Mega Thread Matt Rendell situation thread #2

[Big Gazoongas]

Oh **** ing hell! I didn't say you advocated this; read my post.

I said the problem is that some are looking at this through a white fella's perspective and no matter what we think may be right, no matter if we think we are trying to do the right thing, the point is that Aboriginals find this particular solution to keeping Aboriginals on AFL lists highly offensive.

We, you, me, may not understand this and think, "gee, we are only trying to help these kids" but this is not help in the eyes of indigenous peoples; it's offensive.

To add further insult to Aboriginal sensitivities would be to have a go at the way they feel about this and please Gazoonga, I did not just say and imply that you personally are having a go at the way Aboriginals feel about this: I said it would add further insult if people had a go at them.

So in answer to the first bit, if this is not help in the eyes of indigenous people what is it the white fellas/AFL/Clubs should do...this is what I have been trying to get a bloody answer too.
Do the hite fellas/AFL/Clubs just leave our indigenous friends to find their own way into footy, if that's what they choose, on their own accord???

In answer to the second bit, I'm personally not having a go and I think the wider community would genuinely like some idea on what the white fellas/AFL/Clubs should be doing if anything at all.

So if the white fellas/AFL/Clubs are looking at this from a white/western perspective how do we all move forward without offending??

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

OK, I'm a bit lost.

Is the suggest of an AFL academy the racist part, the 2 white parents or the tone and words he used? or everything.

Because, the reason I say this. Didn't someone suggest the AFL should be implementing an academy style football program at Victorian schools on EMT Sunday night?

This was suggested way before Matthew Rendell even broke his silence.

Why isn't everyone getting all bent out of shape at the person for suggesting.

I'm pro academy as it's about giving people a choice. Once you add that choice, you remove the stolen generation element of it and bring it back to an individual choice of improving their own life.

 

[Mego Red]

It is hard to imagine that thinking an academy to help isolated indigenous assimilate into AFL culture is something that would get someone fired.

Sure, maybe it's not the right thing to do - but fired?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

are those the ones with one white parent.

sorry couldn't resist

Boom!

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

First of all you will find that indigenous players have higher retention rate than non-indigenous players.

That's not quite what the issue is though.

Yes, lots of players get delisted. Don't have the talent, can't get a game, three years is the average length of an AFL career.

The issue being looked at by Misfud and co are the players who do have the talent and ability but still get spat out of the system prematurely.

 

[Allefgib]

Marngrook footy show to peak in its viewing this week you'd imagine.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Marngrook footy show to peak in its viewing this week you'd imagine.

Channel, time and day?

 

[Allefgib]

That's not quite what the issue is though.

Yes, lots of players get delisted. Don't have the talent, can't get a game, three years is the average length of an AFL career.

The issue being looked at by Misfud and co are the players who do have the talent and ability but still get spat out of the system prematurely.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the issue Misfud was looking for input on to do with the high attrition rates of indigenous players from the mroe remote communities - i.e. the ones more than likely to have the two indigenous parents and not to have been exposed to the big city life and all its incumbent expectations and responsibilties?

Not the attrition/retention rates of anyone who can claim an indigenous bloodline.

I'd be curious to see the comparison between the two (and two is a very narrow view) demographics.

 

[Mego Red]

Doesn't everyone in the AFL make sacrifices to succeed? No one is entitled to a spot. Offer people of all races and backgrounds the tools to succeed, and then you have to leave it up to them. How many industries are questioning themselves because people from the APY Lands can't immediately walk into a position with complete success?

 

[aneale]

Both rely upon ripping young aboriginal kids out of their communities, at a relatively young age, with the supposed intention of assimilating them into a predominantly white society.

You might not think that this is offensive.. but I can guarantee that there are a LOT of Aboriginals out there who would beg to differ.

the ridiculous thing about this is that I am aware of at least 36 Academies in this country that do this.

The Clontarf Football Academy (started by Gerard Neesham) is widely lauded by the entire country Indigenous and non as a marvel. If Rendell is a racist or insensitive, misguided or ignorant, what is Neesham. Read the history on the Clontarf Foundation site, it's postively KKK-esque given some of the attitudes in the last week. I'm surprised Mifsud hasn't stormed the gates with flaming pitchforks.

