Premiership sides who drank their own bath water?

[Altum Volantes]

The eagles have been guilty of it each time they won the flag.

1993
1995
2007
2019

Those premiership defences were abysmal. Lost games they shouldn't have lost. Blew top 4 chances at home in their final games as well as top 2. 1995 was probably the worst of them all.

Bombers 94
Hawks 2009
Cats 2023

All Missed finals.

Who else?

WCE were pretty knocked about by injury in 1993 and nobody was beating Carlton in 1995 - history would suggest the Eagles had peaked in 1994.

I have never equated either year to being 'drinking their own bathwater'.

Weird thread really.
Does Chief pay you by how many you can start in a week?

 

[Demon13304]

Not us - our premierships were each followed by a GF appearance at worst - hopefully 2025 has the same in store.

From recent memory, I’d have to vote Melbourne 2021 - were outstanding that year, and their side for the most part didn’t change entering the following year.

Went a somewhat shaky 10-0 to open 2022, a season that culminated in a straight sets exit, to a Lions outfit with a major MCG hoodoo.

Leading into that game, we'd won 6 of the last 13 but still went into that game with no changes. Just very very arrogant lead by a poor coach who still hasn't changed anything since

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

Leading into that game, we'd won 6 of the last 13 but still went into that game with no changes. Just very very arragont lead by a poor coach who still hasn't changed anything since

5 goal lead at half time too. Should have been more. A little unlucky maybe? A prelim would have been a worthy showing. Out in straight sets not good enough. Especially after winning your first 10.

 

[_Cerberus_]

Dogs were weak in 2017 but I don't think it was due to being cocky. Just a piss poor effort.

It was neither really. People overrated that team a little bit. I mean yeah we beat every team but Geelong that year, and had a record that would land you in the top four most years. But the team had a glut of old heads, young guns, and a big age gap in the middle and important age group. So the list profile was out of whack. Won with a brand of hard nosed football, not so much reliance on pure skill. You need a bit of both for a dynasty, plus a balanced list. I knew when that siren went that day, to embrace it because I knew we likely wouldn't return with the same team.

Plus the all out run and gun style became the trend soon after, and we were exposed for slow legs. Took us until the last couple of years to stop being stubborn and catch up, and balance the list profile better.

2016 was a great year, but it was always due to be a one off. 2015 was the best chance for another flag if we got past the Crows, more than 2017.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

It was neither really. People overrated that team a little bit. I mean yeah we beat every team but Geelong that year, and had a record that would land you in the top four most years. But the team had a glut of old heads, young guns, and a big age gap in the middle and important age group. So the list profile was out of whack. Won with a brand of hard nosed football, not so much reliance on pure skill. You need a bit of both for a dynasty, plus a balanced list. I knew when that siren went that day, to embrace it because I knew we likely wouldn't return with the same team.

Plus the all out run and gun style became the trend soon after, and we were exposed for slow legs. Took us until the last couple of years to stop being stubborn and catch up, and balance the list profile better.

2016 was a great year, but it was always due to be a one off. 2015 was the best chance for another flag if we got past the Crows, more than 2017.

Hawks were too good in 2015 you would have lost had you got past the Crows. I r3ckon Hawks 30 plus easily.

 

[Demon13304]

5 goal lead at half time too. Should have been more. A little unlucky maybe? A prelim would have been a worthy showing. Out in straight sets not good enough. Especially after winning your first 10.

First team to ever go out in consecutive straight sets as well.
Not unlucky at all I think, never seen a club so arrogant thinking everything is just gonna fall their way. I think Goody is a poor coach who has failed in 7/9 seasons he's been there as well.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

First team to ever go out in consecutive straight sets as well.
Not unlucky at all I think, never seen a club so arrogant thinking everything is just gonna fall their way. I think Goody is a poor coach who has failed in 7/9 seasons he's been there as well.

Teams do that. They think they can just replicate last seasons premiership form again come finals.

