Opinion The 'Carlton related stuff that doesn't need it's own thread' thread Part 2

[mediumsizered]

I dont even bother to watch footy shows - all the y do is pick a club, highlight a bad passage of play or two and say this is why a certain club is crap.....

you could find bad play in just about every goal kicked from the opposition for every club. Sure Jones stuffs up and when he does its a shocker but you dont question it when he flies in and takes an intercept mark. No-one complains he wasnt on his man then.

This is a fair point.

I'm a great believer in the importance of momentum. When you get yourself to 27 points up, it's fair to say you have the momentum. Late in the 3rd quarter 2 turnovers resulted in goals to the Bulldogs, allowing the Bulldogs to head to 3 quarter time 14 points down. If you hand the momentum to a good team like the Bulldogs, good luck, because they will run over the top of you.

At 27 points up we were probably 1 goal from killing off the game. That 1 of the turnovers came from one of our co-captains is particularly disappointing. As I have previously stated, I don't believe we are being well served by our leaders at the moment. They need to regroup & lead from the front if we are going to see some real improvement in our performances. Otherwise I can only assume they are following the same road map as club leaders that have gone before them & laying the groundwork to bring down yet another coach. Time will tell.

 

[Gavstar]

Yeah Teague’s presser was the same 'we let them score when we take speed out of the ball, we need speed in the ball more' not sure I like the messaging

The message I get is we don't defend we attack, which isn't going to win you that final game in September (usually)

 

[Red_man2008]

The message I get is we don't defend we attack, which isn't going to win you that final game in September (usually)

I always thought Brisbane a few years ago acted this way and they probably still do a bit. The defence part will come IMO.

 

[Arr0w]

Jones wouldn’t play any different if we are behind or in front. It’s happened for years.

And I will take the good with the bad

 

[Arr0w]

Looking at Doc’s communication today he’s basically saying we lost because we stopped scoring rather than we lost due to lack of defence. We slowed down when we should have kept the speed up.

Tempo footy = Bad

Not the first time I’ve been surprised by what the leaders think is going wrong this year. They are in a bubble and common sense is not penetrating it, hoping Worsfold can bring some sense into these strategic discussions!

Have already stated my thoughts on the current gameplan, currently it's not sustainable

 

[Bluella]

Others should be standing up, seeing what is happening and making the adjustments. The best teams self correct in real time, without the need to have a runner/coach tell them. Lack of leadership is a contributing factor too.

This I think is one of our biggest weaknesses as a team. We can't think on our feet and either refocus on the task or change tack and try plan b. We are still too reliant on the quarter breaks to reset, which means we are royally effed if things go wrong in Q4.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Jones wouldn’t play any different if we are behind or in front. It’s happened for years.

Agree. Very little footy iq and even less doing the simple things, like punch when caught behind or 4th man deep even.

 

[sosos]

Not a Plow fan sosos

He worries me as a defender. He plays too loose, does not have a heap of speed, nor a heap of strength so the players he gets put on, can either out muscle him, or burn him off for pace.

Sometimes lacks the maniacal desperation good defenders have to get to a contest to lay a hand on a player about to break free, or to get a fist to a ball before it's marked.

I actually think he could be trialled in a different position. His disposal to a forward happens rarely, but when he pulls the trigger, it's very precise, daisy cutters that drill through the lines, impossible to defend against.

 

[norway blue]

Jones been playing well in my opinion granted a few howlers. He wasn’t Robinson especially the way it came in that last quarter


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[therubbernub]

Cannot wait to see Kemp play.
I am realistic in my expectations - I know he’ll be extremely rusty after so long since his last official game. But hopefully the extended layoff has allowed his knee to heal as well as you can expect, and he is fit and raring to go.
Not sure where he’ll play, but will be nice to see what he can bring to the team once ready for AFL.

With zac going back and stocker and doc and sps, marchbank (if avail) i think we have the Hb line covered.
Injury free the forward line will be ok with charlie , zac fisher , jsos,MM, MM, and martin to return-
To me he should be used in the midfield-it is our area of greatest need; realise he wont have the tank, but that's where he should be heading

 

[FRUMPY]

This is a very simplistic view of our injury list but 8/9 of those players SHOULD be in our best 22.