 

[Vader]

Hopefully he knows that most people in the community are supportive of him - most understand that his intentions were good, even if clumsily expressed.

Hear, hear!

The Stolen Generations lasted almost 100 years, were implemented mostly by state governments and had various justifications.

The genocide claim comes from when it was assumed that Aborigines were a dying race (19th to early 20th century race theory), but that children of mixed descent would continue on and be a problem for society. Thus they were taken from their parents in order to, in the words of the architect of the policy Cecil Cook, 'f*** em up white', or breed out the 'stain' of Aboriginality out of them and so kill off the remaining Aborigines and make Australia a solely white country.*

Hardly some well intentioned form of misplaced paternalism, although that was also used as a trumped up pretext in some forms of forced Indigenous child removal.

*Edit: This arguably fits the UN's definition of genocide

Fair cop. I've understated what went on back then by quite a fair margin. Can't argue with anything that you've written here, only recant my previous post.

 

[Allefgib]

Are we creating issues that don't need to exist by attempting to go out and convince indigenous players, in remote communities living quite traditional lives, to come and be part of the most professional and demanding sporting competition in the country?

Do such people, in general, want to be part of the AFL and all it entails?

What happens if they are used to celebrating in their boxers??

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Doesn't everyone in the AFL make sacrifices to succeed? No one is entitled to a spot. Offer people of all races and backgrounds the tools to succeed, and then you have to leave it up to them. How many industries are questioning themselves because people from the APY Lands can't immediately walk into a position with complete success?

I was under the impression, their are many programs in place specifically designed to help disadvantaged people acclimatise to that industries or occupations. Education has one for Indigenous students.

Doesn't the University of Adelaide (maybe Uni of South Australia) Law Degree have a scholarship in place to reward the highest placed Northern area student? Could be wrong but I thing it's called the David Pank Northern Areas High Achiever Scholarship

From my understanding, it designed to help and encourage students from a the low socio-economic area to become a lawyer. The student with the highest SACE score from that school (regardless of the score) gains a place into the law degree.

Not quite the same as football but it does demonstrate their are programs in place to help people succeed and it doesn't matter of their race, back ground or economic status.

 

[Allefgib]

Hear, hear!

Fair cop. I've understated what went on back then by quite a fair margin. Can't argue with anything that you've written here, only recant my previous post.

Jenny - I just want to highlight this as a positive outcome if you allow debate to take its natural course.

Sure pull up people name calling e.g. 'you aren't true supporters' but please allow people attempting to engage and debate a point to work through it and educate each other, and others following along.

(sorry that's a trifle churlish but I really think the point needs to be made strongly)

 

[aneale]

Do such people, in general, want to be part of the AFL and all it entails?

exactly.

The AFL, whether they like it or not, are a stuffy white Boys Club, and it's getting worse not better. It's overly beuracratic, over governed and places why to high an importance on itself.

The smoking, drinking party boys are gone. So are the 'footballer's in favour of 'athletes' and the 'individuals'.

You bend to the will of the AFL structure, or you piss off. Every 15 mins of your life is now structured for you, and if if there is tension between the rules and your culture, whatever that culture may be then there will casualties.

The AFL has a culture, cultures sometimes collide and more often than not one will win out. Just like the creeping Americanism of our own culture. The AFL is just a series of round holes, and you need to fit it. Conform, or don't, but the square pegs are becoming few and far between and eventually they won't exist as the AFL storms forward.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Slightly different.

A kid from New Zealand is used to city living, a kid from the country is used to internet exposure.

Kids from the country would likely be in the TAC system already, training loads wouldn't be as vast.

Matt's idea has a lot of credit to it. His wording (used to try and get a point across to show the importance of the situation) was poor.

What the bet that Rendell's idea, or a variation of it, is adopted by the AFL in the future?

Sort of like when Greg Blewett was hauled over the coals for saying that it was a bit hard to accept when your career gets decided by 'a bunch of volunteers.'

Redbacks selectors at the time were in volunteer, unpaid roles.

Blewett was canned for his comments but the next season they brought in paid selectors

You were right, Blewey. But you still can't say it.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I was under the impression, their are many programs in place specifically designed to help disadvantaged people acclimatise to that industries or occupations. Education has one for Indigenous students.

