News Essendon list changes (Update: Neagle and Atkinson delisted)

[loopy_cam]

We'll probably take two PSD picks. Gives us a chance to get guys training with us before we pick them.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

get a Full Forward at 31.

Who?

Easy to say, but harder to do.

Same with ruckmen. It's easy to say pick one up at 31, but unless you want a mature aged one, there's nothing after Gorringe and Lycett.

 

[DaSawx]

Five picks in the ND/PSD.

What pick will we use for a ruckman ?

My gut feel says PSD.

CBF reading everything yoday but I'll put my two cents.

Totally fine with the decisions, Atkinson is borderline VFL quality while Neagle needs this kick up the ass.

80 becomes PSD anyway I think, where we may get a mature aged ruckman.

To everyone saying we shouuld have traded Houli, meh, there isn't a lot between 45 and 60, especially in this draft, and teams have a lot of different views in the back end of the draft, you usually get who your after a lot of the time.

And to anyone sooking at having pick 60whatever, take a look at the AA team and look where a lot of them where drafted, ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN.

 

[Big Blow Hard]

What about Mark Williams? Now before everyone shoots me to the insane place, Williams basically played FF in his most sucessful year!

Has supposedly rocked up a bout 6kg lighter and looking pretty fit. Here's hoping he gets unscathed through preseason and shows us why we got him.

 

[Crimsons]

Knowing what we know now, would the club have delisted Slattery & Still ? Should have just waited till final list lodgement (prior to draft)?

 

[Dunn - Well Done]

Alot more better picks in the past 10 years? Maybe one better pick that I missed- Brian Harris.

But outside of that- if you're not willing to look into who was actually drafted after pick 60 in the past 10 years, don't even bother arguing.

Well i thought i would do a little bit of research to back up my argument that good players can be taken around pick 60 (eg: pick 45 this year).

The last 5 years are pretty unproven so i didnt look to much into them.

Enright (pick 47) - premierships, AA's and B&F
Bateman (pick 48) - premiership
ROK (56) - 200+ games, premiership and 2 GF's
B.Johnson (62) - 200+ games, premiership
Bruce (64) - 200+ games, B&Fs
Hargrave (66) - 200+ games, think he just missed out on AA
Houlihan (73) - 200+ games
Shirley (67) - 150+ games

Wakelin (49) - 250+ games
Cassisi (50) - Port Captain, premiership, B&F (i think)
Buchanon (52) - premiership, 150+ games
Newman (55) - 200+ games, captain
Cross (56) - 200+ games, B&F
C.Jones (60) - 150+ games
Johncock (67) - one of the best small defenders in the game, 200+ games, i think also AA (unsure)

Waite (46) - Gun, 200+ if he stops wacking people
Welsh (47) - 150+ games
Medhurst (56) - AA
Swan (58) - B&Fs, Premiership, 200+ games, Jim Stynes medal
Schneider (60) - 150-200+ games, GF's, premiership
Lake (71) - AA one of the best full backs ever, 200+ games

Simpson (45) - good DTer, 200+ games
A.Selwood (53) - potential captain 150/200+ games
Malceski (64)

Jackson (53)
S.Fisher (55) AA, GF's, B&F?
Rischitelli (61) B&F

Knights (56)
Gwilt (63)

Patful (56)
Stokes (61)

Than you have the best of them all T.Zantuck taken above pick 70

Some of the best players are drafted in that range..namely our coach and also a pretty decent player in Dane Swan! There are gems, we need to find them.

And to anyone sooking at having pick 60whatever, take a look at the AA team and look where a lot of them where drafted, ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN.

Plenty of good players can be picked up late, especially with a 3rd round pick at 45 whether that be around 60 with compromised draft.

All im trying to say is i would prefer a pick around 60 than 100 and that we shouldve taken something for Houli whether it meant that we used it or not. Because you never know what could happen in the next few weeks, dont give players away for free. The argument of Cloke is stupid, most on here didnt want him anyway and we were NO CHANCE to get him.

