Opinion Our Midfield

[BM123]

Yep Gibbs will win BnF this year!

Must re-sign him.

Agree with previous comments get Cripps and Graham into the engine room get The Juddster and Carrots back also and looking more tasty.

Robinson and McLean May need to make way as Curnow appears to be locking himself into the best 22.

So midfield of Murph, Gibbs, Daisy, Judd, Carrots, Curnow, Cripps, Graham, Bell.

Can we play all 3 of Bell, Cripps & Graham in same team?

Don't see why not.

 

[mikeythemoocow]

What's it say that Davey Ellard and Ed Curnow were 2 of our best? Well?

That we have two players in the team that at least have a dip every game they play.

 

[Silvagnis]

Not sure about playing Cripps, Graham, Bell, Mclean, etc. At this stage, I doubt that PC has the fitness to man up and push back hard. Poor efforts by our boys to allow their opponents and quality kicks acres of space. Training drill with Westhoff marking one out then passing to Gray one out. No one could stop those lace out passes without a third man in or players filling up space.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Agree re menzel. Absolutely wasted yesterday. Is he going to be a gun midfielder or more of an impact fwd tho? I hope its the former.

A gun midfielder mmmmm, Ollie Wines, Jaegar Omera, Lachie Whitfield, Brad Crouch all in there 2nd season, all 4 are already established midfielders and who don't need to work on fitness.. If Menzel was going to be the future gun you are claiming, he would have shown a lot more than he currently has.

 

[thylacine60]

ffs

 

[Magruder]

A gun midfielder mmmmm, Ollie Wines, Jaegar Omera, Lachie Whitfield, Brad Crouch all in there 2nd season, all 4 are already established midfielders and who don't need to work on fitness.. If Menzel was going to be the future gun you are claiming, he would have shown a lot more than he currently has.

correct me if I'm wrong:

O'Meara is effectively in his third year, Crouch was a mature ager, has Whitfield really demonstrated superior fitness?
I'll give you Wines though, he's a man-child freak.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

correct me if I'm wrong:

O'Meara is effectively in his third year, Crouch was a mature ager, has Whitfield really demonstrated superior fitness?
I'll give you Wines though, he's a man-child freak.

You are correct Omeara & Crouch are both 6 months older than Menzel so perhaps should be slightly a head in development, and both taken as 17 yo so would have an extra preseason under the belts so definitely would have a better engine. Still the point I was trying to make and probably not that well, is that from each draft there would only be a handful of midfielders that turn into genuine A grade quality guns, and the 4 I listed are simply that far in front of Menzel that if he is going to be in that class then I just think he would have shown more.. It might be MM's fault for not giving him the opportunity, like wasting him by having him sit on the bench for 3/4s.

 

[Magruder]

You are correct Omeara & Crouch are both 6 months older than Menzel so perhaps should be slightly a head in development, and both taken as 17 yo so would have an extra preseason under the belts so definitely would have a better engine. Still the point I was trying to make and probably not that well, is that from each draft there would only be a handful of midfielders that turn into genuine A grade quality guns, and the 4 I listed are simply that far in front of Menzel that if he is going to be in that class then I just think he would have shown more.. It might be MM's fault for not giving him the opportunity, like wasting him by having him sit on the bench for 3/4s.

Should not be on the bench. This may be pumping Menzel's tyres a bit much but I think of him as a Stevie J type. May not develop the tank to play in the middle until say his 5th-6th season, until then we have a classy high half foward. Doesn't help in the short-term but I can't see how playing him as the sub helps.

He and Lucas should be playing similar roles, rotating from HFF to wing. Lucas say 70% mid.

Agree with your view that he is unlikely to be a key component of a successful midfield set-up in the short-term.

 

[Sector 7G]

You are correct Omeara & Crouch are both 6 months older than Menzel so perhaps should be slightly a head in development, and both taken as 17 yo so would have an extra preseason under the belts so definitely would have a better engine. Still the point I was trying to make and probably not that well, is that from each draft there would only be a handful of midfielders that turn into genuine A grade quality guns, and the 4 I listed are simply that far in front of Menzel that if he is going to be in that class then I just think he would have shown more.. It might be MM's fault for not giving him the opportunity, like wasting him by having him sit on the bench for 3/4s.

I was expecting Gary Ablett to show as much as Judd in his first couple of years as well. Most people had him pegged as an overrated small forward who did a few flashy things after his first couple of years. Some players are simply ready to go day 1 and then stall like Rich or Palmer, some take time.

