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Stats observations

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Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
Last Friday night's game was rare being a Friday night game in Sydney. It was also rare in that winners of multiple Brownlow medals played against each other. The last few such occasions are:

Code: 
Year Round  Home        Away        Players
--------------------------------------------------
2011  R  6  Sydney      Carlton     Goodes, Judd
2008  R 12  Sydney      St Kilda    Goodes, Harvey
2008  R  1  St Kilda    Sydney      Harvey, Goodes
2007  R 19  Sydney      St Kilda    Goodes, Harvey
2007  R  7  St Kilda    Sydney      Harvey, Goodes
1985  R 17  North Melb  Melbourne   Greig, Moore
1985  R  6  Melbourne   North Melb  Moore, Greig
1975  R  8  North Melb  Richmond    Greig, Stewart
Click to expand...

The only other occasions were:
Skilton & Stewart, 1967 R8, 1968 R1, 1970 R6, 1971 R4
Hutchison & Wright 1955 R1 & 12, 1956 R5 & 16, though this is a technicality since Hutchison's 1952 medal was awarded retrospectively in 1989
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

History of the Highest Score for Each Quarter.
(On occasion of Essendon breaking the record for a first quarter)


  • When Carlton set the then record 3rd quarter score of 9.2-56 in round 11 of 1909, the 9 goals were all that Carlton scored for the match. Final score:
    Carlton 9.14-68 v Sydney/SM 6.8-44.

  • Gold Coast is the only team to have joined the League after 1986 to have had a highest quarter score set against them.

  • The last 6 times that the highest last quarter score has been set have been in matches against St Kilda.

  • On the 47 occasions that a new highest quarter score has been set, 18 have been against St Kilda.

  • Essendon has set the record on the most occasions - 10 times, including the most recent for a first quarter in 2011.
Full List Here:
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Longest current sequences of matches between opponents without a draw:

209 Ge v Sy (VFL/AFL record)
206 Ge v St
176 Co v Ri
157 Ca v Ha
153 Ha v Me
152 Es v Ha
151 Me v St
150 Co v Ha
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Ron The Bear said:
Longest current sequences of matches between opponents without a draw:

209 Ge v Sy (VFL/AFL record)
206 Ge v St
176 Co v Ri
157 Ca v Ha
153 Ha v Me
152 Es v Ha
151 Me v St
150 Co v Ha
Click to expand...

The above caused me to wonder and investigate further:

No draws, Geelong and Sydney/SM have played ten matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Four 6 points, six 1 points. Sydney/SM has won seven, Geelong three.

No draws, Geelong and St Kilda have played eight matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Three 6 points, five 1 points. Each has won 4 (Geelong one by forfeit).

No draws, Carlton and Hawthorn have played four matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Three 6 points, one 1 point. Each has won 2.

No draws, Melbourne and Hawthorn have played nine matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Five 6 points, four 1 points. Melbourne has won 6 of them.

No draws, Essendon and Hawthorn have played five matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Three 6 points, two 1 points. Essendon has won 3 of them.

No draws, Collingwood and Hawthorn have played four matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Two 6 points, two 1 points. Each has won 2.

Since their only draw in 1917 Collingwood and Richmond have played five matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. Two 6 points and three 1 points. Collingwood has won all five.

Since their only draw in 1921 Melbourne and St Kilda have played six matches with scores 1 scoring shot from a draw. All six have been by 1 point. St Kilda has won four of them.

Hawthorn has the lowest percentage of draws of teams that joined the League before 1987. It may be due to the two distinct phases of their career in the League. First as 'chopping block' and second as 'powerhouse'.
 

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Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Wooden Spooners v Finalists

1) The first Wooden Spooner to beat two finalists was St Kilda in 1904. They won against top of the ladder and eventual Premiers, Fitzroy by 47 points and by 15 points against third placed Collingwood.

2) The last finalist to lose twice to the Wooden Spooner was Melbourne to Carlton in 2006. Previously St Kilda lost twice to Brisbane in 1998,

3) In 1922 Wooden Spooner Sydney/SM beat three of year's four finalist's, Collingwood, Carlton and Essendon. They also got to within 11 points of eventual Premiers, Fitzroy.

