Discussion Paddy v Petracca

[Stan_Darsh72]

So here is a simple question.

Since Finnis and Satan have come on board who have been the drafting eff ups?

Long, Battle?
Clark Coffield?
King?
Bytel
These are our highest from the last 4 drafts

Trading
Austinn - lol
Hanners? i would say very iffy
Hill, Jones, Butler, Howard, Ryder? - all been pretty good.

Pretty much this, since 2016, the club has become a shitload better at recruiting.

Only eff up i can see was Clavinaro over Petrucelle and that is reaching a hell of a lot.

 

[Joffaboy]

Pretty much this, since 2016, the club has become a shitload better at recruiting.

Only eff up i can see was Clavinaro over Petrucelle and that is reaching a hell of a lot.

yes, we could see the bugger ups going on. Thats why it has been changed up so much off field.

Billings and Paddy were ordinary top 5 pick and even Billings can be made a case for.

King @ 4 (and Bytel @ 41) were pretty good. You are correct about Clav, has been disappointing.

Feel we are on the right track

 

[Feerits Elf]

15 of 17 other clubs recruiting teams anonymously said petracca was clear number 1 on the night of the draft.

How, by dropping it in our suggestion box?

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

We have 11 players left from the 2015 list (out of 45 players). 3 are probably definitely best 22 next year and 2 of them are Membrey and Seb Ross who have been less than great in 2020. It's better lately but to pretend that our last decade of recruiting has been okay is hard to swallow. I give you that since then we have done a 360 and finding players like Wilkie, Marshall etc on the cheap has been a huge change of fortunes, but it is all very recent. I'm optimistic about our future but still pissy about the Trout Richo Pelican era. Satan has really slapped us into line.

Pelican was a snake oil salesman ... he leveraged on our desperation from getting so close but falling short to make himself as our false messiah ...
i think as soon as we got some quality apointments (some pushed on us by the AFL) like Finnis we saw the huge flaws in the Pelchen plan and he was shown the door .. we hung onto trout for two seasons to many i dont neceserily see him as the incompetent bumbling idiot some on here do but he was not great at his role .. Richo was the coach we needed for the time he was there really he sacrificed his coaching to help us longer term he was happy to toe the party line and allow us to go through seasons of uncompetitiveness to build a list , problem was once the build was done and it was time for it to bear fruit he didnt have the ability to put together the game plan to get us over the line ...
i think the change of our club has been done in phases ...
phase one was to remove the quick fix scam mongers
phase two was to rebuild our culture
phase three build our home
phase four build our relationship with our supporters
phase five finish the build of the list
phase six add the top end talent in the football department
phase seven bring in the players
phase eight build the membership
phase nine become a finals team
phase ten bring home our second flag

 

[Saint believer]

What about inquiring after Andrew McGrath. Not signed yet. Would be great for our inside... Is Doro too much trouble?

 

[TheEnsign]

What about inquiring after Andrew McGrath. Not signed yet. Would be great for our inside... Is Doro too much trouble?

He'd want something like either Steele or RoMa, a first rounder and a future second from us for McGrath and a third rounder coming back and I'm not even joking.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

yes, we could see the bugger ups going on. Thats why it has been changed up so much off field.

Billings and Paddy were ordinary top 5 pick and even Billings can be made a case for.

King @ 4 (and Bytel @ 41) were pretty good. You are correct about Clav, has been disappointing.

Feel we are on the right track

the thing about it is we dont know until its too late if it was a good call or not ... if we go back a few years we would have had people jumping cause we nailed the draft picking Billings Dunstan and Acres .. further back we were killing the draft cause Cripps was going to be a star and Ledger was going to be a midfield beast... we drafted Paddy and goddard and we were set with bookends for the next ten years.....

time will tell on King (although everything points to that being a great pick) and Bytel .. time will tel

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

He'd want something like either Steele or RoMa, a first rounder and a future second from us for McGrath and a third rounder coming back and I'm not even joking.

essendon fans would burn down the club and our club if they let McGrath go ... he is litterally the only shining light in that list they be better off trading every player on their list before you let him go ... UNTOUCHABLE

 

[Roddy Grant]

The difference was that we had pick one and the choice of any player in the draft. We overlooked the obvious pick to take a risk and it f’ed up. It's like if you stop at the casino with your pay check. You want to have a sh*t load of money to show for it or you might not want to show your face at home. If you'd even lost $100 bucks it would be not so bad. Blowing Paddy, Hugh and Mc Kenzie with two first round picks and the first pick in the second round was outstanding shitness. Lonie over Caleb Daniel who was the one everyone thought we'd take was just incredible.

