Review Round 14, 2020 vs Sydney

[TeeKray]

Geelong got belted for a quarter by an average bulldogs and they are lauded as heroes for coming back from a position they should never have been in. Port coast for a quarter when the game is already won and the sky is falling.


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And what happened after that? They conceded 3.4.22 for the remainder of the match and found a way to win the game. The first quarter was a total aberration.

They concede an average of 52 points per game. Their defence is tough, strong and reliable. Our defence looks shaky and brittle and collapses far too easily when put under pressure by good teams. Evidence suggests that a good team only needs to get on top of us for a quarter and it'll be game over - witness the St Kilda and Brisbane games. We can't absorb a sustained period of dominance by an opposition.

 

[Hammer#8]

First time I was sitting high up in the stands yesterday at the game. You really get an idea of how bad our inside-50 entries are, if its not ill-timed kicks its ill-timed leads from our forwards.

Our kicks in always seem to miss their mark, forcing our forwards to bust their guts trying to reach it if not jumping too early. Its so easy to defend against because it always seems to benefit the defender who can mop up or just lock it in.

 

[OneGreatClub]

And what happened after that? They conceded 3.4.22 for the remainder of the match and found a way to win the game. The first quarter was a total aberration.

They concede an average of 52 points per game. Their defence is tough, strong and reliable. Our defence looks shaky and brittle and collapses far too easily when put under pressure by good teams. Evidence suggests that a good team only needs to get on top of us for a quarter and it'll be game over - witness the St Kilda and Brisbane games. We can't absorb a sustained period of dominance by an opposition.

Geelong, for all their glory and experience are also on the same number of wins as us and are yet to play the in form Richmond

 

[TeeKray]

Geelong, for all their glory and experience are also on the same number of wins as us and are yet to play the in form Richmond

Nobody is accusing us of not racking up wins. It's about the way we play and what that looks like in finals and how that translates to winning premierships.

I think our midfield is playing premiership football. Boak, Rockliff, Wines and SPP are all more or less at peak form. The inefficiency of our forward line and brittleness of our back line are continuing concerns and it raises eyebrows when they don't even look good against undermanned bottom 4 teams at home, as has been the case the past fortnight.

We're trying to win a premiership, right? Just 'good' isn't going to cut it.

 

[backtozero]

Nobody is accusing us of not racking up wins. It's about the way we play and what that looks like in finals and how that translates to winning premierships.

I think our midfield is playing premiership football. Boak, Rockliff, Wines and SPP are all more or less at peak form. The inefficiency of our forward line and brittleness of our back line are continuing concerns and it raises eyebrows when they don't even look good against undermanned bottom 4 teams at home, as has been the case the past fortnight.

We're trying to win a premiership, right? Just 'good' isn't going to cut it.

Do you think we can go to another level ie. the way we played against Richmond, again?

 

[TeeKray]

Do you think we can go to another level ie. the way we played against Richmond, again?

Of course we can. There's always been that element of rising and falling to the opposition's level under Hinkley.

But it's still sobering to think about what happens when our midfield gets horse whipped for a quarter (Q2 against Brisbane, Q4 against St Kilda and Q1-Q4 against Geelong). If the midfield doesn't fire, we look like a legitimate bottom 4 team. That has to be a concern.

 

[backtozero]

Of course we can. There's always been that element of rising and falling to the opposition's level under Hinkley.

But it's still sobering to think about what happens when our midfield gets horse whipped for a quarter (Q2 against Brisbane, Q4 against St Kilda and Q1-Q4 against Geelong). If the midfield doesn't fire, we look like a legitimate bottom 4 team. That has to be a concern.

So why is it you think its our midfield that is playing premiership football while the forwards and backs are letting us down?

 

[Qwerty71]

It felt like the game changed when Alir Alir went into the ruck. To me it just proves how important Ladham is to our structure. Alir Alir tap work at centre bounces got them going and his mobility around the ground with Lycett having to cover the ground and ruck with little help took a toll on him. Ladham's allows more resting time for Lycett and his mobility is such a big plus for us.

Twice now when we have faced tap ruckmen (Saints and Sydney) things have gone south for us.

I can't wait to see them two working together in finals, I think we are so much better with both of them in the team.

 

[sobrave]

It felt like the game changed when Alir Alir went into the ruck. To me it just proves how important Ladham is to our structure. Alir Alir tap work at centre bounces got them going and his mobility around the ground with Lycett having to cover the ground and ruck with little help took a toll on him. Ladham's allows more resting time for Lycett and his mobility is such a big plus for us.

Twice now when we have faced tap ruckmen (Saints and Sydney) things have gone south for us.

I can't wait to see them two working together in finals, I think we are so much better with both of them in the team.

Lycett is lumbering around like an old fashioned dinosaur ruckman at the moment. I mean he was never the most agile but he seems to have lost a bit. He's handy against the big boi ruckman but there's not many of those types left.

