Oppo Camp Non Geelong football (AFL) discussion 2022, part II

[AM]

Interesting.

View attachment 1641719

Another club bans Channel Seven's Daisy Pearce from changerooms

The AFLW icon is juggling an assistant coaching role with Channel 7 commitments.

www.sen.com.au

Don't think anyone directly connected to another club should have free access to opposition clubrooms. That also applies to off-field people such as presidents and board members.

Interestingly the same standard as that applied to Daisy isn't applied to Jenkins - yet anyway.

 

[cats_09]

They're just not serious about it.

This reads a little like the old, “reduction for a good record”…

But the Tribunal decided the offence was serious enough to warrant four games, with chairman Jeff Gleeson offering a warning to all players.

"We repeat tonight, players must do all they reasonable can not to cause avoidable head injuries to fellow players," Gleeson said.

"Every player is now taken to be aware of the damaging and sometimes long-term consequences of concussion.

"If not for the early guilty plea to all elements of the charge and the clear contrition (shown by Broad), our starting point for the sanction may have been more than four matches, but taking into account all the circumstances I've mentioned, we start with a base sanction of four matches."

 

[Cataholic]

This reads a little like the old, “reduction for a good record”…

But the Tribunal decided the offence was serious enough to warrant four games, with chairman Jeff Gleeson offering a warning to all players.

"We repeat tonight, players must do all they reasonable can not to cause avoidable head injuries to fellow players," Gleeson said.

"Every player is now taken to be aware of the damaging and sometimes long-term consequences of concussion.

"If not for the early guilty plea to all elements of the charge and the clear contrition (shown by Broad), our starting point for the sanction may have been more than four matches, but taking into account all the circumstances I've mentioned, we start with a base sanction of four matches."

The AFL just doesn't get it. It's pathetic.

Being sorry after the event doesn't cut it, and the AFL shouldn't be fooled by crocodile tears.

If it's genuine in its desire to eradicate this from our game it must refuse any consideration of prior behaviour and contrition, and punish such acts far more forcefully.

 

[rocker_oz33]

JDG did a tackle a bit like that to the hawks ruck I think meek.
Got off .

I feel the AFL wants the best players to be playing RD one .
And meek was fine.
Again outcome based ..not action

 

[catsfootyfan89]

The AFL just doesn't get it. It's pathetic.

Being sorry after the event doesn't cut it, and the AFL shouldn't be fooled by crocodile tears.

If it's genuine in its desire to eradicate this from our game it must refuse any consideration of prior behaviour and contrition, and punish such acts far more forcefully.

What would you say is a more appropriate penalty?

 

[Cataholic]

What would you say is a more appropriate penalty?

6

 

[catsfootyfan89]

6

While I do agree with you that 4 isn't enough, it's interesting to see how much the penalties are going up over the years. From memory, didn't Hall get 7 for punching Staker square in the face and knocking him out?

Whatever the case, if the AFL really wants to change things, the penalties simply have to get more extreme. To the point that players will have it in the backs of their minds when they're playing.

The bumps I can actually be more sympathetic towards, because the error margins are so much smaller and things are happening so much faster. But Broad's tackle was just pure rampant stupidity. Already had him completely wrapped up, so he wasn't going anywhere. Then just dumps him a second later because... why exactly?

It does make you wonder - what kind of penalty is actually needed to change things? Would ten matches do it? I actually think the penalties should start becoming salary-inclusive as well. Take a player salary, average it out over the 22 games, work out how much they get paid per game, and sanction the player for that amount as well as the ban.

For example, let's say you're a 500k player. 500/22 = 22k per game roughly. If you get 5 weeks for a sling tackle, you also get 110k redacted from your contract that season. And the money from the salary can be paid to the AFL and be spent on the betterment of the competition.

I'm sure this would raise a lot of eyebrows, but if you're truly looking for a way to stamp out the stuff you don't like, this would definitely do it.

