Opinion Players who’ve already peaked

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

We need to win a premiership and we need to win it fast, damn fast.

But there are players whose best is behind them already or who’ve already peaked. Sorting this out will be important and we need to do it fast, very fast. Doesn’t mean they won’t or can’t have great seasons but don’t expect improvement from their peak.

So basically we have a narrow window for a flag, maybe only next year before the up and comers fill the void.

Players who’ve peaked are:

Cunningham
Lloyd
Rampe
Melican
Parker
Florent
Rowbottom
Adams
Grundy
Hayward
Mills

You can see it’s half the team. Some retirements for sure, some delistings as well and hopefully some tough calls.

So Horse, get your Hiscox running spikes on and go for it. No more everyone in defence, time to go hard through the midfield and back then in.

We need this flag next year, the rebuild is over.

 

[Kiama Chris]

We need to win a premiership and we need to win it fast, damn fast.

But there are players whose best is behind them already or who’ve already peaked. Sorting this out will be important and we need to do it fast, very fast. Doesn’t mean they won’t or can’t have great seasons but don’t expect improvement from their peak.

So basically we have a narrow window for a flag, maybe only next year before the up and comers fill the void.

Players who’ve peaked are:

Cunningham
Lloyd
Rampe
Melican
Parker
Florent
Rowbottom
Adams
Grundy
Hayward
Mills

You can see it’s half the team. Some retirements for sure, some delistings as well and hopefully some tough calls.

So Horse, get your Hiscox running spikes on and go for it. No more everyone in defence, time to go hard through the midfield and back then in.

We need this flag next year, the rebuild is over.

Reaching their peak and commencing the decline ("their best is behind them") are not the same thing.
Of those you mentioned probably only Rampe is definitely on the decline.
A few are possibly getting close, such as Parker and Adams, having spent a lot of time in the engine room but with sensible management should have a number of very effective years remaining.
Rowbottom has definitely not reached his peak and Florent possibly also not.
The others are playing in their mature years so should be at their best when fit and in form.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Reaching their peak and commencing the decline ("their best is behind them") are not the same thing.
Of those you mentioned probably only Rampe is definitely on the decline.
A few are possibly getting close, such as Parker and Adams, having spent a lot of time in the engine room but with sensible management should have a number of very effective years remaining.
Rowbottom has definitely not reached his peak and Florent possibly also not.
The others are playing in their mature years so should be at their best when fit and in form.

Horse needs to let rowy off the chain so he can extract from the midfield. Needs to back his midfield I reckon.

 

[SGBeach]

Horse needs to let rowy off the chain so he can extract from the midfield. Needs to back his midfield I reckon.

Disagree with your opening post. We have plenty of time to win a flag.
All of our U24's (Theres a lot them) still have improvement in them. This sets us up for a few years to come. I reckon three of our best players are McDonald, Campbell and Gulden who are only entering their 4th season. Blakey, Warner, Rowbottom aren't much older and Players like McLean, Amartey, McCartin, Hayward, Florent are just about to enter their 5 years of prime..
Only Parker and Rampe and possibly Lloyd (excluding recent trades) are at the end of their prime or declining.. In saying that, their leadership and experience is invaluable.
Rowbottom (like the other 22 players picked each week) has a role to play and plays it dam well. Horse gets his best footy out of him.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Disagree with your opening post. We have plenty of time to win a flag.
All of our U24's (Theres a lot them) still have improvement in them. This sets us up for a few years to come. I reckon three of our best players are McDonald, Campbell and Gulden who are only entering their 4th season. Blakey, Warner, Rowbottom aren't much older and Players like McLean, Amartey, McCartin, Hayward, Florent are just about to enter their 5 years of prime..
Only Parker and Rampe and possibly Lloyd (excluding recent trades) are at the end of their prime or declining.. In saying that, their leadership and experience is invaluable.
Rowbottom (like the other 22 players picked each week) has a role to play and plays it dam well. Horse gets his best footy out of him.

Fair post maybe we have 2 years. But Florent and Hayward, best is yet to come, bit of hopium there. McDonald and Campbell are 3 of our best players - have to disagree with you on that one. Hope I’m wrong btw. Just calling it as I see it.

What about the rest of the list ? Pretty sure a lot of them have peaked - doesn’t mean they’re bad just that we’ve seen the best.

Loving the thumbs downs - great for banter.

