Mega Thread The Media Thread

[theGav56]

You say that as though every time a team rebuilds they are guaranteed a premiership. It ain't that easy.

No. He’s saying that the purpose of a rebuild is to win a premiership and if you fail to do that, then it is disappointing. And he is responding to a post hoping for mild to moderate finals success which to me means a couple of top 4 finishes with a win here and there. That doesn’t even mean making a Grand Final.

I’m not having a crack at Freomaniac because it is largely semantics, but I will be disappointed if we don’t mount a strong finals campaign while we still have Fyfe firing, which means in the next 2-3 years.

 

[CapitalA]

No. He’s saying that the purpose of a rebuild is to win a premiership and if you fail to do that, then it is disappointing. And he is responding to a post hoping for mild to moderate finals success which to me means a couple of top 4 finishes with a win here and there. That doesn’t even mean making a Grand Final.

I’m not having a crack at Freomaniac because it is largely semantics, but I will be disappointed if we don’t mount a strong finals campaign while we still have Fyfe firing, which means in the next 2-3 years.

The teams that successfully rebuild and make a grand final/finals for a long period of time (5-10 years) are in the minority is all I'm saying. Seems a bit arrogant to expect it, is all...

Edit: I do think we are on the right track though

 

[Scham]

Mild to moderate?! That’d be disappointing.

Anything less than a flag/s after a rebuild is very disappointing, especially with the promise shown by the youngsters coming thru.

How many years have we been trying to win a flag and not succeeded. Never stop hoping and dreaming about winning one or a few but prepare to be disappointed.

 

[Kapow!!!]

How many years have we been trying to win a flag and not succeeded. Never stop hoping and dreaming about winning one or a few but prepare to be disappointed.

I've gone back and forth on this thought process. Whilst my overriding mindset is pessimism and cynicism and I genuinely believe a majority of posters on this board will be very disappointed this season, it turns out this wave of wishful thinking and overwhelming optimism makes this board a far, far, far better place than it has been since mid-2014.

So...aim for the stars, all aboard the premiership express, shoot for those unrealistic expectations boys and girls. Dream big: Our collective sanity depends on it

 

[Freomaniac]

You say that as though every time a team rebuilds they are guaranteed a premiership. It ain't that easy.

yeah We need to be realistic. I think Justin Longmuir will be a solid coach.

If you think he’ll last only 5 to 7 years that’s probably not a premiership winning coach.

He’ll last 10+

Depends how you see it.

If Justin Longmuir lasts more than 10 years, chances are he would of got a flag in the middle of his stint like in his 5th or 6th year.

Mark choco Williams coached port Adelaide from 1999-2010 and got a premiership in 2004.

John Worsfold coached the eagles from 2002-13 and got grand finals in 2005-6 which resulted in a flag in 2006.

Paul Roos coached the swans from 2002-09 and got a flag in 2005.

Some coaches have lasted 6-7 years, got a few finals and then got sacked.

A couple of examples.....

I always liked Neil Craig's stint as a crows coach. Finals in 2005-9 then sacked in 2011 after not making finals in 2010 and 2011. Neil Craig would love to have that 2nd half of that preliminary final vs West coast in 2006.

We can talk about Ross Lyons stints at the saints from 2007-11 and at Freo from 2012-19.

Again.... I'm going to be realistic. I don't know if Justin Longmuir will guide us to that elusive flag but you can be damned sure he will try.

I just want guys like Walters Fyfe and Hill to play 2-3 Elim finals and hoping to get 1-2 finals wins before they all retire.

Those 3 along with Mundy are the last links to our 2012-15 finals era.

 

[gaskin]

Those 3 along with Mundy are the last links to our 2012-15 finals era.

I was actually thinking that the other day while watching the highlights from the prelim win over Sydney. The turnover of players over the last 5 seasons has been insane when you really think about it.

 

[Freomaniac]

I was actually thinking that the other day while watching the highlights from the prelim win over Sydney. The turnover of players over the last 5 seasons has been insane when you really think about it.

Yeah in a way it is crazy the amount of players turned over since 2016.

Don't get me wrong, it was an ageing squad. But I will always be savour each final we had under Ross Lyon from 2012-15.

You should also look back at our 2006 side that played in the preliminary final also vs the swans. Pavlich, McPharlin, Johnson, Sandilands, Mundy. All 5 of them played in that 2013 preliminary final vs the swans. That was a 7-8 year gap in between 2006 and 2013.

 

[ImperialPurple]

Yeah in a way it is crazy the amount of players turned over since 2016.

Don't get me wrong, it was an ageing squad. But I will always be savour each final we had under Ross Lyon from 2012-15.

