Maxwell Should Settle In The Backline

[daics cousin]

Just thought i'd throw this thread out there.I don't have any reservations with our midfield ,forward line,or our ruck division this year.
Our backline is still solid,but a big hole left with Clement departing.Heath
Shaw can take over in the backline because he reads the play so well,but he is not tall enough to take the bigger forwards.
Maxwell should be settled into the backline ,not moved all over the ground.
This will allow him,to settle in a permenant postion and he will becaome an even better player.I know we have cox,and obrien to take that centre half back slot,but maxwell could be the man to take over from where jimmy left off.What do you guys think?

 

[loki04]

Just thought i'd throw this thread out there.I don't have any reservations with our midfield ,forward line,or our ruck division this year.
Our backline is still solid,but a big hole left with Clement departing.Heath
Shaw can take over in the backline because he reads the play so well,but he is not tall enough to take the bigger forwards.
Maxwell should be settled into the backline ,not moved all over the ground.
This will allow him,to settle in a permenant postion and he will becaome an even better player.I know we have cox,and obrien to take that centre half back slot,but maxwell could be the man to take over from where jimmy left off.What do you guys think?

He will never be a KPP as he is not good enough or big enough to go with the good CHF/FF in the game, i really can't see him changing from what we saw last year.
The only reason they moved him up forward last year was becuase he was struggling down back and they couldn't find a suitable match up for him.

 

[Pecked by a Pie]

Sometimes you need to have one forward who is going to fight really hard to keep the ball in and set an example for the others. At times he can play forward - hope those are few and far between.

 

[loki04]

Sometimes you need to have one forward who is going to fight really hard to keep the ball in and set an example for the others. At times he can play forward - hope those are few and far between.

that role looks to be filled by medders also all forwards should be doing it.

 

[push3r]

I'm not sure that Maxwell will ever become our general as such, however he does hold a very important role in our team. His ability to compliment players like Shaw and O'Brien in defence with his attack on the ball is invaluable and I'm sure his prescence on the ground is going to be nothing but a plus when guys like Anthony and Brown finally hit the main stage. I agree that he may want to try and firm a place in the backline but he has upsides as a pinch hitting forward at times as well. I trust that MM will use him as needed and to the best of his ability.

 

[Pecked by a Pie]

Don't think so Lok - his mind set is different. Leon probably the only one. Rusling no - can't tackle yet. Rocca too slow. Cloke - partly but more an aerial attacking threat.

Maxwell only real blue collar type

 

[Pecked by a Pie]

Don't think so Lok - his mind set is different. Leon probably the only one. Rusling no - can't tackle yet. Rocca too slow. Cloke - partly but more an aerial attacking threat.

Maxwell only real blue collar type

 

[doppleganger]

I know we have cox,and obrien to take that centre half back slot,but maxwell could be the man to take over from where jimmy left off.What do you guys think?

Maxwell simply aint as good as Clement. Not as good a one on one defender, and not as creative and attacking. H.Shaw or Cox better options as attacking general types like Clement was.

Max aint that good on the quality forwards either.

He needs to be played on a weaker opponent and zone off, bit like J.Cloke used to.

 

[loki04]

I'm not sure that Maxwell will ever become our general as such, however he does hold a very important role in our team. His ability to compliment players like Shaw and O'Brien in defence with his attack on the ball is invaluable and I'm sure his prescence on the ground is going to be nothing but a plus when guys like Anthony and Brown finally hit the main stage. I agree that he may want to try and firm a place in the backline but he has upsides as a pinch hitting forward at times as well. I trust that MM will use him as needed and to the best of his ability.

Presence lol he isn't an enforcer he is known for putting his body on the line getting crunched and getting back up, more often than not he comes off 2nd best bar the rooke tackle which was a beauty. Also before anyone refers to it yes he came off 2nd best in the Brown collision as Brown had slight concussion but Maxwell broke his friggen leg., Sollomon also smashed him.

 

[Zeke]

He is and always will be a utility.

 

[loki04]

Don't think so Lok - his mind set is different. Leon probably the only one. Rusling no - can't tackle yet. Rocca too slow. Cloke - partly but more an aerial attacking threat.

Maxwell only real blue collar type

Medhurst grew more into it as the season wore on and Davis is also good at chasing down opponents, Rusling needs to be told to be a bit more aggresive defensively, agree Rocca is too slow.

