Mega Thread Matt Rendell situation thread #2

[SydCrow]

P.s. minus'ing the genocidal element of an attrocity is a remarkably casual.

And the truth reveals itself.

You're actually in denial about the extent of the Stolen Generations atrocity. No wonder you throw comparisons around so trivially.

No, I didnt actually use that term.

The content he posted is worrying though.

You used the terms genocidal and denial in successive posts.

Can we debate the issue and not make it personal?

 

[Allefgib]

As are we all concerned for him. I can tell you that steven trigg is also very concerned for him. In light of his apology today though, do you think he may now recognize that some of his suggestions or the language that he used were the problem? Or do you think he only did it because it was expected?

If the academy concept has been deemed troublesome due to being perceived as racist then matty certainly want aware of this on monday. 2 months after the original discussion and after being denied the opportunity to present to the media by trigg. If that truly is a key cause for concern, and of offense, then its disgraceful its taken that long to be discussed. And disgraceful its cost him his job. And more disgraceful its tarnished a well intentioned man.

Where is the leadership?

 

[RocknRoll]

I do not think he should be doing any media in the state he is in. I do know Misfud has been in contact with him this whole time. Rendell is concerned for Misfud as supposedly he has 4 kids. That is the kind of bloke Matt is, even though Matt has 2 teenage boys himself.
Honestly at present, Matt isnt concerned about money or his job. Only the reputation he spent 35 years building.

Poor Matt.
We all feel for him - everybody.
Sounds like he has just been a little too passionate. He needs a break.
I am sure he won't be harshly judged by this in the long run. His career is not over.

 

[ruscy002]

I believe you believe that. How hard is it for you to understand and accept though, that indigenous people may see similarities in what is being suggested?

Not very hard at all, this is quite obvious.

I agree, this was not his underlying thought process at all - but I am thinking he didn't stop to think this through from an indigenous perspective.

You can't agree on this point and agree with Vader - the whole time he has asserted that Rendell's thought process is the same. He has said that Rendell wants to assimilate indigenous kids into white society, not that this is how it could be "perceived".

 

[WhySoSerious]

Did anyone stop to think that maybe theres some indigenous kids that want to be on a level playing field? As I'm sure theres talented kids from other areas who want the same opportunity.

Comparing forcing kids to adjust to a different way of living (regardless of good intentions or not) should not be compared to giving kids an opportunity. Why does everyone always have to look for the bad in things? It's instantly assuming that Indigenous way of life is worse that that of non-indigenous. The issue is and always has been about a system thats getting more and more ruthless as the years go on. An issue that is seriously going to affect selections of kids coming from all walks of life. I dont know about anyone else but the stat of around 50% of draftees coming through the TAC is seriously alarming for any kid, regardless of race. To me that already indicates that there isn't a level playing field.

You cant pin people on individual comments (especially without considering context) and act upon them as quickly and ruthless as the AFL and AFC have done here. Clearly within our game and our club, you can. That to me is a more serious issue than trying to find racist intentions in Rendells comments. If thats the way we operate, we have serious issues with those who are running this club.

 

[Harris Pilton]

This footy scholarship that Matt was proposng - is it avaiable to non-Koori kids from remote areas? If not, why not? Wouldn't that be discriminatory?

 

[jenny61_99]

This footy scholarship that Matt was proposng - is it avaiable to non-Koori kids from remote areas? If not, why not? Wouldn't that be discriminatory?

Really? You know he was discussing retention rates of indigenous players right? There are already footy academies in most if not all capital cities. You know it. You are being intentionall antagonistic.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

Lawrst - so you believe Aboriginal kids need to be acclimatised? This is where people come undone.

I could of used some acclimatising as a child. I am sure plenty of talented white kids who go to shit schools in crap areas that if sent to Scotch or Sacred Heart would have a much better chance of playing AFL....

So yes. Any kid who gets to go to a prestigious college is more likely to make it and if you think otherwise you are not talking truth.

And if the Indiginous kid gets the offer to go to Scotch but says he wants to stay at home that is no problem. If they are good enough of course they are still going to make it.... Would not matter what school Mcleod or Matera went to!

 

[Southerntakeover]

You used the terms genocidal and denial in successive posts.

Can we debate the issue and not make it personal?

I was debating the issue. You currently are not.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Lawrst - so you believe Aboriginal kids need to be acclimatised? This is where people come undone.

I do think the AFL draft forces a change in lifestyle for any AFL draftee.

 

[RocknRoll]

Really? You know he was discussing retention rates of indigenous players right? There are already footy academies in most if not all capital cities. You know it. You are being intentionall antagonistic.

I'm not sure it was intentionally antagonistic.
If you look back at some of the tweets from Misfud that seems to be a concern. (cant remember but along the lines of how black to you have to be to get in?). From Misfud's tweets he appears to be against having different entry schemes at all based on race. So Harris Pilton has a point.

But I still think the major issue here was not so much the merits or otherwise of Matt's proposal but how it was presented that was the major concern.

 

[WALL-e]

It's not Aboriginal kids that need acclimitization, it's kids from remote communities. How different their situation is from the one they walk into at AFL is SO vast.

Yes I used terms like 'them' and 'they'.....scary issue.

It isn't their background that makes them struggle, it's what they're used to in their lifestyle etc.

 

[Allefgib]

But I still think the major issue here was not so much the merits or otherwise of Matt's proposal but how it was presented that was the major concern.

I suspect youre right.

The poor handling of the situation reflects terribly on everyone, matt included. It reflects worse on the leaders imo.

 

[ruscy002]

It's not Aboriginal kids that need acclimitization, it's kids from remote communities. How different their situation is from the one they walk into at AFL is SO vast.

Yes I used terms like 'them' and 'they'.....scary issue.