4) The biggest win by a Wooden Spooner against an eventual finalists in the Final 4 system (1931-1971) was 42 points. Round 15, 1957 Geelong 11.19-85 v Carlton 6.7-43

5) The biggest win by a Wooden Spooner against an eventual finalists in a Final 8 system is 37 points. Round 22, 2001 Fremantle 17.18-120 v Adelaide 11.17-83

More Here:
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

1. Richmond have made the finals in consecutive years (or better) only 4 times.
2. The Western Bulldogs and St Kilda's best run of consecutive finals is only 4.
3. North Melbourne have only twice made finals in more than two consecutive years.
4. Carlton and Collingwood are the only* teams to never go 8 years without making finals.
5. Carlton is the only team to twice make finals in 10 or more consecutive years.

*ignoring non-Victorian clubs
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
1. Richmond have made the finals in consecutive years only 4 times.
2. The Western Bulldogs and St Kilda's best run of consecutive finals is only 4.
3. North Melbourne have only twice made finals in more than two consecutive years.
4. Carlton and Collingwood are the only* teams to never go 8 years without making finals.
5. Carlton is the only team to twice make finals in 10 or more consecutive years.

*ignoring non-Victorian clubs
Click to expand...

Richmond's consecutive final's appearances have been in:
1 group of 3 1919-1921
1 group of 9 1927-1935
1 group of 5 1940-1944
1 group of 5 1971-1975

Each contains an overlapping subset of consecutive finals appearances for a total of 18.

Nth Melbourne's more than 2 consecutive finals appearances have been in:
1 group of 7 1974-1980
1 group of 8 1993-2000

Each group contains a number of overlapping subsets of 3 or more consecutive finals appearances.

Saying that "Richmond have made the finals in consecutive years only 4 times" and "North Melbourne have only twice made finals in more than two consecutive years" gives the impression that neither club has ever been able to sustain a place in the finals for more than 2 or 3 years at a time.

You could perhaps say that all of Richmond's consecutive finals appearance have been contained in 4 blocks and Nth Melbourne's consecutive finals series of 3 or more have been contained in just 2 blocks.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Richmond's finals appearances are rather intruiging actually, and i didn't realise until looking through 'Allthestats' some years ago that they haven't actually made the finals anywhere nears as regularly as say Geelong has.

What they have been though is highly successful in their finals forays, and have ten flags and i think 11 runners-up finishes, so their strike rate of making the Big Dance and performance in them is excellent. Melbourne and Hawthorn have similar records, although the Hawks's relatively lowish numbers of years of making finals is coloured by their 32-season drought from 1925-1956.

Geelong by contrast has made the finals roughly half the time, but obviously haven't progressed into the Grand Final as much as the clubs listed above. Mind you, i think Geelong has 17 3rd placings, so we have been around up to the penultimate week in about 30% of our active seasons. Not too bad really.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Number of games it has taken the expansion teams to win 1 thru 5 games:

Code: 
[B]              1st  2nd  3rd  4th  5th
-------------------------------------[/B]
Adelaide        1    3    6    9   11
Brisbane        1    2    5    8   15
Fremantle       3    4    6    9   10
Gold Coast      4    6
Port Adelaide   3    4    5    6    9
West Coast      1    5    6    7    9

Very impressive that the first 5 expansion clubs were all at worst 3-3 and 4-5.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
Number of games it has taken the expansion teams to win 1 thru 5 games:

Code: 
[B]              1st  2nd  3rd  4th  5th[/B]
[B]-------------------------------------[/B]
Adelaide        1    3    6    9   11
Brisbane        1    2    5    8   15
Fremantle       3    4    6    9   10
Gold Coast      4    6
Port Adelaide   3    4    5    6    9
West Coast      1    5    6    7    9

Very impressive that the first 5 expansion clubs were all at worst 3-3 and 4-5.
Click to expand...