That was the arrogance of West Coast many times.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Carlton Football club are still drinking bath water from the 70s, 80s and their tainted flag from the 90s. It is why they think they are a modern powerhouse when in fact they are the least successful club of the modern era. They have been left in the 80s.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

Carlton Football club are still drinking bath water from the 70s, 80s and their tainted flag from the 90s. It is why they think they are a modern powerhouse when in fact they are the least successful club of the modern era. They have been left in the 80s.

They're so touchy aren't they.

 

[Elixuh]

Pies 2023. Missed finals the next year.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Adam Simpson drank a entire Olympic sized swimming pool of his own water. He basically quit on October 1st 2018 in reality but collected a wage in the mean time

 

[Rotayjay]

I don't think drinking the bathwater is the main factor in poor premiership defences. More important factors, I think, are opposition coaches putting a lot of work into figuring out your game plan, senior players getting that little bit older, and the hunger fading.

Winning a premiership is very difficult in a salary-capped 18-team league. Dynasties are the exception rather than the rule. Premiership sides tend to have several key players all having a career-best season at the same time, along with at least a decent injury run. It's hard to replicate that the following year for 23 blokes.

And I distinguish fading hunger from drinking your own bathwater. Once you've won an AFL premiership, the ultimate prize you've been chasing since you were a little boy, surely it's hard to maintain the same level of hunger. Humans aren't robots - we can't give 100% for 100% of the time.

 

[Captain_Bender]

Kind-of... I don't think anyone was getting close to us in 2007. The Eagles were a good team in an even era.

But in all seriousness - I'd nominate Geelong 2008. Incredible work throughout the year - 1 loss all year. 10 goal win in the QF. 5 goal win in the PF. Aaaaaand... it all goes to our head in the GF. We play selfish, everything Hawthorn touches turns to gold, the mother of all chokes.

In 2008 Geelong were more concerned with winning the grand final for themselves

 

[Dark Eagle 9]

A fit Kerr, Cousins & Judd in the side for the whole year, Eagles finish top 2, make the GF & get to with in at least 24 of the Cats.

 

[Mr Meow]

View attachment 2363567

Geelong's was more down to Selwood leaving and a few top players being cooked, then retiring or never playing well again (Hawkins, Smith, Cam Guthrie etc).

It'd be the same if next year Collingwood lost Pendlebury, then Sidebottom, Elliot and Howe all fell off a cliff.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

I don't think drinking the bathwater is the main factor in poor premiership defences. More important factors, I think, are opposition coaches putting a lot of work into figuring out your game plan, senior players getting that little bit older, and the hunger fading.

Winning a premiership is very difficult in a salary-capped 18-team league. Dynasties are the exception rather than the rule. Premiership sides tend to have several key players all having a career-best season at the same time, along with at least a decent injury run. It's hard to replicate that the following year for 23 blokes.

And I distinguish fading hunger from drinking your own bathwater. Once you've won an AFL premiership, the ultimate prize you've been chasing since you were a little boy, surely it's hard to maintain the same level of hunger. Humans aren't robots - we can't give 100% for 100% of the time.

Good post. However yous went b2b. Lions, Hawks and Tigers in modern footy did also or better. That's what separates them from the rest.

 

[Andyy]

Of recent memory, Dees clearly take the cake.

There was discussion of a dynasty and who the hell would be able to challenge them etc. Have hardly fired a shot since and look like they're going backwards at a rate of knots. Hence likely to only realise 1 premiership from the current core before its turned over again.

 

[Mr Meow]

I don't think drinking the bathwater is the main factor in poor premiership defences. More important factors, I think, are opposition coaches putting a lot of work into figuring out your game plan, senior players getting that little bit older, and the hunger fading.

Winning a premiership is very difficult in a salary-capped 18-team league. Dynasties are the exception rather than the rule. Premiership sides tend to have several key players all having a career-best season at the same time, along with at least a decent injury run. It's hard to replicate that the following year for 23 blokes.