You should also look back at our 2006 side that played in the preliminary final also vs the swans. Pavlich, McPharlin, Johnson, Sandilands, Mundy. All 5 of them played in that 2013 preliminary final vs the swans. That was a 7-8 year gap in between 2006 and 2013.

In the 2006 PF, those 5 players you mentioned were 24,24,23,21,21. It was a very young and incredibly promising squad, which underperformed almost unforgivably from 2007-2011.
Add Haselby and Medhurst (both 24), Roger Hayden, and trades Josh Carr and Des (all 25), we should have been heading towards a decent period of dominance.
Too much cream, not enough cake for most of that time, unfortunately. And then an unwillingness to properly turn the list over till 2016.

 

[gaskin]

2006 was a wasted season. I reckon we would have won that flag if we got there.

 

[Freomaniac]

In the 2006 PF, those 5 players you mentioned were 24,24,23,21,21. It was a very young and incredibly promising squad, which underperformed almost unforgivably from 2007-2011.
Add Haselby and Medhurst (both 24), Roger Hayden, and trades Josh Carr and Des (all 25), we should have been heading towards a decent period of dominance.
Too much cream, not enough cake for most of that time, unfortunately. And then an unwillingness to properly turn the list over till 2016.

I have posted this Before and will post this Again.

Yeah Pavlich, McPharlin, Johnson, Sandilands, Mundy were all under 25 as you said. So you wonder why freo wasted 3 years of their prime (2007-9) outside of Finals.

Hasleby and Medhurst were only 24. Yet I was suprised Medhurst was traded out at the end of 2006. Another young guy that was only 24 and was also traded out was Graham Polak.

Again, I have posted this before and will post this again....

By the end of 2008, Freo had the oldest list in the AFL. Freo only had 7-8 players aged 23 or under in which the next team, which was the demons at least had 15 guys aged 23 or under. Remember this is a 43 man list of 38 players in the main squad and 5 rookies.

Again..... the blokes I remembered in 2008 that were aged 23 or under were Rhys Palmer, Chris Mayne, Clayton Hinkley, Garrick Ibbotson, Marcus Drum, Rob Warnock who was traded to carlton and finally my Personal Favourite Brock "Lesnar" O Brien.

If you wanna know why Freo only had 7-8 player aged 23 or under is 2 things.......

1. Trading Heavily in that 2000-06 period. Every 2nd year we constanly traded our 1st and 2nd round picks for established players in that prime 23-27 year old range

2000: Peter Bell was traded in From North melbourne. Traded picks 6, 37 and Jess Sinclair

2001: the Infamous trade of trading picks 1, 20 and 36 for Luke McPharlin and Trant Croad. Trading Pick 17 for Jeff Farmer from the demons.

2002: Traded picks 3 and 19 for Des Headland from Brisbane.

2004: Traded picks 11, 27 and 43 for Josh Carr From Port Adelaide.

2006: Traded pick 12 and Graham Polak to richmond for pick 8. Then traded that pick 8 and Paul Medhurst to Collingwood for Chris tarrant.


2. the other main reason was due to reason one of trading 1st and 2nd rounders every 2nd year for experienced players was not a lot of youth came through.

2001 draft got us Graham Polak and Paul Medhurst.


The 2003 draft was solid As we got Ryan Murphy (Who I thought was slowly developing into an ok tall forward), David Mundy, Brett Peake. Michael Johnson was taken in the 2004 PSD. Paul Duffield was taken in the 2004 rookie draft.

2005 draft wasnt too bad, Marcus Drum, Garrick Ibbotson and Rob Warnock were taken.

The point was when 1st rounders and 2nd rounders are Valuable, Freo didnt use them wisely that often.

Also, Around this time freo didnt really get a lot of Gems in those 3rd and 4th rounders and Rookie picks. getting 1-2 solid players each year with late picks might of made a difference too.


Seems like at the time Freo wanted instant finals success..... It worked.... Sort of it did work.

Only thing we can look back on that 2002-7 era under our coach Chris Connolly was that 2003 elim final and that 2006 prelim. As I said, we under achieved and we should of made finals each year from 2003-6.

 

[Freomaniac]

Mild to moderate?! That’d be disappointing.

Anything less than a flag/s after a rebuild is very disappointing, especially with the promise shown by the youngsters coming thru.

Some of you have been supporting freo since 1995, I have Followed Freo since late 2001- early 2002.

If Following freo has taught me anything, There will be very few good times and a lot of bad times.

I hate comparing Freo to other Non-Vic sides.

But Saying that....