 

[backtozero]

Lycett is lumbering around like an old fashioned dinosaur ruckman at the moment. I mean he was never the most agile but he seems to have lost a bit. He's handy against the big boi ruckman but there's not many of those types left.

He's still carrying niggles imo. He'll benefit massively from Ladhams coming back in #2weeks.

 

[TeeKray]

So why is it you think its our midfield that is playing premiership football while the forwards and backs are letting us down?

Backs aren't big or strong enough (see Stewart, Taylor, Henderson, Bews at Geelong).

Key forwards apart from Dixon are too young (Ladhams, Marshall, Georgiades) or too old (Westhoff).

Don't get me wrong, we can still fire and trouble good teams on our day, especially when the midfield gets on top. But can we do it 3 times in October and lift the cup? I can't see it.

 

[Qwerty71]

Lycett is lumbering around like an old fashioned dinosaur ruckman at the moment. I mean he was never the most agile but he seems to have lost a bit. He's handy against the big boi ruckman but there's not many of those types left.

I agree but having a Dinosaur and young buck working together is probably the best of both worlds..

 

[Interstater]

In my opinion we really should have played Hayes instead of Westhoff in the Sydney game.
Huge missed opportunity.

But our coaches are remaining loyal to those they consider are owed one (or two) last chances of a flag.

 

[240volt]

In my opinion we really should have played Hayes instead of Westhoff in the Sydney game.
Huge missed opportunity.

But our coaches are remaining loyal to those they consider are owed one (or two) last chances of a flag.

In this game stacked season Hayes should have been given a go.
We are running Lycett into the ground because westy is not worth squat.

 

[swanssince2002]

I come in peace. Congrats on the win guys. We tried our best in the second half, but the game is a reflection of where the two sides are at ATM. Gonna be a long way back.

 

[Jason K]

You could tell in the warm up they were tired and were going to struggle. I reckon Hinkles snuck in a heavy training load while he could. Shits me to tears when he does this.

 

[gbear]

If we are able to get Rozee, Duursma, Marshall and Burton firing we will be a better side. We need to increase the pace through the middle of the ground. One of our main problems in this second half of the season is our inability to transition that ball through the middle quickly, rather the ball is moved along the wings and into the pockets the majority of the time which gives our opponents more time to contest our forward line.

 

[Doctor Feel]

So why is it you think its our midfield that is playing premiership football while the forwards and backs are letting us down?

Our forwards and backs are exposed if the midfield doesn't fire. They can't stand on their own two feet.

Teams like West coast can rely on their backline when the going gets tough, or their forwards to get creative when scoring dries up. We just stop.

 

[PJ Power]

Backs aren't big or strong enough (see Stewart, Taylor, Henderson, Bews at Geelong).

Key forwards apart from Dixon are too young (Ladhams, Marshall, Georgiades) or too old (Westhoff).

Don't get me wrong, we can still fire and trouble good teams on our day, especially when the midfield gets on top. But can we do it 3 times in October and lift the cup? I can't see it.

That's the thing. It's doing it against three out of Brisbane, Richmond, Geelong and West Coast. That's a very tall order, especially given the finals-hardened make-up of those sides and the dominance that Geelong and Brisbane have over us especially.

There will need to be some remarkable and sustained performances for us to pull it off. Dixon will need to go to another level in finals, while we will need Gray, Rozee, Butters, Boak and Wines to be at their absolute best against all opposition. Then we'll need someone like a Marshall, Ladhams or Georgiades to really have some break out performances. It's not out of the question.

 

[Power freak 2008]

I agree with most that we are in a funk at the moment. The coach even admits it. Richmond have had some shockers, Sydney beat GWS recently and has been plucky in most games they have played. The Bulldogs gave Geelong a fright and Wet Toast just got a hiding from Richmond. I don't think any team can keep the top pace going week in and week out. We may not be playing well but I think our best is still very good and that is all you can ask for.

We keep in the game for 3 quarters and know that when we surge other teams struggle to go with us. How many times have we seen it this year? Even the Sydney game. We busted our gut, got a lead, and then backed off again. I don't think that you can surge every single week. Too many young players and veterans not able to keep it up.

Good signs that Robbie Gray seems to be coming good at the right part of the season, Rozee should be molly coddled so that he can lift during the finals. Boak can go into cruise control for a while. If we do make a finals Motlop can play his 2-3 great games of the year. Marshall is a form player. Needs to play a few games to get his confidence. Duursma needed a spell. He may need one more break just before finals.

In the mean-time we are being carried by a defense that has saved our bacon on more than a few occasions. SPP, DBJ, Jonas, Lycett and Houston when he was in are players that put in most weeks. Boak, Gray, Dixon, Amon with Cameos from a few others provides the spark and makes up look like world beaters when we need it.

Winning a flag isn't a gimme but once we get to the big dance, I think that there is an argument that we can get into finals mode. I also think that there is an argument that if we were playing at our best now we could get found out at finals. Teams are trying to knock the ball on quickly and get it over the top or Switch to opposite sides of the field to move our defence around.