And I distinguish fading hunger from drinking your own bathwater. Once you've won an AFL premiership, the ultimate prize you've been chasing since you were a little boy, surely it's hard to maintain the same level of hunger. Humans aren't robots - we can't give 100% for 100% of the time.

If you have a very old squad, injuries and lack of fitness through a whole season are also common follow-ups for premiership sides. The dynasty sides started in slightly earlier phases where that wouldn't be such an issue until year 4 or 5.

 

[_Cerberus_]

Hawks were too good in 2015 you would have lost had you got past the Crows. I r3ckon Hawks 30 plus easily.

Most likely that would have been the case yes, though anything is possible in finals. Just meant that I felt our 2015 team was better than our 2017 team. A funny little stat though. For all the talk that Bevo and the Bulldogs cannot beat top 8 teams, and rightfully so. 2015 was the only year in his whole tenure, where we had a positive record vs the top 8 (5-3). Have had only losing records, with a couple of pars ever since.

 

[HairyO]

The eagles have been guilty of it each time they won the flag.

1993
1995
2007
2019

Those premiership defences were abysmal. Lost games they shouldn't have lost. Blew top 4 chances at home in their final games as well as top 2. 1995 was probably the worst of them all.

Bombers 94
Hawks 2009
Cats 2023

All Missed finals.

Who else?

Hawks had retirements and half the team had surgeries at the end of 2008 so we were crap for the first couple of months of 2009. 5 / 5 after the first 10 games. I suspect it became clear we werent going to be repeating which then saw us lose 8 of the final 12 games.

The sad thing is, despite finishing on 9 wins, we were 1 game outside the 8. This year 13 wins may not be enough to play finals.

Essendon who did get in ahead of us lost by 16 goals in week 1 of the finals, so maybe we saved ourselves a bit of humiliation.

 

[hawkman]

Combination of selfish play, lack of respect for opponent and Clarko utilising the rushed behind tactic that forced a rule change because they spammed it during the game.

These days it would have been about 9 free kicks directly in front of goal for deliberate rushed behind.

Only about 3 or 4 would be free kicks

 

[Hobbes]

Hawks had retirements and half the team had surgeries at the end of 2008 so we were crap for the first couple of months of 2009. 5 / 5 after the first 10 games. I suspect it became clear we werent going to be repeating which then saw us lose 8 of the final 12 games.

The sad thing is, despite finishing on 9 wins, we were 1 game outside the 8. This year 13 wins may not be enough to play finals.

Essendon who did get in ahead of us lost by 16 goals in week 1 of the finals, so maybe we saved ourselves a bit of humiliation.

14 wins might not be safe. I’m not sure that 16 wins is a mathematical certainty. If the top 9 keep beating the bottom 9, the number could be very high indeed.

 

[Mr Meow]

14 wins might not be safe. I’m not sure that 16 wins is a mathematical certainty. If the top 9 keep beating the bottom 9, the number could be very high indeed.

A 62.5% win rate and percentage of 112 is currently good enough for 8th.

Over a full season that's 14.38 wins. Probability says that for most sides, 14 wins should be enough. But maybe not for Freo. GWS are slightly safer % wise, but at risk too.

 

[PerthBoy86]

It is frustrating how we drop off after winning a premiership, for various reasons. Never even had a chance to defend a title in the gf the year after winning. We have always won one shortly after losing one, though, 92 after 91, 06 after 05, 18 after 15.

 

[lordbob]

The eagles have been guilty of it each time they won the flag.

1993
1995
2007
2019

Those premiership defences were abysmal. Lost games they shouldn't have lost. Blew top 4 chances at home in their final games as well as top 2. 1995 was probably the worst of them all.

Bombers 94
Hawks 2009
Cats 2023

All Missed finals.

Who else?

The hawks definitely drank the bath water but Id argue the loss of their CHB (croad) without anyone to replace him who could play on the big KPFs and the loss of their no1 ruckman (campbell) created structural issues that they couldn't overcome until they acquired brian lake.