From 1995-2010 which is the Period where there were 16 teams and 8 finals spots, so literally a 50-50 chance to make finals, Freo only made finals only 3 years out of 16. Had Freo drafted and traded better, I am not saying freo would of been certain of a flag but we would of made finals in 6-8 years out of 16 and got an extra finals win or 2.

Meanwhile Adelaide, Brisbane, Sydney, Port and West coast have done way better than us in that same 1995-2010 era. With the Exception of Port, each of those non vic sides have made finals in at least 8 out of 16 years and at least made 2 grand finals and got at least 1 flag.

Port have made finals 7 years from 1997-2010 and made 2 grand finals and got a flag.

Think about it. Freo made finals in 3 years out of 16 from 1995-2010.

Under Ross Lyon, Freo made finals in 4 years out of 8 from 2012-19. He is the only coach to guide us to finals for at least 2 consecutive years. Think about it.

You say that as though every time a team rebuilds they are guaranteed a premiership. It ain't that easy.

Yep at least you are realistic. Its not often Freo makes top 4 and make a prelim.

Our 1st finals win came in 2006 vs the demons. Our 1st prelim was vs the Swans at NSW. Our next Prelim was Ironically vs the Swans and it was in Perth. Fortunately Freo won that 2013 prelim.

Only Pavlich, Sandilands, Johnson, Mundy and McPharlin played in Both 2006 and 2013 Prelims.

Rebuilds were easier back then if those 1st and 2nd rounders are used correctly. We have seen teams like richmond and demons go through a 10 year period of playing no finals. Saints just endured a period of 8 years of no finals.

Freo dont make finals in 2021, then thats 6 years from 2016-2021 of no finals.

Now with 18 teams fighting for 8 finals spots. From here on in, Savour every final freo will play, Even if its An Elim final loss.

Teams these days might have to get used to having 5 years in a row and no finals. But In that 5 year period, the average team should have a bunch of 18-21 year olds and 5 years later those 18-21 year olds will be 23-26 year olds with 70-100 games under the belt.

No. He’s saying that the purpose of a rebuild is to win a premiership and if you fail to do that, then it is disappointing. And he is responding to a post hoping for mild to moderate finals success which to me means a couple of top 4 finishes with a win here and there. That doesn’t even mean making a Grand Final.

I’m not having a crack at Freomaniac because it is largely semantics, but I will be disappointed if we don’t mount a strong finals campaign while we still have Fyfe firing, which means in the next 2-3 years.

I know you are not having a crack at me.

I would love to see Freo win a flag in my life time.

Saying that.... my view of mild success is having 2-3 years in a row of elim finals and get 1 or 2 finals wins.

Moderate success to me would be Like the crows under neil craig of 2005-09 of 4-5 years in a row with a prelim or 2 and 3-4 elim finals. and getting 2-4 finals wins.

 

[ImperialPurple]

I have posted this Before and will post this Again.

Yeah Pavlich, McPharlin, Johnson, Sandilands, Mundy were all under 25 as you said. So you wonder why freo wasted 3 years of their prime (2007-9) outside of Finals.

Hasleby and Medhurst were only 24. Yet I was suprised Medhurst was traded out at the end of 2006. Another young guy that was only 24 and was also traded out was Graham Polak.

Again, I have posted this before and will post this again....

By the end of 2008, Freo had the oldest list in the AFL. Freo only had 7-8 players aged 23 or under in which the next team, which was the demons at least had 15 guys aged 23 or under. Remember this is a 43 man list of 38 players in the main squad and 5 rookies.

Again..... the blokes I remembered in 2008 that were aged 23 or under were Rhys Palmer, Chris Mayne, Clayton Hinkley, Garrick Ibbotson, Marcus Drum, Rob Warnock who was traded to carlton and finally my Personal Favourite Brock "Lesnar" O Brien.

If you wanna know why Freo only had 7-8 player aged 23 or under is 2 things.......

1. Trading Heavily in that 2000-06 period. Every 2nd year we constanly traded our 1st and 2nd round picks for established players in that prime 23-27 year old range

2000: Peter Bell was traded in From North melbourne. Traded picks 6, 37 and Jess Sinclair

2001: the Infamous trade of trading picks 1, 20 and 36 for Luke McPharlin and Trant Croad. Trading Pick 17 for Jeff Farmer from the demons.

2002: Traded picks 3 and 19 for Des Headland from Brisbane.

2004: Traded picks 11, 27 and 43 for Josh Carr From Port Adelaide.

2006: Traded pick 12 and Graham Polak to richmond for pick 8. Then traded that pick 8 and Paul Medhurst to Collingwood for Chris tarrant.