Agree completely. Was only joking about the merit of this discussion still going on 6 years after the draft. What’s done is done and you don’t get clean rolling around in the dirt.

Up until this year de Goey was probably the best player in that draft anyway

 

[NarklesHelmet]

My problem is that most of us knew how it was going to work out before it even happened. It's whatever now but still stings seeing a player that by rights should be playing for us now tear us a new one.

I agree with you for what it’s worth and did at the time: the decision was a mistake.

My issue more is that it doesn’t matter what me or you thought as it wasn’t us making the decision: it was a few blokes at the footy club we love. We literally had no control over it.

I have no problem beating ourselves up if we were part of the decision-making but it makes no sense if we are repeatedly doing it over a decision we had no input in years after. It’s a recipe to make you unhappy and will send you mad.

I look at Petracca dispassionately. He’s a Dees player now, that’s it.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

2016 is where everything changed or at least Rebuild 2.0 began

2016 got us Long, Battle and Phillips is a soild draft, 2 of them best 22 and Phillips is a handy depth player, Then got Marhsall in the rookie draft (the best place to get rucks imo). Traded in Steele as well which looks to be a bargain for what we paid for him now

2017 got us Clark and Coffield who look like 250 game players and Paton who will be a 200 gamer and a gun small defender, Rookie draft got us Langlands who is an unknown. 2017 traded in Austin for depth

2018 go us King who will be the main star forward for the next decade, Hind and Parker as mature aged small forwards, Bytel who can be anything and Robbie young who was probably never going to make it. Rookie draft Wilke was drafted to us which was our best valued pick up since Sam Fisher. Traded in Kent who is good depth and Hanners who does add leadership and can help the culture and development of the team

2019 we used our picks for trades getting in Howard, Ryder, Hill, Jones and Butler, 5 best 22 players cannot argue with that trading, Drafted Byrnes who we hope will develop well.

4 years of Trading and drafts have changed the mood of the club and has recovered us from the early part of the decade.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Guarenteed Best 22 players from those 4 years in 2021
Marshall, Battle, Long, Steele, Clark, Coffiled, Paton, King, Wilkie, Howard, Ryder, Hill, Jones, Butler

Youth who could be anything
Bytel and Byrnes

Depth players
Austin, Phillips, Pakers, Hind, Kent

 

[Crusty Undies]

How, by dropping it in our suggestion box?

No actually by answering questions from multiple journalists the night of and for several months after the draft

 

[StCicatriz]

come on ... let be fair here all clubs have muffed their fair share of first rounders its not just a St Kilda thing .. where we have been perhaps better than the rest of the comp is identifying talent with late picks we also have a fairly solid strike rate in trading in fringe players who become very very good players ...

None of them have done it this bad. Atleast not in the professional era.

 

[StCicatriz]

So here is a simple question.

Since Finnis and Satan have come on board who have been the drafting eff ups?

Long, Battle?
Clark Coffield?
King?
Bytel
These are our highest from the last 4 drafts

Trading
Austinn - lol
Hanners? i would say very iffy
Hill, Jones, Butler, Howard, Ryder? - all been pretty good.

The issue isn't finnis with the paddy thing. He was barely there and like richo wasn't gonna rock the boat.

Firmly at the feet of trout and ameet. Libba may have had some involvement.

 

[StCicatriz]

People need to accept that pelchen trout and cox were sacked.

Ameet was in a football role he had no idea about. It was like if we made finnis the list managet.

Would you be surprised if it failed if that happened? Of course not.

 

[George]

None of them have done it this bad. Atleast not in the professional era.

Yes they have. We've already gone over this.

 

[StCicatriz]

Yes they have. We've already gone over this.