 

[Kiama Chris]

I once saw the stages of a player's career described rather well. Can't remember if it was on here or elsewhere. My recollection not as good as the original.
1) Recruit. Body and experience both growing. Development is quite rapid. Often playing in lower grades and/or lesser positions to gain experience.
2) Peak. Body at its best. Experience increasing. Playing in their favoured position.
3) Late Peak. Body begins to perform at a lower level but experience makes up for it. Still playing in their favoured position or may move to a lesser position.
4) Veteran. Performance falling away but still good enough because of experience to hold a lesser position for a short time.
The key thing is that 1 is normally 2-4 years, 2 the best part of a player's career and may last 8 years, 3 a few years at most and 4 not long at all.

 

[rustycrate]

We need to win a premiership and we need to win it fast, damn fast.

But there are players whose best is behind them already or who’ve already peaked. Sorting this out will be important and we need to do it fast, very fast. Doesn’t mean they won’t or can’t have great seasons but don’t expect improvement from their peak.

So basically we have a narrow window for a flag, maybe only next year before the up and comers fill the void.

Players who’ve peaked are:

Cunningham
Lloyd
Rampe
Melican
Parker
Florent
Rowbottom
Adams
Grundy
Hayward
Mills

You can see it’s half the team. Some retirements for sure, some delistings as well and hopefully some tough calls.

So Horse, get your Hiscox running spikes on and go for it. No more everyone in defence, time to go hard through the midfield and back then in.

We need this flag next year, the rebuild is over.

Fact 1. The Sydney Swans don't rebuild. We regenerate at the same time as contending. Just like we are now.
Fact 2. We are within one to four years of a chance at a flag pretty consistently.
Fact 3. See point 1 and 2.

 

[SGBeach]

Fact 1. The Sydney Swans don't rebuild. We regenerate at the same time as contending. Just like we are now.
Fact 2. We are within one to four years of a chance at a flag pretty consistently.
Fact 3. See point 1 and 2.

Yep..
I think all teams 'rebuild' or 'regenerate', or call it what ever you want. I reckon like all teams, we continually regenerate, but we seem to do it better than most.
The Swans finished bottom 4 in 2019 & 2020, We were losing great players like Hanners and McVeigh, holding onto a very ageing JPK and Buddy, and not trading in anyone, instead going to the draft. In 2021 we managed to scrape into finals against all odds (we were 5:1 of making the 8 that year!). In 2022 we made the Granny!
I think these two results have skewed peoples opinion of where our list is at.. ie. that our list should win the flag Now, before its too late. The reality is (IMO) that with players like Hayward, Florent, Blakey, Warner, Rowbum, JMac, TMac, McLean, Amartey, McDonald, Gulden, Campbell + 2022 & 23 draftees (+ others) still to reach their consistent peaks,, our future is bright and we should continue to play finals for the next 4-8 years.
If all things align.. good run with injuries, Mills, Heeney and Paps have good years, Grundy works, and the above mentioned youth continue their upward trajectory, theres nothing stopping us from winning the flag(s)
In 4 years when Mills, Heeney and Paps start to slow down (Rampe, Lloyd, Parker etc have retired) We'll have players like Gulden, Campbell, Logan hitting their prime years.. If all things align, theres nothing stopping us winning more flags!

 

[SGBeach]

Fair post maybe we have 2 years. But Florent and Hayward, best is yet to come, bit of hopium there. McDonald and Campbell are 3 of our best players - have to disagree with you on that one. Hope I’m wrong btw. Just calling it as I see it.

What about the rest of the list ? Pretty sure a lot of them have peaked - doesn’t mean they’re bad just that we’ve seen the best.

Loving the thumbs downs - great for banter.

Florent and Hayward - 25yo, 140 games, very durable. Their best 4-5 years start now.
McDonald, Campbell, Gulden - sorry I should've said 'will be our best players'. Im very bullish that those three will be elite players, and they're only entering their 4th season. Very much looking forward to watching Campbell and Logan in 2024 - breakout years??
TMac, JMac, Warner, Rowbum, Blakey, McLean, Amartey etc + lots of draftees from the last few years haven't peaked.
Then theres trades and drafts over the next few years too..

Thumbs down was because i strongly disagreed with your post.. no offence intended (dont think any was taken)

 

[The King!]

Coached peaked 10 years ago

 

[The King!]

I don't think it matters some are past their peak , many are , but are still good players anyway

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Dear Mods, if anyone nominates The Chad in this thread what is the process of instituting a temporary ban ?

 

[sataris]

Dear Mods, if anyone nominates The Chad in this thread what is the process of instituting a temporary ban ?