 

[SIDE BY SIDE]

He is just like J.Cloke but he can kick and has a footy brain or at least more then Cloke ever did. Has to be on the third tall or a player we try and get free to be the third man up or cut off passes that come in. Not good enough one on one against the better players but we have people for that.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

He is and always will be a utility.

Mainly a defensive utility, but a utility all the same

 

[push3r]

Presence lol he isn't an enforcer he is known for putting his body on the line getting crunched and getting back up, more often than not he comes off 2nd best bar the rooke tackle which was a beauty. Also before anyone refers to it yes he came off 2nd best in the Brown collision as Brown had slight concussion but Maxwell broke his friggen leg., Sollomon also smashed him.

I never actually said that he was an enforcer, merely that if you have someone who attacks the ball without fear of how he may come off that sends a positive message to the team. Whether he hurts the opposition physically is irrelevant, he is always trying to do the team things.
You yourself have noted that regardless of whether or not he comes off second best, he is always quick to get back up and into the contest.

 

[loki04]

I never actually said that he was an enforcer, merely that if you have someone who attacks the ball without fear of how he may come off that sends a positive message to the team. Whether he hurts the opposition physically is irrelevant, he is always trying to do the team things.
You yourself have noted that regardless of whether or not he comes off second best, he is always quick to get back up and into the contest.

yeah sorry jumped the gun a bit because since the end of the season people have been talking him up like he is a gun player that strikes fear into the opposition when in reality he is an average but courageous player that hasn't even played well for a full season yet.

But he has a role and i agree he attacks things with 100% which is a great example to the youngsters, Maxwell turns 25 so he is hitting his prime lets hope he can put together a full season worth of games like his last six.

 

[Pie eyed]

He will never be a KPP as he is not good enough or big enough to go with the good CHF/FF in the game, i really can't see him changing from what we saw last year.
The only reason they moved him up forward last year was becuase he was struggling down back and they couldn't find a suitable match up for him.

I am really looking forward to you being comprehensively proven wrong in the next few years.
I think Maxwell has all the qualities, not necessarily physical, to be a stand-out player and a huge asset for the Collingwood Club.
So many supposedly "average" players who have been "pidgeon-holed" over the last thirty odd years have risen up to be one of, if not the most, important player at a given club it is not funny, but always satisfying.

 

[loki04]

I am really looking forward to you being comprehensively proven wrong in the next few years.
I think Maxwell has all the qualities, not necessarily physical, to be a stand-out player and a huge asset for the Collingwood Club.
So many supposedly "average" players who have been "pidgeon-holed" over the last thirty odd years have risen up to be one of, if not the most, important player at a given club it is not funny, but always satisfying.

and yet he hasn't ever shown the ability to subdue his opponents regularly he didnt even beat Staker who is a 3rd tall in the semi , he plays the 3rd man up and very loose which is why 90% of FF and CHF towel him. He is almost 25 so if he was ever going to be a linch pin in defence this year is it, if he does so successfully great but from what hes shown its unlikely unless he gets alot bigger and stronger.

 

[mdc]

and yet he hasn't ever shown the ability to subdue his opponents regularly he didnt even beat Staker who is a 3rd tall in the semi , he plays the 3rd man up and very loose which is why 90% of FF and CHF towel him. He is almost 25 so if he was ever going to be a linch pin in defence this year is it, if he does so successfully great but from what hes shown its unlikely unless he gets alot bigger and stronger.

He absolutely destroyed both CHF Ryan O'Keefe and CHF Nathan Ablett, playing one-on-one against both. Finals matter, right?

And I'm still waiting on a list of guys who supposedly "towel" him apart from Mitch Clark in the Brisbane game.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

He ain't much chop as a full-time defender, he's best used as a utility to create matchup problems for the opposition.

 

[loki04]

He absolutely destroyed both CHF Ryan O'Keefe and CHF Nathan Ablett, playing one-on-one against both. Finals matter, right?

And I'm still waiting on a list of guys who supposedly "towel" him apart from Mitch Clark in the Brisbane game.

O'keefe is NOT a CHF, N.Ablett is a young and also inconsistant forward so both aren't big scalps.
Rnds 1-15 Maxwells opponents beat him clearly and most were there teams 3rd option lets see what the J.Browns, Hall , Fevola, Pavlich, Tarrant Reivwoldts of the AFL do to him, becuase as a FB/CHB these will be his opponents.
Also by toweling I don't mean by just goals kicked I'm also reffering to setting up play that results in a shot on goal, being a link man ect.

