List Mgmt. List Management Thread

[AFC979810]

Are Vic (or WA) Under 18s really training more often than our guys? Are the facilities much different? Surely population is the single biggest factor.

Population - Vic 6.9 million, WA 2.9million, SA 1.8 million. No Point in including the rugby states or irrelevant tassie.

So for the sake of argument lets say its 7 million, 3 million and 2 million. So if we look at the first 24 picks of the last 10 drafts - for every 7 vic players drafted there should be 3 from WA and 2 from SA.

With the top 240 players taken over the past 10 years - If you estimate that about 10% of players will come from the rugby states and tassie - the players taken by state (according to population) should be approximately 126 from Victoria, 54 from WA and 36 from SA with 24 from outta state.

2024 - 20 Vic, 2 WA, 1 SA, 1 QLD
2023 - 15 VIC, 3 WA, 2 SA, 3 QLD, 1 NSW
2022 - 15 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA, 1 QLD
2021 - 16 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA
2020 - 15 VIC, 3 WA, 4 SA, 1 QLD, 1 NSW
2019 - 15 VIC, 4 WA, 4 SA, 1 NEAFL
2018 - 14 VIC, 2 WA, 5 SA, 2 Tassie, 1 QLD, 1 NSW
2017 - 16 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA
2016 - 16 VIC, 4 WA, 1 SA, 1 QLD, 2 NSW
2015 - 14 VIC, 1 WA, 3 SA, 2 QLD, 3 NSW, 1 TAS

Vic - 156 players taken
WA - 34 players taken
SA - 29 players taken
Outta Staters - 22 players taken.

I know its a small sample size, but to me this suggests that it isn't population alone and we do have a bit of a problem with development, but WA has a much worse problem.

 

[Tex Danger]

Population - Vic 6.9 million, WA 2.9million, SA 1.8 million. No Point in including the rugby states or irrelevant tassie.

So for the sake of argument lets say its 7 million, 3 million and 2 million. So if we look at the first 24 picks of the last 10 drafts - for every 7 vic players drafted there should be 3 from WA and 2 from SA.

With the top 240 players taken over the past 10 years - If you estimate that about 10% of players will come from the rugby states and tassie - the players taken by state (according to population) should be approximately 126 from Victoria, 54 from WA and 36 from SA with 24 from outta state.

2024 - 20 Vic, 2 WA, 1 SA, 1 QLD
2023 - 15 VIC, 3 WA, 2 SA, 3 QLD, 1 NSW
2022 - 15 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA, 1 QLD
2021 - 16 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA
2020 - 15 VIC, 3 WA, 4 SA, 1 QLD, 1 NSW
2019 - 15 VIC, 4 WA, 4 SA, 1 NEAFL
2018 - 14 VIC, 2 WA, 5 SA, 2 Tassie, 1 QLD, 1 NSW
2017 - 16 VIC, 5 WA, 3 SA
2016 - 16 VIC, 4 WA, 1 SA, 1 QLD, 2 NSW
2015 - 14 VIC, 1 WA, 3 SA, 2 QLD, 3 NSW, 1 TAS

Vic - 156 players taken
WA - 34 players taken
SA - 29 players taken
Outta Staters - 22 players taken.

I know its a small sample size, but to me this suggests that it isn't population alone and we do have a bit of a problem with development, but WA has a much worse problem.

Bigger based on population but outcome for the afl clubs is bigger problem for SA teams (marginally) as they’re still producing more

 

[Cromulant]

Are Vic (or WA) Under 18s really training more often than our guys? Are the facilities much different? Surely population is the single biggest factor.

The Vic kids are, I think you were a bit disingenuous with your response really.

Those Talent League clubs are there solely for the development of junior players, whereas SANFL clubs goals are entirely different.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

The Vic kids are, I think you were a bit disingenuous with your response really.

Those Talent League clubs are there solely for the development of junior players, whereas SANFL clubs goals are entirely different.

I doubt they're training more. There's only so many hours in the day and kids still have school no matter which state they live in. I doubt the facilities are much different either. Maybe they are

I'd love to know the differences in coaching resources, if there are any. Maybe I'm wrong and it's chalk and cheese

I'd also love to hear from someone involved at an SANFL club about how the $50k per draftee generated got taken away a number of years ago. I believe now the money generated just goes into a pool and is shared evenly by all SANFL clubs which seems very wrong to me.

 

[AFC979810]

Bigger based on population but outcome for the afl clubs is bigger problem for SA teams (marginally) as they’re still producing more

Sorry mate - not really following there.

 

[1970crow]

Is he auditioning (given there’s no list spot) or was it convenient there’s a player moving to SA who has been on an AFL list and so used to those training standards who could be offered a training spot

Not so much about auditioning but benefit to us being having a fringe AFL level for Rick training and benefit to him being he gets an afl preseason and while not a formal audition it still gives him an outside chance if he impresses enough

That seems more likely to me than us asking us to train with any likely expectation of a list spot

Wouldn't we be better off getting ruck training into the most likely backup in the event ROB goes down too?

 

[Tex Danger]

Wouldn't we be better off getting ruck training into the most likely backup in the event ROB goes down too?

We don’t have a list spot so we can’t really entice someone to move across the country for a train on spot with nothing to offer.