Port winning 4 on the trot is a decent effort, would like to see this stat for a whole year
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Gold Coast records v Brisbane
- biggest win
- most goals
- most behinds
- most scoring shots
- highest score
- most accurate score
- first time winning 2 quarters
- first time leading at every quarter

Occasionally they will enter the record books for their losses. But given time, they will create some positive records :thumbsu:
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
Number of rounds it has taken for each team to first reach the top or bottom of the ladder:

Code: 
                 [B]First   Last[/B]
Adelaide            49    208
Brisbane Bears     209     20
Brisbane Lions      45     23
Carlton             96      1
Collingwood         58     45
Essendon             7     29
Fitzroy              1    163
Fremantle          363*    94
Geelong             14      2
Gold Coast           5*     2
Hawthorn           270      4
Melbourne            3     92
[B]Nth Melbourne       39[/B]     22
Port Adelaide      122     67
Richmond           188     22
St Kilda           159      3
South Melbourne    125     43
University          19      1
West Coast          24     46
Footscray          288     18
* current; yet to be on top of the ladder
Click to expand...

Some interesting little notes about North's first trip to the top of the ladder in 1927...

- It was after a 1926 season in which the Shinboners won their first wooden spoon, and recorded just one draw in 18 matches (against Hawthorn).

- they took top spot after pumping eventual 1927 wooden spooner Hawthorn at Glenferrie in round four (with 3 wins).

- they would not win another game that season, even getting beaten at Arden St in the return game against the Hawks (who had an 8 goal to 1 final term). It was Hawthorn's only win during the 1927 season. This game was also one of the lowest crowds ever recorded during a VFL/AFL match. Just 4,000 people turned up.

- so after being 3 wins 1 loss after round four, they finished the season in 11th place with a 3 win 15 loss record.

- North would go on to lose 15 consecutive matches after going top, not hitting the winners list again until round 2 1928 when they defeated, you guessed it, Hawthorn, at Arden Street in front of an improved crowd of 6000.

- North would finish 1928 in 11th place again - this time with five wins. Their biggest win was 16 points against Carlton - their other wins were vs Hawthorn (15 and 4 points) and South Melbourne (1 and 2 points).

- In 1929, they were back on the bottom with just one win for the year, a feat they repeated in 1930 (but with a substantially worse percentage).

- It got worse though - the Roos went all of 1931 without a single win for a 3rd consecutive spoon.

- So essentially, after going top early in 1927, they then won just 7 games in the next 86 matches.

- North would not find themselves top of the ladder at the end of a completed round again until the final round of 1949 - a gap of almost 23 seasons - and giving them their first minor premiership.

Interesting also to note that round 1 1909 was the one and only time University topped the ladder at any stage in their 7 VFL seasons.
 

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Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Building on 'Red & Black's original research here are some expanded tables on First Top and Bottom

Of the teams that joined the League in 1925 Hawthorn had their first sustained period on top of the ladder (8 rounds or more) in 1971, North Melbourne not until 1978, while WB/Footscray have failed to do so yet.

Meanwhile: Here's a trivia question in the style of QI's 'general ignorance'.

Which team was the last "minor premiers"?

Before you answer you might like to check some background.

(Nth Melbourne play a significant role.)
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

RogersResults said:
Building on 'Red & Black's original research here are some expanded tables on First Top and Bottom

Of the teams that joined the League in 1925 Hawthorn had their first sustained period on top of the ladder (8 rounds or more) in 1971, North Melbourne not until 1978, while WB/Footscray have failed to do so yet.

Meanwhile: Here's a trivia question in the style of QI's 'general ignorance'.

Which team was the last "minor premiers"?

Before you answer you might like to check some background.

(Nth Melbourne play a significant role.)
Click to expand...

I think the term 'Minor Premiers' has taken on a different meaning in the last 104 years. I also don't think there is anything wrong with that.

The answer to the question - Fitzroy.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Last time Melbourne had two 90 point victories in the same season: 1993.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
Number of rounds it has taken for each team to first reach the top or bottom of the ladder:

Code: 
                 [B]First   Last[/B]
Adelaide            49    208
Brisbane Bears     209     20
Brisbane Lions      45     23
Carlton             96      1
Collingwood         58     45
Essendon             7     29
Fitzroy              1    163
[B]Fremantle[/B]          363*    94
Geelong             14      2
Gold Coast           5*     2
Hawthorn           270      4
Melbourne            3     92
Nth Melbourne       39     22
Port Adelaide      122     67
Richmond           188     22
St Kilda           159      3
South Melbourne    125     43
University          19      1
West Coast          24     46
Footscray          288     18
* current; yet to be on top of the ladder
Click to expand...