1) GC, WCE, BRIS were all in front of us
2) He was gonna sign with collingwood anyway

 

[Big Blow Hard]

Well i thought i would do a little bit of research to back up my argument that good players can be taken around pick 60 (eg: pick 45 this year).

The last 5 years are pretty unproven so i didnt look to much into them.

Enright (pick 47) - premierships, AA's and B&F
Bateman (pick 48) - premiership
ROK (56) - 200+ games, premiership and 2 GF's
B.Johnson (62) - 200+ games, premiership
Bruce (64) - 200+ games, B&Fs
Hargrave (66) - 200+ games, think he just missed out on AA
Houlihan (73) - 200+ games
Shirley (67) - 150+ games

Wakelin (49) - 250+ games
Cassisi (50) - Port Captain, premiership, B&F (i think)
Buchanon (52) - premiership, 150+ games
Newman (55) - 200+ games, captain
Cross (56) - 200+ games, B&F
C.Jones (60) - 150+ games
Johncock (67) - one of the best small defenders in the game, 200+ games, i think also AA (unsure)

Waite (46) - Gun, 200+ if he stops wacking people
Welsh (47) - 150+ games
Medhurst (56) - AA
Swan (58) - B&Fs, Premiership, 200+ games, Jim Stynes medal
Schneider (60) - 150-200+ games, GF's, premiership
Lake (71) - AA one of the best full backs ever, 200+ games

Simpson (45) - good DTer, 200+ games
A.Selwood (53) - potential captain 150/200+ games
Malceski (64)

Jackson (53)
S.Fisher (55) AA, GF's, B&F?
Rischitelli (61) B&F

Knights (56)
Gwilt (63)

Patful (56)
Stokes (61)





Plenty of good players can be picked up late, especially with a 3rd round pick at 45 whether that be around 60 with compromised draft.

Nice list, but would be remiss to point out all those gaps in between those mentioned are filled with players who did not make it. Sure, hits are possible, but misses are moreso. I wouldn;t like to pretend any of these recruiters had any more than hope ratgher than expectation when drafting these guys. So thats what we can do, hope like hell for a hit. But at least we can be rid of them in 2 years if they don't measure up.

 

[Dunn - Well Done]

Nice list, but would be remiss to point out all those gaps in between those mentioned are filled with players who did not make it. Sure, hits are possible, but misses are moreso. I wouldn;t like to pretend any of these recruiters had any more than hope ratgher than expectation when drafting these guys. So thats what we can do, hope like hell for a hit. But at least we can be rid of them in 2 years if they don't measure up.

Absolutely there are always going to be more misses than hits later on in the draft. But to say you cant get someone decent at 60 is an ignorant statement. Afterall thats where our coach came from.

You can also get rid of players after one year, you dont have to wait the 2. You must still have to pay them out for the next year though.

 

[Mrs Mercuri]

Surprised about the timing of these delistings... but im not overly shocked that these players wer elet go.

Neagle has had more than enough chances to get fit and if a stint on the rookie list is what he needs to kick start a career then so be it. Im more disappointed in Atkinson's attitude... so many players miss out on an AFL chance and he has simply walked away from his...

So will we have 4 live draft picks plus the Howlett upgrade now?? and 1 or 2 in the PSD??

I doubt we will rookie all of Neagle, Still and Tyson Slats, GWS will pounce on a couple I reckon.

 

[Big Blow Hard]

Absolutely there are always going to be more misses than hits later on in the draft. But to say you cant get someone decent at 60 is an ignorant statement. Afterall thats where our coach came from.

You can also get rid of players after one year, you dont have to wait the 2. You must still have to pay them out for the next year though.

I didn't say that. I just said it is more unlikely to get a good one than to land one. WHy would you inly have a new draftee for 1 year? What good is sacking them and paying a load of wages to guys who don't play anymore? Then you need to replace sacked players, meaning you are paying another player as well. It's just poor business there.

