The ALP is pissweak (and has been for years)

[Hawk Dork]

The Greens are the loons, Labor should be moving to distance themselves from them.

Would have thought the real loons are the ones they need to distance themselves from
Small target Lib light is not going to work

Federal Labor has never won from opposition by simply offering relief from unpopular government.
The only way Labor wins is by connecting a suite of progressive policy proposals to a unifying vision that makes politically disengaged voters feel two things: hope and ambition.
That’s what Whitlam, Hawke and Rudd all did.
It’s is a tough path, but it’s the only one that leads to victory.
Conservative parties, especially those in government, have an easier option: fear.
Conservatives can win by convincing voters to feel defensive and worried.

Labor shouldn't be tempted by a small target strategy – it needs to sell hope | Sam Crosby

The only way the party wins is by connecting a suite of progressive policy proposals to a unifying vision

www.theguardian.com

 

[Gethelred]

No. I made a camparison to another type of crime.

So at $615 a fortnight people will commit crimes, but at $635 a fortnight they will stop being criminals?

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjAAegQIAxAB&usg=AOvVaw2HXMKQjThhrFt5q9e7GmvJ

[/URL]

Invalid URL, post it again, please.

And every cent counts when you're unemployed.

 

[HairyO]

Invalid URL, post it again, please.

And every cent counts when you're unemployed.

And if youre a few dollars short you steal?

You have a pretty poor opinion of low income earners.

I will try again. Was a NSW report examining causes. Said there is some correlation with poverty but not able to confirm whether its a cause or symptom. People who have been in gaol tend to struggle to find work.

The big correlation was having bad parents/upbringing.

 

[Gethelred]

And if youre a few dollars short you steal?

You have a pretty poor opinion of low income earners.

I was a low income earner, and I spent 3 years on the Newstart. I have an entirely accurate opinion of what desperate people will do when they're driven to it.

I was one of the lucky ones; I had no dependents, and I was a relatively able-bodied young man without any history of injury. I was able and happy to look for work; that it took 3 years and me moving away from the region I was in (despite owning a car, and being happy to drive hours to get to work) is a testament to conditions as they are. That I never stole or did anything is a testament to the fact that while I was desperate I was never quite that desperate. If I did it, I would only have been in it for me. Change the levers, and you potentially change that choice.

If that's the situation now, and it is going to get worse if the status quo is maintained, how many people are going to fall on the opposite side of the ledger?

I will try again. Was a NSW report examining causes. Said there is some correlation with poverty but not able to confirm whether its a cause or symptom. People who have been in gaol tend to struggle to find work.

The big correlation was having bad parents/upbringing.

... because, by and large, we're a nation that has done away with most instances of extreme poverty and/or ingrained and entrenched instances of generational criminality.

While correlation does not equal causation, there has been a relatively well established link that extreme poverty and intergeneration poverty have higher rates of criminal activity and violence. I would quote sources, but unfortunately (fortunately) I completed my degree, and I don't have access to university level sources online anymore, and my books are all in boxes.

 

[HairyO]

I was a low income earner, and I spent 3 years on the Newstart. I have an entirely accurate opinion of what desperate people will do when they're driven to it.

I was one of the lucky ones; I had no dependents, and I was a relatively able-bodied young man without any history of injury. I was able and happy to look for work; that it took 3 years and me moving away from the region I was in (despite owning a car, and being happy to drive hours to get to work) is a testament to conditions as they are. That I never stole or did anything is a testament to the fact that while I was desperate I was never quite that desperate. If I did it, I would only have been in it for me. Change the levers, and you potentially change that choice.

If that's the situation now, and it is going to get worse if the status quo is maintained, how many people are going to fall on the opposite side of the ledger?


... because, by and large, we're a nation that has done away with most instances of extreme poverty and/or ingrained and entrenched instances of generational criminality.

While correlation does not equal causation, there has been a relatively well established link that extreme poverty and intergeneration poverty have higher rates of criminal activity and violence. I would quote sources, but unfortunately (fortunately) I completed my degree, and I don't have access to university level sources online anymore, and my books are all in boxes.

https://www.bocsar.nsw.gov.au/Documents/CJB/cjb54.pdf

Most young criminals stop. If there was an ongoing desperation, you would think they would continue to commit crimes. Crap parents is a strong influence. And points out that studies on poverty and crime are often flawed due to the assumptions used.

Anyway, this is drifting a fair way off the topic.

 

[Rob R]

I could say exactly the same of you to an even higher degree. I gave you full reasons why your comment was a straw man argument. Your response ignored that altogether and was simply whinging and insults, so I think it's extremely rich for you to complain about that.