This stat shocked me. But in a good way, like when you're a kid and you put your tongue on a 9V battery.
 
The highest score which has been doubled, though not precisely doubled, is:
109 by St.Kilda (16.13) vs Geelong 35.18.228, Round 7, 1989

The highest score which has been tripled is:
75 by Brisbane Bears (11.9) vs Geelong 37.17.239, Round 7, 1992

The highest score which has been quadrupled is:
48 by Melbourne (6.12) vs Fitzroy 36.22.238, Round 17, 1979

The highest score which has been quintupled is:
36 by Fitzroy (5.6) vs Richmond 28.19.187, Round 21, 1996

The highest score which has been sextupled is:
31 by North Melbourne (4.7) vs Richmond 30.19.199, Round 2, 1931


Naturally, I could go on and on, but obviously, the lower each score gets, the less surprising it is that it has been increased by each subsequent quantity.
 

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Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Round 7 2011


1) Melbourne's 2nd win by 90 points or more this year, their equal most in any year. Previous: 2 in 1993 and 1939.
2) Geelong's 30th win by 10 goals in 5 seasons 2007-11. Next most: Collingwood 16 and WB/Footscray 16. Least: Brisbane 2.
3) Hawthorn v Port Adelaide: Only the third match ever played where both teams scored exactly 1 quarter of their total score in the 2nd quarter. Previous: Round 13 1972 Hawthorn v Nth Melbourne and round 8, 1914 University v Fitzroy.
4) St Kilda's 11th consecutive match without scoring a century, the most since 11 in 1999.
5) This was St Kilda's 1,000th match since they won their only Premiership in 1966.

More Here
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

*Paul* said:
Heh, a little too pedantic for my tastes :p

Next we'll have a bunch of Grand Finals excommunicated because they pre-dated the explicit term, or were one of those only-needed-one-final seasons.
Click to expand...

The League might have thought that a possibility at some stage because they retrospectively have given all the last matches that determined the Premiers in those years the title of 'Grand Final', even if it was the only final match played.
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

Can't remember what was said on radio to trigger this, but I thought I'd have a look at Ladder Differentials. Basically, how many times has a given team finished higher or lower than all other teams.

Below is a look at Fremantle and their ladder differential relative to every other club for their 16 season existence. How far higher or lower they finish was not considered, just whether they finished higher or lower. This is as at the end of each home and away season.

eg. Fremantle has finished lower than Sydney a difference of 14 times (1 higher, 15 lower).

I then had a look at Fremantle's win/loss record against each side, and noted any peculiarities.

eg. Fremantle's ladder differential is just -2 relative to Hawthorn, yet Hawthorn are Fremantle's 2nd most difficult opponent. Conversely, Fremantle almost always finishes lower than Sydney, yet Sydney are only their 12th most difficult opponent.

Hope this all makes some kind of sense :confused: :p

Code: 
+ 2 : Melbourne, Richmond (10), Fitzroy
--------------------------------------------------------------
- 2 : Carlton, Hawthorn (2)
- 4 : Essendon (4)
- 6 : Collingwood (7), St Kilda
- 8 : Western Bulldogs, North Melbourne, West Coast, Brisbane
-10 : Adelaide (11), Port Adelaide
-12 : Geelong
-14 : Sydney (12)
 
Re: Post 5 random (obscure) stats

red+black said:
Can't remember what was said on radio to trigger this, but I thought I'd have a look at Ladder Differentials.
...
Click to expand...

Might be easiest to display this in a crosstab showing all clubs at once, e.g.


Code: 
Cb  Ad  Br  Ca  Co  Es...
-------------------------
Ad       x   x   x   x
Br   x       x   x   x
Ca   x   x       x   x
Co   x   x   x       x
Es   x   x   x   x    
Fr -10  -8  -2  -6  -4...
etc.
 

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Stats observations

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