 

[Darealrath]

Have to admire the stance Hird is taking here, even though the news was a bit of a surprise.

Unfortunate draft to have so many picks though.

 

[Dunn - Well Done]

I didn't say that. I just said it is more unlikely to get a good one than to land one. WHy would you inly have a new draftee for 1 year? What good is sacking them and paying a load of wages to guys who don't play anymore? Then you need to replace sacked players, meaning you are paying another player as well. It's just poor business there.

I was referring to Walesy not you mate.

I agree about letting drafted players play for there 2 years, i was surprised when T.Lee and K.King were let go after just one year. Although having played against them not that surprised.

 

[Walesy]

Firstly, the vast majority of those players were taken prior to pick 60.

If I was to say- "Pick 30 in this years draft is useless" - sure, throw in Waite and his like.

Yes, of course there are always going to be bargins found- but once you go above 60, they become few and far apart.

Further to that, of the thirteen 60+ players that you actually mentioned, 4 I already mentioned as good.

5 of them were drafted more than 10 years ago (In a time where less was spent on recruiting).

The remaining 4- C. Jones, Johncock, Schneider and Gwilt. Sure, maybe.

But even if you include them, that's 8 decent players over 10 years. With the majority of them occuring at the start of the decade.

Basically you're looking at the same- if not worse hit rate than having a crack in the rookie draft

In other words, you haven't really lost anything at all as it's all a crapshoot at that level.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Who?

Easy to say, but harder to do.

Same with ruckmen. It's easy to say pick one up at 31, but unless you want a mature aged one, there's nothing after Gorringe and Lycett.

That is what the recruiters job is- find the full forwards and ruckmen. However it does not change our most pressing need- A Grade mids.

I don't want Gorringe or Lycett anyway, so I will be happy if we avoid them anyway. I'd draft a VFL ruckman at the PSD pick!

 

[Burzum]

Which one?

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Personally I would take John Anthony as the full forward in the PSD, then look for a VFL ruck as a rookie selection (and there are plenty of VFL rucks)

 

[yaco55]

Well i thought i would do a little bit of research to back up my argument that good players can be taken around pick 60 (eg: pick 45 this year).

The last 5 years are pretty unproven so i didnt look to much into them.

Enright (pick 47) - premierships, AA's and B&F
Bateman (pick 48) - premiership
ROK (56) - 200+ games, premiership and 2 GF's
B.Johnson (62) - 200+ games, premiership
Bruce (64) - 200+ games, B&Fs
Hargrave (66) - 200+ games, think he just missed out on AA
Houlihan (73) - 200+ games
Shirley (67) - 150+ games

Wakelin (49) - 250+ games
Cassisi (50) - Port Captain, premiership, B&F (i think)
Buchanon (52) - premiership, 150+ games
Newman (55) - 200+ games, captain
Cross (56) - 200+ games, B&F
C.Jones (60) - 150+ games
Johncock (67) - one of the best small defenders in the game, 200+ games, i think also AA (unsure)

Waite (46) - Gun, 200+ if he stops wacking people
Welsh (47) - 150+ games
Medhurst (56) - AA
Swan (58) - B&Fs, Premiership, 200+ games, Jim Stynes medal
Schneider (60) - 150-200+ games, GF's, premiership
Lake (71) - AA one of the best full backs ever, 200+ games

Simpson (45) - good DTer, 200+ games
A.Selwood (53) - potential captain 150/200+ games
Malceski (64)

Jackson (53)
S.Fisher (55) AA, GF's, B&F?
Rischitelli (61) B&F

Knights (56)
Gwilt (63)

Patful (56)
Stokes (61)

Than you have the best of them all T.Zantuck taken above pick 70





Plenty of good players can be picked up late, especially with a 3rd round pick at 45 whether that be around 60 with compromised draft.

