Coaching Staff Former Coach Ben "Truck" Rutten - Sacked for real this time - 21/8

[Red Black and Blue]

Rutten is in cloud cuckoo land
Asking too much of the players
Give me a ******* spell

They actually had a crack tonight that’s all you can ask….. but anyone just had to be there live tonight to know why we are where we are. There is ZERO game plan that stands up at all. Our plan for scoring is hoping shiel/ merrett win the ball out of the middle and go forward. ZERO system behind the ball and inability to defend the ground.

Of course the players are being asked too much. We've got zero hard ball winners in the middle of the ground. We are routinely asking them to compete out sized and out skilled. We have zero small forwards with pace, meaning mids have to press and push back. We have one really good runner in the midfield in Durham who is being asked to mark three players at once.

We are asking Durham, Perkins, D'Ambrossio, Reid, Bryan, Hobbs, Martin to immediately hit the ground running and be AFL standard without confident leaders guiding them.

Dodoro has built a list so unbalanced that everyone has to everything all the time, rather than be like other sides and just have defined roles in a team.

 

[Kong]

I encourage you to watch that game again and watch how much harder Richmond run in comparison to us and how much pretty well every other club runs harder than us. How much better their follow up, spread and their second efforts were, they have some genuine hacks out there but **** me can they run, and that more than makes up for it.

That’s what he meant by asking too much of players. They are the most unfit side in the league by the length of the Flemington straight, they are never in a fair fight.

With the exception of a passing moment under Hird, it’s been that way for about 15 years. Inexplicably.

 

[Bjchan13]

I hope he gets his final year. If the players love him so much and want the stability they will not be having another soft, lazy pre season. They will show up round 1 the fittest they've ever been breathing fire and playing for their coach.

 

[Schnitzengruben]

I hope he gets his final year. If the players love him so much and want the stability they will not be having another soft, lazy pre season. They will show up round 1 the fittest they've ever been breathing fire and playing for their coach.

The players love Truck the same way students love substitute teachers, often when the PE Teacher fills in for English Studies.

Great bloke to talk to, loves a laugh, never goes hard on you and will let you get away with blue murder because you both like footy.

We need that one prick who pushes you to be the best you can be, makes you prepare multiple drafts before submission, makes (or strongly encourages) students to come in out of hours or on holidays to better themselves etc. We need my ******* Year 12 Accounting Teacher, but I'm afraid he's busy atm.

Point is - Truck isn't that guy. For as much as "da bois love him", they sure don't play like it bar a couple. I'm not necessarily a huge fan of the idea, but this is where Ross Lyon could actually be great for a team who desperately needs real leadership.

 

[Bjchan13]

The players love Truck the same way students love substitute teachers, often when the PE Teacher fills in for English Studies.

Great bloke to talk to, loves a laugh, never goes hard on you and will let you get away with blue murder because you both like footy. Neither really care as long as you both head home at 3pm.

We need that one prick who pushes you to be the best you can be, makes you prepare multiple drafts before submission, makes (or strongly encourages) students to come in out of hours or on holidays to better themselves etc. We need my ******* Year 12 Accounting Teacher, but I'm afraid he's busy atm.

Point is - Truck isn't that guy. For as much as "da bois love him", they sure don't play like it bar a couple. I'm not necessarily a huge fan of the idea, but this is where Ross Lyon could actually be great for a team who desperately needs real leadership.

I agree with you on what the group needs, however the reason i wanted him to get his last year was that it would have exposed the players completely. If they'd dished up the same in the first half next year it essentially would've been the players throwing Truck under the bus through poor performance. After this week of board/management incompetence, the players have now rallied behind Truck and are using off field instability as an excuse. I dont want them to have any excuses anymore.

 

[Jack Richards]

I feel for Rutten and have been one of the few that feel he has been the scapegoat for 22 years if mediocrity. No other coach has won us a final in those years..

 

[BrunoV]

The emotion has gotten the better of many of you.

We have not improved our defence or any aspect of our game in the 4 years he has been here.

Not every coach appointed is up to it.

I am sure that every coach appointed when giving an emotional job application sounds like the person you want at the club.

Always remember. Multiple things wrong at the same time and one of them is very clearly the coach.

