Recommitted Paddy Dow [OOC 2023] explored his options, but stayed

[fargothegreat]

Think the penny is starting to drop, though in the VFL...

Averaging at VFL (only 2 games)
Disposals - 31
Clearances - 11 (15 on the weekend)
Goals - 1.5

Would rather keep him, but if he was to leave there would be a premium if he keeps this trajectory...

His work through traffic in these highlights is a joy to watch.



Based on those numbers he'd have to be recalled this week wouldn't he? Tough midfield to break into though, I guess.

 

[Jeremias]

What's keeping him out of the side? Is he still struggling with a lack of defensive accountability?

He's being kept out of the side by a midfield containing Cripps, Hewett, Kennedy, Cerra and Walsh. All have started the year extremely well, and he doesn't have a second position to fall back on.

Defensive accountability and fitness are Paddy's two main issues. Disposal has been very poor at times but I think more than anything that's a confidence issue - we saw it improve at the back end of last season.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

RCD would be worth next to nothing now I'd imagine

So is Dow.

 

[fargothegreat]

He's being kept out of the side by a midfield containing Cripps, Hewett, Kennedy, Cerra and Walsh. All have started the year extremely well, and he doesn't have a second position to fall back on.

Defensive accountability and fitness are Paddy's two main issues. Disposal has been very poor at times but I think more than anything that's a confidence issue - we saw it improve at the back end of last season.

Sounds like similar issues that we have with Collier-Dawkins, though Dow is a lot more productive than RCD at the lower level, and RCD doesn't have any issues with disposal efficiency.

RCD doesn't seem to have that natural will to push himself with gut running, like you see from someone like Walsh for example. Sounds like Dow may have the same flaw - which can be fixed imo.

 

[bird_man]

So is Dow.

Dow still has some value

A former top 5 pick that is starting to dominate the VFL.

RCD was pick 20 and has been average in the VFL.

 

[bird_man]

We are 3 games into the season, hardly stuck in the VFL...

3 games in and he's stuck behind 5 or 6 midfielders

Unfortunately for him he's shown that he struggles to play another position.

If he can find his way into that midfield and start dominating then you can demand a premium but that seems like a long shot from here

 

[YeahGnar]

Straight swap for Ben McKay

32

Ben Mckay

Age

27

Ht

202cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.5

2star

K

3.7

1star

HB

3.8

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

1.7

4star

MG

77.2

1star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.5

3star

T

1.5

2star

MG

88.5

2star

D

7.0

2star

K

3.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.0

4star

MG

67.8

1star

at NM, or include a future pick with the deal. Carlton need another KPD more than anything

 

[bird_man]

Sounds like similar issues that we have with Collier-Dawkins, though Dow is a lot more productive than RCD at the lower level, and RCD doesn't have any issues with disposal efficiency.

RCD doesn't seem to have that natural will to push himself with gut running, like you see from someone like Walsh for example. Sounds like Dow may have the same flaw - which can be fixed imo.

Richmond had Martin, Prestia and Lambert all missing on the weekend and he still couldn't find himself in there.

He was outperformed by a couple of first year midfielders in the VFL on the weekend.

I'd imagine Sonsie will get a call up before him.

 

[fargothegreat]

Richmond had Martin, Prestia and Lambert all missing on the weekend and he still couldn't find himself in there.

He was outperformed by a couple of first year midfielders in the VFL on the weekend.

I'd imagine Sonsie will get a call up before him.

Yeah I'm not trying to argue that RCD is at a similar level/value to Dow. He's certainly behind, but you'd expect that considering one was pick 3 and the other pick 20 (and considered a risky pick given he slid down the order).

I'm just pointing out that it sounds like both players share a few common flaws.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Dow still has some value

A former top 5 pick that is starting to dominate the VFL.

RCD was pick 20 and has been average in the VFL.

Going on that reckoning a former top 5 pick playing well at vfl level vs a former top 20 who's not then you'd call it even wouldn't you?

 

[3rd Grade Maggy]

Straight swap for Ben McKay at NM, or include a future pick with the deal. Carlton need another KPD more than anything

Yeah ****, Norf would jump at that lol. They probably should hand over a second round pick as well just to even it up.

 

[bird_man]

Going on that reckoning a former top 5 pick playing well at vfl level vs a former top 20 who's not then you'd call it even wouldn't you?

Not sure how you have come to that conclusion?

 

[juss]

Doesn't usually matter the reasons, if you can't break into a best 22 as a midfielder, and you've been in the system a few years, your currency is not much.

Doesn't matter the club or player, no one pays high for state league mids in their early 20s.

They're token picks late 40s or beyond, or pick upgrades at best.

