Rookie List Elevations & Nominating Banked Draft Selections

[Punchy Demons]

I've had a look around but couldn't find an answer to my two questions

1) When do clubs have to nominate the elevated rookies? It is usually the week before the first round but with the split 1st round, is it this week or the week before the relevant club plays?

2) When do clubs have to nominate if they are using banked draft picks in the 2012 draft by? (eg. Melbourne has two draft picks as compo for Scully)

Thanks in advance

 

[Chris25]

Tuesday the 20th of March is the date for activating compensation picks.

At a guess, I would say rookie elevations might be the same date. But I don't know.

 

[captainMyCaptain]

After the draft the thinking process from gws was that they would look to active all there banked draft picks this year. will be interesting if this is still thinking from gws

 

[Silvagnis]

https://twitter.com/#!/CatsInsider/status/181622339564355585

The Cats have decided to not activate the remaining compensatory pick (received for Gary Ablett) in this year's draft.

https://twitter.com/#!/CatsInsider/status/181622339564355585

Interesting decision.

Everyone thinks the draft is strong, yet Wells or Geelong don't appear to be interested in having another pick in this draft.

 

[scottwade]

Interesting decision.

Everyone thinks the draft is strong, yet Wells or Geelong don't appear to be interested in having another pick in this draft.

I don't understand why clubs should have to make their decisions now.

I fail to see why clubs can't be allowed to make the decision post season and be in a position to consider their list in terms of retirements, injuries etc at that time and then make the choice as to whether or not they activate their compensatory pick.

I can't see how anyone would be disadvantaged if the deadline was extended to the end of the season, but prior to trade week.

 

[grimlock]

I read in an article about Port that the cutoff for rookie elevations is he Wednesday before round 1.

 

[100action]

Reported that Geelong is not activating their compo this year?

 

[grimlock]

Reported that Geelong is not activating their compo this year?

Look up

 

[goodie23]

https://twitter.com/#!/CatsInsider/status/181622339564355585

https://twitter.com/#!/CatsInsider/status/181622339564355585

Interesting decision.

Everyone thinks the draft is strong, yet Wells or Geelong don't appear to be interested in having another pick in this draft.

Their remaining compensation pick is positioned after their first round selection, they're probably backing themselves to have a strong year and reserving it for down the track when they suspect they'll finish lower.

I don't understand why clubs should have to make their decisions now.

I fail to see why clubs can't be allowed to make the decision post season and be in a position to consider their list in terms of retirements, injuries etc at that time and then make the choice as to whether or not they activate their compensatory pick.

I can't see how anyone would be disadvantaged if the deadline was extended to the end of the season, but prior to trade week.

The original theory was probably to dissuade tanking, clubs don't set out to lose at the start of the year but might 'play the kids' at the tail and tank if they knew they could activate a compensation pick and improve their first two draft picks.

That theory doesn't really consider clubs trading away picks which creates a whole other bunch of issues and complications though.

 

[Silvagnis]

Compo picks triggered

THE Western Bulldogs, Melbourne and Greater Western Sydney have decided to utilise extra first-round draft picks in 2012, meaning this year's bumper national draft will have a crowded first round and clubs will be pushed back in the pecking order.

Along with activating the first-round Ward compensation pick, the Bulldogs have also decided to utilise the extra third-round choice they got for the departure of Sam Reid to the Giants.

Compo picks triggered

GWS' pick will be tied to where the Crows finish.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

It's a bit surprising but I don't think it's a reflection on the strength of the draft, more that the club feels we are likely to finish higher up the ladder this year than we will in 2014, so they feel they will get better value from it then.

Also they probably are concerned about not having a lot of free list spots at the end of the year, as a lot of the kids haven't played enough yet to make a call on them. Makes sense to give a few more 12 months.

Slightly unrelated question, but also relevant given the strength of the draft, does anyone know if the third year rookie rule (i.e. the allowance to keep players on your rookie list for a third year) is continuing? My understanding was it was a concession for the compromised drafts (along with the allowance to include rookie elevations in the 3 compulsory picks) so I am wondering if it is continuing beyond this year? It would cause issues for a lot of clubs who may be planning to clear a lot of spots for this draft if they have to elevate their second year rookies.

 

[Silvagnis]

How strong does the 2013 draft look?

With Melbourne, Geelong and the GC having four comp picks plus anyone else who loses a player, then the next draft and this one are still going to be compromised to a degree.

Just four drafts in a row.

They could also be holding onto these compensation picks for the remaining two selections in the mini-draft.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

AFAIK pretty strong, although I'll defer to the residents experts here on that.

Certainly it'll take a few years before all the compo picks get out of the system and the draft is truly uncompromised again.

The clubs might be saving picks for the mini draft although with the strength of this draft I tend to think the remaining mini draft picks won't fetch the same price that OMeara and Crouch did.

 

[coryne]

I must say I am pretty happy "only" 3 clubs are activating compo picks this year. I am a little surprised Melbourne haven't activated both compo picks so they could load up on kids this year, as you would expect that their ladder position would improve in the near future (well they have to eventually don't they) so they would prob get best value activating them this year before they climb the ladder again.

