokie that I've picked as fourth ruck in my team. May finally get his chance with Lobbe and Renouf injured/sore.

Yep - he's the one to keep an eye on. Rd.13 bye helps as well.

 

[dylan123]

Cox played with Nic Nat all year in 2011 and averaged 107. I don't think that partnership will affect his score too much, especially as Cox gets so many of his points around the ground.

I thought Cox might drop his average slightly due to his age, but he certainly didn't look like he's lost anything based on sunday night.

Brogan and Giles might be a separate story though.

True although it was said that early on into the 2011 season Naitanui hurt his shoulder again which would have surely affected how many centre bounces he rucked. It may have little/no impact at all but I can't help but think he will see him spend more time in the centre square then previously before which might mean Cox is up forward more then last season which could in turn effect the amount of cheap touches he gets in the link up plays.

 

[northeast tiger]

Really like the rest of my team's structure when my rucks look like:

Cox, Stephenson, (Giles, 4th ruck).

Just can't decide who that 4th ruck should be? Rowe or Derickx or...?

 

[Freo2012]

Really like the rest of my team's structure when my rucks look like:

Cox, Stephenson, (Giles, 4th ruck).

Just can't decide who that 4th ruck should be? Rowe or Derickx or...?

Yep, only problem is Cox and Giles share the first bye, and potentially Brogan's effect, though you'll possible trade for premium by then. I'm thinking Cox and Zac Smith (think he will step up further this year) with Giles and Steph on bench - fairly safe for points and also keeps $ reasonable. Upgrade Smith to Leuen after R11?

Or just safe and lock Leuen/McEvoy for year and save trades (hoping Steph plays R11)?

Damn, also the HMac($)/Goldy question - so many possible options with Rucks this year, but have to consider byes/trade-ups

 

[Keystone agony]

Leuenberger seems like he is becoming more and more unique as time goes on.

*Waiting for him to score 60 points in NAB next week with Hudson not playing, than everyone having him in their teams again*

 

[nameless]

After much thought I think i've just about convinced myself to put Giles on the bench with Stephenson.

I like the look of my team with two premo ruckmen, so with Giles on the bench it's win/win for me.

He does well i have a massive cash cow sitting on the bench just fattening up allowing me to do a big upgrade elsewhere.
He does poorly/injured, not too much of a worry, he's only on my bench and he'll still make me a little coin.

 

[CrozaN]

After much thought I think i've just about convinced myself to put Giles on the bench with Stephenson.

I like the look of my team with two premo ruckmen, so with Giles on the bench it's win/win for me.

He does well i have a massive cash cow sitting on the bench just fattening up allowing me to do a big upgrade elsewhere.
He does poorly/injured, not too much of a worry, he's only on my bench and he'll still make me a little coin.

Yeah thats the way i see it also.

Plus factor in say one of your premo rucks falls down with injury, you have a solid back up who will play every game.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Apart from Giles and Stephenson, McIntosh looks to me like the best "value" ruck there.

If you chose a known scorer ( Probably McEvoy because of the bye's) and those three, you'd gain plenty of value and you'd be unlucky not to have a half decent choice every week, and be able to upgrade later on.

 

[Quigley]

Apart from Giles and Stephenson, McIntosh looks to me like the best "value" ruck there.

If you chose a known scorer ( Probably McEvoy because of the bye's) and those three, you'd gain plenty of value and you'd be unlucky not to have a half decent choice every week, and be able to upgrade later on.

I am always reluctant to even consider second rucks which is what McIntosh is with Goldstein there. Kruezer is closer to the real deal but again it was said earlier in the year that Warnock went in as the number 1 ruck. At the absolute best those guys are going to be splitting time in a major way which is not going to help their scoring.

 

[elhadjihenry]

Kruezer possibly being the 2nd "ruck" doesn't phase me, there has been talk at Carlton of playing him on the ball in a similar way the eagles did with Naitinui with Cox rucking. If not he will play forward or float around the ground still gathering points when he isn't rucking.

With such a massive engine he doesn't spend anywhere near as much time as most ruckman have to on the bench.