I don't think that Hinkley is alone in making changes. I think that the combination of the coaches in Schofield, Hinkley and Basset is allowing us to work on the problems. Case in point is when they started employing Rockcliff as a defender at stoppages to prevent the ball from exiting easily. Giving us better organisation and structure at our stoppages. Looks like when he was dropped he was working ith a coach to iron this out.

Now we have to fix the way teams are getting it over the top of or defense too easily. The return of Burton may fix that because he reads the play well and is quicker and taller than all of our defenders. He needs to get some form and be the guy that doesn't allow that to happen. We are in a stage when we are not just playing games but have to balance the team to prepare for the finals.

If you guys think that we should be humming along nicely now you are delusional. We are one of the most studied teams in the league. Geelong is getting more scrutiny and look at how the gap is closing. Every system is beatable. Richmond's system has been the hardest to crack but one team will get it right and win the finals. Our coaches all have to earn their paycheck as well as the players. We just need to see signs that they are trying.

 

[edgie]

Marshall needs a killer edge. Dixon has it, Powell-Pepper has it.

I don't know if Dixon does have it. I've seen him appear to barrel in t blokes several times, but they always bounce back up. I don't think he's actually hurt anyone, left them on the ground for more than a few seconds. Dixon gets by due to his size and strength, and his angry face, not his killer instinct.

 

[PJ Power]

I agree with most that we are in a funk at the moment. The coach even admits it. Richmond have had some shockers, Sydney beat GWS recently and has been plucky in most games they have played. The Bulldogs gave Geelong a fright and Wet Toast just got a hiding from Richmond. I don't think any team can keep the top pace going week in and week out. We may not be playing well but I think our best is still very good and that is all you can ask for.

We keep in the game for 3 quarters and know that when we surge other teams struggle to go with us. How many times have we seen it this year? Even the Sydney game. We busted our gut, got a lead, and then backed off again. I don't think that you can surge every single week. Too many young players and veterans not able to keep it up.

Good signs that Robbie Gray seems to be coming good at the right part of the season, Rozee should be molly coddled so that he can lift during the finals. Boak can go into cruise control for a while. If we do make a finals Motlop can play his 2-3 great games of the year. Marshall is a form player. Needs to play a few games to get his confidence. Duursma needed a spell. He may need one more break just before finals.

In the mean-time we are being carried by a defense that has saved our bacon on more than a few occasions. SPP, DBJ, Jonas, Lycett and Houston when he was in are players that put in most weeks. Boak, Gray, Dixon, Amon with Cameos from a few others provides the spark and makes up look like world beaters when we need it.

Winning a flag isn't a gimme but once we get to the big dance, I think that there is an argument that we can get into finals mode. I also think that there is an argument that if we were playing at our best now we could get found out at finals. Teams are trying to knock the ball on quickly and get it over the top or Switch to opposite sides of the field to move our defence around.

I don't think that Hinkley is alone in making changes. I think that the combination of the coaches in Schofield, Hinkley and Basset is allowing us to work on the problems. Case in point is when they started employing Rockcliff as a defender at stoppages to prevent the ball from exiting easily. Giving us better organisation and structure at our stoppages. Looks like when he was dropped he was working ith a coach to iron this out.

Now we have to fix the way teams are getting it over the top of or defense too easily. The return of Burton may fix that because he reads the play well and is quicker and taller than all of our defenders. He needs to get some form and be the guy that doesn't allow that to happen. We are in a stage when we are not just playing games but have to balance the team to prepare for the finals.

If you guys think that we should be humming along nicely now you are delusional. We are one of the most studied teams in the league. Geelong is getting more scrutiny and look at how the gap is closing. Every system is beatable. Richmond's system has been the hardest to crack but one team will get it right and win the finals. Our coaches all have to earn their paycheck as well as the players. We just need to see signs that they are trying.

Good post. Having a fit and in-form Houston (who is desperate to atone) play behind the ball, will also help our defensive structures and ability to make the high press work and not leak goals.

 

[Shaucob_Burjan]

Wonder if anyone can look up Dixon with Marshall and without Marshall this season, bet you that there's a huge difference in no. of goals kicked by Dixon

 

[backtozero]

Wonder if anyone can look up Dixon with Marshall and without Marshall this season, bet you that there's a huge difference in no. of goals kicked by Dixon

There's no doubt that Dixon plays better with Todd in the team but it would be nice if Todd could be more than just a decoy at times. I think it's OK to expect a little bit more.

 

[backtozero]

I don't know if Dixon does have it. I've seen him appear to barrel in t blokes several times, but they always bounce back up. I don't think he's actually hurt anyone, left them on the ground for more than a few seconds. Dixon gets by due to his size and strength, and his angry face, not his killer instinct.

Killer instinct doesn't mean thug acts. He's no good to anyone if he gets reported.
A killer instinct means not being timid.