2. the other main reason was due to reason one of trading 1st and 2nd rounders every 2nd year for experienced players was not a lot of youth came through.

2001 draft got us Graham Polak and Paul Medhurst.


The 2003 draft was solid As we got Ryan Murphy (Who I thought was slowly developing into an ok tall forward), David Mundy, Brett Peake. Michael Johnson was taken in the 2004 PSD. Paul Duffield was taken in the 2004 rookie draft.

2005 draft wasnt too bad, Marcus Drum, Garrick Ibbotson and Rob Warnock were taken.

The point was when 1st rounders and 2nd rounders are Valuable, Freo didnt use them wisely that often.

Also, Around this time freo didnt really get a lot of Gems in those 3rd and 4th rounders and Rookie picks. getting 1-2 solid players each year with late picks might of made a difference too.


Seems like at the time Freo wanted instant finals success..... It worked.... Sort of it did work.

Only thing we can look back on that 2002-7 era under our coach Chris Connolly was that 2003 elim final and that 2006 prelim. As I said, we under achieved and we should of made finals each year from 2003-6.

Agree agree agree agree - only thing is that Polak was 22 when we traded him, not 24. Makes it worse.

 

[theGav56]

Some of you have been supporting freo since 1995, I have Followed Freo since late 2001- early 2002.

If Following freo has taught me anything, There will be very few good times and a lot of bad times.

I hate comparing Freo to other Non-Vic sides.

But Saying that....

From 1995-2010 which is the Period where there were 16 teams and 8 finals spots, so literally a 50-50 chance to make finals, Freo only made finals only 3 years out of 16. Had Freo drafted and traded better, I am not saying freo would of been certain of a flag but we would of made finals in 6-8 years out of 16 and got an extra finals win or 2.

Meanwhile Adelaide, Brisbane, Sydney, Port and West coast have done way better than us in that same 1995-2010 era. With the Exception of Port, each of those non vic sides have made finals in at least 8 out of 16 years and at least made 2 grand finals and got at least 1 flag.

Port have made finals 7 years from 1997-2010 and made 2 grand finals and got a flag.

Think about it. Freo made finals in 3 years out of 16 from 1995-2010.

Under Ross Lyon, Freo made finals in 4 years out of 8 from 2012-19. He is the only coach to guide us to finals for at least 2 consecutive years. Think about it.



Yep at least you are realistic. Its not often Freo makes top 4 and make a prelim.

Our 1st finals win came in 2006 vs the demons. Our 1st prelim was vs the Swans at NSW. Our next Prelim was Ironically vs the Swans and it was in Perth. Fortunately Freo won that 2013 prelim.

Only Pavlich, Sandilands, Johnson, Mundy and McPharlin played in Both 2006 and 2013 Prelims.

Rebuilds were easier back then if those 1st and 2nd rounders are used correctly. We have seen teams like richmond and demons go through a 10 year period of playing no finals. Saints just endured a period of 8 years of no finals.

Freo dont make finals in 2021, then thats 6 years from 2016-2021 of no finals.

Now with 18 teams fighting for 8 finals spots. From here on in, Savour every final freo will play, Even if its An Elim final loss.

Teams these days might have to get used to having 5 years in a row and no finals. But In that 5 year period, the average team should have a bunch of 18-21 year olds and 5 years later those 18-21 year olds will be 23-26 year olds with 70-100 games under the belt.


I know you are not having a crack at me.

I would love to see Freo win a flag in my life time.

Saying that.... my view of mild success is having 2-3 years in a row of elim finals and get 1 or 2 finals wins.

Moderate success to me would be Like the crows under neil craig of 2005-09 of 4-5 years in a row with a prelim or 2 and 3-4 elim finals. and getting 2-4 finals wins.

Finals is the end result of getting a whole lot of other things right: List management, player development, coaching, game plan, S&C, team culture, being financially well managed, and the like.

If those things are being done well then being a force in September should be expected, and is a reasonable if blunt way of measuring the club. The failed years in your post about the club’s history reflect failures in list management, player development, coaching etc, and simply hitting the rebuild button doesn’t necessarily address the issues, and can be a distraction. No point rebuilding if your S&C can’t get your players on the park. No point rebuilding if the salary cap is so badly managed that you are running fire sales during the trade period.

If we are getting those things right and failing to achieve well in Finals I would be pretty disappointed. And I guess I’m disappointed if we aren’t getting those things right.

 

[Freo]

It feels to me like this list is the best overall list we have ever had. We have plenty of experience, a super solid defence and a whole bunch of talented youngsters coming through at the same time. I think we are only one or two pieces short of a complete list with a young coach who gets the younger players.