It isn't their background that makes them struggle, it's what they're used to in their lifestyle etc.

Just like country kids, or people from New Zealand right?

 

[King Elvis]

Look, the offers for the kids are for under 16's and that, in Indigenous eyes, is just not on. As I said earlier, this is a very special period for that age group.

Every one goes on about Liam Jurrah being an "initiated" Warlpiri man but he could never have been one if he had been at a college, prestigious or not, at the age that has been suggested that these kids be placed.

He might not have the problems he has now either.

 

[Southerntakeover]

He might not have the problems he has now either.

Terrible post.

 

[King Elvis]

It's not pleasant, I agree, but is it wrong?

There are so many issues in the aboriginal communities, and by few people know how to even begin to tackle them - even fewer have the balls to do it.

Forget the actual alleged assault, but Jurrah was widely reported to struggle with the rigors of AFL - which was made even worse with the arrival of Neeld and his increased demands on the playing group - if there was more done to ease him into the AFL structure (maybe this academy, maybe something else), would he have had these issues?

And it touches on the entire issue - if that was done, and had allowed him to fall into the AFL easier, how would he handle having grown up at a high school, and not with his people?

I think you rated Milera - I thought Rendell's comments on him deserve a lot more discussion.

If you actually look at all the reports and interviews the only person that clearly made conflicting reports, half stories or changing stories as you say, is Matt Rendell. And he has now for the first time genuinely apologised and will chase down Jason and Ali and do it personally as well. Considering he had nothing to lose right now it doesn't sound like he thought he was in the right. Otherwise if as you say, people like himself who genuinely want to help and were duplicitous and sanctimoniously sacked in this manner, wouldn't someone in his position and altruist like you think he may be, be willing to take this to the bitter end?

If he genuinely offended them, I've got no doubt he'd Apologise - problem being, he only found out he offended them a week ago... And Grant Thomas stated that Mifsud laughed the comments off to him.

The level of offense taken seems to have multiplied as public opinion fell in with Rendell.

 

[King Elvis]

If I said I didnt sleep for 2 days I would not be exaggerating. He is a family friend and I am hearing how badly he is holding up.

His passion was this bloody academy. He has spoken of it everytime I have spoken to him since he has been back in Adelaide. He had no bloody idea it would be deemed racist. I honestly fear for him right now. That is the issue

Hopefully he knows that most people in the community are supportive of him - most understand that his intentions were good, even if clumsily expressed.

 

[WALL-e]

Just like country kids, or people from New Zealand right?

Slightly different.

A kid from New Zealand is used to city living, a kid from the country is used to internet exposure.

Kids from the country would likely be in the TAC system already, training loads wouldn't be as vast.

Matt's idea has a lot of credit to it. His wording (used to try and get a point across to show the importance of the situation) was poor.

 

[King Elvis]

Lawrst - so you believe Aboriginal kids need to be acclimatised? This is where people come undone.

No it isn't Jenny.

Only becomes an issue when people project racism onto it.

 

[ruscy002]

Slightly different.

A kid from New Zealand is used to city living, a kid from the country is used to internet exposure.

Kids from the country would likely be in the TAC system already, training loads wouldn't be as vast.

Matt's idea has a lot of credit to it. His wording (used to try and get a point across to show the importance of the situation) was poor.

Sorry, should've included some sort of emoticon after the NZ bit

 

[Lawrst]

Lawrst - so you believe Aboriginal kids need to be acclimatised? This is where people come undone.

Take the APY lands for an example. Move a person who has been there for their whole life and move them to the city. How do you think they will go? Will they just be able to move to the city and function without the need for help at the start. Talk about throwing a child to the wolves.

Not only does their whole life change and they would have no idea what duties we have in our daily life to be apart of our society (things like putting the bins out) take time to sink in. My father works for AFSS and helps people deal with these issues every day. Simple things like this people are expected to know, but when they dont grow up in an environment that exposes them to it how are they supposed to know?

Its not that different to a club helping an irish person get used to australia. Thats what these people are dealing with, it is akin to moving from china to australia.

Add in with that of the expectation of being an AFL footballer and it is a life changing task that needs to be undertaken. Its not about black, white, red, blue, green etc.

Its about helping the people that want to and are talented enough to become part of the AFL system. A large poplulation of the aboriginal people are in a very difficult situation for them to get into the AFL system and thrive and this is why they are singled out for help.

Anyway a person wishes to live their life is fine, its no better than anyone elses, but if a person wants to be apart of an oginisation like the AFL then they will need to be willing to change their lifestyle, whats wrong with a person wanting to make that drastic transition easier with people who are only there to help them?

 

[crowtricolours]

Marngrook Footy Show interview with Mifsud tomorrow

 

[Mattrox]

Maybe the biggest offence was taken with 'this needs to be fixed now, not in 6 months, not next year, now' . This May have cast the assertion that the jobs these 2 gentlemen are doing was not up to standard. The current programmes not working does make the incumbent look bad.

 

[mulz]

If he genuinely offended them, I've got no doubt he'd Apologise - problem being, he only found out he offended them a week ago... And Grant Thomas stated that Mifsud laughed the comments off to him.

The level of offense taken seems to have multiplied as public opinion fell in with Rendell.

id say your pretty close here KE. The thing that has really irked me, regardless of comments made, who was offended and so on is the way the whole situation has been handled.
its been handled absolutely deplorable.
this should of never been in the public domain. the AFL leaking this to the media is completely unproffesional.
A lot of crows fan here seem to be backing MR to a certain extent. and rightly so. one of our own has been thrown under the bus and our CEO has reversed back over him.
I for one will never forgive vlad or triggy for this. triggy must now go. a large majority of supporters have lost confidence in him. we cant have someone running the club we have no faith in.