 

[Cataholic]

While I do agree with you that 4 isn't enough, it's interesting to see how much the penalties are going up over the years. From memory, didn't Hall get 7 for punching Staker square in the face and knocking him out?

Whatever the case, if the AFL really wants to change things, the penalties simply have to get more extreme. To the point that players will have it in the backs of their minds when they're playing.

The bumps I can actually be more sympathetic towards, because the error margins are so much smaller and things are happening so much faster. But Broad's tackle was just pure rampant stupidity. Already had him completely wrapped up, so he wasn't going anywhere. Then just dumps him a second later because... why exactly?

It does make you wonder - what kind of penalty is actually needed to change things? Would ten matches do it? I actually think the penalties should start becoming salary-inclusive as well. Take a player salary, average it out over the 22 games, work out how much they get paid per game, and sanction the player for that amount as well as the ban.

For example, let's say you're a 500k player. 500/22 = 22k per game roughly. If you get 5 weeks for a sling tackle, you also get 110k redacted from your contract that season. And the money from the salary can be paid to the AFL and be spent on the betterment of the competition.

I'm sure this would raise a lot of eyebrows, but if you're truly looking for a way to stamp out the stuff you don't like, this would definitely do it.

Your second paragraph encapsulates my thoughts.

If they truly want to stamp that stuff out they simply must wield a much bigger stick and really give the players something to think about.

Your monetary idea is an interesting one, and something I hadn't considered.

 

[Strange Cat]

Agreed for the dog acts like the sling tackle and punches or elbows for example there needs to be a very very lengthy holiday

The fact that Judd got rewarded a brownlow for splitting Pav’s face open saids it all

 

[4quarter_cat]

There will always be dog acts on the football field whilst the culture around the players accepts them. As Australians the culture our colonial past makes us inclined to use punitive measures to dissuade people, but research shows that isn't a very effective way of changing peoples behaviour (speeding for example) I'm not saying there shouldn't be a punishment, there definitely should be, but that won't actually help that much to change players behaviour.

Culturally that runs all the way down to junior footy, not just at the elite level.

I don't know how you fix that, but I'd say you start by looking at coaching methods and singleing out protection of the head and tackle technique as a fundamental component of all coaching courses and Auskick.

 

[Strange Cat]

There will always be dog acts on the football field whilst the culture around the players accepts them. As Australians the culture our colonial past makes us inclined to use punitive measures to dissuade people, but research shows that isn't a very effective way of changing peoples behaviour (speeding for example) I'm not saying there shouldn't be a punishment, there definitely should be, but that won't actually help that much to change players behaviour.

Culturally that runs all the way down to junior footy, not just at the elite level.

I don't know how you fix that, but I'd say you start by looking at coaching methods and singleing out protection of the head and tackle technique as a fundamental component of all coaching courses and Auskick.

Simple solution would be to de register multiple repeat offenders as the likes of Toby Greene for example instead of making him a captain for example

But the $$$ talks over the player’s health

 

[RobPearce28]

Your second paragraph encapsulates my thoughts.

If they truly want to stamp that stuff out they simply must wield a much bigger stick and really give the players something to think about.

Your monetary idea is an interesting one, and something I hadn't considered.

There will always be dog acts on the football field whilst the culture around the players accepts them. As Australians the culture our colonial past makes us inclined to use punitive measures to dissuade people, but research shows that isn't a very effective way of changing peoples behaviour (speeding for example) I'm not saying there shouldn't be a punishment, there definitely should be, but that won't actually help that much to change players behaviour.

Culturally that runs all the way down to junior footy, not just at the elite level.

I don't know how you fix that, but I'd say you start by looking at coaching methods and singleing out protection of the head and tackle technique as a fundamental component of all coaching courses and Auskick.

I’ve been a follower here for a few years but never posted.

The issue with bumps and dangerous tackles in just 2 rounds seems to be as bad as ever despite eduction and the words from the afl. But the one that has me incensed is the Kosy Picket one where his feet left the ground to bump. It should have gone straight to the tribunal. I thought at one stage the rulings took into account if you left the ground.