Does anyone else see it this way or am I a delusional rusted on Freo freak?

 

[theGav56]

It feels to me like this list is the best overall list we have ever had. We have plenty of experience, a super solid defence and a whole bunch of talented youngsters coming through at the same time. I think we are only one or two pieces short of a complete list with a young coach who gets the younger players.

Does anyone else see it this way or am I a delusional rusted on Freo freak?

The list looks good. We have traded reasonably well apart from the Hogan debacle, drafted well, and player development is a positive.

The only thing I don’t agree with is that we are one or two pieces short of a complete list comment. I think we have the pieces for a functional forward line and a much improved midfield transition game.

 

[Bring back Drum]

The most important piece of the puzzle is the coach & personally I feel we have just the right bloke for the situation. The knock on Ross was always his ability to handle a young group & develop them, where Longmuir has had a very rounded coaching path which included time as a development coach during the modern period.

He has made the tough decisions that this club has feared to do in the past & has bought in people with recent premiership experience, but who are more importantly people who were known as hard workers to get their success.

Longmuir understands the club & its supporters & has put pressure on himself to succeed with the recent comments he has made. The way he handled everything to do with last season as a first year coach was astonishing & I look forward to the next 5 years as we are building a list for sustained success.

 

[Superkoops]

Our improvement for mine in 2021 will relate to two areas.
- improved injury management (in 2020 we saw none of Hamling, APearce, Switta and minimal from Logue, Sturt). Injuries will happen like the unfortunate ankle to Young and Hamstring to Tucker but having these aforementioned players up and running more often than not like we saw with Tabs will move us up into top 8 calculations.
- continued development of 1st to 4th years (draftees from 2017-2020); Brayshaw, Cerra, Crowden, Sturt, Valente, Schultz, Young, Serong, Henry & Frederick with some cameo input from the new 2020 draftees.

Improvement/Development to the above and we’re in a good position to trade /free agency whilst keeping a decent hand for 2021 draft (keeping 2021 1st round pick).

List position needs remain midfield speed, ruck depth and Key Position fwd depth.

I like Longmuir he has a vision and culture set. He has some good support staff now but he will face challenges as a young coach finding his way and a young squad. I know some posters don’t like comments around importance of culture but I really like bond being formed and a real family orientated focus right through the staff, coaches, women and men’s team.

 

[Freo]

The list looks good. We have traded reasonably well apart from the Hogan debacle, drafted well, and player development is a positive.

The only thing I don’t agree with is that we are one or two pieces short of a complete list comment. I think we have the pieces for a functional forward line and a much improved midfield transition game.

So Patrick Cripps and a gun forward would finish things nicely? We'd win 3 in a row!

 

[CapitalA]

The most important piece of the puzzle is the coach & personally I feel we have just the right bloke for the situation. The knock on Ross was always his ability to handle a young group & develop them, where Longmuir has had a very rounded coaching path which included time as a development coach during the modern period.

He has made the tough decisions that this club has feared to do in the past & has bought in people with recent premiership experience, but who are more importantly people who were known as hard workers to get their success.

Longmuir understands the club & its supporters & has put pressure on himself to succeed with the recent comments he has made. The way he handled everything to do with last season as a first year coach was astonishing & I look forward to the next 5 years as we are building a list for sustained success.

Yes JLo has returned from his double agent espionage mission of 10+ years at the dirty birds nest with all of their secrets for Freo to reap the rewards .

 

[mightymouse75]

Covid is back. Who is still in Victoria or back in quarantine already ?
McClownan has already backdated arrivals to the 21st for quarantine..
What a jerk.

 

[gaskin]

Covid is back. Who is still in Victoria or back in quarantine already ?
McClownan has already backdated arrivals to the 21st for quarantine..
What a jerk.

Mate, don't start that shit here. There is a politics thread for McGowan bashing if you are that way inclined.

 

[mightymouse75]

Mate, don't start that sh*t here. There is a politics thread for McGowan bashing if you are that way inclined.

So my question is who is in quarantine & who is yet to return.
Seems 2020 is on repeat this year.

 

[FreoRicci]

All Victorian players had to get in by tonight right?

 

[ChimpaWompa]

yeah the plague didn't just evaporate when the clock struck midnight

 

[SandiHill]

So my question is who is in quarantine & who is yet to return.
Seems 2020 is on repeat this year.

Was at Perth airport yesterday and saw a bunch of the Vic boys come off the plane. Included Serong, Cerra, Young, Shultz, Sturt, Meek, Duman, and Switta. No Brayshaw