The player most often compared to Menzel would be Stevie J, who took his time to become the player he is. Menzel is also coming off an interrupted preparation in 2013.

 

[Magruder]

I was expecting Gary Ablett to show as much as Judd in his first couple of years as well. Most people had him pegged as an overrated small forward who did a few flashy things after his first couple of years. Some players are simply ready to go day 1 and then stall like Rich or Palmer, some take time.

The player most often compared to Menzel would be Stevie J, who took his time to become the player he is. Menzel is also coming off an interrupted preparation in 2013.

Well put. Exactly what I was trying to say.

 

[gbatman]

Carlton needs some class and polish and quality depth in our midfield. Mclean, Bell and Robinson aren't up to it if we are to go into the top 4. Replace them with Carrazzo, Cripps and Judd and things start to look much brighter. Need some players like Fyfe in our team. Got no doubt Cripps could have the same output as Bell Currently does and with better ball use. Judd is easily a better upgrade on Robinson and Carrazzo is very similar to Mclean but he can run, offers more defensively and has better evasive skills in close.

On a positive note, David Ellard may be a bloke who may have gone up a level and may relish playing under Malthouse. He's that midfield/forward who has a real go and tackles with intent, kicks goals and may now be able to find the footy. He was really good the other night and just may have a role in our team.

Graham is a guy I'd like to see go to the next level and that is playing some games where he gets it 35-40 times in the VFL and also kicking the odd goal. He will be one who I see replacing Mclean. Mclean is a good ball winner and uses it alright but gee he gets burnt when the opposition have it.

Fairly interested in seeing how Nick Holman goes, could just be the sort of guy to give us a real lift in the middle of the ground.

The sub rule is killing the development of young players. Menzel got nothing out of the other night and you really can't have your better experienced players on there can you? Our maybe you can, maybe Scotland fits the sub position.

 

[Blue Flame]

Here we go again.
Menzel will be awesome, and desperately what we need. Leave him alone.
Why don't we have ready-made stars like Wines, O'Meara, Crouch?
To attract that kind of quality you need fairly high picks, same reason we do not have Boyd.

Having said that, I think the issue we have with our midfield is that we don not have enough natural accumulators. We seem to have a lot of players who can claim around 20 disposals, whereas I think we need a few who are capable of having it on a string. If Carrazzo returns to peak form you won't recognise our midfield. For the same reason, I think we need to be developing Graham in the firsts, and Buckley needs to be down back. Both find the ball naturally, and need to develop their vision and awareness under pressure. Excited for Cripps for the same reason.

 

[Magruder]

Carlton needs some class and polish and quality depth in our midfield. Mclean, Bell and Robinson aren't up to it if we are to go into the top 4. Replace them with Carrazzo, Cripps and Judd and things start to look much brighter. Need some players like Fyfe in our team. Got no doubt Cripps could have the same output as Bell Currently does and with better ball use. Judd is easily a better upgrade on Robinson and Carrazzo is very similar to Mclean but he can run, offers more defensively and has better evasive skills in close.

On a positive note, David Ellard may be a bloke who may have gone up a level and may relish playing under Malthouse. He's that midfield/forward who has a real go and tackles with intent, kicks goals and may now be able to find the footy. He was really good the other night and just may have a role in our team.

Graham is a guy I'd like to see go to the next level and that is playing some games where he gets it 35-40 times in the VFL and also kicking the odd goal. He will be one who I see replacing Mclean. Mclean is a good ball winner and uses it alright but gee he gets burnt when the opposition have it.

Fairly interested in seeing how Nick Holman goes, could just be the sort of guy to give us a real lift in the middle of the ground.

The sub rule is killing the development of young players. Menzel got nothing out of the other night and you really can't have your better experienced players on there can you? Our maybe you can, maybe Scotland fits the sub position.

I still think there is room for Bell in the mid group, but Robbo is a role player. (Defensive forward perhaps or wet weather specialist)

Any thoughts why Bell was subbed out rather than a ruckman?

 

[serenityNow]

Judd is still number 1, he rolls up with the 100% more often then anyone else. Still the best leader too.

Curnow is in our best 22 every week imo.

I dont see Robbo in the side for much longer. Good Skills are so important, he doesn't have em.

 

[BluStreak]

Just throwing this in but imo I would play Cachia instead of Robbo (at the moment).
Cachia is hard at the ball and appears to have more composure when he has the ball.
I do not believe we would lose anything that Robbo is delivering by swapping in Cachia.

