Mid East Israel declare war after Hamas attack II

[Gethelred]

Part I:

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack.

Breaking the law. 'International humanitarian law prohibits a siege of Gaza, UN human rights commissioner says From CNN's Eve Brennan Ravina Shamdasani speaks at the Palais des Nations in Geneva, Switzerland, on September 7, 2018. Ravina Shamdasani speaks at the Palais des Nations in...

www.bigfooty.com

Thread Rules:

Alright.

I recognise that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have connections to either side of the conflict. What you need to understand is that this site has rules governing posting standards and the appropriate way to talk to other posters, and you will abide by them.

How this interacts with this thread is that the following will result in your post being deleted, with a recurrence of the same behaviour resulting in (depending on severity) a threadban for a week and a day off:

• direct labelling of someone as anti-semitic or a terrorist sympathiser for posting that is merely critical of Israel's response over time. I appreciate that Israel has the right to defend themselves from violence, but that does not mean that Israel has carte blanche to attack disproportionately towards people under their care.
• deliberate goading or flippant responses, designed to get people reacting to your posting emotionally.
• abuse.
• attempts to turn this into a Left vs Right shitfight.
• If I see the word 'Nazi' in here, you had better be able to justify it in the post you're making and the comparison had better be apt. Godwin's law is in full effect for the purposes of this thread; if you refer to Nazis, you've lost whatever argument you're involved in.
• Any defense of Hamas' actions on the basis of justification. There's no justification for genocide, regardless of whether or not they have the power to do so.

Please recognise that this is a difficult time for all involved, and some level of sensitivity is absolutely required to permit discussion to flow. From time to time, mods will reach out to specific posters and do some welfare checks; we may even give posters who get a bit too involved some days off to give people some time to cool down. This is not a reflection on you as a poster, merely that this is an intense subject.

I get that this is a fairly intense topic about which opinion can diverge rather significantly. If you feel you cannot be respectful in your disagreement with another poster, it is frequently better to refuse to engage than it is to take up the call.

From this point, any poster who finds themselves directly insulting another poster will find themselves receiving a threadban and an infraction, with each subsequent reoccurance resulting in steadily more points added to your account.

If you accumulate enough points in a 12 month period you will lose privileges:

5 points - 1 week off.
10 points - 2 weeks off
15 points - 3 weeks off
20 points - Account banned.

It has also become apparent that this needs to be said: just because someone moderates a part of this forum that isn't on Int Pol or the SRP does not hold them to a different standard of posting than anyone else. All of us were posters first, and we are allowed to hold opinions on this and share them on this forum.

Treat each other with the respect each of you deserve.

Thanks all.

Play nicely, all.

 

[sr36]

Still not sure if you're talking about Israel or Palestine.

If Israel is able to exist with the goal of Palestine not existing, it would only be fair if Palestine existed with the goal of Israel not existing.

I'm talking about the use of the term Zionist as a slur.

It's history as a slur is much broader than how many are currently trying to use it as a slur.

 

[Trouto]

They caused these problems in the middle east, you don't find all this death in the middle east upsetting?

Rubbish. the labels put on US politicians are just point-scoring attempts. The right and the left are both hand-in-hand in fully supporting the Zionist agenda. The political system in the USA is set up to only accept people who have pledged allegiance to the Zionists.

Their system is set up so only the ones with money make the grade - and the Zionists supply the money.

 

[MrsBlueSky]

The only serious dent in Hamas numbers can come if we help Israel drop another 15,000 indiscriminate bombs on cities in Gaza.
Then who are we going to help get rid of next?
I like the idea of going into Yemen after the Houthis. I don't have anything against them, I just find them annoying, so we should kill them all.

 

[Trouto]

Idiots bringing the violence to Australia

Sydney man sentenced to 12 months in jail after planting homemade bomb outside pro-Palestinian’s house

Lawyers for David Maurice Wise claim he only has ‘dream-like memory of planting the bomb’ but magistrate says offending ‘serious’

www.theguardian.com

wow that was quick from the courts! nice job

 

[Trouto]

The only serious dent in Hamas numbers can come if we help Israel drop another 15,000 indiscriminate bombs on cities in Gaza.
Then who are we going to help get rid of next?
I like the idea of going into Yemen after the Houthis. I don't have anything against them, I just find them annoying, so we should kill them all.

And if the military industry happen to make a buck out of it, who's to argue? Its a win/win situation!

;-)

 

[Tiger 79]

The right and the left are both hand-in-hand in fully supporting the Zionist agenda.

You're talking now, I'm talking when the imprudent left recognised the State of "Israel" immediately upon proclamation, endorsed the theft if you like, surely we can't say the "racist right" recognised it?

 

[Trouto]

You're talking now, I'm talking when the imprudent left recognised the State of "Israel" immediately upon proclamation, endorsed the theft if you like, surely we can't say the "racist right" recognised it?

And back then, as now, it wouldn't have mattered who was in power, they would have done what they were told to do by the bribe-makers.

 

[Tiger 79]

I'm talking about the use of the term Zionist as a slur.

It's history as a slur is much broader than how many are currently trying to use it as a slur.

Some people see Zionism as synonymous with theft. Thou shalt not steal. Stealing is not good. Zionism no good.

