Society/Culture How the Left created the Alt-Right

[Lethality]

This is interesting enough, but perhaps it's also obvious, as even I have spoken many times about this probably happening, and the importance of open conversation, although perhaps not as eloquently It all reminds me of the Star Trek: The Next Generation finale where Q informed Picard that he created the very spatial anomaly he was trying to stop.

The title of the thread relates to an observation made by Steven Pinker, a Harvard psychology professor.

Pinker argued political correctness prevents people from talking about certain inconvenient truths, hence when someone from the alt-right discovers these things, they are not also presented with the protective opposing arguments, or a corrective understanding of those truths and how they should be applied.

'. When they are exposed the first time to true statements that have never been voiced in college campuses or in The New York Times or in respectable media, that are almost like a bacillus to which they have no immunity, and they're immediately infected with both the feeling of outrage that these truths are unsayable, and no defense against taking them to what we might consider to be rather repellent conclusions.'

Full comments here.

 

[Dixie Normous]

Your signature in conjunction with your reference to Star Trek concerns me.

That being said, I have a bumper sticker on my car that says 'Alt Right Now'

 

[ShanDog]

I've only heard a little of what Pinker has said before, but he's struck me as someone worth listening to. On this topic I think he's hit the nail on the head, as have a few other academics and thinkers who have discussed similar issues.

 

[fleabitten]

Your signature in conjunction with your reference to Star Trek concerns me.

That being said, I have a bumper sticker on my car that says 'Alt Right Now'

Are you related to Hugh Mungus?

 

[Snake_Baker]

This is interesting enough, but perhaps it's also obvious, as even I have spoken many times about this probably happening, and the importance of open conversation, although perhaps not as eloquently It all reminds me of the Star Trek: The Next Generation finale where Q informed Picard that he created the very spatial anomaly he was trying to stop.

The title of the thread relates to an observation made by Steven Pinker, a Harvard psychology professor.

Pinker argued political correctness prevents people from talking about certain inconvenient truths, hence when someone from the alt-right discovers these things, they are not also presented with the protective opposing arguments, or a corrective understanding of those truths and how they should be applied.

'. When they are exposed the first time to true statements that have never been voiced in college campuses or in The New York Times or in respectable media, that are almost like a bacillus to which they have no immunity, and they're immediately infected with both the feeling of outrage that these truths are unsayable, and no defense against taking them to what we might consider to be rather repellent conclusions.'

Full comments here.

The oppressive bullying format that supports PC is it's strength and will ultimately be its Achilles heel.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

I first became aware of the alt-right ('internet righties' as I understand it) when all that 'Gamer Gate' and 'mens rights' activism broke into the news cycle. 2013/14, I think.

 

[yebiga]

The oppressive bullying format that supports PC is it's strength and will ultimately be its Achilles heel.

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics has been attacked from all quarters over the last 18 months. It’s demise in to the dust bin of history is now inevitable.

There are two fundamental flaws to PC and Identity Politics.

First, it is horribly divisive. This is now more commonly understood.

Secondly , it is fundamentally a philosophy for losers, sooks and babies. How Screaming that life is unfair became a legitimate political movement is something historians and sociologist will have to decipher.

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the * up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

 

[ShanDog]

Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline

Hope so. Don't think so, though.

 

[RupieDupie]

This is interesting enough, but perhaps it's also obvious, as even I have spoken many times about this probably happening, and the importance of open conversation, although perhaps not as eloquently It all reminds me of the Star Trek: The Next Generation finale where Q informed Picard that he created the very spatial anomaly he was trying to stop.

The title of the thread relates to an observation made by Steven Pinker, a Harvard psychology professor.

Pinker argued political correctness prevents people from talking about certain inconvenient truths, hence when someone from the alt-right discovers these things, they are not also presented with the protective opposing arguments, or a corrective understanding of those truths and how they should be applied.

'. When they are exposed the first time to true statements that have never been voiced in college campuses or in The New York Times or in respectable media, that are almost like a bacillus to which they have no immunity, and they're immediately infected with both the feeling of outrage that these truths are unsayable, and no defense against taking them to what we might consider to be rather repellent conclusions.'

Full comments here.

Here's an inconvenient truth for your inconvenient truth, where your inconvenient truth is for another inconvenient truth, where underneath there is the reality - the Gnostic reality, not the human engineered reality.

This is all just Group Dynamics, happens with everything (where Group Dynamics are involved), including groups dedicated towards supernatural phenomena that does not actually exist, and including in groups against PC...

 

[ChampRevesby]

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics

When you have a Marxist like Brendan O'Neill (from that video above) critiquing PC culture then you know its out of control.

 

[Matt Stevic]

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics has been attacked from all quarters over the last 18 months. It’s demise in to the dust bin of history is now inevitable.

There are two fundamental flaws to PC and Identity Politics.

First, it is horribly divisive. This is now more commonly understood.

Secondly , it is fundamentally a philosophy for losers, sooks and babies. How Screaming that life is unfair became a legitimate political movement is something historians and sociologist will have to decipher.