Cox/Kruezer/Giles/Stephenson is my ruck combo, only part of my team I don't think will change before the season starts (barring injuries/suspensions of course).

 

[dylan123]

I am always reluctant to even consider second rucks which is what McIntosh is with Goldstein there. Kruezer is closer to the real deal but again it was said earlier in the year that Warnock went in as the number 1 ruck. At the absolute best those guys are going to be splitting time in a major way which is not going to help their scoring.

It will be very interesting to see how North use the two. Goldstein dominates in the hitouts yet McIntosh seems to give him a run for his money and training and they have previously played Goldstein in other positions when McIntosh was in the side. A couple of seasons ago Hille managed to be a pretty decent midpriced ruckman with Ryder also in the side so there's always potential for him to do something similar to Hille. But it's very risky as you've mentioned.

 

[CrozaN]

It will be very interesting to see how North use the two. Goldstein dominates in the hitouts yet McIntosh seems to give him a run for his money and training and they have previously played Goldstein in other positions when McIntosh was in the side. A couple of seasons ago Hille managed to be a pretty decent midpriced ruckman with Ryder also in the side so there's always potential for him to do something similar to Hille. But it's very risky as you've mentioned.

Few observations i found during last weeks NAB cup games.

I think honestly Hmac will take back his role as NO.1 ruck. He was a lot more involved in the ruck contests, gave good second efforts and IMO had better disposal/decision making in the ruck. I agree with what the commentators were saying also about the 2 rucks, where one will need to play forward and IMO the commentators were right when they said "Goldy is more suited for the forward role". If that is the case i don't know, but to me Hmac looked more impressive, moved well and seems like he could do quite well this year.

These observations were just based on the first round of the NAB, i guess we have to wait and see if this continues during the NAB cup, but i honestly think, Hmac is a steal at his price and should average 80+.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Few observations i found during last weeks NAB cup games.

I think honestly Hmac will take back his role as NO.1 ruck. He was a lot more involved in the ruck contests, gave good second efforts and IMO had better disposal/decision making in the ruck. I agree with what the commentators were saying also about the 2 rucks, where one will need to play forward and IMO the commentators were right when they said "Goldy is more suited for the forward role". If that is the case i don't know, but to me Hmac looked more impressive, moved well and seems like he could do quite well this year.

These observations were just based on the first round of the NAB, i guess we have to wait and see if this continues during the NAB cup, but i honestly think, Hmac is a steal at his price and should average 80+.

Depending how it all goes, at some point the decision may be made that they are too tall. So one or all of Hansen, Goldstein or McIntosh could get rested frequently.

 

[Keystone agony]

HMAC only scored 24 and 23 points in his two NAB games right? or are fanfooty wrong?

I agree with the thought Goldstien offers more forward than HMAC but he also offers more in the middle than HMAC. But HMAC is a much better ruckman than forward. Ive also seen him kick a couple of goals up front but he is too easy to rebound on.

Im not sure how north fans see it, but from what i saw last year Goldy has very good/elite foot skills for a ruckman of his size. He also covers the ground beautifully and gets involved in some link up work. He by no means is a Cox but he goes alright. From watching HMAC two years ago his foot skills were pretty avg and his movement around the ground also sat about avg.

I dont think you need to take a RISK with any of the above 2 when you can get a certainty right in the rucks.

 

[CrozaN]

HMAC only scored 24 and 23 points in his two NAB games right? or are fanfooty wrong?

I agree with the thought Goldstien offers more forward than HMAC but he also offers more in the middle than HMAC. But HMAC is a much better ruckman than forward. Ive also seen him kick a couple of goals up front but he is too easy to rebound on.

Im not sure how north fans see it, but from what i saw last year Goldy has very good/elite foot skills for a ruckman of his size. He also covers the ground beautifully and gets involved in some link up work. He by no means is a Cox but he goes alright. From watching HMAC two years ago his foot skills were pretty avg and his movement around the ground also sat about avg.

I dont think you need to take a RISK with any of the above 2 when you can get a certainty right in the rucks.

Keystone, are you going with the 2x prem rucks or a prem/giles combination?