What I’m saying though is if the primary purpose is to have a better person for Rob to train against an AFL player just delisted moving to SA is a bit of a convenience to use

 

[Carmo]

Sounds like you heard about contracts being juggled before Luko announced his intentions, which was September 23. If payments were brought into 2024, that would have needed to be negotiated at the start of the season and would have nearly all been paid by then.

Why? As long as the payments landed in the bank accounts of the relevant players by Dec 31st 2024 shouldn't that have been ok? Could do late in yr negotiations and achieve this easily.

 

[Mostyn]

Why? As long as the payments landed in the bank accounts of the relevant players by Dec 31st 2024 shouldn't that have been ok? Could do late in yr negotiations and achieve this easily.

Perhaps?

Obviously, you'd only have the ability to adjust the last payment if it happened later. The later you adjust, the smaller the adjustment would be - unless you have someone a big balloon payment?

I think the most likely thing would be - they looked at the 2024 and 2025 salary positions, and realised pushing salary into 2024 and filling that up opened up a lot of options for 2025. They knew they had players they were interested in - Luko, Cumming, Petty, etc - so they adjusted to give options.

Whatever happened, it looks like they thought the upside of salary to bring in mature players was worth not cutting a player early for an extra pick.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Essendon Training Report (yesterday)



I'm not advocating Draper, simply stating ....at what age do RUCK's mature ? .....26 YO this season, with zero PS in 2024

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Essendon Training Report (yesterday)

View attachment 2211052

I'm not advocating Draper, simply stating ....at what age do RUCK's mature ? .....26 YO this season, with zero PS in 2024

Whoohoo!

They'd be mad to let him go

 

[AFC979810]

Essendon Training Report (yesterday)

View attachment 2211052

I'm not advocating Draper, simply stating ....at what age do RUCK's mature ? .....26 YO this season, with zero PS in 2024

His price is going up and up......

Lets just pinch one of the Saints ruckman for 3rd rounder and call it a day.

 

[spenze]

Strange for a footballer in coming out of contract FA year would be lighting up the track and training the house down

 

[GreyCrow]

Strange for a footballer in coming out of contract FA year would be lighting up the track and training the house down

Scott Cummins Likes This

 

[Coopers]

Whoohoo!

They'd be mad to let him go

To be fair, my issue with him is him sucking at football.

If that turns out to not be the case, then I might reverse my "yeah nah" position.






Also, haircut.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

To be fair, my issue with him is him sucking at football.

If that turns out to not be the case, then I might reverse my "yeah nah" position.






Also, haircut.

And general Essendon stinkiness

 

[Doctor B]

 

[Golumless]

Essendon Training Report (yesterday)

View attachment 2211052

I'm not advocating Draper, simply stating ....at what age do RUCK's mature ? .....26 YO this season, with zero PS in 2024

25ish, however, the one thing to watch with Draper is usage. There is definitely an argument there that Draper is mediocre because how Essendon manage their best 22, and them trying to have their cake with trying to get around their lack of key forwards.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

25ish, however, the one thing to watch with Draper is usage. There is definitely an argument to be made that Draper is mediocre because of how Essendon manage their best 22.

He certainly was mediocre in 2023 ....he was injured & unfit though

 

[Golumless]

He certainly was mediocre in 2023 ....he was injured & unfit though

Groins can certainly wreck a season if he was trying to push through it. 2023 was an inconsistent mess though, seeing Sam had weeks where he peeled off 15-16 disp/3-4 clearances and a couple of just nothing.

Still, the part I keep coming back to with Draper is he's always saddled with a guy who is typically picking up 30+ ruck contests a game, seeing ruck is a position where you've really got to commit to a guy for the vast majority of the game to get the best out of them.

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Groins can certainly wreck a season if he was trying to push through it. 2023 was an inconsistent mess though, seeing Sam had weeks where he peeled off 15-16 disp/3-4 clearances and a couple of just nothing.

Still, the part I keep coming back to with Draper is he's always saddled with a guy who is typically picking up 30+ ruck contests a game, seeing ruck is a position where you've really got to commit to a guy for the vast majority of the game to get the best out of them.

The problem is that I don’t think Draper is fit enough to be the number ruck, doing 80% of the contests

 

[Mutineer]

Former Suns ruckman invited to train with Bulldogs

Former Suns ruckman Brayden Crossley has been invited to train with the Bulldogs

www.afl.com.au

 

[MRB37]

Whoohoo!

They'd be mad to let him go

Nick Bryan is a fringe guy and Goldstein is closing in on 350 games this year, at a minimum I would hope Draper could athletically outperform the pair of them.

 

[Mutineer]

Probably of some interest to us...

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/essendon/essendon-track-watch-elijah-tsatas-pushing-for-opening-round-spot/news-story/2d6c58d93e174f3e2fc36fad6fc8fa49

RUCK ‘N ROLE

Essendon looks set to run with a two-pronged ruck attack this season, which would allow Sam Draper to spend some more time forward.

Draper and Nick Bryan started on the same side opposed to Todd Goldstein, before switching teams later in the game.

They combined well early, switching roles from the ruck to attack, and at one stage they shared four consecutive goals.
Draper, 26, is about to enter the final year of his current deal with the Bombers and seems fired up and ready to perform.

He kicked three goals for the game, mixing his time between the two roles, while Bryan is looking more and more comfortable in his role within the team, kicking two goals himself.

Bryan, 23, has only played 19 games, and has never played more than eight in one season, but looks set to play a bigger role in 2025.

 

[Mostyn]

Look, I'm happy for Draper to prove me wrong ...