Expansion How to fix the Suns

[dave123]

They will be replaced with younger and better players.

And to say they are great players is a bit of a reach.

Ablett was great but is a money hungry has been now.

Omera....good
Matera has been ok
Saad ...excellent pace and good
Dixon has been handy

Better younger players ....sorry they take 70 games to mature

What will happen is they’ll be poached by Victorian clubs as soon as they show any ability

It’s basically a training ground for other clubs

 

[iameviljez]

All clubs have gone through times like this at some stage.

No they haven't. Carlton has, Adelaide has, Brisbane has - but I can't really think of others who've had that kind of player loss rate.

 

[dave123]

All clubs have gone through times like this at some stage.

You have gone on like this whole time

 

[JackFlash]

Yup


Agree .....the fixturing was stupid ....why didn’t they just play Gold Coast games at the Gabba when their ground was not ready ....they could promote their club to Brisbane people

It’s an hour away .....Melbourne people travel to Geelong and Geelong people travel to mcg to watch

I agree Queensland can’t really sustain two teams

Get the whole state behind them....

 

[iameviljez]

I could go on, but that is an ordinary side with no stars, and just a slice of potential thrown in there. GC have real problems.

All the goalkicking ability of Stephen Hawking

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Lynch's sister is signed to Richmond AFLW side (which doesnt have a salary cap) and apparently bought a house in South Yarra at the ripe old age of 21.

If true that's a disgrace, would not be allowed in the NFL

 

[Nick Lions]

They’ve done the right thing by telling Kochie and the Power to jump, regarding the China game. Not the club for that sort of experiment. Need to fix their own backyard first.

In fact the way the Power have been going, not too sure they are either.

 

[Roylion]

Merge the Suns with Brisbane. Re - Brand the club as the "Queensland Lions". Play 7 home games at the Gabba, 3 at Metricon and 1 in Cairns.

And who's going to merge the Lions and the Suns?

 

[master bate]

That side is rubbish. Have a good look at it. We are talking about a back line of Harbrow, Leslie and Ah Chee. I will give Ah Chee props because he looks extremely promising, but those other two are not effective. Kolo, Thompson are not much chop. Hanley is just ok these days.

Their HF line and deeper forwards are unproven and haven't shown much. Day is average and has shown no real signs he is the answer, and Young and Holman are just stop gap players - the type you play when you deficient of quality players. Sexton is probably above average and underrated, and Ainsworth shows promise. Wright is just potential.

I could go on, but that is an ordinary side with no stars, and just a slice of potential thrown in there. GC have real problems.

It's not a good team. And it badly lacks stars. But it's not a list devoid of talent and it's not a team that should throw in the towel or desperately requires some massive intervention. In fact more than anything - and I'm looking at Carlton this year as a great example - they need to not make huge changes and just keep building what Dew had going at the start of the year.

Outside of Witts - who's decent enough - the talls are ugly but they can turn the corner quickly if (and it's a big if) they've finally sorted out their fitness team, facilities etc. Thompson is not a pretty player but he can do a job, he's going to give away free kicks but his size and speed makes life very hard for forwards. Sam Day can do a job too bringing the ball to ground up forward. Leslie and Wright are more hope and see but teams have survived with worse talls.

I disagree on their flankers. With a decent midfield I think Harbrow, Kolo, Ah Chee, Hanley is a decent amount of skill and they can win the ball if given an even chance. Holman and Young are definite role players but that's what Dew wants - I look at Port last year and this year with and without Young, it's not really any different. Ainsworth and Sexton with decent supply can both kick 30 goals. Jack Martin can play anywhere and if they finally had enough of a side to work with he'd be able to do that as a great utility.

Their biggest issue is the midfield is in constant turnover without leadership, stability or structure. If you have a half decent core in the middle you can quickly become competitive. Gold Coast's aim for next year has got to be a percentage of 80%, not so much wins. Might be 4 wins, might be 7 wins. I believe in the Swallow, Miller, Lyons, Brodie, Fiorini, Bowes midfield. Again, it's fitness questions but if Swallow stays healthy and the young guys made a jump physically there's a basis for a team.

Nathan Jones and new arrival Bernie Vince was all Melbourne had for proven senior players in 2014. The Suns might even be worse off than that for their best players if May leaves. But if Swallow, Miller and Lyons do enough and they start adding maturing kid one by one in to the midfield they will steadily improve. Their overall list has far more talent than Melbourne did in '14 or Richmond did when Hardwick arrived and probably more than Brisbane a few years ago too.

They have to get their fitness and development right and they have to find trades for a few more senior players - be prepared to pay overs at the trade table as they did for Weller, ideally with 2nd or 3rd round picks - but it's not all doom and gloom.

 

[Johnny Karate]

Recruit talented players, develop them and retain them. Helps if the administration is stable too. Yeah they got belted a few times but they’re a young side doing a rebuild of a rebuild with a savage injury list, first year coach & they had the added bonus of playing everywhere but home for virtually half a season. I think some people fail to grasp that in the AFL there will always be a couple of teams down the bottom struggling for reasons innumerate. Calls for special assistance, mergers etc are often knee jerk IMO.