 

[Duckworth]

The emotion has gotten the better of many of you.

We have not improved our defence or any aspect of our game in the 4 years he has been here.

Not every coach appointed is up to it.

I am sure that every coach appointed when giving an emotional job application sounds like the person you want at the club.

Always remember. Multiple things wrong at the same time and one of them is very clearly the coach.

With multiple things wrong, and the list going through a rebuild, how can you be certain it's the coach?

The rebuild was always going to take time. I'm sick of the sacking the coach mid-way through a rebuild only to achieve the lofty heights of an elimination final thumping mentality. If the club wasn't run by impatient fans, maybe we might actually see something through and get some real success.

Hurley who would know better than most has called for 'stability' above all else.

 

[VelvetSledge]

As a word of warning to opposition posters.

We are well, WELL aware of the horrible way Truck has been treated by those in charge at our club. The way he’s been hung out to dry is unfathomable, and I’d argue 99% of our supporters here are utterly miserable with how things are for our club right now.

Coming on here and gloating, telling us how *ed our club is, and trying to throw barbs will have you kicked out of here quick smart. We are supporters and fans, and we have no say at all with how our club is run. If we did, we wouldn’t be in this mess.

Consider this the first and last warning.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

The players love Truck the same way students love substitute teachers, often when the PE Teacher fills in for English Studies.

Great bloke to talk to, loves a laugh, never goes hard on you and will let you get away with blue murder because you both like footy.

We need that one prick who pushes you to be the best you can be, makes you prepare multiple drafts before submission, makes (or strongly encourages) students to come in out of hours or on holidays to better themselves etc. We need my ******* Year 12 Accounting Teacher, but I'm afraid he's busy atm.

Point is - Truck isn't that guy. For as much as "da bois love him", they sure don't play like it bar a couple. I'm not necessarily a huge fan of the idea, but this is where Ross Lyon could actually be great for a team who desperately needs real leadership.

The “we need a hard as nails, prick coach!” thing is almost always misguided.

Supporters angry and want somebody who’ll take out that anger on the players.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

The emotion has gotten the better of many of you.

We have not improved our defence or any aspect of our game in the 4 years he has been here.

Not every coach appointed is up to it.

I am sure that every coach appointed when giving an emotional job application sounds like the person you want at the club.

Always remember. Multiple things wrong at the same time and one of them is very clearly the coach.

How do you know it is the coach that’s the problem?

 

[Schnitzengruben]

The “we need a hard as nails, prick coach!” thing is almost always misguided.

Supporters angry and want somebody who’ll take out that anger on the players.

Yeah, no.

It's clear we have longstanding issues with leadership, egos, standards and accountability. A stern coach would be a step in the right direction to fix that. Prick is a bit of hyperbole but in black and white; we need to be closer to that end of the spectrum than the great bloke end.

 

[Jordanio]

The emotion has gotten the better of many of you.

We have not improved our defence or any aspect of our game in the 4 years he has been here.

Not every coach appointed is up to it.

I am sure that every coach appointed when giving an emotional job application sounds like the person you want at the club.

Always remember. Multiple things wrong at the same time and one of them is very clearly the coach.

Totally agree! Truck's coaching needs to be examined more closely.
Using last nights defeat as an example. what levers could have been pulled but weren't.
We were getting beaten defensively early and Lynch was giving it to us. We had two backs that were playing fwd, Hearly and Read. I'm not saying they would have been the answer but it would have shown he was trying something. Rids was really struggling early and we were four goals down before we knew it.
There seems a lack of flexibility or/and a lack of desire to be flexible. Surely this is one key element to coaching.
Some of our less experienced player have struggled recently, combined with Heps decline and McGrath having a poor run of form

 

[Snake Charmer]

The players love Truck the same way students love substitute teachers, often when the PE Teacher fills in for English Studies.

Great bloke to talk to, loves a laugh, never goes hard on you and will let you get away with blue murder because you both like footy.

We need that one prick who pushes you to be the best you can be, makes you prepare multiple drafts before submission, makes (or strongly encourages) students to come in out of hours or on holidays to better themselves etc. We need my ******* Year 12 Accounting Teacher, but I'm afraid he's busy atm.