 

[doppleganger]

He absolutely destroyed both CHF Ryan O'Keefe and CHF Nathan Ablett, playing one-on-one against both. Finals matter, right?

And I'm still waiting on a list of guys who supposedly "towel" him apart from Mitch Clark in the Brisbane game.

Harry O and Goldsack were getting the tough jobs on the best KP players when Clement went down. Malthouse had more faith in those kids to try and stop the gun players instead of Maxwell.

The point being that with Clement out all year, Presti out most of the year, Maxwell was still overlooked against the majority of dangerous forwards.

 

[Pie eyed]

Again, I can't wait for him to prove you wrong.
He has something....Collingwood can see it and hopefully they are right.

 

[mdc]

O'keefe is NOT a CHF, N.Ablett is a young and also inconsistant forward so both aren't big scalps.
Rnds 1-15 Maxwells opponents beat him clearly and most were there teams 3rd option lets see what the J.Browns, Hall , Fevola, Pavlich, Tarrant Reivwoldts of the AFL do to him, becuase as a FB/CHB these will be his opponents.
Also by toweling I don't mean by just goals kicked I'm also reffering to setting up play that results in a shot on goal, being a link man ect.

O'Keefe is Sydney's CHF. Using CAPS won't make your argument any more persuasive.

The bolded bit is a joke. I ask you once again...name the opponents that beat Maxwell clearly.

Harry O and Goldsack were getting the tough jobs on the best KP players when Clement went down. Malthouse had more faith in those kids to try and stop the gun players instead of Maxwell.

The point being that with Clement out all year, Presti out most of the year, Maxwell was still overlooked against the majority of dangerous forwards.

Harry was getting the tough jobs because he's our best one-on-one defender...it's not an indictment on Maxwell.

Goldsack's reputation as a defender is bloated out of proportion. He did well in beating the old O'Loughlin a couple of times (even though O'Loughlin still kicked several goals). On the other hand, his job on Stokes in the first quarter of the Geelong game might have cost us the match.

Clement and Presti are both very different players. Maxwell will never be a FB, because that takes him out of the play too much...but he can certainly play CHB at times, and he can do a reasonable job against most opponents.

I personally don't think he's a full-time defender, but that doesn't mean he can't be effective when he plays there - he's shown he can be. It's just sometimes he'll be more useful up the field.

 

[loki04]

O'Keefe is Sydney's CHF. Using CAPS won't make your argument any more persuasive.

The bolded bit is a joke. I ask you once again...name the opponents that beat Maxwell clearly.

If you rewatch most the games up till his form reversal 4 goal against brisbane you will get those names, quite often his opponents set up goals or kicked them directly not every game but a fair few. People tend to remember recent games more so but i remember a lot calling for him to be dropped at the time then jumped back on his bandwagon when his form picked up.
I'm not debating his position in the 22 my qualm is the continual overrating of him and if he is good enough to hold down a key post ie beating quality opponents like Brown and Hall the answer is no.
He has a role and does add value but there were times last year his continual selection despite poor form was in question.

 

[mdc]

O'Keefe is Sydney's CHF. Using CAPS won't make your argument any more persuasive.

The bolded bit is a joke. I ask you once again...name the opponents that beat Maxwell clearly.

If you rewatch most the games up till his form reversal 4 goal against brisbane you will get those names, quite often his opponents set up goals or kicked them directly not every game but a fair few. People tend to remember recent games more so but i remember a lot calling for him to be dropped at the time then jumped back on his bandwagon when his form picked up.
I'm not debating his position in the 22 my qualm is the continual overrating of him and if he is good enough to hold down a key post ie beating quality opponents like Brown and Hall the answer is no.
He has a role and does add value but there were times last year his continual selection despite poor form was in question.

I'm not going to rewatch every game to try to prove your point for you

There's no doubt he played better in the second half of the season and the finals. You choose to view it as a long streak of luck. I choose to view it as natural improvement from a player who works harder than most.

He's never going to beat guys like Jonathan Brown because no-one really beats Jonathan Brown. I never even said he was our best option at CHB - I think Harry wins that position comfortably. But depending on matchups, he can certainly do a good job in a key position if asked, and he's proven that in big matches.

Maybe we've all been spoilt by having watched Clement and Presti for so many years...they were both All-Australian grade defensive players. It's just not fair to compare our young defenders to those guys.

If you look around the league at the average standard of KP defensive players...Maxwell measures up just fine.