All im trying to say is i would prefer a pick around 60 than 100 and that we shouldve taken something for Houli whether it meant that we used it or not. Because you never know what could happen in the next few weeks, dont give players away for free. The argument of Cloke is stupid, most on here didnt want him anyway and we were NO CHANCE to get him.

1) GC, WCE, BRIS were all in front of us
2) He was gonna sign with collingwood anyway

DWD

Great list - but unfortunately facts are often disreagarded on this board.

Do you know that Collingwood's GF team only comprised 7 players who were drafted in the top 20.

 

[stay true]

I'd draft a VFL ruckman at the PSD pick!

Personally I would take John Anthony as the full forward in the PSD, then look for a VFL ruck as a rookie selection (and there are plenty of VFL rucks)

Cool.

**** this VFL ruck in the rookie draft idea. If we want a ruckman and Gorringe is available at 8 then we'd be nuts to pass. The more I think about it, the more I have a feeling we'll snap him up if available.

 

[yaco55]

Personally I would take John Anthony as the full forward in the PSD, then look for a VFL ruck as a rookie selection (and there are plenty of VFL rucks)

How about Jonathon Giles ex Power.

Would be happy to use pick 47.

 

[yaco55]

Firstly, the vast majority of those players were taken prior to pick 60.

If I was to say- "Pick 30 in this years draft is useless" - sure, throw in Waite and his like.

Yes, of course there are always going to be bargins found- but once you go above 60, they become few and far apart.

Further to that, of the thirteen 60+ players that you actually mentioned, 4 I already mentioned as good.

5 of them were drafted more than 10 years ago (In a time where less was spent on recruiting).

The remaining 4- C. Jones, Johncock, Schneider and Gwilt. Sure, maybe.

But even if you include them, that's 8 decent players over 10 years. With the majority of them occuring at the start of the decade.

Basically you're looking at the same- if not worse hit rate than having a crack in the rookie draft

In other words, you haven't really lost anything at all as it's all a crapshoot at that level.

Should EFC participate in the PSD or Rookie Draft ?

All these picks are way after 60 - or speculative.

Should we run a reduced list ?

 

[Duckworth]

Should EFC participate in the PSD or Rookie Draft ?

All these picks are way after 60 - or speculative.

Should we run a reduced list ?

I wouldn't run a reduced list. We can take a chance and develop a project player. If it doesn't work out (even after a year) we can delist them.

Picks in that range are hit and miss, but you may as well keep trying.

 

[yaco55]

I wouldn't run a reduced list. We can take a chance and develop a project player. If it doesn't work out (even after a year) we can delist them.

Picks in that range are hit and miss, but you may as well keep trying.

I was being a bit sarcastic.

We have the picks - albeit at the bottom end of the draft - So lets see if we can find a nugget. Realistically the players at 64/81 dont have to be much good to be an upgrade on Neagle or Atkinson. And probably better to have more draft picks in 2010 than 2011.

 

[Duckworth]

I was being a bit sarcastic.

We have the picks - albeit at the bottom end of the draft - So lets see if we can find a nugget. Realistically the players at 64/81 dont have to be much good to be an upgrade on Neagle or Atkinson. And probably better to have more draft picks in 2010 than 2011.

If Neagle finds his way to the Rookie list it's not like we've 'lost' him either. I would give him an extra kicking for being lazy by drafting a full forward with the extra pick we get from de-listing him... (or is that kicking him while he's down?)

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Cool.

**** this VFL ruck in the rookie draft idea. If we want a ruckman and Gorringe is available at 8 then we'd be nuts to pass. The more I think about it, the more I have a feeling we'll snap him up if available.

Atley, etc provide us with a more immediate need. If you want us to go to struggle town next year sure pick Gorringe. We have no midfielders and we pick another tall bloke.

You can ALWAYS trade for a ruckman when you are in a window, we are not. Stock up on midfielders.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

How about Jonathon Giles ex Power.

Would be happy to use pick 47.

Yep, I would be happy to use 47 on Giles.