Autopsy Rd 2 vs Hawks - Blues fight but lose due to lack of class and pace ... again

[James_Blues]

To me there's two glaring issues;

When we're trying to exit defensive 50, it appears that our go-to option is to dump kick out wide where the opposition who have set up the wall. When you watch better teams exit, they can often handball out of traffic and then find an outlet kick somewhere. The odd thing is we have shown we can do this properly (look at the GWS practice game) but I don't know if it's a personnel thing, a confidence thing, or something else as to why we don't do it more often.

The second big issue is forward 50 entries. We're very predictable with our entries with long kicking. Hawthorn were at least effective with their long bomb entries as they at least tried to block our defenders. Too often we miss the easier 15-20m kick in favour of a 40m bomb.

What seems to sit underneath a lot of this is poor skill execution at times, an inability to be composed with the ball (basic things like forcing a stoppage instead of handballing to keep the play alive), inconsistent application of effort, and poor tackling.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Too tall for the game, even when we had the chance before the game we doubled down then at the start of the last quarter to remove one and inject Lord into the game we triple down on stupidity and replace a small

Why the f do we have Cripps rucking on so many occasions when we have so many talls in the team, makes absolutely zero sense.

Why is Docherty all of a sudden sleeping with the lights on?

I was absolutely petrified we’d get smashed after the pathetically weak effort from Young for the Hawks first goal but we fought and fought, and had so many chances late in the third and early in the 4th to kick goals but just stuffed it up.

Could have won the game, but we didn’t…we have to win next week it’s an absolute must

#freekickhawthorn

 

[skadoosh]

Chol's first mark of the night on Young exemplifies the Hawks' attention to detail regarding blocking and creating space for eachother. Chol bodies up on Young and creates space, Watson comes into this space and effectively removes Young from the contest, resulting in an easy mark to Chol and a set shot 30ish meters out.

Numerous other examples of shepards and blocks in transition. Hawks play for eachother, we play for ourselves. We used to fly the flag for eachother in the good run of 2023, what happened to that?

Chol was licking his lips at the prospect of lining up against Young. Chol went in with a simple plan. Push Young off the ball and body him at all contests. Worked a charm too.

 

[Gointocarlton]

Chol was licking his lips at the prospect of lining up against Young. Chol went in with a simple plan. Push Young off the ball and body him at all contests. Worked a charm too.

Pushed him square in the back too in the marking contest which resulted in his first goal.

 

[BlueAbroad]

 

[Arr0w]

Pushed him square in the back too in the marking contest which resulted in his first goal.

Ultimately, Young positioning was poor

 

[Blue since 72]

Yes it was, complete clearence domination, impossible to maintain game style, poor decision making, poor skill execution.

Once the weather improved Hawthorn looked every bit a 10 goal better side.

No it wasn't.

Last night the players gave their all and played their game style but to coin a phrase it is what it is, we have limitations. We have been given a game style by Voss that mostly suits our list, what we lack is some class and pace.

That's a fact we can't fix immediately, no one on our list is suddenly going to start playing with the pace and skill of (insert random Hawks player here).

That's not on Voss he largely inherited what he has and the recruiting team (perhaps a bit belatedly) is starting to catch up with current best in class (think Hawks) by drafting Jagga. We need more.

To get to a GF we will need luck with injuries and we need to be smart about resting players and introducing new blood so players don't break down because we play a bloody exhaustive game style.

 

[jj1978]

My real fear is now we are in no mans land. I read all the comments here and they are the same every week and have been for 2 years.

Bottom 6 players not good enough
Bomb it long
Slow
Poor skills
No game plan
Dumb football
Lazy soft slow defenders etc etc


and whilst I don't disagree, nothing is improving, we are getting older, our best players are pushing 30

IMO we can't win the flag and we have too much top end talent to be in the bottom.

After 30 years of medicority I feel we are no better off and stand for nothing. We are just going through the motions and it's really sad.

I am now resigned to the fact that I will likely never see another flag in my lifetime and it hurts

We’ve beaten StKilda at their MO.

95 was so special.

AFL in hindsight punished the club severely and the livelihood of innocent players for an infringement made by a rogue president and a handful of players. That teams like Geelong now are being investigated for creativity instead of direct cash payment but will get nothing but a slap on the wrist eats me to this day. It wasn’t a 10 year destructive outcome for the club, the domino effect it’s had still festers today.

And you’ll have the club tell us to stick fat as usual.

Here we have a new president who has been where since his appointment? Nothing coming from the club apologising for the behaviour of king dicpik.

A coach who’s still finding our best version but doesn’t realise we’re now in the digital age and no longer use Melways.