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the **** up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

Couldn’t agree more.

 

[ChampRevesby]

I've only heard a little of what Pinker has said before, but he's struck me as someone worth listening to. On this topic I think he's hit the nail on the head, as have a few other academics and thinkers who have discussed similar issues.

He is a brilliant writer and thinker, his books are well worth reading.

He was just on Rogan, goes for a while but worth the listen.

 

[Pulsedriver]

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the **** up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

I used to think it was awful that life was so unfair. Then I thought, wouldn't it be much worse if life were fair, and all the terrible things that happen to us come because we actually deserve them? So now I take great comfort in the general hostility and unfairness of the universe.

 

[ShanDog]

I used to think it was awful that life was so unfair. Then I thought, wouldn't it be much worse if life were fair, and all the terrible things that happen to us come because we actually deserve them? So now I take great comfort in the general hostility and unfairness of the universe.

Conversely, it's always better if the root of major issues you have in life is your own decisions or attitudes. You can change those - you can't go changing the world if it's actually everyone just being against you. No hope there.

 

[Showbags]

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics has been attacked from all quarters over the last 18 months. It’s demise in to the dust bin of history is now inevitable.

There are two fundamental flaws to PC and Identity Politics.

First, it is horribly divisive. This is now more commonly understood.

Secondly , it is fundamentally a philosophy for losers, sooks and babies. How Screaming that life is unfair became a legitimate political movement is something historians and sociologist will have to decipher.

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the **** up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

Agree to an extent regarding PC police going too far BUT the alt right's solution to the fact that life is unfair is to do absolutely nothing and reject ANY practical solutions to make things fairer.

The SSM survey was a case in point. The rebuttal to the Yes side pointing out the unfairness of excluding gays from marriage was essentially "life is unfair so just suck it up".

But there was a practical solution available to the unfairness. Changing the Marriage Act.

A balance has to be struck between accepting that life has an inbuilt unfairness and actually attempting to make things fairer.

 

[yebiga]

Agree to an extent regarding PC police going too far BUT the alt right's solution to the fact that life is unfair is to do absolutely nothing and reject ANY practical solutions to make things fairer.

The SSM survey was a case in point. The rebuttal to the Yes side pointing out the unfairness of excluding gays from marriage was essentially "life is unfair so just suck it up".

But there was a practical solution available to the unfairness. Changing the Marriage Act.

A balance has to be struck between accepting that life has an inbuilt unfairness and actually attempting to make things fairer.

The obsession with fairness is not logical, reasonable or practical. Life is not a game where everyone starts on an equal footing. Nor can I think of a single game where the objective is for everyone to become equal.

Justice and fairness are linked but not anywhere near the same thing. The distinction - I draw - is that Justice concerns equality of opportunity under a legal frame work. No Justice system can or should try to compensate for individual or group disadvantages.

Justice cannot be concerned with equal outcomes. Justice is something we can all agree on. SS couples should have justice under the law. More than that - no one has the right to demand.

Everyone is faced with advantages and disadvantages. Who can weigh one over the other?

I’m sure that the alt right phenomena is at least in part inspired by a rejection of this fairness at the most visceral level of the human condition. Namely, the subjective injustices we all face.

 

[kickazz]

Yes life is unfair. The kids today need to learn that you win some, you lose some.

And in western democracies (where PC thrives), compared to most of the world, by gosh we win so much more than we lose.

 

[kickazz]

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics has been attacked from all quarters over the last 18 months. It’s demise in to the dust bin of history is now inevitable.

There are two fundamental flaws to PC and Identity Politics.

First, it is horribly divisive. This is now more commonly understood.

Secondly , it is fundamentally a philosophy for losers, sooks and babies. How Screaming that life is unfair became a legitimate political movement is something historians and sociologist will have to decipher.

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the **** up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

Many good points in this post. May I highlight the bit about screaming that life is unfair becoming a political movement in itself:

There is a place for making things fairer, but the discussion used to be more outcome focused. For example, encourage more women in engineering because the profession is missing out on potentially excellent people because they feel too excluded to give it a go.
Likewise public education. Society should be better off by having higher education and professional employment go to people based on merit and ability, not cost. There is a chance those brilliant people can excel even if they are poor.
A basic level of respect (which includes respect for different viewpoints) and understanding makes people happier and more productive.
But like you say, the PC message seems to be less about outcomes and more about "what about me, it isn't fair"

 

[yebiga]

https://www.city-journal.org/html/identity-u-15701.html

Just when you thought it couldn't get any more insane - one university goes "all in".

The Humanities and Social Sciences should be producing graduates who defend our rights, liberties and constitutions. They should be equipped to formulate the arguments to defend us against the excess of the powerful and clarity to progress policy towards a brighter future.

Instead, we produce cry babies and sooks who promote anecdotes of helplessness. They cannot formulate coherent arguments because they have by necessity studied only that which doesn't work, that which fails, that which doesn't fit in. They have indoctrinated themselves to believe the entire system has only failed people.

Is it conceivable they could defend a system they believe is responsible for all the suffering they have studied?
Is it conceivable they could recommend workable progress when they have never studied how anything actually works?