 

[The 747]

Dow’s game requires him to be psychical developed to be effective.
He’s game is an inside mid, that’s good below the knees and has that explosive pace to break tackles and burst out of the stoppage.
He’s been to slight to do this regularly at AFL level.
He was drafted in the 2017 draft, so five years of development, should have him ready to start impacting games.
Watched him tear Geelong’s midfield apart, iirc he had 6 clearance in a quarter.
It’s going to be hard for him to break into our midfield with Cripps Walsh Kennedy Cerra Hewitt are all in front of him, but he does offer a point of difference in he’s game, which should help him break into the midfield rotation hopefully.

 

[cznsnowy91]

Straight swap for Ben McKay at NM, or include a future pick with the deal. Carlton need another KPD more than anything

What about Kayne Turner for Harry Mckay?

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

For a player that is supposedly got 'very little value' sure has a lot of suitors. If he wants to leave, early 2nd round pick or we just send him to the PSD, we will not accept the poor return The Dogs got for Lipniski.

Very confident he stays at Carlton anyway,esp as it now appears our flag window is about to open.

 

[bird_man]

For a player that is supposedly got 'very little value' sure has a lot of suitors. If he wants to leave, early 2nd round pick or we just send him to the PSD, we will not accept the poor return The Dogs got for Lipniski.

Very confident he stays at Carlton anyway,esp as it now appears our flag window is about to open.

What did Carlton end up getting for SPS?

 

[Foxman98]

For a player that is supposedly got 'very little value' sure has a lot of suitors. If he wants to leave, early 2nd round pick or we just send him to the PSD, we will not accept the poor return The Dogs got for Lipniski.

Very confident he stays at Carlton anyway,esp as it now appears our flag window is about to open.

You can't be this delusional surely. The guy has never averaged over 14.3 disposals in 4 years and is currently playing 2's. Lipinski had 1 year under his best and dominated VFL consistently, we didn't get a poor return for him at all he was an out of contract depth player which is what Dow is. He doesn't have a lot of suitors blokes saying he will be handy for my team on BigFooty aren't list managers. Your window opening is irrelevant for him as he won't get close to the side. He is a mediocre 3rd to 4th round pick at best.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

You can't be this delusional surely. The guy has never averaged over 14.3 disposals in 4 years and is currently playing 2's. Lipinski had 1 year under his best and dominated VFL consistently, we didn't get a poor return for him at all he was an out of contract depth player which is what Dow is. He doesn't have a lot of suitors blokes saying he will be handy for my team on BigFooty aren't list managers. Your window opening is irrelevant for him as he won't get close to the side. He is a mediocre 3rd to 4th round pick at best.

We will keep him then thanks.

 

[Foxman98]

We will keep him then thanks.

No one is suggesting you shouldn't. We would've preferred to keep Lipinski in fact even offered him a 3 year deal, He however decided he wanted to move onto greener pastures hence we took what he was worth. You can't honestly say with Dow's production and contract status that he holds any value in a trade.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

No one is suggesting you shouldn't. We would've preferred to keep Lipinski in fact even offered him a 3 year deal, He however decided he wanted to move onto greener pastures hence we took what he was worth. You can't honestly say with Dow's production and contract status that he holds any value in a trade.

Fair enough, Richmond had a good crack in the trade period last season, but we told him he was not for trade.

He is still highly rated at the club internally, but Voss clearly has performance and intensity markers set for the players, and I have no problem or worries with Paddy having to fight for/earn his spot

Not really too worried about him leaving (at this stage)

But you can never say never until he recommits to the club I suppose.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Dow for RCD.
Both need a change.

Dow is 6th in line at Carlton, RCD would be 10th. He seems miles off it.

Stack looks like he needs a fresh start, I wouldn’t mind looking at him instead.

 

[Foxman98]

Fair enough, Richmond had a good crack in the trade period last season, but we told him he was not for trade.

He is still highly rated at the club internally, but Voss clearly has performance and intensity markers set for the players, and I have no problem or worries with Paddy having to fight for/earn his spot

Not really too worried about him leaving (at this stage)

But you can never say never until he recommits to the club I suppose.

Everyone is rated highly at their clubs that is why they are there.

There's no issue with him leaving or staying it was more the ridiculous value when there are plenty of recent comparables

 

[tiger_tough]

Late 1st/Early 2nd at a guess.

But hopefully we can convince him to stick around.

This post must be the record holder for most 'haha' reacts with no other likes.

In all seriousness he's worth about the same as what we got for Dan Butler - that was a 3rd rounder, pick 56. He played 7 games in his final year with us and 45 in his 3 seasons in. Dow has played 58 in 4 seasons and it's hard to see him locking down a spot in this blues midfield. Both out of contract.

 

[tiger_tough]

Fair enough, Richmond had a good crack in the trade period last season, but we told him he was not for trade.

He is still highly rated at the club internally, but Voss clearly has performance and intensity markers set for the players, and I have no problem or worries with Paddy having to fight for/earn his spot

Not really too worried about him leaving (at this stage)

But you can never say never until he recommits to the club I suppose.

Yeah you can do that when players are contracted....