A bunch of assistant coaches that the fisheries that accept John West’s rejects would even reject as would the Reject Shop.

A head of football who has the football acumen of a Mickey Mouse club member.

And we don’t pull up players such as Williams, McGovern, Motlop who time and time again shirk contests and are just interested in a pay cheque and status instead of team success.

At least some past posters are no longer here that would try to gaslight us into thinking we’re crazy, non supporters, who have no clue about football. Been paying a full membership for 26 years straight and 16 years straight for my kid. Watch every bloody game to the end. Stayed to the end at our huge shellacking over North during Pagans tenure and saw the anguish on his face as he left the coaches box where you could see he knew we were screwed for a long time.

There is a limit to the hope one can sustain. Now with another franchise joining and previous ones having so much collateral to still keep topping up with the crème and the academies we’re doomed.

It’s not about players, it’s about the constants such as admin, management, skills, preparation and standards that should be of a high level between generations. We’ve failed at all for a long long time.

 

[Michael Jezz]

To all supporters. Do not think replacing Voss solves our problem..Yes he is a carcass blowing in the breeze but we just replace one piece of meat with another. Until the entire club,including supporters embrace systemic change across the whole organisation: board, recruiting, football department we will not be successful. We tried.to.do this.2015 but did not really stay the course..The starting point is to gather around the right potential president who needs to change the constitution to reinstate board or partial board elections. The current system sustains mediocre leadership. If you think the board does not influence.onfield leadership, then who holds the onfield departments.to.account when they produce the current level of performance. Don't get sucked in by a run of wins, the organisation needs total change to break the cycle of mediocrity

 

[jj1978]

Can remember an elite kick for us?

Who was the last one?

Weiters till he got fully Carlton’d

 

[Blues_fest]

I liken last night to my golf game.

I play with a mate who is a low-mid handicapper. He'll dink an iron down the middle, hit the green in regulation, lip out for a birdie and tap in for the safest of pars.

I'll blast a driver into the trees, duff a recovery, put the next shot in a greenside bunker, blast out 15m past the hole, and drop in a bullshit putt for a bogey.

In my mind I will invent a scenario that we're not too far apart cos he only got me by a stroke.

haha Briliant.

Or, I'll bomb the drive to an unmissable approach. Chunk a 70m wedge over the green and wide, skull a chip, 3 putt and go in for double. He can be in the trees off the tee, recover to just off the green, up and down in 2 and walk off with a par.

Quality counts... And same deal, I'll think I got unlucky and should drove better than him all day. Carlton win contested possessions and think the same even though they can't hit an iron, chip or putt. We've only got 1 solid shot.

 

[dumb]

most teams will dump a kick out of d50 at some point in a game. gives defence a breather, and maybe reset if it doesn't land with your team. last resort. however we seem to lean on it very heavily. opposition does the thing you're taught to do in junior footy, build the wall, and that's enough to counteract it. either our runners aren't near the contest, in enough space, and there's no-one up the field as they've committed to getting the ball out of d50.

much like i'm sure bombing the ball into the forward 50 is the last resort. our plans to score come unstuck and we have our fallback of landing it on jesse motlop's head.

 

[jj1978]

it's round 2 let's not trade the entire team, sack the coach and burn the place down

Can we do 2 of 3?

 

[Y Goat]

This is true.
Hawthorn caught with too many players on the field

But my question is, why isn't the AFL reversing the result. Why aren't they checking the footage for the whole game and making sure that Hawthorn didn't slip players onto the field during a non-stoppage period?

Nothing would surprise me, Mitchell - remember he had a habit as a player of sneaking up behind Oppo’s star players behind play and corking them in the thigh, pretending to have accidently run into them causing them to be out for the game… but happened to keep doing it to the identified best player.. (Fyfe was one he targeted, I remember the footage)

 

[Sector 7G]

Ultimately, Young positioning was poor

There was no pressure on the player kicking it inside 50 so not all Youngs fault. Whoever was on Morrison did the defence no favours. Low penetrating kick and Young focused too much on the man and not enough on the ball.

 

[Arr0w]

There was no pressure on the player kicking it inside 50 so not all Youngs fault. Whoever was on Morrison did the defence no favours. Low penetrating kick and Young focused too much on the man and not enough on the ball.

Agreed, pressure on incoming kicker is vital

But, in that scenario he should have been playing back right shoulder, not front left

 

[Sector 7G]

This goes back to last nights bias umpiring. Simple.

Also, the question is valid, how long did they actually have the 19th player on the field - I'm not convinced it was only after a goal and why didn't our players call for a head count? Seriously grow some....