Doesn't the University of Adelaide (maybe Uni of South Australia) Law Degree have a scholarship in place to reward the highest placed Northern area student? Could be wrong but I thing it's called the David Pank Northern Areas High Achiever Scholarship

From my understanding, it designed to help and encourage students from a the low socio-economic area to become a lawyer. The student with the highest SACE score from that school (regardless of the score) gains a place into the law degree.

Not quite the same as football but it does demonstrate their are programs in place to help people succeed and it doesn't matter of their race, back ground or economic status.

I reckon that Rostrevor College already has an indigenous sports academy for indigenous kids from the Northern Territory. Was headed up by Che C-C for a while?

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

I reckon that Rostrevor College already has an indigenous sports academy for indigenous kids from the Northern Territory. Was headed up by Che C-C for a while?

Yeah, he did.

He borrowed the idea from the South Australian Indigenous Sports Training Academy that was funding by the Premiers office and the South Australian Social Inclusion Unit.

 

[JP Sauce]

Mifsud now retweeting some negative messages he received... weird.

Damian ‏ @dmccann65
@jason_mifsud Congrats on the damage to Rendell, an innocent man hung out to dry. When are you going to have the guts to stand up?
Retweeted by jason mifsud

TMT ‏ @TMT17
@jason_mifsud your the type of bloke I want to go to war with, I'm suicidal and wouldn't mind getting stabbed in the back. #backstabber
Retweeted by jason mifsud

Mark Richards ‏ @richardmarx1
@jason_mifsud had Andy D written your speech yet? #puppet
Retweeted by jason mifsud

Neither of mine yet though haha

 

[King Elvis]

Chasing sympathy?

 

[bjn1960]

Yeah, he did.

He borrowed the idea from the South Australian Indigenous Sports Training Academy that was funding by the Premiers office and the South Australian Social Inclusion Unit.

Scotch College was doing something along those lines in the 70's. I remember boarding with several lads from the Point Pearce, one playing for Woodville, if memory seerves.

 

[Bicks]

Mifsud now retweeting some negative messages he received... weird.


Damian ‏ @dmccann65
@jason_mifsud Congrats on the damage to Rendell, an innocent man hung out to dry. When are you going to have the guts to stand up?
Retweeted by jason mifsud

TMT ‏ @TMT17
@jason_mifsud your the type of bloke I want to go to war with, I'm suicidal and wouldn't mind getting stabbed in the back. #backstabber
Retweeted by jason mifsud

Mark Richards ‏ @richardmarx1
@jason_mifsud had Andy D written your speech yet? #puppet
Retweeted by jason mifsud


Neither of mine yet though haha

Hmmmmm!!

Poor old Jason got a guilty conscience or what???

By his "retweeting" looks like he's playing the sympathy card...

Got news for you Jase, IMO your getting your just deserts mate!!!

 

[fatbarber]

Probably been said before but first time for me so though I would repeat!!!

"Between January and Rendell's forced resignation on Friday, the AFL has negotiated for several million of dollars of government grants for an indigenous program in Darwin and a significant sponsorship from Australia Post to support the league's multi-cultural programs."

That's a quote from Michelangelo Rucci (Mar 19).

Australia Post is run by Ahmed Fahour, brother of Ali Fahour who now works for the AFL as National Multi Cultural manager

This is getting alarming.

 

[Elite Crow]

Why do we all have Howe sponsorship?

 

[SydCrow]

Mifsud now retweeting some negative messages he received... weird.

Damian ‏ @dmccann65
@jason_mifsud Congrats on the damage to Rendell, an innocent man hung out to dry. When are you going to have the guts to stand up?
Retweeted by jason mifsud

TMT ‏ @TMT17
@jason_mifsud your the type of bloke I want to go to war with, I'm suicidal and wouldn't mind getting stabbed in the back. #backstabber
Retweeted by jason mifsud

Mark Richards ‏ @richardmarx1
@jason_mifsud had Andy D written your speech yet? #puppet
Retweeted by jason mifsud

Neither of mine yet though haha

Poor Jason, he's just ....

MIFSUDerstood