He should have been given 4

 

[goyoucatters]

He should have been given 4

Minimum.

Absolute disgrace, and further evidence of the AFL being nothing more than hot air about the issue of player safety and well-being.

 

[4quarter_cat]

Simple solution would be to de register multiple repeat offenders as the likes of Toby Greene for example instead of making him a captain for example

But the $$$ talks over the player’s health

It's not that simple though is it. The AFL is never going to cut it's nose off to spite their face. The better solution is that someone plays the game like Toby Greene is never drafted in the first place. Far better to just get the good parts of Toby with an under developed as opposed to over developed dick head gland.

 

[Strange Cat]

It's not that simple though is it. The AFL is never going to cut it's nose off to spite their face. The better solution is that someone plays the game like Toby Greene is never drafted in the first place. Far better to just get the good parts of Toby with an under developed as opposed to over developed dick head gland.

I agree however my point is that if you continually do dog acts and act like a dickhead at what point is it worth having the player in the system ?

 

[Partridge]

The AFL just doesn't get it. It's pathetic.

Being sorry after the event doesn't cut it, and the AFL shouldn't be fooled by crocodile tears.

If it's genuine in its desire to eradicate this from our game it must refuse any consideration of prior behaviour and contrition, and punish such acts far more forcefully.

It seemed to for us when Tom Stewart did it though.

That's why every player does it now.

 

[Strange Cat]

It seemed to for us when Tom Stewart did it though.

That's why every player does it now.

To be fair he genuinely looked distressed all night after the incident so I don’t doubt the sincerity

 

[4quarter_cat]

I agree however my point is that ifzz you continually do dog acts and act like a dickhead at what point is it worth having the player in the system ?

I do take your point.

You gotta look at motivations. Do we want expell the Toby Greene's from the league? Tom Stewart would be gone too. Or do we look at what is motivating the behaviour and take that away.

For example like high or in the back. Take away any in game motivation and it will just stop happening.

 

[Strange Cat]

I do take your point.

You gotta look at motivations. Do we want expell the Toby Greene's from the league? Tom Stewart would be gone too. Or do we look at what is motivating the behaviour and take that away.

For example like high or in the back. Take away any in game motivation and it will just stop happening.

Why not both? You can’t have results without a deterrent

 

[Cataholic]

It seemed to for us when Tom Stewart did it though.

That's why every player does it now.

Doesn't = shouldn't.

Going forward contrition should not be considered a mitigating factor.

And Stewart getting 4 only reinforces my belief that Broad should've got 6.

 

[4quarter_cat]

Why not both? You can’t have results without a deterrent

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I do think players should be suspended. Just that upping the penalty won't reduce the behaviour very much. Stronger in game deterrents would though because it remove any perceived in game benefit.

 

[And_ROOS]

It seemed to for us when Tom Stewart did it though.

That's why every player does it now.

Did Stewart argue for a lower sentence though? Richmond argued for 3 weeks due to being remorseful, contacting the player he tackled and apologising, etc etc.

 

[Partridge]

Did Stewart argue for a lower sentence though? Richmond argued for 3 weeks due to being remorseful, contacting the player he tackled and apologising, etc etc.

Sure did. They tried to get it lowered to 3. The rest was similar too instead of it being a bump instead of a tackle.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Under the table ....

Did you hear about the salary cap breach in the GCA this summer?
Bell Park due to be promoted sent the wrong excel spreadsheet to the league.

They sent the sheet showing all their under the table deals. Not the hush hush clean as copy
Had their promotion rejected. Funny that.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Doesn't = shouldn't.

Going forward contrition should not be considered a mitigating factor.

And Stewart getting 4 only reinforces my belief that Broad should've got 6.

Nah. A month for Broad is fair enough IMO.
The 6-8 week bans should be for the utterly repulsive acts. Like king hits.