I think it is a good move that Geelong are golding off theirs, they can't stay up the top of the ladder forever (can they???) so will get better value in a year or two after their remaining AA's have retired, and their position weakens.

It will now be interesting to see what teams who loose players to the GWS do this year (eg if they will activate it straight away). That said, I am happier that the 1st rd will end somewhere around 21 instead of 26 ............

 

[goodie23]

I must say I am pretty happy "only" 3 clubs are activating compo picks this year. I am a little surprised Melbourne haven't activated both compo picks so they could load up on kids this year, as you would expect that their ladder position would improve in the near future (well they have to eventually don't they) so they would prob get best value activating them this year before they climb the ladder again.

I think it is a good move that Geelong are holding off theirs, they can't stay up the top of the ladder forever (can they???) so will get better value in a year or two after their remaining AA's have retired, and their position weakens.

It will now be interesting to see what teams who lose players to the GWS do this year (eg if they will activate it straight away). That said, I am happier that the 1st rd will end somewhere around 21 instead of 26 ............

Only one of the Melbourne picks is linked to their ladder finish, the other is a mid-first round. Odds are they're keeping the latter in reserve

 

[dlanod]

Certainly it'll take a few years before all the compo picks get out of the system and the draft is truly uncompromised again.

As of this year and later, there's going to be compo picks handed out for losing players to free agency. Depending on how many players change clubs, there's never going to be an "uncompromised" draft again.

 

[coryne]

Only one of the Melbourne picks is linked to their ladder finish, the other is a mid-first round. Odds are they're keeping the latter in reserve

Thus it was interesting that they wouldn't activate it in THIS draft, as it is supposed to be a STRONG draft and they won't be able to advance it's position by holding off using it latter. It will be almost impossible to use it in a draft where it is the ONLY pick used, so it would be better to use it in a strong draft and a possibly weaker draft in a year or two time.


IMO it would have been the best draft to use both as
a) It is a strong draft, thus getting good value-for-money from the mid-1st rd pick
b) They will be looking to improve their ladder position in the near future, thus they would get the best value-for-money from the "after 1st rd pick" pick.

Sure there will be 2 compo picks activated which could possibly push the value of the picks down the order due to them being tied into the ladder positions of Adelaide and the Bulldogs, but the strength of the draft + their impending move up the ladder would have made it an attractive proposition for this year. I guess the main issue would have been the extra player who would need to make way at the end of the year for the second new draftee, but I think a fair few clubs will cull their lists this year to take advantage of an "uncompromised"/strong draft anyway .........

 

[coryne]

As of this year and later, there's going to be compo picks handed out for losing players to free agency. Depending on how many players change clubs, there's never going to be an "uncompromised" draft again.

Considering the number of PP's handed out over the years, have there really been that make "uncompromised" drafts ???

 

[Raymann]

I would have thought that Melbourne would activate its compo pick directly after its 1st rnd pick this year for all of the reasons mentioned above.

I would have thought they would hold the other pick to trade into the mini draft etc with GWS as this pick has great value to GWS or GC.

They may even trade it this year with GC since GC have already secured the best player in this years age group.

 

[liz]

When people refer to a "strong draft" it is often a reference to the depth, as much as to the quality at the top end. Most drafts seem to have a pretty good top 20-30 but it is the perception of how good 30+ are that rank a draft.

Hence a first round compensation pick (whether middle, end or floating) is arguably of more value in a weak draft than a strong one, since it enables you to make an extra pick from a limited pool of high quality players. In a strong draft, recruiters probably back themselves to get their hands on good players even with later picks. So unless you envisage having a massive list clean-out at the end of the season, why not hang onto it in a strong (deep) draft?

 

[Slattery_20]

When people refer to a "strong draft" it is often a reference to the depth, as much as to the quality at the top end. Most drafts seem to have a pretty good top 20-30 but it is the perception of how good 30+ are that rank a draft.

Hence a first round compensation pick (whether middle, end or floating) is arguably of more value in a weak draft than a strong one, since it enables you to make an extra pick from a limited pool of high quality players. In a strong draft, recruiters probably back themselves to get their hands on good players even with later picks. So unless you envisage having a massive list clean-out at the end of the season, why not hang onto it in a strong (deep) draft?

Heppell is, supposedly, our second worst 1st pick we've had in about 8 years, and supposedly in the "weakest" draft.
He's clearly the best we've had in that time - and guys who went just before or soon after him look almost as good. (Even if we'd gone Hansen over Gumby as we were tossing up)

Predicting the strength of a group appears to be a crab-shoot at best, and it just becomes accepted as fact around here.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

I'd rather Melbourne go after a classy young mid with both our compo picks personally...

 

[RandB]

If a club activates a pick and then trades it at the end of the year to another club is the receiving club forced to use that pick (because it was initially activated) or can they "de-activate" the pick and re activate it in a future season?

 

[dlanod]

If a club activates a pick and then trades it at the end of the year to another club is the receiving club forced to use that pick (because it was initially activated) or can they "de-activate" the pick and re activate it in a future season?

Once activated that pick is effectively now just pick XX, where XX is determined at the end of the season. It can't be deactivated.

 

[RandB]

Once activated that pick is effectively now just pick XX, where XX is determined at the end of the season. It can't be deactivated.

ah ok, thanks.