Point is - Truck isn't that guy. For as much as "da bois love him", they sure don't play like it bar a couple. I'm not necessarily a huge fan of the idea, but this is where Ross Lyon could actually be great for a team who desperately needs real leadership.

Been In the rooms abit with the boys?

 

[Lore]

Even Knights got 3 full seasons.

 

[Jordanio]

Even Knights got 3 full seasons.

Three years wasted

 

[Lore]

Three years wasted

Next year will be a waste anyway, we’ve already guaranteed that

 

[Nuts4Bolts]

Ross Lyon for 3 to 4 years to beat the crap culture out of the playing group and then do a full interview process for a new coach to finish the job. Gotta go backwards to go forwards. Sorry Truck but you were never a chance with this group (both with the players and off field clowns).

 

[Jordanio]

Next year will be a waste anyway, we’ve already guaranteed that

Next year will only be wasted if we dont take clear steps to correct what has taken place before.
If it comes out "this is what we're doing and this is how we are going to achieve it" people will get on board.
We need to clearly see improvement and to see the plan working. If element show signs of failing, what we're doing to address it.
If anything this is one of Trucks failing with the supporter base. It gives the impression of floundering

 

[JayJ20]

Out of the 4 coaches we've signed post-Sheedy, only 1 has been an Essendon person.

So I think it's out of touch because Sheedy himself is in a different category (as outlined earlier), it doesn't fit the overall narrative - and is a result of a pretty low sample size in the grand scheme of things club history-wise due to Sheeds taking up the 26 years prior.

If we had the Essendon-person lust that is described, then we never would have signed Knights, never would have signed Worsfold and never would have signed Rutten. It's as simple as that. And even in the Hird era we were sober enough to know when it was right to part ways - and didn't just replace him with another Essendon person in the wake of it.

And our most recent pursuit, was less from where he was from, and more from what he could bring in terms of stability and trust (even though in hindsight we could clearly see he was a flog of the highest order for the empty and unjustified lead-on that he could have ended at any point after declining GWS).

In regards to Hird, I think it's less about Hird being an Essendon person that makes Sheedy (reportedly) an advocate - but more-so because Sheedy knows that Hird knows everything that he knows. He taught him. He mentored him. It's more about Hird being the student of what was a linearly improving, straight shooting, premiership winning turn-around king in Sheedy than anything else. And I can understand that. Doesn't exactly mean Hird is a great coach, but I can understand where he'd be coming from.

But like I said, it's either you pull a Sheedy, which quickly helps absolve you of any Essendon link (hard to do, because he wasn't just any person) - or you show consistent signs of improvement, even in a loss, to indicate a reason for continued patience that is based more on logic and reasoning and less on faith. Hard to do, but easier than emulating Sheedy if you're worth your caper, and hence, if you take the Essendon job, you better be up for it.

I think you’re missing the point. They do recruit coaches outside of Essendon people, but make it very very difficult for them to operate. Woosha, Rutten and Knights all indicated this. This seems to be an Essendon exclusive issue. Other clubs embrace their coach as if they played for the club. The support Knights received in comparison to Hird (even until this very day) is night and day. The support Rutten is receiving in comparison to Hird is also night and day.

Do you think the club would have treated Hird, Lloyd, Bomber, Watson (if he ever coaches) and any other past Essendon player the way they treated Rutten this week? There’s no doubt that Clarkson doesn’t even get a call if Hird was coach.

What you mention about Sheedy advocating for Hird is exactly the problem. Goodwin (who coaches the reigning premiers) and Rutten were teammates. Why dismiss the credentials of non-Essendon people and favour Essendon people? Hird had his time and it was an utter disaster. Give someone else a fair go.

 

[JayJ20]

Of course the players are being asked too much. We've got zero hard ball winners in the middle of the ground. We are routinely asking them to compete out sized and out skilled. We have zero small forwards with pace, meaning mids have to press and push back. We have one really good runner in the midfield in Durham who is being asked to mark three players at once.

We are asking Durham, Perkins, D'Ambrossio, Reid, Bryan, Hobbs, Martin to immediately hit the ground running and be AFL standard without confident leaders guiding them.

Dodoro has built a list so unbalanced that everyone has to everything all the time, rather than be like other sides and just have defined roles in a team.