 

[The Meerkat]

No they haven't. Carlton has, Adelaide has, Brisbane has - but I can't really think of others who've had that kind of player loss rate.

Geelong lost 3 in 86 to Sydney and im sure all clubs in their history have gone through this.

 

[The Meerkat]

You have gone on like this whole time

So, it wont always be this way.

 

[iameviljez]

Geelong lost 3 in 86 to Sydney and im sure all clubs in their history have gone through this.

Greg Williams, Bernard Toohey, and... are you counting the coach?

Anyway, three players is absolutely sweet stuff-all compared to the exodus coming from the Suns. Yes, it burned us - well, more specifically, losing Williams burned us - but it's hardly the roll-call that has left Metricon.

 

[footyfan1978]

Geelong lost 3 in 86 to Sydney and im sure all clubs in their history have gone through this.

I think Geelong were content to sell off Greg Williams, Bernard Toohey and Bolton to Sydney to reduce debt at time which must have been in a really bad state. The coach Tom Hafey went to Sydney too. Wonder if that was some deal too. Clubs no longer trade players for transfer fees so it is all about draft picks now for most part or salary cap relief but overall club finances no longer part of trade deals as they once were back in early to mid 80's.

 

[Carringbush2010]

If I may negate between you Roylion and dave123

You both make points which have firm ground, for you Dave your posts come across as blunt but nonetheless on face value yes the interest in Australian football is minimal, and there is an argument that players would rather play for big clubs and crowds.- now

Roy you bring backed up facts on participation and the increasing popularity among the next generation etc. etc. so it is hard to dismiss that way in the distance in terms of time the game will be popular in a participation / viewing sense in what is now foreign territory for the code.

And that it is where the conundrum lies, it is way way in the future that QLD and NSW will be developing the bulk of their own talent and have their own rusted on supporters. So for now Dave has a point in that it is simply going to be more popular for your Lynch types to play for a big club in front of a regular 60 -70k like a Collingwood or Richmond in their home state for example, of course there are other factors like $,culture, facilities etc. but on face value it is true. -now

And I get it's gonna take light years to get there and probably the narrative from HQ from the start should've been blunt and to the point so the footy public isn't mislead into thinking the "experiment" teams are going to make the nrl population look the other way. It's fair enough that for those who don't analyse overly it does have a look of "because we've got new teams in NSW & QLD we're gonna be the no.1 code soon"

Of course that was never going to be the case but there's never been much noise from HQ to the contrary, so the fans of the established clubs see these teams as a financial vacuum rather than a long term code growth proposition in what is now very much so foreign territory.

 

[footyfan1978]

those who don't analyse overly it does have a look of "because we've got new teams in NSW & QLD we're gonna be the no.1 code soon"

Of course that was never going to be the case but there's never been much noise from HQ to the contrary, so the fans of the established clubs see these teams as a financial vacuum rather than a long term code growth proposition

It is a lack of interest by those fans only care about their own club that do not understand why expansion clubs allow a game each week in those states be a norm going forward. For those of us that actually have an interest in the game HQ did actually communicate the reasons and the difficulty involved for decades to come. I remember Vlad explaining it fully one day when I listened on radio. They do a lot of stupid things I hate and still do but for what it is worth that stuff was indeed explained for those of us truly interested back then to listen why the AFL were adding seconds clubs in NSW & QLD. My only query I still have is why Gold Coast location with all challenges there to start when Sunshine Coast might be a better second option to truly gets roots into the community for a football club?

 

[Carringbush2010]

It is a lack of interest by those fans only care about their own club that do not understand why expansion clubs allow a game each week in those states be a norm going forward. For those of us that actually have an interest in the game HQ did actually communicate the reasons and the difficulty involved for decades to come. I remember Vlad explaining it fully one day when I listened on radio. They do a lot of stupid things I hate and still do but for what it is worth that stuff was indeed explained for those of us truly interested back then to listen why the AFL were adding seconds clubs in NSW & QLD. My only query I still have is why Gold Coast location with all challenges there to start when Sunshine Coast might be a better second option to truly gets roots into the community for a football club?

Whilst I agree there was some "speculative information" in the beginning, the footy public by and large was never going to swallow it. It's the timeline and the amount of $$ in that timeline that seem to get everyone's back up. I'm all for "growing the game" but it seems to be "we're coming and you're going to like it whether you like it or not" attitude from HQ while at the same time "we still love you Tas but sorry" and "for the rest of you we're doing this, snub or follow".

As far as gold coast v sunshine coast for location, I think that's really splitting hairs given their proximity. Hazard a guess less than 50 clicks? If so I don't think that's going to impact "planted supporters" which won't be coming for years and decades yet - not in large numbers anyway.