 

[BIGGUS 64]

The sub rule is killing the development of young players. Menzel got nothing out of the other night and you really can't have your better experienced players on there can you? Our maybe you can, maybe Scotland fits the sub position.

And why only sub him on 8 minutes into the final quarter, when Port were already taking the game away from us? Should rather bring the fresh legs on halfway through the third quarter, when the game is still in the balance. That's when he can do some good, and by then we should also know who is having a shocker and needs to be subbed out.

 

[Blue Flame]

And why only sub him on 8 minutes into the final quarter, when Port were already taking the game away from us? Should rather bring the fresh legs on halfway through the third quarter, when the game is still in the balance. That's when he can do some good, and by then we should also know who is having a shocker and needs to be subbed out.

Yeah, that was a little odd.

 

[Coona Blues]

We have a very solid midfield which is being "bashed" mercilessly and unjustly.
We need Cripps to realise his potential/hype as a gun extractor and realistically that
one line breaking, pacy type that we are missing.
I am very confident our recent draftees will pretty much all become solid B Grade mids
at a minimum. Read Graham, Temay and Holman added to Bell. We just need a bit more X Factor.

The problem we have is that the two players we have on the list who could elevate to that level
now are Yarran and Lucas. Yaz does some great things, but not enough of them, he needs a tank.
Lucas has the tank, but not the intensity. I think he has the skills, but not the confidence to use them.
Menzel will be a gun, but those waiting for a Stevie J or GAJ elevation will almost certainly be disappointed.
I am hoping for a "Dominator" like comparison, for the youngsters here Wayne Johnston was among the best
half forwards you would hope to see and made a huge impact with short stints in the middle as his career
progressed.

We need Judd and Carrazzo on the park, but a combination involving Murphy, Gibbs, Thomas, McLean, Curnow, Bell,
Robinson, Ellard and Simmo is far from threadbare.
Edit: Apologies for not mentioning one J.Cachia in our midfield mix....he certainly is.

 

[Jeremias]

You are correct Omeara & Crouch are both 6 months older than Menzel so perhaps should be slightly a head in development, and both taken as 17 yo so would have an extra preseason under the belts so definitely would have a better engine. Still the point I was trying to make and probably not that well, is that from each draft there would only be a handful of midfielders that turn into genuine A grade quality guns, and the 4 I listed are simply that far in front of Menzel that if he is going to be in that class then I just think he would have shown more.. It might be MM's fault for not giving him the opportunity, like wasting him by having him sit on the bench for 3/4s.

Agreed.

Menzel hasn't won a Brownlow yet - should be delisted immediately.

Forget player development and management. That has no place in modern day football.

 

[ODNBlue]

Agreed.

Menzel hasn't won a Brownlow yet - should be delisted immediately.

Forget player development and management. That has no place in modern day football.

I hate posts that literally drip with sarcasm...

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Agreed.

Menzel hasn't won a Brownlow yet - should be delisted immediately.

Forget player development and management. That has no place in modern day football.

No one is saying this at all, but people on here are claiming by getting Menzel it forgives all our past errors, when Menzel is a long way from being an established AFL player let alone an A grade player,

 

[Cringle]

You'd have one of Bell, McLean, Robinson and Cachia in the team... Maybe 2. But no more.

Murphy, Gibbs, Thomas, Judd, Carrazzo, Curnow and one of the others listed above should be our engine room. Later down the track we can add Graham, Cripps, Lucas (I'd still have him on the flanks, but overtime I believe he can go through the middle), Menzel and Docherty.

 

[gbatman]

I still think there is room for Bell in the mid group, but Robbo is a role player. (Defensive forward perhaps or wet weather specialist)

Any thoughts why Bell was subbed out rather than a ruckman?

only had one clearance for the game, not getting a lot of it. Role players are for teams who haven't the depth to play 22 quality and have to play players with glaring weaknesses.

 

[Styxx]

I'm going to throw a weird idea.

We miss Armfield. A lot more than I think we thought we would. His speed is exceptional plus he has a very good tackling/defensive game. Had a lot of really good games last year and seems to have become the forgotten man over the last 6 months.

 

[BuxbaumBixby]

Get Graham in there.

Investment in both now and the future.

He's a leader - not a follower. Has street-smarts.

Not just about skills and pace - we need to groom players that stand up when the going gets tough.