If you hadn't led off with your insult, I would have responded to your actual comment.

You are right, you never suggested the same cut and you are right that the increase is not much for lower incomes earners in the later phases. I would have noted however that lower income earners got their tax cuts 4 years earlier, benefit from govt services that people on higher incomes pay for and point out that I said we need to crack down on dodgy practises and loopholes being exploited by the well off. The last part is critical and should be a priority to help pay off our debt, build infrastructure and fund our defence forces, health etc properly without taxing honest people higher just because they earn more than the average wage by a bit and aren't rich enough to rort the system.

On SM-G570F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Dry Rot]

Anyway, this is drifting a fair way off the topic.

Just checked in to the thread I started...What a train crash.

Mind you, on the irrelevant topic of vegans with cats...

I love cats and to their credit, they are meat eating killers.

I kept a scoreboard on my fridge for my cat before last like the Luftwaffe kills on a side of a Spitfire. He bagged 22 rats and mice.

And they enjoy killing - I admire that.

No self respecting cat would live with a vegan. They would bide their time, and then the rip the throat out of their vegan owner while they slept and then move into the house three doors down.

And fair enough.

Would you trust a vegan? It's almost as bad as trusting someone who doesn't drink or do drugs.

 

[Kwality]

Common knowledge that Albo has no love for the Greens and they none for him.

Albos elbows appear sharper than his predecessor, looking forward to that.

 

[Kram]

Common knowledge that Albo has no love for the Greens and they none for him.

We'll he's got my backing then

 

[go you pups]

Would have thought the real loons are the ones they need to distance themselves from
Small target Lib light is not going to work

Federal Labor has never won from opposition by simply offering relief from unpopular government.
The only way Labor wins is by connecting a suite of progressive policy proposals to a unifying vision that makes politically disengaged voters feel two things: hope and ambition.
That’s what Whitlam, Hawke and Rudd all did.
It’s is a tough path, but it’s the only one that leads to victory.
Conservative parties, especially those in government, have an easier option: fear.
Conservatives can win by convincing voters to feel defensive and worried.

Labor shouldn't be tempted by a small target strategy – it needs to sell hope | Sam Crosby

The only way the party wins is by connecting a suite of progressive policy proposals to a unifying vision

www.theguardian.com

Agree

The Greens look more desirable for many disenchanted ALP voters when they go away from progressive vision

 

[eastfreo75]

Agree

The Greens look more desirable for many disenchanted ALP voters when they go away from progressive vision

The game of Squash is won by controlling the middle as do elections.

 

[go you pups]

The game of Squash is won by controlling the middle as do elections.

Correct, but how do they maintain balance and debunk the myth that the LNP are superior economic strategists and repel the constant negativity surrounding them

 

[Mofra]

Correct, but how do they maintain balance and debunk the myth that the LNP are superior economic strategists and repel the constant negativity surrounding them

In the current environment, just wait a few months.

 

[go you pups]

In the current environment, just wait a few months.

Hope so

But after the last election I ain't getting my hopes up

 

[Hawk Dork]

You have to factor in the Brazilian Flood


Whoever wins the federal election this Saturday can expect to inherit an economic windfall, as iron ore prices surge to highs not seen since 2014.

As of May 10, the commodity was fetching $US95.08 per dry metric tonne (dmt) on the global market, an increase of about 37.8 per cent since the beginning of the year.

That’s also 73 per cent higher than the conservative $US55 per dmt estimate outlined by government in the 2019 federal budget.

It’s good news for whoever wins the May 18 election, as the low prices built into the federal budget estimates mean the current, near-double price effectively translates to “free money” for Australia’s economy, Mr Koukoulas said.

Five year-high iron ore price means ‘free money’ for Australia

Whoever wins the fiercely contested federal election can expect to inherit an economic windfall, as iron ore prices surge to highs not seen since 2014.

thenewdaily.com.au

 

[Power Raid]

...

Um, I'm rather sorry to have to tell you this, but I don't have the time to prove that what you've just stated above is relatively well known as a thing. There is a clear link between poverty and crime that has been well established over time.

Also, way to ignore the question. How is getting marginally extra money akin to being addicted to heroin? That's the comparison you made; justify it, please.

I for one support increasing the dole, pension and Austudy but I doubt an increase alone will reduce crime.

Crime is a dysfunctional behaviour with many motivations from being anti-social, a response to having no purpose, too much time, inability to control impulses, mental health, drugs, etc etc. but being dirt poor is rarely the actual cause.

Better education and preparing people to look after themselves is required and clearly a failure of their parents and schools.

Its also a failure of the judicial system, where these skills could be retrained.