I see 5 maybe 6:
I dont include Kemp or Philp as they havent played or barely played AFL
I dont include Marchbank as who knows how he will go when fit and have others taken his spot (he would be the 6th)
I dont include Murphy as he isnt best 22
I dont include McDonald, no need for explanation really

 

[Blue__Balls]

Looking at Doc’s communication today he’s basically saying we lost because we stopped scoring rather than we lost due to lack of defence. We slowed down when we should have kept the speed up.

Tempo footy = Bad

Not the first time I’ve been surprised by what the leaders think is going wrong this year. They are in a bubble and common sense is not penetrating it, hoping Worsfold can bring some sense into these strategic discussions!

I think there's an element of truth to it.

You can't park the bus at 4 goals up with 40mins to play against a quality side like the Bulldogs.

The same happened against Essendon and we were somewhat lucky to get away with it in the end.

We build a lead and then, fair too early, decide that we need to go a complete 180 on our mindset and we just start chipping the ball around behind centre. It in turn allows the opposition to press up and apply pressure, we then **** up and turn it over and they score.

Honestly, I think it's the sign opposition coaches and players are now looking for. When Carlton start trying to play defensive footy, that's when they're at their most vulnerable.

We do need to get better at that defensive game, but we probably need to do it in 3-5 minute bursts each quarter to help sustain our energy for the full game, rather than going a 3 quarter blitz and then turtling for the rest of the game.

 

[The Return of the Paf]

I’ve seen snippets of his play looks to be Avery good kick quick and good overhead.
Any one no what his endurance,tank is like.
Hopefully a bit more advanced than where Stocker started from

The new 'Tex'?

 

[chunkylover53]

Looking at Doc’s communication today he’s basically saying we lost because we stopped scoring rather than we lost due to lack of defence. We slowed down when we should have kept the speed up.

Tempo footy = Bad

Not the first time I’ve been surprised by what the leaders think is going wrong this year. They are in a bubble and common sense is not penetrating it, hoping Worsfold can bring some sense into these strategic discussions!

Yeah Teague’s presser was the same 'we let them score when we take speed out of the ball, we need speed in the ball more' not sure I like the messaging

Why not? We had them on toast when we went through the corridor and moved it quick. They had us on toast when we stopped doing that. We went into our shells and stopped attacking without sharpening up the defence.

It's clear the plan is to attack for 4 quarters. The best defence is offence sort of setup.

I'm ok with this, but we need the mental fortitude to keep playing like this when the opposition gets a run on instead of shitting the bed.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Why not? We had them on toast when we went through the corridor and moved it quick. They had us on toast when we stopped doing that. We went into our shells and stopped attacking without sharpening up the defence.

It's clear the plan is to attack for 4 quarters. The best defence is offence sort of setup.

I'm ok with this, but we need the mental fortitude to keep playing like this when the opposition gets a run on instead of shitting the bed.

We didn't stop attacking, the dogs just figured out what we were doing and we couldn't counter back. We didn't lose that game for slow ball movement, we lost it cause we couldn't get first hands on it and clearances.

 

[__Bobcat__]

What if we'd won the ball and they used Jones to Springboard through the corridor and set up McKay....would they use the same footage to say Lipinski cheated and got burnt?? Yep he took a gamble...good teams get away with it.... we're not a good team

Problem was/is Kernafides we don't have the ball.
its great to be attacking, but if we haven't got the ball, bust your arse and find an opponent.

 

[Own The Future]

With zac going back and stocker and doc and sps, marchbank (if avail) i think we have the Hb line covered.
Injury free the forward line will be ok with charlie , zac fisher , jsos,MM, MM, and martin to return-
To me he should be used in the midfield-it is our area of greatest need; realise he wont have the tank, but that's where he should be heading

Agree with this.
Having only seen highlights at draft time, he certainly appears to have the skills to play mid as an explosive stoppage player. As you say, his endurance will likely be an issue for at least a while - but it’d be a shame if we don’t at least run him through there as a burst player.
At the moment I do think there is a vacancy as a third tall/medium forward. Gov a long way off, JSOS just can’t stay on the park, Jack M more of a small/medium forward who is a better than average overhead mark than a legit tall option, and who the hell knows with Charlie. Kemp is a brute of a man even at his young age, could see him troubling some defenders. Whether he can provide the required forward pressure is another question, but surely can’t be worse than what we’re currently getting with Levi.