No they haven't. You're using a later pick to make that call and the player they did get they got more out of.

Comparing apples with oranges.

Id rather that outcome than the paddy one.

 

[George]

No they haven't. You're using a later pick to make that call and the player they did get they got more out of.

Comparing apples with oranges.

Id rather that outcome than the paddy one.

It isn't Tambling over McCartin. It's Tambling over Franklin.

The gap in talent from Tambling to Franklin is far, far greater than the gap between McCartin & Petracca. And lets not kid ourselves, Petracca was not the clear cut #1 pick in that draft. He has had a dozen good games. Before this year nobody battered an eye to him. Could even argue De Goey, who was pick 5, has had a better 5 years than both of them combined.

 

[Joffaboy]

The issue isn't finnis with the paddy thing. He was barely there and like richo wasn't gonna rock the boat.

Firmly at the feet of trout and ameet. Libba may have had some involvement.

People need to accept that pelchen trout and cox were sacked.

Ameet was in a football role he had no idea about. It was like if we made finnis the list managet.

Would you be surprised if it failed if that happened? Of course not.

My post was about since those guys were sacked. They were sacked for a reason, Satan came in and with Finnis said, this is a mess, lets clean it up.
So you rightly state those administrators were sacked. Who replaced them?

Gallagher
Allen
Rath

They changed up the coaching
Ratten
Roughhead
even Slater who was an innovative move.

My point is that we can torture ourselves about the previous admin, or look at what has happened since the current admin has taken over.

The clubs rebuild under pelchan trout and cox failed miserably so it is reset and so far is on an upward trajectory.

 

[StCicatriz]

It isn't Tambling over McCartin. It's Tambling over Franklin.

The gap in talent from Tambling to Franklin is far, far greater than the gap between McCartin & Petracca. And lets not kid ourselves, Petracca was not the clear cut #1 pick in that draft. He has had a dozen good games. Before this year nobody battered an eye to him. Could even argue De Goey, who was pick 5, has had a better 5 years than both of them combined.

Thats not pick 1.

Disagree on the clear cut 1. Especially on here back then.

 

[StCicatriz]

My post was about since those guys were sacked. They were sacked for a reason, Satan came in and with Finnis said, this is a mess, lets clean it up.
So you rightly state those administrators were sacked. Who replaced them?

Gallagher
Allen
Rath

They changed up the coaching
Ratten
Roughhead
even Slater who was an innovative move.

My point is that we can torture ourselves about the previous admin, or look at what has happened since the current admin has taken over.

The clubs rebuild under pelchan trout and cox failed miserably so it is reset and so far is on an upward trajectory.

Agree entirely.

In the end what we saw with richo was the same delivered with the other positions in pelchen trout cox ameet etc.

 

[gringo2011]

Guarenteed Best 22 players from those 4 years in 2021
Marshall, Battle, Long, Steele, Clark, Coffiled, Paton, King, Wilkie, Howard, Ryder, Hill, Jones, Butler

Youth who could be anything
Bytel and Byrnes

Depth players
Austin, Phillips, Pakers, Hind, Kent

Im not sold on Long. He’s still similar to how he was forward. Goes in and out of games too often and some games he has no influence at all. I would think he’s the most vulnerable if we got Zac Williams or someone else jumps up.

 

[gringo2011]

It isn't Tambling over McCartin. It's Tambling over Franklin.

The gap in talent from Tambling to Franklin is far, far greater than the gap between McCartin & Petracca. And lets not kid ourselves, Petracca was not the clear cut #1 pick in that draft. He has had a dozen good games. Before this year nobody battered an eye to him. Could even argue De Goey, who was pick 5, has had a better 5 years than both of them combined.

Melbourne mates have rated him like we rate Gresham. He wasn’t s**t just still had improvement in him. He’s now stepped up to a top 10 in the Comp type. We didn’t care when he was a pretty good player. Now he is good it hurts more. Paddy never really looked that good ever. He brother has shown much more than he ever did.

He was a pretty clear number one pick too.

 

[gringo2011]

None of them have done it this bad. Atleast not in the professional era.

Richmond and Melbourne were bad too. Carlton were always good for a laugh as well.