 

[footyfan1978]

Whilst I agree there was some "speculative information" in the beginning

It was not speculative information. Vlad outlined why they were doing it, I heard it on radio. Was not some guess work of what he was thinking. If you wanted to listen you could hear him. If people want to pretend in the dark or have no interest to find out that is their business but it was not speculative information. The information was there if you wanted to know at the time.

 

[Carringbush2010]

It was not speculative information. Vlad outlined why they were doing it, I heard it on radio. Was not some guess work of what he was thinking. If you wanted to listen you could hear him. If people want to pretend in the dark or have no interest to find out that is their business but it was not speculative information. The information was there if you wanted to know at the time.

I never said there was speculation about it happening, I said the speculative information was about how successful the experiment would be and could only be speculative at the time because it was very much in it's infancy.

And obviously there still will be speculation for a very very very................. long time.

 

[footyfan1978]

As far as gold coast v sunshine coast for location, I think that's really splitting hairs given their proximity. Hazard a guess less than 50 clicks?

No, more. Sunshine Coast is north of Brisbane, Gold Coast south. Having been to all those regions it far more as a community feel to me on Sunshine Coast. Sunshine Coast feels like a region you could instill a sense of community feel for a football club in a region than Gold Coast. However the population and bright lights of Gold Coast tourism glitz is a bigger selling point can only assume. Sunshine Coast may not even be an option, just something I always wondered about considering been to all these regions. I just sense more locals are intending to live in Sunshine Coast for good and therefore following a club there than Gold Coast that seems more transient in terms of those living and going from there. Just does not have the same regional community feel for mine.

 

[footyfan1978]

I never said there was speculation about it happening, I said the speculative information was about how successful the experiment would

You started out suggesting posts ago, the information of why they were doing it was not forthcoming from HQ. It is why I brought that up. Not the speculation of how successful it would be. We all know that has been up in air but the why was clearly there from start from Vlad in HQ.

 

[Carringbush2010]

You started out suggesting posts ago, the information of why they were doing it was not forthcoming from HQ

No I did not, you've misread my posts - I have not suggested the information was not publicly given. I know it was I never said it wasn't.

What I did "suggest" was that the impression I get is that HQ has not made a lot of noise on the time span that they expect the expansion teams to finally flourish since the inception of the two expansion teams. Tony and Mark have been much more vocal on the issue than any of Andrew or Gil of late.

 

[Carringbush2010]

No, more. Sunshine Coast is north of Brisbane, Gold Coast south. Having been to all those regions it far more as a community feel to me on Sunshine Coast. Sunshine Coast feels like a region you could instill a sense of community feel for a football club in a region than Gold Coast. However the population and bright lights of Gold Coast tourism glitz is a bigger selling point can only assume. Sunshine Coast may not even be an option, just something I always wondered about considering been to all these regions. I just sense more locals are intending to live in Sunshine Coast for good and therefore following a club there than Gold Coast that seems more transient in terms of those living and going from there. Just does not have the same regional community feel for mine.

So I gather you think that the gold coast is too "las vegas" like? Which I'd agree - so long as the Sunshine coast is not of the same "vibe" i:e as you suggest than of course it would be a better fit to start up a club in the lands biggest competition.

 

[Kirkswan]

No, more. Sunshine Coast is north of Brisbane, Gold Coast south. Having been to all those regions it far more as a community feel to me on Sunshine Coast. Sunshine Coast feels like a region you could instill a sense of community feel for a football club in a region than Gold Coast. However the population and bright lights of Gold Coast tourism glitz is a bigger selling point can only assume. Sunshine Coast may not even be an option, just something I always wondered about considering been to all these regions. I just sense more locals are intending to live in Sunshine Coast for good and therefore following a club there than Gold Coast that seems more transient in terms of those living and going from there. Just does not have the same regional community feel for mine.

I have not lived there since the turn of the century, and I was there for only a short time, but imo the strip is transient, the suburbs behind it are not. The suburbs are the people who come to games, support clubs, raise families. The strip used to run from tweed through to Main or Southport. The rest is suburbia.

EDITED: Added the underline not... sorry

 

[footyfan1978]

So I gather you think that the gold coast is too "las vegas" like? Which I'd agree - so long as the Sunshine coast is not of the same "vibe" i:e as you suggest than of course it would be a better fit to start up a club in the lands biggest competition.

Yes, I do feel the vibe is more tourist theme so even the football club just another theme park tourist thing in the place. But having not lived there it is more an impression in being there a few times and what others have said that have lived there and know more about it.

Do not get same vibe from Sunshine Coast so a football club I sense would have a less gimmicky feel that locals living there can get themselves into.

But I admit it is all impression for me and the costs involved and potential to do it completely unknown. It may not be even viable. It is close enough to Brisbane for those there into footy but not Lions supporters to maybe support it as a club. Is the population there to make it work? Not really sure. Just something to wonder about. If they could build a club with similar model to Geelong it might still work.