The failures of a mental health system are currently under the microscope but just as ridiculous outcomes like “prostitute services” like rub and tugs for the NDIS will be the outcome rather than sensible reforms.

What we need is “work for social welfare”. It always meets immediate opposition from those that support more government jobs though. It shouldn’t be dismissed after the successes in Iceland with drugs and community participation.

If we can get more people participating in society, having purpose and experiencing happiness, we will have less mental health, crimes, drugs and less people on the dole.

 

[Bunkdar]

I for one support increasing the dole, pension and Austudy but I doubt an increase alone will reduce crime.

Crime is a dysfunctional behaviour with many motivations from being anti-social, a response to having no purpose, too much time, inability to control impulses, mental health, drugs, etc etc. but being dirt poor is rarely the actual cause.

Better education and preparing people to look after themselves is required and clearly a failure of their parents and schools.

Its also a failure of the judicial system, where these skills could be retrained.

The failures of a mental health system are currently under the microscope but just as ridiculous outcomes like “prostitute services” like rub and tugs for the NDIS will be the outcome rather than sensible reforms.

What we need is “work for social welfare”. It always meets immediate opposition from those that support more government jobs though. It shouldn’t be dismissed after the successes in Iceland with drugs and community participation.

If we can get more people participating in society, having purpose and experiencing happiness, we will have less mental health, crimes, drugs and less people on the dole.

The royal commission into the big banks
" Crime is a dysfunctional behaviour " which part did they fit into

 

[Power Raid]

The royal commission into the big banks
" Crime is a dysfunctional behaviour " which part did they fit into

well certainly not poverty

I'd suggest "the inability to control impulses" and specifically greed

 

[Bunkdar]

well certainly not poverty

I'd suggest "the inability to control impulses" and specifically greed

" well certainly not poverty "
thank damn you are there 2 pump them up
being rich justify

 

[Hawk Dork]

Where was Dick Smith during the election campaign ?

Millionaire Australian businessman Dick Smith received $500,000 in franking credits from the government in a single year, in what he called an "outrageous" use of taxpayers' money that should be subject to a means test.

"I found I was getting this ridiculous money from the government," Mr Smith told The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age.

"That's wrong, I said - I'm wealthy. My accountant said 'that's how it works, that's what you have to do'. I can't stop it. I think it's outrageous for wealthy people to be getting money from the government."

'It's outrageous': Dick Smith received $500,000 of franking credit refunds in one year

The entrepreneur says Labor should have capped the proposal so that only wealthy Australians would lose their benefits.

www.theage.com.au

 

[NSWCROW]

Where was Dick Smith during the election campaign ?

Millionaire Australian businessman Dick Smith received $500,000 in franking credits from the government in a single year, in what he called an "outrageous" use of taxpayers' money that should be subject to a means test.

"I found I was getting this ridiculous money from the government," Mr Smith told The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age.

"That's wrong, I said - I'm wealthy. My accountant said 'that's how it works, that's what you have to do'. I can't stop it. I think it's outrageous for wealthy people to be getting money from the government."

'It's outrageous': Dick Smith received $500,000 of franking credit refunds in one year

The entrepreneur says Labor should have capped the proposal so that only wealthy Australians would lose their benefits.

www.theage.com.au

 

[HairyO]

Where was Dick Smith during the election campaign ?

Millionaire Australian businessman Dick Smith received $500,000 in franking credits from the government in a single year, in what he called an "outrageous" use of taxpayers' money that should be subject to a means test.

"I found I was getting this ridiculous money from the government," Mr Smith told The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age.

"That's wrong, I said - I'm wealthy. My accountant said 'that's how it works, that's what you have to do'. I can't stop it. I think it's outrageous for wealthy people to be getting money from the government."

'It's outrageous': Dick Smith received $500,000 of franking credit refunds in one year

The entrepreneur says Labor should have capped the proposal so that only wealthy Australians would lose their benefits.

www.theage.com.au

Rich people and large tax returns arent new.

Donate the money to charity and dont claim it for tax, Dick.

Id love to know how large his super is if its getting $500k in credits. Would assume at least $5m or $6m. Possibly as much as $10m.

 

[Demons09]

View attachment 710585

Thats the face i pulled after reading the melts on here after the ALP losing the un losable election.

 

[NSWCROW]

Thats the face i pulled after reading the melts on here after the ALP losing the un losable election.

Bullshit

I hacked your webcam that night

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

More pissweakery from the maybe-if-we-just-go-along-with-everything-the-government-wants-people-will-vote-US-into-government-one-day party.

https://www.theguardian.com/austral...ool-package-it-previously-called-a-slush-fund