Normally we just tape a bunch of cats together.

 

[Membling]

Just for fun, our under 24 squad. Turning 24 in 2024 is the cut off:

FB: Vickery, Edwards, Magor
HBF: JMac, Snell, Blakey
C: Errol, Sheldrick, Campbell
HFF: Rowbottom, Logan, Jordan
FF:Konstanty, Buller, Co. Warner
R:Green, Chad, Cleary

Int: Cleary, Roberts, McAndrew, Kirk, (Mitchell)

Few positional shenannigans but shows we are missing experience in KPDs sub 24 (Tmac misses as bday is 30th Dec....).

We are also fairly light on in the general and small fwds (for experience)

Point of the post, have a fair bit of room for improvement from our younger brigade.

 

[rustycrate]

Just for fun, our under 24 squad. Turning 24 in 2024 is the cut off:

FB: Vickery, Edwards, Magor
HBF: JMac, Snell, Blakey
C: Errol, Sheldrick, Campbell
HFF: Rowbottom, Logan, Jordan
FF:Konstanty, Buller, Co. Warner
R:Green, Chad, Cleary

Int: Cleary, Roberts, McAndrew, Kirk, (Mitchell)

Few positional shenannigans but shows we are missing experience in KPDs sub 24 (Tmac misses as bday is 30th Dec....).

We are also fairly light on in the general and small fwds (for experience)

Point of the post, have a fair bit of room for improvement from our younger brigade.

I think it is going to be very difficult for any player who did not play the last game this year to break into the best 23.
The following players are the least experienced players who played out last game. But they are vastly experienced vs what we have in reserve.
Amartey 28 games
McDonald 44 games
Campbell 50 games
Wicks 50 games
McLean 53 games
Warner 60 games
It is going to be tough to break into the Swans best 23.

 

[Membling]

I think it is going to be very difficult for any player who did not play the last game this year to break into the best 23.
The following players are the least experienced players who played out last game. But they are vastly experienced vs what we have in reserve.
Amartey 28 games
McDonald 44 games
Campbell 50 games
Wicks 50 games
McLean 53 games
Warner 60 games
It is going to be tough to break into the Swans best 23.

Competition is good but means players will be squeezed out.

Here is hoping performance in ressies is rewarded with underperformers spots.

Interestingly, we have one player in the 10-40 games range in Amartey.

 

[SGBeach]

Just for fun, our under 24 squad. Turning 24 in 2024 is the cut off:

FB: Vickery, Edwards, Magor
HBF: JMac, Snell, Blakey
C: Errol, Sheldrick, Campbell
HFF: Rowbottom, Logan, Jordan
FF:Konstanty, Buller, Co. Warner
R:Green, Chad, Cleary

Int: Cleary, Roberts, McAndrew, Kirk, (Mitchell)

Few positional shenannigans but shows we are missing experience in KPDs sub 24 (Tmac misses as bday is 30th Dec....).

We are also fairly light on in the general and small fwds (for experience)

Point of the post, have a fair bit of room for improvement from our younger brigade.

I actually think thats a pretty good younger brigade.. that team would've beaten north and west coast last year!
If you were to add players that are 24yo or less 01/01/2024, you end up with a pretty well balanced group
Amartey 24yr 3mth
Arnold 24yr 8mth
TMac 23yr 11mth
McLean 24yr 11mth
Wicks 24yr 3mth

Interestingly 4 of 5 of those players are KPPs. As they take longer to develop than the shorter guys you could probably include them. The other is Wicks - a small fwd.
So that group covers the holes you've pointed out

 

[Membling]

I actually think thats a pretty good younger brigade.. that team would've beaten north and west coast last year!
If you were to add players that are 24yo or less 01/01/2024, you end up with a pretty well balanced group
Amartey 24yr 3mth
Arnold 24yr 8mth
TMac 23yr 11mth
McLean 24yr 11mth
Wicks 24yr 3mth

Interestingly 4 of 5 of those players are KPPs. As they take longer to develop than the shorter guys you could probably include them. The other is Wicks - a small fwd.
So that group covers the holes you've pointed out

Yup, but I am a stickler for the cut off

For me it signals we are in a pretty good place lst wise outside of a medium fwd

 

[Kiama Chris]

Yup, but I am a stickler for the cut off

For me it signals we are in a pretty good place lst wise outside of a medium fwd

Arguably Jordon, Campbell or McInerney could fill that position if necessary and then backfill their positions. Mills another who could but better utilised elsewhere. So that position is IMO covered.