 

[Original Moody Blue]

Jones has a stack of ability, but very little football smarts. The Opposition are starting to exploit this hence him regularly having multiple goals kicked on him now.

Fair enough, but what about his teammate who could see what was going on and calling out to him to run back? Jones was 6 weeks from never playing footy again when they threw him into the backline, and since then he has been very good. Until you can find someone who has the ability to compete with the talls and is as mobile and has his athleticism, we will have to endure. We have other more pressing matters to deal with in this team..

 

[__Bobcat__]

Fair enough, but what about his teammate who could see what was going on and calling out to him to run back? Jones was 6 weeks from never playing footy again when they threw him into the backline, and since then he has been very good. Until you can find someone who has the ability to compete with the talls and is as mobile and has his athleticism, we will have to endure. We have other more pressing matters to deal with in this team..

Docherty is a co captain of the club. needs to be more of a Captain of the Backline.
he too needs to tighten up his game in the back 6.

 

[Kernafides]

Problem was/is Kernafides we don't have the ball.
its great to be attacking, but if we haven't got the ball, bust your arse and find an opponent.

That's not true it was kicked from their backline to a contest on the wing...that we lost...had we won it he may have been utilised...as I said it was a gamble...and sure given we were getting smashed around the ball...he probably shouldn't have rolled the dice

 

[ctwenty1]

I think there's an element of truth to it.

You can't park the bus at 4 goals up with 40mins to play against a quality side like the Bulldogs.

The same happened against Essendon and we were somewhat lucky to get away with it in the end.

We build a lead and then, fair too early, decide that we need to go a complete 180 on our mindset and we just start chipping the ball around behind centre. It in turn allows the opposition to press up and apply pressure, we then fu** up and turn it over and they score.

Honestly, I think it's the sign opposition coaches and players are now looking for. When Carlton start trying to play defensive footy, that's when they're at their most vulnerable.

We do need to get better at that defensive game, but we probably need to do it in 3-5 minute bursts each quarter to help sustain our energy for the full game, rather than going a 3 quarter blitz and then turtling for the rest of the game.

Yep- as the saying goes, make hay when the sunshines

don’t slow things down for the sake of it when we are in control. Scoreboard pressure is an invaluable psychological tool. Play tempo when the other team is getting a run on, or late in the fourth when the result is beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

[__Bobcat__]

That's not true it was kicked from their backline to a contest on the wing...that we lost...had we won it he may have been utilised...as I said it was a gamble...and sure given we were getting smashed around the ball...he probably shouldn't have rolled the dice

i wasn't only pinpointing that incident,

 

[Mentallo]

I see 5 maybe 6:
I dont include Kemp or Philp as they havent played or barely played AFL
I dont include Marchbank as who knows how he will go when fit and have others taken his spot (he would be the 6th)
I dont include Murphy as he isnt best 22
I dont include McDonald, no need for explanation really

I think most people would see the same as well.
My theory is we invested early picks with Kemp & Philip and the players drafted around them are playing senior footy.
Marchbank was playing good consistent senior footy prior to his injury 2 years ago now.
Murphy would be a toss of the coin, I guess that is where you would like to see Philip or Kemp essentially in his role if they were actually ever fit.
I didn't include Mcdonald clearly recruited as a depth player on our list.

 

[Kleenex Crew]

Latest show.

We introduce a new segment 'glass half full or glass half empty?', review the Dogs match, discuss players, clip and clap and preview the upcoming Demons game.

 

[Ash24]

This is a very simplistic view of our injury list but 8/9 of those players SHOULD be in our best 22.

STRAIGHT SWAPS
Curnow --> Levi
Fisher --> Betts
TDK --> Pittonet
Newman --> Newnes
Martin --> Owies

POSSIBLE SWAPS
Marchbank? --> Parks
SPS/Dow? --> Stocker

NOT B22, BUT WOULD'VE PLAYED
Kemp
OMac
Murph
Philp?

Either way, we have loads of injured players. If they weren't originally best 22, they would've come in as an injury replacement.

On a side note... not really sure where Gov fits in. It's probably a battle between him and JSOS for a spot as our 3rd tall. I doubt we can have Charlie, Harry, Gov and JSOS in the same forward line. Thoughts?