Excellent. I would like this 10 times if I could.

Yesterday they asked Laverde to play on Lynch because there is no one else with the strength to play on him. That’s asking way too much of Laverde.

 

[BrunoV]

With multiple things wrong, and the list going through a rebuild, how can you be certain it's the coach?

The rebuild was always going to take time. I'm sick of the sacking the coach mid-way through a rebuild only to achieve the lofty heights of an elimination final thumping mentality. If the club wasn't run by impatient fans, maybe we might actually see something through and get some real success.

Hurley who would know better than most has called for 'stability' above all else.

That's stability for its sake. We will need stability at some point, obviously. I'd aim for October 2022 to October 2032.

But it's probably up to you to specify why it is we should persist with a guy who cannot be credited with any defensive improvement in his 4 years. 4 years that the players haven't taken his message seriously, which is why we're here.

Now we've blow up the authority and credibility he had by chasing another coach openly. The risk is that the culprits contine to tank defensively because the coach is only really a few bad results from being gone. Interim coach comes in, we play to enjoy the results improve and we convince ourselves that is who we really are (not appreciating that it is who we are and why we're s**t). We've done this every year now from 2017.

Does anyone seriously think this is a recipe for success?

We're adopting another wasted year next year with instability for what? What is the compelling reason? I've said it a number of times, compare what we are doing with Adelaide under Nicks.

We started in the middle of trying to solve the problem, again, last year. That's Rutten's fault.

Yes we don't have the ball winners I'd like but how does that excuse a lack of application and intensity at the contest? He set up the team to play in space, what I call circle work, and now he needs to reign it back in? When has anything like that worked?

I need someone to articulate a compelling reason Rutten is the right man. No one at Essendon does or can. Other than citing his time at Richmond no one can here either. Stability is not a compelling reason.

All it took was 3 years of Knights attack focus and poor leadership, among the players, for a rot that contaminated 3 to 4 generations of players. Why would we do that again?

 

[JayJ20]

Of course the players are being asked too much. We've got zero hard ball winners in the middle of the ground. We are routinely asking them to compete out sized and out skilled. We have zero small forwards with pace, meaning mids have to press and push back. We have one really good runner in the midfield in Durham who is being asked to mark three players at once.

We are asking Durham, Perkins, D'Ambrossio, Reid, Bryan, Hobbs, Martin to immediately hit the ground running and be AFL standard without confident leaders guiding them.

Dodoro has built a list so unbalanced that everyone has to everything all the time, rather than be like other sides and just have defined roles in a team.

To add to that, Heppell is the perfect example of a player that was asked to do too much. His body is practically finished at his age because Watson was never replaced. He should never have been the main inside mid. This is why I say it’s a list management issue.

 

[Jordanio]

That's stability for its sake. We will need stability at some point, obviously. I'd aim for October 2022 to October 2032.

But it's probably up to you to specify why it is we should persist with a guy who cannot be credited with any defensive improvement in his 4 years. 4 years that the players haven't taken his message seriously, which is why we're here.

Now we've blow up the authority and credibility he had by chasing another coach openly. The risk is that the culprits contine to tank defensively because the coach is only really a few bad results from being gone. Interim coach comes in, we play to enjoy the results improve and we convince ourselves that is who we really are (not appreciating that it is who we are and why we're s**t). We've done this every year now from 2017.

Does anyone seriously think this is a recipe for success?

We're adopting another wasted year next year with instability for what? What is the compelling reason? I've said it a number of times, compare what we are doing with Adelaide under Nicks.

We started in the middle of trying to solve the problem against last year. That's Rutten's fault.

Yes we don't have the ball winners I'd like but how does that excuse a lack of application and intensity at the contest? He set up the team to play in space, what I call circle work, and now he needs to reign it back in? When has anything like that worked?

I need someone to articulate a compelling reason Rutten is the right man. No one at Essendon does or can. Other than citing his time at Richmond no one can here either. Stability is not a compelling reason.

All it took was 3 years of Knights attack focus and poor leadership, among the players, for a rot that contaminated 3 to 4 generations of players. Why would we do that again?

Totally agree. On the ball.
Its accountability

 

[Jordanio]

I read in some posts saying Truck is being used as a scape goat.
Scape goat or accountable?