How can Zionism be good if theft is not good, maybe you can explain to the people why theft is good, and why the left did the right thing in aiding the theft?

 

[Saint]

I'm talking about the use of the term Zionist as a slur.

It's history as a slur is much broader than how many are currently trying to use it as a slur.

A bit like the inverse of Anti-semitism.

It used to mean people who hate Jews.

Now it also means "anyone who says anything nice about a Palestinian is offending Jews"

 

[MrsBlueSky]

Thou shalt not steal.

I like the Biblical phrase eye for an eye.
That's what Israel is doing to Hamas in reprisal for their Oct 7 attack.
But Israel seems to have modernised that phrase and made it a thousand eyes for an eye.

 

[faible]

Someone's got big feelings about the left it seems.

the left

the left

the left

The liberal left

liberal left

the imprudent left

the left

 

[Trouto]

I like the Biblical phrase eye for an eye.
That's what Israel is doing to Hamas in reprisal for their Oct 7 attack.
But Israel seems to have modernised that phrase and made it a thousand eyes for an eye.

"you throw a stone, we will throw a few 2000LB bombs"

 

[sr36]

Some people see Zionism as synonymous with theft. Thou shalt not steal. Stealing is not good. Zionism no good.

How can Zionism be good if theft is not good, maybe you can explain to the people why theft is good, and why the left did the right thing in aiding the theft?

Your left versus right stuff is moronic. They're labels for economic and social beliefs , but you're using them as a cheerleader for different American political parties. The whole Western world was further left economically in 1948 - both US Parties included and further right socially - both US parties included. Truman was socially right by today's standards - so in criticising his policies you are actually criticising the right.

Both the settlements and 1948 were/are colonial theft - shithousery.

But 1948 is 3 generations ago - I wouldn't expect Israeli born Israelis to feel any less right to live in their country than the many of us Australians who also are the product of colonial theft.

 

[Tiger 79]

Someone's got big feelings about the left it seems.

You know you can't say prudent left? Just look at what's happening.

 

[QuietB]

Your left versus right stuff is moronic. They're labels for economic and social beliefs , but you're using them as a cheerleader for different American political parties. The whole Western world was further left economically in 1948 - both US Parties included and further right socially - both US parties included. Truman was socially right by today's standards - so in criticising his policies you are actually criticising the right.

Both the settlements and 1948 were/are colonial theft - shithousery.

But 1948 is 3 generations ago - I wouldn't expect Israeli born Israelis to feel any less right to live in their country than the many of us Australians who also are the product of colonial theft.

We are not talking about colonial theft this time - we are talking about genocide and colonial expansion.

And this colonial expansion is happening at the time where all other colonial powers are shrinking.

 

[faible]

You know you can't say prudent left? Just look at what's happening.

At the hands of that liberal left Israeli Government?

 

[Tiger 79]

their country

But when "Israel" play a football international the welcome to country is performed by a Palestinian not a Jew?

 

[Tiger 79]

At the hands of that liberal left Israeli Government?

At the end of the day, you either believe that the Zionists are full of guile, or without guile, if you believe they're full of guile, that's when you ask yourself, who did they decieve?

Why do you think Stalin supported a State of "Israel"?

 

[Tiger 79]

Truman was socially right by today's standards - so in criticising his policies you are actually criticising the right.

It was the imprudent Zionist allies left, the Axis right, and no one gives a shit what Truman would be by today's standards, what would Stalin be by today's standards?

 

[sr36]

It was the imprudent Zionist allies left, the Axis right, and no one gives a s**t what Truman would be by today's standards, what would Stalin be by today's standards?

Stalin would be economically very left and socially very right by today's standards.

This wasn't axis versus allies. Mussolini's plan was to set up a Zionist state in Northern Africa to ethnically cleanse Jews to. And with the Nazis, the "final solution" wasn't the first solution.

 

[sr36]

We are not talking about colonial theft this time - we are talking about genocide and colonial expansion.

And this colonial expansion is happening at the time where all other colonial powers are shrinking.

I know. I was responding to a post about theft.

 

[Tiger 79]

Stalin would be economically very left and socially very right by today's standards.

What was he back when he supported a State of "Israel"? "very right"?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Still not sure if you're talking about Israel or Palestine.

If Israel is able to exist with the goal of Palestine not existing, it would only be fair if Palestine existed with the goal of Israel not existing.

That would seem to be the case.

However , what has fairness got to do with it?

Its like saying, if you massacre my family its fair for me to massacre your family.

Other people with better priorities might override the concept of fairness, though it can make a good action movie.

 

[sr36]

What was he back when he supported a State of "Israel"? "very right"?

He was very left economically - that's all the term meant at the time. That era was dominated by economics. Right vs Left was a distinciton in terms of economic views. Right wing liberals (for their era) and left wing conservatives were common.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The only serious dent in Hamas numbers can come if we help Israel drop another 15,000 indiscriminate bombs on cities in Gaza.
Then who are we going to help get rid of next?
I like the idea of going into Yemen after the Houthis. I don't have anything against them, I just find them annoying, so we should kill them all.

Its like "you have a wolf amongst your sheep ", but don't worry , we have some bombs and machine guns that will sort out that sucker.