The head count isn't a thing anymore. Interchange stewards are responsible for monitoring the number of players on the ground. Hawks should have been penalised but the fault with the decision being missed lies with the AFL who for obvious reasons are trying to sift the blame.

 

[Stamos]

Carlton’s list issues laid bare as Voss confronts Blues nightmare​

Hun

https://archive.md/VhOva

 

[Rustica]

What a melt

 

[Stamos]

“The Carlton abattoir”: Hawthorn’s crisp ball movement trumps Blues brutality

The Blues were better than last week, but lacked efficiency.

sen.com.au

Is Voss to blame for underdone Curnow’s shocker?

“And this is not a crack at Charlie…”

sen.com.au

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

I seem to be more optimistic than most. I thought last night was quite positive and certainly a step in the right direction.

Some things are obvious - we are panicking out of D50 in a way that really hurts us, but the Hawks also struggled moving it from D50 bc of our F50 pressure a lot of the time - it's just that when they got through it's more memorable bc of their style. We tackled really well. It felt like a step towards things clicking. Our delivery inside F50 needs work too obviously - I'd literally be looking for Cerra or Williams every time for that last kick.

The Hawks look a lot 'prettier' than us and we are a bit too ugly (as in, we need to get a bit 'prettier' - a couple of better kicks in the team), but honestly, we don't have to look pretty to win a premiership (remember Demetriou calling the Swans unattractive?).

I don't care how we win, as long as we win. But for a few bits of misfortune (when does that free kick against JSOS ever get paid on the last line??), Motlop snicking the post, Cotts not getting the free for 'over the shoulder' directly in front, the Hawks' 19 players on field, several missing set shots (and posters) that the Hawks nailed etc, it was a flip of the coin result.

TDK and Motlop were the real positives for me (though Hewett possibly best on). It only reinforced my view that we have to do whatever it takes to keep TDK. As I've said many times, I'd trade one of the key forwards regardless (I'd love to know if Trac was a real option (and would then be sick if he was and we didn't take it)!), but it's a complete no-brainer if it's the difference between keeping or losing TDK.

Wish respect, JSOS shows that the gap between a C-grade forward and an A+ grade forward closes significantly when heart comes into it.

Walsh, H and Charlie taking up 2.5-3 million of our salary cap is a stinger atm, esp if you throw Williams in there as well. I worry about Walsh's body - he looks so stiff in his movements and nothing like his former self at this stage. We are very unlucky if his body doesn't allow him to get back to his best... But I get more frustrated by Charlie and H who rarely give everything they have.

I think there is a change that could really benefit us, and is at least worth experimenting with, and that's bringing Matt Carroll in with the freedom to play that 'loose-ish' half-back role where his focus is being an 80m driving force from defence. It would probably be for Haynes, who was fine but probably first to go from defence. He's a better defender for sure, but we need more drive.

Young is amazing - does a couple of really good things: nice marks and a lovely aggressive kick into the corridor and in my head I'm thinking "this is positive, building some confidence" .. and then he undoes it all for his own confidence, by going the spoil instead of the mark on the wing ... baffling.

I hope the team takes confidence out last night and makes that effort their baseline. Hopefully other things fall into place with some more confidence. Would be nice to be able to bring Elijah in next week... Hopefully he isn't too far away.

(None of this is to say that I'm happy with where we're at... We should be better than what we are for sure and I'm fuming that the Club seems to know less about our list than the invested footy fan ....again... (this has been going on 20 years), but I saw someone compare this current crop to 2014 ish era and we're in a far better position now than we were then I reckon. This list can be saved and contend with some bold trading and tweaks imo..... I've never been sold on Voss but hoping to be proven wrong.)

Agree with your thoughts in general above - especially on Motlop (can't believe everything I am reading praising Watson and downplaying Motlop last night) and TDK.

Also agree on Young - to me he has a lot of attributes of a good player just he thinks too slowly. You see him take a brilliant intercept mark and then take an age deciding what to do with the ball and then finally kicking it to the man who was free 30 seconds ago. His spoil on the wing was another example, he would have been thinking "I have got to get a hand on this" from a long way out and then not been able to change his thinking when he made the ground with time to spare.

I agree this did look like a step in the right direction and if we can replicate the effort next week and have both Harry & Charlie up forward against an undermanned dogs defence we might just get a win that starts the snowball moving.

 

[TylerDurden]

TDK is a monster.
Pay him whatever you have to!

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

it's round 2 let's not trade the entire team, sack the coach and burn the place down

Lions didn't start too well last year

 

[bigblueboy]

Can remember an elite kick for us?

Who was the last one?

Ryan Houlihan

Edit, already beaten to it!

 

[Arr0w]

Ryan Houlihan

Edit, already beaten to it!

Poetry