Unfortunately, these graduates are not only useless they are harmful. For where ever they go they spread an ideology of helplessness. They propagate indolence, self pity, purposelessness, enmity, irresponsibility, unaccountability, physical weakness, apathy, disrespect towards everything, depression, excuses and mindless self indulgence.

We would be far better off swapping 10,000 immigrants, from war torn or impoverished parts of the world, for each 1 of these graduates and their professors to leave our shores and never return - For the damage they do is immeasurable.

 

[ShanDog]

https://www.city-journal.org/html/identity-u-15701.html

Just when you thought it couldn't get any more insane - one university goes "all in".

The Humanities and Social Sciences should be producing graduates who defend our rights, liberties and constitutions. They should be equipped to formulate the arguments to defend us against the excess of the powerful and clarity to progress policy towards a brighter future.

Instead, we produce cry babies and sooks who promote anecdotes of helplessness. They cannot formulate coherent arguments because they have by necessity studied only that which doesn't work, that which fails, that which doesn't fit in. They have indoctrinated themselves to believe the entire system has only failed people.

Is it conceivable they could defend a system they believe is responsible for all the suffering they have studied?
Is it conceivable they could recommend workable progress when they have never studied how anything actually works?

Unfortunately, these graduates are not only useless they are harmful. For where ever they go they spread an ideology of helplessness. They propagate indolence, self pity, purposelessness, enmity, irresponsibility, unaccountability, physical weakness, apathy, disrespect towards everything, depression, excuses and mindless self indulgence.

We would be far better off swapping 10,000 immigrants, from war torn or impoverished parts of the world, for each 1 of these graduates and their professors to leave our shores and never return - For the damage they do is immeasurable.

Got more and more hyperbolic as the post went on, but agree with the sentiment.

 

[kickazz]

Got more and more hyperbolic as the post went on, but agree with the sentiment.

Yes the sentiment is sound, but they might want to trade the hyperbole with data or at least some concreteconcrete , it ended up just being a rant.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Blaming "the left" for Donald Trump was moronic in 2016 and is still moronic in 2018.

 

[Jello_B]

https://www.city-journal.org/html/identity-u-15701.html

Just when you thought it couldn't get any more insane - one university goes "all in".

The Humanities and Social Sciences should be producing graduates who defend our rights, liberties and constitutions. They should be equipped to formulate the arguments to defend us against the excess of the powerful and clarity to progress policy towards a brighter future.

Instead, we produce cry babies and sooks who promote anecdotes of helplessness. They cannot formulate coherent arguments because they have by necessity studied only that which doesn't work, that which fails, that which doesn't fit in. They have indoctrinated themselves to believe the entire system has only failed people.

Is it conceivable they could defend a system they believe is responsible for all the suffering they have studied?
Is it conceivable they could recommend workable progress when they have never studied how anything actually works?

Unfortunately, these graduates are not only useless they are harmful. For where ever they go they spread an ideology of helplessness. They propagate indolence, self pity, purposelessness, enmity, irresponsibility, unaccountability, physical weakness, apathy, disrespect towards everything, depression, excuses and mindless self indulgence.

We would be far better off swapping 10,000 immigrants, from war torn or impoverished parts of the world, for each 1 of these graduates and their professors to leave our shores and never return - For the damage they do is immeasurable.

Mate I have to employ these people

 

[kickazz]

Blaming "the left" for Donald Trump was moronic in 2016 and is still moronic in 2018.

Why moronic?

Trump hardly had great support. For all the talk about Trump winning over the Rust Belt, he ended up with fewer votes there than Mitt Romney got four years earlier.

It was the Democrats, Hilary, the left's inability to connect with their base that handed the spoils to Trump.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I believe the worm has turned - PC and Identity Politics has been attacked from all quarters over the last 18 months. It’s demise in to the dust bin of history is now inevitable.

There are two fundamental flaws to PC and Identity Politics.

First, it is horribly divisive. This is now more commonly understood.

Secondly , it is fundamentally a philosophy for losers, sooks and babies. How Screaming that life is unfair became a legitimate political movement is something historians and sociologist will have to decipher.

Life is unfair for everyone. Some of us have big noses, small dicks, bad parents, low iqs - some of us are black, some of us are gay. That’s just life - we give you a little PC cuddle but then we need to toughen the **** up.

No one has a mortgage on what is fair and unfair. This nonsense has made our whole culture idiotic. Fortunately, this BS is now in terminal decline.

Nah.

The issue with that attitude is people just use it as an excuse to act like pricks as our parents and grandparents did (even if unconsciously).

There a middle ground to be walked. There is some ingrained, natural “unfairness” in being part of the human race (there’s the small dick), but there’s also inequalities that are simply man-made, and fairly recent phenomena... as in a few hundred years ago when we started crossing continents and anybody who wasn’t white got destroyed.

Attempts at genuine progress to continue remedying that are more than decent. To label current man-made inequalities as “just life” and “harden the * up” are just an excuse to continue unequal privilege and keep other people subjugated.