Or you keeping it a secret?

 

[Keystone agony]

Keystone, are you going with the 2x prem rucks or a prem/giles combination?

Or you keeping it a secret?

Nah im happy to say atm im going with 1 premium. It depends on a few things and my side can change very quickly.

 

[CrozaN]

Nah im happy to say atm im going with 1 premium. It depends on a few things and my side can change very quickly.

Yep im the same, however at the moment i have gone with 2x premium rucks. However, saying that my team looks much more structured when i go with a 1 prem/Giles combo. I seem to change my mind/team daily, so i guess things will be more clear as the NAB cup progresses.

I will most likely go with 1 prem/Giles combo though, but again my team changes very quickly also....come lockout, i probably won't know lol.

 

[Blues_FC]

I'd be all for the one premo ruck strategy if there was a decent ruck rookie other than Giles or Stephensen.

At the moment, Rowe and Derickx look the most likely, but I'm not sold on either of them.

 

[portetdaspet]

At the moment I am convinced that Premium + Giles is the way to go. We saw the way Zac Smith could score points last year and Giles looks to be ahead of him in career progression. GWS are going to struggle rebounding off half back cleanly, so they will be looking at the long kick to Giles a good percentage of the time. I see an average of 75-80 as being achievable. It seems a waste to me to have those points on the bench. Unless you think all of your rookies on the ground will score more than Giles, I think you should put him in at R2.

As for the problem we may have with picking an R4, I am not too worried. I think you could put Adam Pattinson there (85k R/F) and forget about him for the rest of the year without losing too much value. I know I had Broc McCauley for a lot of last year and never wished I had 4 playing ruckmen. If Rowe (maybe), Derickx (I think you're dreaming) or anyone else looks like getting games than it becomes a numbers game as to whether they will make you enough cash. Hopefully Giles and Stephenson should be able to cover every game until one can be upgraded.

Just as a side note, if some people are planning say Stephenson to Cox after Round 11 to dodge the byes, this is not the best plan. Doing this trade will necessarily cost you an extra donut somewhere else. To minimize bye round donuts the rucks need to have all rounds covered without trading. This means that you either need 4 playing ruckmen (with no more than 2 from one bye round) or 1 from each round. I think the first option will be hard even with 2 premium starters, as it means you won't be able to downgarde either of the rookies before Round 13. So most teams will need a Round 13 ruckman to maximize their score. Because of this, I think McEvoy should be the most picked ruck this year, but we will see.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

At the moment I am convinced that Premium + Giles is the way to go. We saw the way Zac Smith could score points last year and Giles looks to be ahead of him in career progression. GWS are going to struggle rebounding off half back cleanly, so they will be looking at the long kick to Giles a good percentage of the time. I see an average of 75-80 as being achievable. It seems a waste to me to have those points on the bench. Unless you think all of your rookies on the ground will score more than Giles, I think you should put him in at R2.

As for the problem we may have with picking an R4, I am not too worried. I think you could put Adam Pattinson there (85k R/F) and forget about him for the rest of the year without losing too much value. I know I had Broc McCauley for a lot of last year and never wished I had 4 playing ruckmen. If Rowe (maybe), Derickx (I think you're dreaming) or anyone else looks like getting games than it becomes a numbers game as to whether they will make you enough cash. Hopefully Giles and Stephenson should be able to cover every game until one can be upgraded.

Just as a side note, if some people are planning say Stephenson to Cox after Round 11 to dodge the byes, this is not the best plan. Doing this trade will necessarily cost you an extra donut somewhere else. To minimize bye round donuts the rucks need to have all rounds covered without trading. This means that you either need 4 playing ruckmen (with no more than 2 from one bye round) or 1 from each round. I think the first option will be hard even with 2 premium starters, as it means you won't be able to downgarde either of the rookies before Round 13. So most teams will need a Round 13 ruckman to maximize their score. Because of this, I think McEvoy should be the most picked ruck this year, but we will see.

Its a reasonable system, but why Pattison.
Wouldnt you be better going with a Ruck who has a chance of getting a game than someone like Pattison who most likely wont?